It just seems ESO is a watered down shadow of its former self

Klad

When MMO's are launched there is a roadmap that guides the devs where the game should go and what characters should guide it so when the series started I was naturally impressed with a core of memorable characters When the series started we had these three badasses that took us through awesome adventures.





Now the devs have decided to mix things up...so for some unfathomable reason now we have three very anemic npc's , The annoying elf with the annoying voice, The Chris Cyborg clone whose main contribution is scowling last but certainly not least Lyranth the "Foolkiller" who has [snip] is compelled to say "Little Mortal" at the end of every sentence.. (Oh I didn't forget the Argonian...he is just a doorstop and doesn't really matter)

I really don't know why [snip] are now the face of Tamriel's warriors



[snip]

[edited for inappropriate content and baiting]

RageKing

I dont believe we actually quested with those characters in the original promo pic. they were just in the trailers. And the main characters you quest with in this new chapter werent meant to be badasses and they dont claim to be, besides ELam Drals.

Netheniel

It's just the promotion ZoS did for the chapter. With Morrowind, Naryu was given screen time because the content centred around the Dunmer. With Summerset, they were able to shoehorn the Altmer hero because it's her home turf, with a dash of zazzy Raz. With Elsweyr, Khamira was given screen time as the chapter focused on the Khajiit. Western Skyrim, like Summerset, they were able to shoehorn the Nord hero in there with a touch of Lyris as she's the lead companion. The Blackwood chapter focuses on the Imperials for the first time in ESO history, so they introduced a new female Imperial "hero" that represents the players, much like the heroes from the 3 core factions in the previous trailers. She doesn't play a strong role in the trailer though, as Eveli Sharp-Arrow is the centrepiece for the narrative in the chapter (much like the other lead characters from other trailers). Nonetheless, her purpose is just to act as a filler for the player (albeit, she's not as cool as the other heroes).

And yes, the Argonian in that trailer was a goof. He was there only because the Argonian's are neighbours to the Imperials. A notepad checklist that had to be checked off for the trailer. If ZoS dedicates a chapter to the Argonians, I'm sure you'll see some top-lizard action satisfaction.

VaranisArano

Er, as has been mentioned, those original cinematic characters don't appear in ESO.

Instead, ESO does use recurring, fan favorite characters to guide us through the stories. Razum-dar, Darien Gaultier, and Naryu Virian have all had their hey-day in the base game, Morrowind, and Summerset. The cast of the Main Quest has made an appearance in Elsweyr, Dragonhold, and Greymoor. Count Verandis showed up in Markarth. And while you may not care for Eveli and Lyranth, they are also recurring characters, with Eveli as the fan favorite from Orsinium.

rpa

Do people actually watch gaem trailers? And if they do, expect any relevance to actual gaemplay.

Aztrias

So it's a watered down shadow of itself because they introduce new characters and recurring fan favorites?


I personally never found the promotional characters very memorable... the Altmer isn't even a proper TES elf, she looks more like a Romulan

Ekzorka

Klad wrote: »

I really don't know why [snip] are now the face of Tamriel's warriors

Bah, remember that those trailers is now for non-actual playerbase, their task is to advertise the project. No piece of story, no reflecting a character, no words. Just a CGI picture which trying to be serious. Anyone who's been here long enough knows how a story and characters actually looks like. You know who is these characters, but a potential buyer doesn't, so when you see an annoying or dumb persons the potential buyer see a cool and promising persons.

Orion_89

True. It seems like the "old" era ended with greymoor where we saw player's representation as the Nord Hero.

As for me, Eveli isn't that annoying, but it also feels she is like 2nd plan character who step into 1st plan for some reason (lack of ideas, I guess).
Lyranth would be nice as the companion for sorcerer, but her time in the main quest is very low so I don't even understand why she is in trailers.
Imperial woman... Idk, is she our new representation? I'd better see an old Altmer Hero.
And I laughed when they cut out the argonian from the story (Or does he a new Pact Hero?)

Lugaldu

Klad wrote: »

I really don't know why [snip] are now the face of Tamriel's warriors

Sorry, but I absolutely don't understand what should be so much better about the old trailer characters than about the new ones. I actually think it's better that Eveli and Lyranth are shown, beause they are two characters that we actually have something to do with in the game. The only thing I don't like is that there are only three female characters and not a single male.

