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Block Cost Bug
-
Soul_Demon✭✭✭✭✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......7 -
Calypso589✭✭✭Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.2 -
Soul_Demon✭✭✭✭✭Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
I get it.....I mean it really has more relevance when you have been here long enough to see a track record vs May of last year. I can see it may appear to you that its a simple thing to just wait this one time till it fits "our' timeline......but when you see it virtually every patch for years with posts up in PTS warning of issues that are pushed live over and over- you begin to see a very different thing.....and start to interpret simple statements from Community Mangers in a different way.5 -
Vevvev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I just thought they boosted the light armor weakness or something, but this explains why in my duels I lost all my stamina after just a couple seconds of blocking.PC NA - Ceyanna Ashton - Breton Vampire MagDK1 -
SirNom✭✭✭Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
everything else that was said aside, if stadia is the real reason we have to wait, then why was such a clearly abysmal contract set up between zos and stadia and why has it not been addressed. They cannot update their own game because they have to wait for approval for stadia (I know of no one that uses stadia personally). I would love to see the stats of how many stadia players play the game consistently compared to alternatives - if stadia holds a over 10 or even 5% if that, I would be surprised.
Whomever signed the contract between stadia and a huge game company like bethesda/zos should be reprimanded for their inability to see possible issues like this now. How can such a mistake be made in the first place, and the further more, why has it not been fixed?6 -
Dabulousness✭✭When is console getting the fix? Are we going to need to wait even longer than the 14th or will you be squeezing it into the console chapter release?2
-
danthemann5✭✭✭✭✭
✭It costs money and time (which are essentially the same thing) to push out quick and/or multiple fixes.
It costs exactly nothing to ignore people complaining on the forum regardless of how justified the complaints may be.ZeniMax has no obligation to correct any errors or defects in the Services.
Greetings! We've closed this thread due to its non-constructive nature.
"You know you don't have to be here right?" - ZOS_RichLambert1 -
Calypso589✭✭✭Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
everything else that was said aside, if stadia is the real reason we have to wait, then why was such a clearly abysmal contract set up between zos and stadia and why has it not been addressed. They cannot update their own game because they have to wait for approval for stadia (I know of no one that uses stadia personally). I would love to see the stats of how many stadia players play the game consistently compared to alternatives - if stadia holds a over 10 or even 5% if that, I would be surprised.
Whomever signed the contract between stadia and a huge game company like bethesda/zos should be reprimanded for their inability to see possible issues like this now. How can such a mistake be made in the first place, and the further more, why has it not been fixed?
It's not necessarily a contract thing.
It takes time to certify new patches when you're a platform holder and you wanna make sure everything's on the up and up.
It's not new.
This is exactly how it works for consoles and why they get patches much later.
There's a process that has to happen.
You also have to remember that you're not the only game certifying a new patch. This is why the process can take a week or so.
ZoS has to work with that. It's just business.
It's annoying sometimes sure, but it's not like it's hidden from us. This is how it's been for years.Edited by Calypso589 on June 7, 2021 4:57PM2 -
Soul_Demon✭✭✭✭✭Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
everything else that was said aside, if stadia is the real reason we have to wait, then why was such a clearly abysmal contract set up between zos and stadia and why has it not been addressed. They cannot update their own game because they have to wait for approval for stadia (I know of no one that uses stadia personally). I would love to see the stats of how many stadia players play the game consistently compared to alternatives - if stadia holds a over 10 or even 5% if that, I would be surprised.
Whomever signed the contract between stadia and a huge game company like bethesda/zos should be reprimanded for their inability to see possible issues like this now. How can such a mistake be made in the first place, and the further more, why has it not been fixed?
Agreed for sure...I dont use it either-2 -
Calypso589✭✭✭Soul_Demon wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
I get it.....I mean it really has more relevance when you have been here long enough to see a track record vs May of last year. I can see it may appear to you that its a simple thing to just wait this one time till it fits "our' timeline......but when you see it virtually every patch for years with posts up in PTS warning of issues that are pushed live over and over- you begin to see a very different thing.....and start to interpret simple statements from Community Mangers in a different way.
