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Dungeon Queue there has GOT to be a better way?

Veinblood1965
Veinblood1965
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OK I've played healers and tanks and those are great almost instant queue but playing a dps and queuing just plain sucks. Waiting 20 to 30 minutes to get a group, or waiting that long and the system just unques you for no reason(this has happened a few times in the last week btw), or zoning and just as you zone you get the queue invite only to have it gone and you have to requeue again after you zone and so on and so on.

Something is broken with the group finder anyway. Last night i queued for Stone Garden normal. I waited about 40 minutes and nothing. I finally just soloed a normal dungeon and requed and within ten minutes had the invite. Then of all things my daily random ended up being Stone Garden right after that which was about a 20 minute wait.

Just tossing out some ideas here but anything is better than this as a DPS. (And yes I could play my healer or tank but this is my new toon). How about normal dungeon option with no healer or tank, just take your chances. I can pretty much solo most of those anyway except those that require a group like Direfrost due to mechanics etc. Or even two man option? Make the dungeons a little harder in that case. Not the best options I'll admit but this is getting OLD fast. I was fine with it as i'd just go do other things while waiting until the bug started happening where you get unqueued for no reason at all just a BUG!. There just has to be a better alternative to what there is now.

And yes I could play my tank (once the bug is fixed with his skill points missing) but I like playing a dps from time time also.

RANT OVER now back to regularly scheduled programming.
Edited by Veinblood1965 on May 12, 2021 7:32PM
  • Odovacar
    Odovacar
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    if you're queued for more than 15 minutes requeue and one should pop-up soon. Also, if you queue for a specific dungeon expect your times to be longer. Big tip: find some guildies or even zone chat players to give you a hand...get a few in the group and the remaining roles should fill up quicker for you.

    Good luck OP!
  • Veinblood1965
    Veinblood1965
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    Odovacar wrote: »
    if you're queued for more than 15 minutes requeue and one should pop-up soon. Also, if you queue for a specific dungeon expect your times to be longer. Big tip: find some guildies or even zone chat players to give you a hand...get a few in the group and the remaining roles should fill up quicker for you.

    Good luck OP!

    Thank you Odovacar! YepI usually try and grab some guildies but sometimes I like PUGs it keeps me on my toes! Yeah I know weird eh? I didn't know that about the queing for specific dungeons, I guess that includes the three undaunted dailies?
  • Gundug
    Gundug
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    I’m not against adding a wildcard queue that has no role requirements, in addition to the regular queue. As long as everyone knows what they are getting into, I don’t see the harm.

    It’s somewhat unfortunate that dungeons were not designed with a scalable difficulty based on the number of people in the group. That would have eliminated wait times completely and accommodated more play styles.
  • Odovacar
    Odovacar
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    Odovacar wrote: »
    if you're queued for more than 15 minutes requeue and one should pop-up soon. Also, if you queue for a specific dungeon expect your times to be longer. Big tip: find some guildies or even zone chat players to give you a hand...get a few in the group and the remaining roles should fill up quicker for you.

    Good luck OP!

    Thank you Odovacar! YepI usually try and grab some guildies but sometimes I like PUGs it keeps me on my toes! Yeah I know weird eh? I didn't know that about the queing for specific dungeons, I guess that includes the three undaunted dailies?

    Yeah specific dungeons always take longer regardless of role but ofc DPS would be the longest. And I feel what you're saying too...PUG's can be sorta fun but i always prefer playing with players I've ran with over the years.

    One side note to random groups is sometimes (most of the time, lol) you have to pull/carry others through content and maybe have to help out so there's always that sense of community service I suppose, lol. I don't mind helping ever but when i waited 30+ minutes it can be frustrating.
  • NettleCarrier
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    I'd love a wildcard queue as often filling in for another role is a simple gear/CP swap away IF I were to even land in a dungeon where it was important to have proper gear. The queue system itself still has bugs too on top of it. Half the time when I queue as a full group of players I either have to wait 10 minutes or leave/reenter the queue for it to recognize that it doesn't need to search for players because we are already all here...
    GM of Gold Coast Corsairs - PCNA
  • Jeremy
    Jeremy
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    OK I've played healers and tanks and those are great almost instant queue but playing a dps and queuing just plain sucks. Waiting 20 to 30 minutes to get a group, or waiting that long and the system just unques you for no reason(this has happened a few times in the last week btw), or zoning and just as you zone you get the queue invite only to have it gone and you have to requeue again after you zone and so on and so on.