FrancisCrawford

If I answered yes, it would be very different reasons. ESO used to have some excellent quest lines; now it seems that the quality of the writing is substantially down. At the same time, overland has lost its combat challenges. As a "bonus", they reused some characters and diminished them, such as the Companions or Verandis.

I haven't done a new zone's quest line since Summerset, and I'm pretty sure I didn't miss much.

New dungeons are basically fine, in balance, imagination, loot, story writing, etc. That's the one part of the game I play where the quality has held up. But the benefit of that success is greatly diminished due to the various pathologies in general rewards, notably the huge spread of dungeon difficulty in the richly-rewarded Random finder. It's also diminished by the pall cast over gear due to the perennial likelihood of future drastic nerfs. So despite praising the new dungeons, I don't actually run them very much, if at all.

Orion_89

Lugaldu wrote: »

Klad wrote: »

I really don't know why [snip] are now the face of Tamriel's warriors

Sorry, but I absolutely don't understand what should be so much better about the old trailer characters than about the new ones. I actually think it's better that Eveli and Lyranth are shown, beause they are two characters that we actually have something to do with in the game. The only thing I don't like is that there are only three female characters and not a single male.

With those three heroes we moved from the Aliance War and Molag Bal's invasion through the subsequent events: Summerset, Elsweyr, Greymoor, but now we lost this connecting link like the Blackwood story isn't for us.

RedMuse

Funny how you complain about no player insert characters for Blackwood when they gave us a brand new one this year, The Imperial. Wonder why you don't feel she's representative of you?

Do I wish she was more present and active in the trailer? Yeah, but that doesn't seem to be your problem.

SammyKhajit

The side quests really stand out in Blackwood. There is a recruitment quest (like magnificent 7) in a village, then another theatric story telling one from another featuring a favourite from Summerset. Yet another “Mills and Boons” romance thing which was very sweet.

Overall this one likes Blackwood a lot, and all paws to them storytelling team.

Orion_89

RedMuse wrote: »

Funny how you complain about no player insert characters for Blackwood when they gave us a brand new one this year, The Imperial. Wonder why you don't feel she's representative of you?

Do I wish she was more present and active in the trailer? Yeah, but that doesn't seem to be your problem.

Because of the[snip]? Even her armor looks plastic.

[edited for bashing]

RedMuse

Orion_89 wrote: »

RedMuse wrote: »

Funny how you complain about no player insert characters for Blackwood when they gave us a brand new one this year, The Imperial. Wonder why you don't feel she's representative of you?

Do I wish she was more present and active in the trailer? Yeah, but that doesn't seem to be your problem.

Because of the [snip]? Even her armor looks plastic.

Lol, same can be said about the three "original" ones or whatever you want to call them. They look artificial including their armor but somehow that's fine in their case. As pointed out the Altmer doesn't even look like an elf, she's a cheap, ripoff Romulan and yet...

SerafinaWaterstar

Am rather confused as we have never ever ‘journeyed’ with the three initial characters - nor were we supposed to.
I thought they were there to illustrate the 3 alliances, ie the player?

WeerW3ir

SerafinaWaterstar wrote: »

Am rather confused as we have never ever ‘journeyed’ with the three initial characters - nor were we supposed to.
I thought they were there to illustrate the 3 alliances, ie the player?

Actually they do at some point.
But considering their current aviability. We dont know. Nord hero died, Breton hero is undead and the Altmer hero is alive and well. (still one of the most sexiest elves ever.. Cough. We are not here for simping.)

WeerW3ir

VaranisArano wrote: »

Er, as has been mentioned, those original cinematic characters don't appear in ESO.

Instead, ESO does use recurring, fan favorite characters to guide us through the stories. Razum-dar, Darien Gaultier, and Naryu Virian have all had their hey-day in the base game, Morrowind, and Summerset. The cast of the Main Quest has made an appearance in Elsweyr, Dragonhold, and Greymoor. Count Verandis showed up in Markarth. And while you may not care for Eveli and Lyranth, they are also recurring characters, with Eveli as the fan favorite from Orsinium.