Developers have schedules and finding a bug, replicating it and fixing it takes time. Certification across various platforms once you have a patch to put out also takes time.
This has been the "track record" since I started playing 4 years ago.
If you have an expectation of how much time you think it should take, then you're going to be disappointed a lot and I would advise you either take up coding yourself or drop those expectations.
/shrug
0 -
BlakMarket✭✭✭✭Honestly this is crazy I changed two toons from nord to imperial because of sustain issues, to realize it was a BUG!!!!!!!! Who would I speak to, to get a refund of race change tokens.
5 -
Soul_Demon✭✭✭✭✭Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
I get it.....I mean it really has more relevance when you have been here long enough to see a track record vs May of last year. I can see it may appear to you that its a simple thing to just wait this one time till it fits "our' timeline......but when you see it virtually every patch for years with posts up in PTS warning of issues that are pushed live over and over- you begin to see a very different thing.....and start to interpret simple statements from Community Mangers in a different way.
Developers have schedules and finding a bug, replicating it and fixing it takes time. Certification across various platforms once you have a patch to put out also takes time.
This has been the "track record" since I started playing 4 years ago.
If you have an expectation of how much time you think it should take, then you're going to be disappointed a lot and I would advise you either take up coding yourself or drop those expectations.
/shrug
Thanks for the advice--- I am really comfortable with you feeling that way about it. I on the other hand simply dont agree and could not be further in opinion on the issue.4 -
Calypso589✭✭✭Soul_Demon wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
I get it.....I mean it really has more relevance when you have been here long enough to see a track record vs May of last year. I can see it may appear to you that its a simple thing to just wait this one time till it fits "our' timeline......but when you see it virtually every patch for years with posts up in PTS warning of issues that are pushed live over and over- you begin to see a very different thing.....and start to interpret simple statements from Community Mangers in a different way.
Developers have schedules and finding a bug, replicating it and fixing it takes time. Certification across various platforms once you have a patch to put out also takes time.
This has been the "track record" since I started playing 4 years ago.
If you have an expectation of how much time you think it should take, then you're going to be disappointed a lot and I would advise you either take up coding yourself or drop those expectations.
/shrug
Thanks for the advice--- I am really comfortable with you feeling that way about it. I on the other hand simply dont agree and could not be further in opinion on the issue.
I mean it's not really something to agree or disagree with. It's just....how it works?
You can't magically make bug fixing or platform certification go faster. It wasn't a "mistake" that was made when these deals are finalized.
Sometimes the time table isn't favorable. Welcome to life.
1 -
iksde✭✭✭✭Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
I get it.....I mean it really has more relevance when you have been here long enough to see a track record vs May of last year. I can see it may appear to you that its a simple thing to just wait this one time till it fits "our' timeline......but when you see it virtually every patch for years with posts up in PTS warning of issues that are pushed live over and over- you begin to see a very different thing.....and start to interpret simple statements from Community Mangers in a different way.
Developers have schedules and finding a bug, replicating it and fixing it takes time. Certification across various platforms once you have a patch to put out also takes time.
This has been the "track record" since I started playing 4 years ago.
If you have an expectation of how much time you think it should take, then you're going to be disappointed a lot and I would advise you either take up coding yourself or drop those expectations.
/shrug
Thanks for the advice--- I am really comfortable with you feeling that way about it. I on the other hand simply dont agree and could not be further in opinion on the issue.
I mean it's not really something to agree or disagree with. It's just....how it works?
You can't magically make bug fixing or platform certification go faster. It wasn't a "mistake" that was made when these deals are finalized.
Sometimes the time table isn't favorable. Welcome to life.
welcome to life...but why in games also which are escape from life? as I see most of whiteknghts here never ahve player literally any other mmo game besides eso which isnt even that much fully mmo...atleast from basic desing of devs when they was working on this game....if you have played literally eny other successfull mmo you could see not a single this game had so much, so bad problems as eso have not only with patches but a simple maitenances.
I have played some online games and I never experienced any game to have so much downtimes of servers and need to turn offline servers just for simple maitenance for hours or even entire days and especially Ihavnt seen anywere else need to do maitenance for maitencance over maitenance becasue of maitenance before after patch which even wasn't that big as they can be in MMO games and still not have that bad, big problemsand long downtimes of servers
Im just surprised how most people here doesnt see it and still pay for this...oh ok I forget...they jsut didnt play any other bigger mmo game to have compare how mmo game should work and how it shouldnt especially for paying customer
the best here is that there is so many f2p game working much better than eso and threating their customers very well in compare to here1 -
SirNom✭✭✭Calypso589 wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
everything else that was said aside, if stadia is the real reason we have to wait, then why was such a clearly abysmal contract set up between zos and stadia and why has it not been addressed. They cannot update their own game because they have to wait for approval for stadia (I know of no one that uses stadia personally). I would love to see the stats of how many stadia players play the game consistently compared to alternatives - if stadia holds a over 10 or even 5% if that, I would be surprised.
Whomever signed the contract between stadia and a huge game company like bethesda/zos should be reprimanded for their inability to see possible issues like this now. How can such a mistake be made in the first place, and the further more, why has it not been fixed?
It's not necessarily a contract thing.
It takes time to certify new patches when you're a platform holder and you wanna make sure everything's on the up and up.
It's not new.
This is exactly how it works for consoles and why they get patches much later.
There's a process that has to happen.
You also have to remember that you're not the only game certifying a new patch. This is why the process can take a week or so.
ZoS has to work with that. It's just business.
It's annoying sometimes sure, but it's not like it's hidden from us. This is how it's been for years.
Other MMOs and games do not take this long to update such bugs, sure they might have to wait for PS + XBOX due to various reasons(i highly doubt it would be a week), but they are on a separate server anyway. They have no excuse for waiting when they themselves should be able to update their game through steam and their own software instantly - the only thing holding them back is stadia. If they need to go through a thorough process of checking things over a week, just to be sure they don't make mistakes over such a small issue, then perhaps they need people with better skill at their disposal, or they should outsource.
Stadia is the only thing in my mind holding them back and quite honestly, because I know of no one that uses it - I question the logic in making thousands waiting for a bug to be fixed just for the small few that use stadia. Maybe stadia has a bigger standing that I realise and accounts for lots of loyal eso players, but I doubt it. Block bug affects end game players more than most and them not fixing it instantly just continues to show in my eyes that they do not give a damn about end game players and they continue to cater to people that enjoy the roleplay. This game has excellent combat and not many people experience end game because ZoS do not know how to market and cater to end game players. I feel like they are completely out of touch with end game players and have only one interest. Making money.3 -
Calypso589✭✭✭Calypso589 wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
everything else that was said aside, if stadia is the real reason we have to wait, then why was such a clearly abysmal contract set up between zos and stadia and why has it not been addressed. They cannot update their own game because they have to wait for approval for stadia (I know of no one that uses stadia personally). I would love to see the stats of how many stadia players play the game consistently compared to alternatives - if stadia holds a over 10 or even 5% if that, I would be surprised.
Whomever signed the contract between stadia and a huge game company like bethesda/zos should be reprimanded for their inability to see possible issues like this now. How can such a mistake be made in the first place, and the further more, why has it not been fixed?
It's not necessarily a contract thing.
It takes time to certify new patches when you're a platform holder and you wanna make sure everything's on the up and up.
It's not new.
This is exactly how it works for consoles and why they get patches much later.
There's a process that has to happen.
You also have to remember that you're not the only game certifying a new patch. This is why the process can take a week or so.
ZoS has to work with that. It's just business.
It's annoying sometimes sure, but it's not like it's hidden from us. This is how it's been for years.