See? This is why an era ended with summerset. The game is not itself since since that. Summerset was the last great story. The ending you could say. Since that you get these forgetable 1 year long stories with forgetable characters

FrancisCrawford

SammyKhajit wrote: »

The side quests really stand out in Blackwood. There is a recruitment quest (like magnificent 7) in a village, then another theatric story telling one from another featuring a favourite from Summerset. Yet another “Mills and Boons” romance thing which was very sweet.

Overall this one likes Blackwood a lot, and all paws to them storytelling team.

As much as I generally liked Summerset, I didn't like the famous theater quest all that well. The whole premise -- actors perhaps being deceptive -- led to a lack of characterization. I didn't dislike or object to it in any way, but it was a bit of a letdown for being one of the most applauded (as it were) side quests in the game.

SammyKhajit

FrancisCrawford wrote: »

SammyKhajit wrote: »

The side quests really stand out in Blackwood. There is a recruitment quest (like magnificent 7) in a village, then another theatric story telling one from another featuring a favourite from Summerset. Yet another “Mills and Boons” romance thing which was very sweet.

Overall this one likes Blackwood a lot, and all paws to them storytelling team.

As much as I generally liked Summerset, I didn't like the famous theater quest all that well. The whole premise -- actors perhaps being deceptive -- led to a lack of characterization. I didn't dislike or object to it in any way, but it was a bit of a letdown for being one of the most applauded (as it were) side quests in the game.

This one thinks you will be pleasantly surprised with the Blackwood quest as it’s complex, about people not realising what they have already, and helping someone who is desperately unhappy with where they are 💗

Lugaldu

WeerW3ir wrote: »

This is why an era ended with summerset. The game is not itself since since that. Summerset was the last great story. The ending you could say. Since that you get these forgetable 1 year long stories with forgetable characters

Why does a personal opinion always have to be presented as a "fact"? People have different tastes and there are enough people who also like the stories after Summerset and the concept of the year-long story and don't see it as a "decline" at all. If I personally don't like something, then I make it clear that that is solely my opinion.

Ekzorka

Orion_89 wrote: »

And I laughed when they cut out the argonian from the story (Or does he a new Pact Hero?)

It's just an Argonian. I have no idea why he is (and the in-game Argonians) have a Bright-Throat Tribe markings, but he's just playing the role of a local resident of Blackwood. No more alliance heroes.

Danikat

If those three characters from the first trailer are so memorable and central to the game what are their names?

For that matter which quests do they appear in? What kind of skills and builds do they use? What are their opinions on the alliance war, daedra worshippers, or any of the other problems facing Tamriel?

"The 3 generic hero figures who were occasionally in trailers" is a prime example of a lack of characterisation. Sure you can imagine they might be a total badass because you never see them say or do anything except fight a couple of enemies, but that's purely you building your own fan fiction to compensate for the absence of information from the developers.

It's not surprising that you prefer your own fan fic, but that doesn't mean the nameless version with no personality in the trailer actually has more characterisation than someone who appears in the game with a name, backstory and their own motivations, interests and opinions. It just means you prefer a character you made up in your own head to some of the ones ZOS wrote into the game.

(It's also important to remember that in any RPG the majority of characters you encounter can't be 'total badasses' able to handle anything solo without trouble, partially because that actually makes for very dull story telling and mostly because it leaves no space for the player character. If they already know everything and don't need any help with even the most dangerous enemies they won't ever come into your story because they don't need you.)

WeerW3ir

Lugaldu wrote: »

WeerW3ir wrote: »

This is why an era ended with summerset. The game is not itself since since that. Summerset was the last great story. The ending you could say. Since that you get these forgetable 1 year long stories with forgetable characters

Why does a personal opinion always have to be presented as a "fact"? People have different tastes and there are enough people who also like the stories after Summerset and the concept of the year-long story and don't see it as a "decline" at all. If I personally don't like something, then I make it clear that that is solely my opinion.

Because in fact the 1 year long stories are nothing to the stories which goes through years?? Also because they are just a badly clone of eachother? Tho while khajiits had an interesting story, the skyrim storyline were so bad, almost unforgetable. Blackwood not even try.

Just check wow, or check for example a destiny. Story indeed goes for a year. But the next chapter continues where the last ended and not drops you into a whole different story!!