Other MMOs and games do not take this long to update such bugs, sure they might have to wait for PS + XBOX due to various reasons(i highly doubt it would be a week), but they are on a separate server anyway. They have no excuse for waiting when they themselves should be able to update their game through steam and their own software instantly - the only thing holding them back is stadia. If they need to go through a thorough process of checking things over a week, just to be sure they don't make mistakes over such a small issue, then perhaps they need people with better skill at their disposal, or they should outsource.
Stadia is the only thing in my mind holding them back and quite honestly, because I know of no one that uses it - I question the logic in making thousands waiting for a bug to be fixed just for the small few that use stadia. Maybe stadia has a bigger standing that I realise and accounts for lots of loyal eso players, but I doubt it. Block bug affects end game players more than most and them not fixing it instantly just continues to show in my eyes that they do not give a damn about end game players and they continue to cater to people that enjoy the roleplay. This game has excellent combat and not many people experience end game because ZoS do not know how to market and cater to end game players. I feel like they are completely out of touch with end game players and have only one interest. Making money.
/sigh
/facepalm
No, ZoS is not taking the week to "check over things." That's not what the certification process entails.
The bug fix has already undergone it's testing. It and anything else that will come with next week's patch.
The process takes this long because it does and you also have to consider ESO isn't the only game on Stadia, Sony or MS. It's not the only game pushing builds to be certified.
And yes it DOES take this long to wait for PS and Xbox to get patches. Why do you think consoles always get patches after PC and Stadia?
Because of certification.
The standard length of time for this process for Stadia, PS and MS is about a week.
===========================================================================
And I appreciate your bit about endgame players (such as myself) but no, the block cost bug doesn't affect as much. As an end game tank I know what I need to block and what I don't need to block so while the bug is certainly annoying, it's not killing runs by any stretch.
New tanks and new players are the ones suffering because they're more likely to perma block everything as they learn.
And what's this about not fixing it?
They are?
It's just that so many people in this thread apparently don't know how real life works in this industry and why sometimes we have to wait.
It takes time to identify, replicate and fix a bug. It can't be done "instantly." That's not how real life works.
It takes time to certify a patch through your console vendor.
That's just the reality for all game developers. All of them.
Edited by Calypso589 on June 7, 2021 6:37PM2 -
Calypso589✭✭✭Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
I get it.....I mean it really has more relevance when you have been here long enough to see a track record vs May of last year. I can see it may appear to you that its a simple thing to just wait this one time till it fits "our' timeline......but when you see it virtually every patch for years with posts up in PTS warning of issues that are pushed live over and over- you begin to see a very different thing.....and start to interpret simple statements from Community Mangers in a different way.
Developers have schedules and finding a bug, replicating it and fixing it takes time. Certification across various platforms once you have a patch to put out also takes time.
This has been the "track record" since I started playing 4 years ago.
If you have an expectation of how much time you think it should take, then you're going to be disappointed a lot and I would advise you either take up coding yourself or drop those expectations.
/shrug
Thanks for the advice--- I am really comfortable with you feeling that way about it. I on the other hand simply dont agree and could not be further in opinion on the issue.
I mean it's not really something to agree or disagree with. It's just....how it works?
You can't magically make bug fixing or platform certification go faster. It wasn't a "mistake" that was made when these deals are finalized.
Sometimes the time table isn't favorable. Welcome to life.
welcome to life...but why in games also which are escape from life? as I see most of whiteknghts here never ahve player literally any other mmo game besides eso which isnt even that much fully mmo...atleast from basic desing of devs when they was working on this game....if you have played literally eny other successfull mmo you could see not a single this game had so much, so bad problems as eso have not only with patches but a simple maitenances.
I have played some online games and I never experienced any game to have so much downtimes of servers and need to turn offline servers just for simple maitenance for hours or even entire days and especially Ihavnt seen anywere else need to do maitenance for maitencance over maitenance becasue of maitenance before after patch which even wasn't that big as they can be in MMO games and still not have that bad, big problemsand long downtimes of servers
Im just surprised how most people here doesnt see it and still pay for this...oh ok I forget...they jsut didnt play any other bigger mmo game to have compare how mmo game should work and how it shouldnt especially for paying customer
the best here is that there is so many f2p game working much better than eso and threating their customers very well in compare to here
"but why in games also which are escape from life?"
^ I want this on a shirt0 -
Calypso589✭✭✭@ZOS_GinaBruno Love you for putting up with what you do. So much ignorance in here. Yeesh.
I hope the studio has a rage room. :P1 -
Soul_Demon✭✭✭✭✭Calypso589 wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Calypso589 wrote: »Soul_Demon wrote: »ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
Good question..this to me is more insulting than it having to be the players who catch this in the first place. I read her post but what I get from it is "Glad you paid for the patch....appreciate you guys funding our troubleshooting program here at ZOS- otherwise we could not charge for product that isn't functioning properly at 7 years in- We are so happy you guys are willing financially to support our jobs while we develop our proficiency in game development" .....this is what I hear in my head when I read something that is doing the majority of leg work for the Dev team and they put off fixes till its convenient for them ......
I can't speak for whatever's going on in your head..........but the reason we have to wait the week is most likely because of the certification process for Stadia.
everything else that was said aside, if stadia is the real reason we have to wait, then why was such a clearly abysmal contract set up between zos and stadia and why has it not been addressed. They cannot update their own game because they have to wait for approval for stadia (I know of no one that uses stadia personally). I would love to see the stats of how many stadia players play the game consistently compared to alternatives - if stadia holds a over 10 or even 5% if that, I would be surprised.
Whomever signed the contract between stadia and a huge game company like bethesda/zos should be reprimanded for their inability to see possible issues like this now. How can such a mistake be made in the first place, and the further more, why has it not been fixed?
It's not necessarily a contract thing.
It takes time to certify new patches when you're a platform holder and you wanna make sure everything's on the up and up.
It's not new.
This is exactly how it works for consoles and why they get patches much later.
There's a process that has to happen.
You also have to remember that you're not the only game certifying a new patch. This is why the process can take a week or so.
ZoS has to work with that. It's just business.
It's annoying sometimes sure, but it's not like it's hidden from us. This is how it's been for years.
Other MMOs and games do not take this long to update such bugs, sure they might have to wait for PS + XBOX due to various reasons(i highly doubt it would be a week), but they are on a separate server anyway. They have no excuse for waiting when they themselves should be able to update their game through steam and their own software instantly - the only thing holding them back is stadia. If they need to go through a thorough process of checking things over a week, just to be sure they don't make mistakes over such a small issue, then perhaps they need people with better skill at their disposal, or they should outsource.
Stadia is the only thing in my mind holding them back and quite honestly, because I know of no one that uses it - I question the logic in making thousands waiting for a bug to be fixed just for the small few that use stadia. Maybe stadia has a bigger standing that I realise and accounts for lots of loyal eso players, but I doubt it. Block bug affects end game players more than most and them not fixing it instantly just continues to show in my eyes that they do not give a damn about end game players and they continue to cater to people that enjoy the roleplay. This game has excellent combat and not many people experience end game because ZoS do not know how to market and cater to end game players. I feel like they are completely out of touch with end game players and have only one interest. Making money.
/sigh
/facepalm
No, ZoS is not taking the week to "check over things." That's not what the certification process entails.
The bug fix has already undergone it's testing. It and anything else that will come with next week's patch.
The process takes this long because it does and you also have to consider ESO isn't the only game on Stadia, Sony or MS. It's not the only game pushing builds to be certified.
And yes it DOES take this long to wait for PS and Xbox to get patches. Why do you think consoles always get patches after PC and Stadia?
Because of certification.
The standard length of time for this process for Stadia, PS and MS is about a week.
===========================================================================
And I appreciate your bit about endgame players (such as myself) but no, the block cost bug doesn't affect as much. As an end game tank I know what I need to block and what I don't need to block so while the bug is certainly annoying, it's not killing runs by any stretch.
New tanks and new players are the ones suffering because they're more likely to perma block everything as they learn.
And what's this about not fixing it?
They are?