Orion_89

Lugaldu wrote: »

Why does a personal opinion always have to be presented as a "fact"? People have different tastes and there are enough people who also like the stories after Summerset and the concept of the year-long story and don't see it as a "decline" at all. If I personally don't like something, then I make it clear that that is solely my opinion.

It might not be obvious to you, but for many people Summerset became a location where they are actually living in game (Hi, empty Elsweyr and western Skyrim! Their smaller dlc regions are also dead zones).

I didn't noticed that untill now, but this "year long story" is nothing more than an attemt to create a production conveyor like Ubisoft did it with their games. If it will continue, the quality of content will become very low. It already is.

Lugaldu

WeerW3ir wrote: »

Because in fact the 1 year long stories are nothing to the stories which goes through years?? Also because they are just a badly clone of eachother? Tho while khajiits had an interesting story, the skyrim storyline were so bad, almost unforgetable. Blackwood not even try.

Orion_89 wrote: »

It might not be obvious to you, but for many people Summerset became a location where they are actually living in game (Hi, empty Elsweyr and western Skyrim! Their smaller dlc regions are also dead zones).

Still, that's your opinion. For example, I didn't like the main quest/story in Morrowind, even if it was linked to CWC and Summerset and I liked last year's story, despite some weaknesses in Q2.

xeNNNNN

Klad wrote: »

When MMO's are launched there is a roadmap that guides the devs where the game should go and what characters should guide it so when the series started I was naturally impressed with a core of memorable characters When the series started we had these three badasses that took us through awesome adventures.





Now the devs have decided to mix things up...so for some unfathomable reason now we have three very anemic npc's , The annoying elf with the annoying voice, The Chris Cyborg clone whose main contribution is scowling last but certainly not least Lyranth the "Foolkiller" who has [snip] and is compelled to say "Little Mortal" at the end of every sentence.. (Oh I didn't forget the Argonian...he is just a doorstop and doesn't really matter)

I really don't know why [snip] are now the face of Tamriel's warriors



[snip]

They just seem completely weak, devoid of any charisma and no bulk at all which to make matters worse, these two bested A DAEDRIC PRINCE? Come on... There's not even a heroic stance or positioning. They just seem....well for the lack of a better term....pathetic. Remember the AvA Trailers? The DC Hero, AD Hero and EP Hero? NOW THAT was good promotional material and they stuck and have done for the longest time. Not just the trailers though the art that came with it was amazing.

To this day those old trailers are still some of my favourite promotional material to date.

I will say for this recent promotional material for blackwood, someone has been playing too much AC odyssey and Valhalla. Specifically regarding the hero in the middle. Are they trying to make Kassandra/eivor the generic female now? lol Feels really repetitive. Not sure how I feel about ZoS using the repetitive design philosophy of ubisoft haha At least ZoS doesn't kill well written female characters at every chance they get like Ubi.

I would even go as far to argue that in comparison of the first artwork the game had and now this blackwood art - its lost its maturity. The original art was very clearly heroic, mature...seasoned. The second art just looks like a bunch of people slapped on some Armor and said "sureeeee daggy, we'll take you" and then some how won. I feel like I am Abna Tharn right now lol

Come on marketing & Art team, you're better than this! I know you are because I was here in beta it was because of the art and the marketing that got me interested in the first place!

Rykoth

Klad wrote: »

When MMO's are launched there is a roadmap that guides the devs where the game should go and what characters should guide it so when the series started I was naturally impressed with a core of memorable characters When the series started we had these three badasses that took us through awesome adventures.





Now the devs have decided to mix things up...so for some unfathomable reason now we have three very anemic npc's , The annoying elf with the annoying voice, The Chris Cyborg clone whose main contribution is scowling last but certainly not least Lyranth the "Foolkiller" who has [snip] and is compelled to say "Little Mortal" at the end of every sentence.. (Oh I didn't forget the Argonian...he is just a doorstop and doesn't really matter)

I really don't know why [snip] are now the face of Tamriel's warriors



[snip]

Let's look at your critiques.

"The annoying elf with the annoying voice."
"The Chris Cyborg clone."
[snip]

All women (or in the case of Lyranth, female presenting.)

You're not making a serious critique. You're not even making a good faith argument. It's a bad faith argument because to me it sounds like you've just got an issue with women.