It's just that so many people in this thread apparently don't know how real life works in this industry and why sometimes we have to wait.
It takes time to identify, replicate and fix a bug. It can't be done "instantly." That's not how real life works.
It takes time to certify a patch through your console vendor.
That's just the reality for all game developers. All of them.
After reading your post now its becoming quite clear the 'white-knight' moniker is quite fitting....and here is the best part, you tank in PvE- and seem completely unaware there is more to the game than the tiny, infinitesimally small role you play in it.
PvP has a tremendous hit here with blocking malfunctioning, sets not giving stats or working and ranged skills distance broken. Now the next time there is something that has to do with end game tanking, I am perfectly willing to let you educate me on what to be bothered by....but until I ask for it ......its quite possible your attempts to ingratiate yourself with the staff here can be done elsewhere and the 'cool points' tracking board you feel must exist for cheerleaders of ZOS in forums can be earned elsewhere. Right?
5 -
guarstompemoji✭✭✭✭I did work in IT project management. It is a stressful job!
Fixing bugs in code isn't a simple endeavor. Sure, it can be simple for a small or personal project--but for a larger one, it needs:
1. Evaluate the bug. What part of the game does it pertain to? What is its scope? What is its potential impact? What is its relative importance to other bugs currently under code?
2. Once evaluated, the project manager must communicate the bug to the proper code staff. Different coding staff will have different specialities.
3. Once the proper coder is assigned the bug, priorities may need shifted. For example, were they working on x project? Is y more important? If y is, it may need shifted to later in the coder's queue, or shifted to another coder. Depending on the severity of the bug, there may be additional communication between code and the PM required as regards resource requirements and timeline. If this is the case, additional steps are required, as other people in the organization may need notified (such as communications).
4. Assigned coder addresses the bug.
5. Potential bug fix is communicated to the test group. This assumes there is a test group; maintaining a test group requires some overhead. For example, the test group needs to have received detailed communication regarding the bug, such as how to trigger it, where it existed, and its scope. Someone has to provide this detail. Therefore, not every bug will get the attention of a test group, and it is (haha) often more cost-efficient to have coders perform their own tests.
6. The test group, if there is one, communicates the results to code.
7. Based on the results of the test, does the bug need to go back to code? If so, go back to 4. If not, proceed to 8.
8. Once the bug fix is confirmed, this confirmation is communicated to the larger organization and any connected roles. These roles include documentation, project management, server administrators, communications, and in the case of larger bugs, higher management. The best companies include customer support within this loop.
9. Once communication occurs and testing is complete, the bug fix is placed into an upcoming patch queue, along side any other bug fixes they need to bundle with it, each supposedly having been through the same process. Which patch queue it is part of relies on previous evaluations. For example, does downtime need scheduled, or are server restarts required? If this is the case, it needs to be part of a patch where these activities are planned. If it is a large enough bug, then an emergency restart and patch session can be arranged--at the expense of overtime of all associated staff.
10. Once the patch is assigned to the appropriate, scheduled (or unscheduled) update, notes must be posted to communications staff, who are responsible for handing this information to the greater world (a post made to the forums, for example).
Processes which add to the time: Certification will add an additional step-and-check loop in the process above, as well as additional types of staff. Testing staff may have additional requirements and forms, for example--so, certification may require separate documents for bug tracking and submission versus testing, with the latter being more explicit. Who handles this documentation and communicates it? Who makes sure it is checked off?
Eventually, with the above process complete, the patch downtime is scheduled and occurs, as performed by server admin. The patches are pushed through, as performed by code. Communication occurs in appropriate areas (the forum, and/or the launcher + popup) as made by those staff.
...this repeats for each bug. The process involved means it's efficient to bundle bug fixes if possible--or at least schedule them together.
Even outside of Stadia, bundling patches and setting dates for them lets staff coordinate, as well as lets them better plan for server downtime. And, one might hope--allow code and PMs to slip extra bug fixes into patches, since code and other staff now have a "set date" when the restart, software push, and so on process will happen in an organized way.
I am not saying this is what ZOS Is doing. I don't know their process. More, I wished to speak up and say that, in general, "just pushing a fix" isn't a thing. For larger systems, coders aren't just coders--there's a spiderweb of staff working alongside and with them who are part of the process, whose work is often unacknowledged.
Also, at times, getting code to listen to bug reports and testing can be a task in and of itself. The old PEBCAK is a thing. Appreciate your testers and customer support personnel.
When ZOS first launched the patch, they probably had staff of each type pre-allocate additional hours for the first week for unexpected patches and downtime. We're nearing the end of that allocation period, and it may be Stadia, too. It may be certification. Or, the issue just touches too many parts of the game, or they've got enough that they need to "bundle."
Some or all of the above might be happening--I've no idea. I more wanted to say though, "just pushing" is a misconception. Possible for personal projects. Much more difficult for broader ones, with many moving parts.Edited by guarstompemoji on August 31, 2021 4:32AM2 -
Marto✭✭✭✭✭
✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
To put it simply
Because releasing fixes instantly, without 1-3 weeks of QA and certifications, is how you get sudden game breaking bugs."According to the calculations of the sages of the Cult of the Ancestor Moth, the batam guar is the cutest creature in all Tamriel"2 -
D1Storm✭I'm not a professional in programming and game design, but a natural question arises: the chapter on PC came out on June 1, messages that useless pieces of a full-fledged companion disappear equipment, let's say June 2-3 (yes, on the day the chapter is released on June 1) - a hotfix comes out on June 4 ... Please explain to me stupid: the fix and release of the fix in this case for what reasons did not require a week of waiting, approvals and similar actions? I really don't get it.And if such a problem was on pts why wasn't it mentioned in the chapter's patch note?4
-
Mahabahabtha✭✭✭✭✭let me guess...
2 Hotfixes handling the Item loss on companions does have no effect...
and we should believe your patch will help ?"In fact, I’ve met more PVEers that are worse at PvE than PvPers."2 -
SirNom✭✭✭@ calypso
Sigh and facepalm? Really?
"The process takes this long because it does.."
Well, I guess its figured out, lets go back home. You truly have a way with words.
Clearly there is an issue(you can see this by simply reading the whole thread), and solutions will not be made unless someone points out that there is a problem. If you don't think there is a problem, then I cannot help you. The world works and moves forward when flaws are pointed out. Progress will not be made by people just accepting things. So you can stop being so condescending and park your attitude. If ZOS has some answers, I will listen and have a constructive argument but I will not be lectured by a coward who calls others ignorant indirectly. Tagging Gina, as if she would support you when you insult others. Other people in this thread have been respectful, I see no reason why you should not be.
I am aware that there will be a lot of work required to update the game with a patch. However, I see no reason why a huge company cannot push this forward faster like other MMOs can. I want answers that are certain.
My question was not directed towards someone who wanted to guess at how things are and how they work. It was directed towards ZOS in an effort to say that people notice this is an issue and if there is a solution - please fix it.Edited by SirNom on June 7, 2021 11:00PM5 -
iksde✭✭✭✭ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »Hi everyone,
We got confirmation this morning that a fix for the block cost issue reported in this thread will be going into the next PC/Mac and Stadia incremental patch (on June 14.)
If there is a fix, why is this not instant? Why are we waiting another week?
To put it simply
Because releasing fixes instantly, without 1-3 weeks of QA and certifications, is how you get sudden game breaking bugs.
where was QA when releasing patch?0 -
blktauna✭✭✭✭✭
✭LOL everyone blames QA.
Stuff manifests in a live environment that will have you scratching your head. Unit testing and other automated testing can only test for what you tell it to. Then when you have to send the patch to sony... Speaking from experience here, they do what they do on their own timetable with their own rules. They can and will reject patches over strange stuff. Then you have to redo it and there's some more time for you.