That annoying elf with the annoying voice helped the Hero of Tamriel become the Hero of Wrothgar.
The Chris Cyborg clone is a CGI representation of the player character, and is an awesome looking Imperial.
I'm not even going to give you the satisfaction of your insulting language just because you don't like how Lyranth moves.

So yeah. Bad faith argument coming from a malicious place. Must be a day that ends in Y.

[edited to remove quoted content]

Jazraena

The generic Nord is completely over the top, the Breton is the Aassassin's Creed super acrobat if anything and the elf has cleavage for cleavage's sake. After the trailer they weren't ever important again beyond the occasional costume, and two of those aren't even good.

The new generic Imperial is at least wearing full body dress/armour, even though I'd wish the breastplate would extend across her belly, and Lyranth is still one of my favourite characters in this game - and is, well, a character. The same goes for Eveli, with my only caveat being my general dislike for short and frail archers because that's not how bows work.


How you could want to exchange Lyranth and Eveli with generic_nord_01, generic_breton_02 and generic_altmerfantasyelf_03 is beyond me.

KalyanLazair

I really enjoyed Elsweyr, but Skyrim was a total let down. Also, zones have become smaller and smaller with each release, and they don't feel as lively as other zones in the game. Aside from the one or two big settlements, the rest feels kind of empty. In my opinion, the absolute best DLC hands down is Wrothgar. The story is awesome, the area is huge and the exploration of orc culture is fantastic. Morrowind was also very well done, with a lot of stuff to do. I keep going back to both zones from time to time.

I like Summerset, and the story was ok, but I was honestly not that impressed. Zone is beautiful, but it does feel smaller and less full than both Worthgar and Morrowind. Northern Elsweyr had a nice story, and the map size is decent, but it feels empty and traversing with that rift splitting it in half makes traversing it more annoying than challenging. Murkmire is a horrible map, and the argonians felt more like cartoons comic reliefs than a true culture, and don't even get me started on how disappointing Skyrim was.

Oblivion is, by far, my favorite game, so I'm not having high expectations about Blackwood, considering what they did with Skyrim. For me the game has been going downhill ever since Morrowind, at least content wise. Morrowind was the last big map we ever got. The rest have been tiny maps with very little going on outside of the main quest. They keep tossing these two tiny, boring maps, and the two of them together can't even approach what a single big map like Morrowind or Wrothgar is. It's like they've stopped trying.

xeNNNNN

KalyanLazair wrote: »

I really enjoyed Elsweyr, but Skyrim was a total let down. Also, zones have become smaller and smaller with each release, and they don't feel as lively as other zones in the game. Aside from the one or two big settlements, the rest feels kind of empty. In my opinion, the absolute best DLC hands down is Wrothgar. The story is awesome, the area is huge and the exploration of orc culture is fantastic. Morrowind was also very well done, with a lot of stuff to do. I keep going back to both zones from time to time.

I like Summerset, and the story was ok, but I was honestly not that impressed. Zone is beautiful, but it does feel smaller and less full than both Worthgar and Morrowind. Northern Elsweyr had a nice story, and the map size is decent, but it feels empty and traversing with that rift splitting it in half makes traversing it more annoying than challenging. Murkmire is a horrible map, and the argonians felt more like cartoons comic reliefs than a true culture, and don't even get me started on how disappointing Skyrim was.

Oblivion is, by far, my favorite game, so I'm not having high expectations about Blackwood, considering what they did with Skyrim. For me the game has been going downhill ever since Morrowind, at least content wise. Morrowind was the last big map we ever got. The rest have been tiny maps with very little going on outside of the main quest. They keep tossing these two tiny, boring maps, and the two of them together can't even approach what a single big map like Morrowind or Wrothgar is. It's like they've stopped trying.

I can agree with this assessment, I think for me blackwood has been the worst... it was cool at first but then you realise just how little is on the map and it just feels like a DLC zone over a expansion (chapter). They're dropping the ball.

I will say though that summerset was by far my favourite area to run through the quests were interesting the environment was beautiful the story was really intriguing for me, the biggest let down for me with summerset was nocturnal which I still think they haven't fixed; Her character model. "Hi Im the big bad of the entire thing I had so much build up so im not going to show you my true form I will just show you the A typical redgaurd woman in my naughty dress". It was just a gigantic default model. Incredibly boring.