As to hotfixes. Those are usually either REEEEEEELLLLY bad errors or cosmetic or something simple and not far reaching. the bad errors are gone over asap and tested in tandem with coding and its a group effort to make it correct as soon as humanly possible. The rest of hotfixes are usually simple things that its plain where the error was made and the fix was very simple and non invasive. Its not as easy as you think too tell which is which.
Alls I can say is that these folks prob know about all the stuff we are nagging about. Yes I get frustrated and nag as well. Yes I would love for some acknowledgement but in all seriousness, I'd rather they use their bandwidth fixing the stuff vs be distracted by having to explain whats happening to a forum manager so they can figure out what parts of that explanation they are actually allowed to share with forum readers.
TLDR yeah I'd love for more transparancy but I'm guessing theres a lot of stuff they cant share so we are where we are. I'm also sure they are fully aware of all the stuff we are complaining about.PCNA
PCEU1 -
Fennwitty✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I did work in IT project management. It is a thankless and stressful job!
Fixing bugs in code isn't a simple endeavor. Sure, it can be simple for a small or personal project--but for a larger one, it needs:
1. Communicate the bug to the proper code staff.
2. Ensure code staff is assigned the bug; priorities may need shifted. For example, were they working on x project? Is y more important? If y is, shift.
3. Assigned coder addresses the bug.
4. Potential bug fix is communicated to test group.
5. Test group communicates to code.
6. Does bug need to go back to code? If so, go back to 3. If not, proceed to 6.
7. Tested bug fix is confirmed, communicated to larger organization.
8. Final bug fix is placed into patch queue along side any other bug fixes they need to bundle with it, each supposedly having been through the same process.
9. Does downtime need scheduled, or restarts? Arrange for downtime/restarts. Communicate with code to determine the level of downtime estimated.
10. Prepare notes to send to communication staff (a post made on the forums, for example).
Certification will toss a loop in here, too, as well as additional types of staff. Documentation needs fit in there, too, along the way, which is a different set of staff.
With the above process complete, the downtime is scheduled and occurs, as performed by server admin. The patches are pushed through, as performed by code. Communication occurs in appropriate areas (the forum, and/or the launcher + popup) as made by those staff.
...this repeats for each bug. The process involved means it's efficient to bundle bug fixes if possible--or at least schedule them together.
Even outside of Stadia, finalizing a set date for a "patch launch" lets their staff plan--and one might hope--slip extra bug fixes since code and other staff now have a "set date" when the restart, software push, and so on process will happen in an organized way. Doing things in this manner also, theoretically, reduces server downtime.
I am not saying this is what ZOS Is doing. I don't know their process. More, I wished to speak up and say that, in general, "just pushing a fix" isn't a thing. For larger systems, coders aren't just coders--there's a spiderweb of staff working alongside and with them who are part of the process, whose work is often unacknowledged.
When ZOS first launched the patch, they probably had staff of each type pre-allocate additional hours for the first week for unexpected patches and downtime. We're nearing the end of that allocation period, and it may be Stadia, too. It may be certification. Or, the issue just touches too many parts of the game, or they've got enough that they need to "bundle."
Some or all of the above might be happening--I've no idea. I more wanted to say though, "just pushing" is a misconception. Possible for personal projects. Much more difficult for broader ones, with many moving parts.
All very true.
What ZoS appears to keep missing out is it takes WAY less time and effort to catch the bug during development, and not actually push it live. Whether it's staffing, procedures, internal communication I don't know but the QA continues to be the weak link.PC NA1 -
iksde✭✭✭✭LOL everyone blames QA.
as QA is a thing then why major gamebreaking bugs go to live even when they has been reported during PTS?
what about console with bugged af interface and many other hard bugs not letting for decent playing is a thing for months?
if thats nt a QA to blame then for sure that are devs to blame for not even providing QA or just ignoring, at cases like this there need to be someone for blate, thats impossible to not be anyone to blame for such miserability and letting it to be for so long2 -
Fennwitty✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Well the non-QA focused reason would be something like, "the devs change their code constantly so it's impossible to perform real QA testing."
Which is also possible, but then it's really a management issue.PC NA1