    Something is broken with the group finder anyway. Last night i queued for Stone Garden normal. I waited about 40 minutes and nothing. I finally just soloed a normal dungeon and requed and within ten minutes had the invite. Then of all things my daily random ended up being Stone Garden right after that which was about a 20 minute wait.

    Just tossing out some ideas here but anything is better than this as a DPS. (And yes I could play my healer or tank but this is my new toon). How about normal dungeon option with no healer or tank, just take your chances. I can pretty much solo most of those anyway except those that require a group like Direfrost due to mechanics etc. Or even two man option? Make the dungeons a little harder in that case. Not the best options I'll admit but this is getting OLD fast. I was semi fine with it until the bug started happening where you get unqueued for no reason at all just a BUG!.

    RANT OVER now back to regularly scheduled programming.

    It's because there is a severe shortage of players who play as tanks, even more so on this game than is usual for an MMORPG. They need to stop nerfing tanks, and start taking their problems seriously (like pets blocking their view so they can't watch for animations to block etc.). This game neglects tanks and actively works to make them secondary to DPS characters, so it really isn't any wonder when people stop playing them. Maybe when the precious DPS characters can't get into queues they will finally start taking this issue seriously and start paying some needed attention to tanks except when it comes to nerfing them so DPS classes can kill the more easily. Because that's usually the only time they pay any attention to them.

    So keep threads like this coming.
    Edited by Jeremy on May 10, 2021 5:16PM
  • Veinblood1965
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    Jeremy wrote: »
    OK I've played healers and tanks and those are great almost instant queue but playing a dps and queuing just plain sucks. Waiting 20 to 30 minutes to get a group, or waiting that long and the system just unques you for no reason(this has happened a few times in the last week btw), or zoning and just as you zone you get the queue invite only to have it gone and you have to requeue again after you zone and so on and so on.

    Something is broken with the group finder anyway. Last night i queued for Stone Garden normal. I waited about 40 minutes and nothing. I finally just soloed a normal dungeon and requed and within ten minutes had the invite. Then of all things my daily random ended up being Stone Garden right after that which was about a 20 minute wait.

    Just tossing out some ideas here but anything is better than this as a DPS. (And yes I could play my healer or tank but this is my new toon). How about normal dungeon option with no healer or tank, just take your chances. I can pretty much solo most of those anyway except those that require a group like Direfrost due to mechanics etc. Or even two man option? Make the dungeons a little harder in that case. Not the best options I'll admit but this is getting OLD fast. I was semi fine with it until the bug started happening where you get unqueued for no reason at all just a BUG!.

    RANT OVER now back to regularly scheduled programming.

    It's because there is a severe shortage of players who play as tanks, even more so on this game than is usual for an MMORPG. They need to stop nerfing tanks, and start taking their problems seriously (like pets blocking their view so they can't watch for animations to block etc.). This game neglects tanks and actively works to make them secondary to DPS characters, so it really isn't any wonder when people stop playing them. Maybe when the precious DPS characters can't get into queues they will finally start taking this issue seriously and start paying some needed attention to tanks except when it comes to nerfing them so DPS classes can kill the more easily. Because that's usually the only time they pay any attention to them.

    So keep threads like this coming.

    This is true, tanks are in short supply. I brought my DK tank out of mothballs a few weeks ago as I was tired of the wait times even though I like my new DPS toon, only to find all his skill points are completely gone. Still waiting on that to be fixed as I opened a ticket.

    Just has to be something better than this, I like running the dungeons but just about have gotten to the point I'm done with DPS and undaunted PUGS lol.
  • Klad
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    I used to Tank...

    But with all the pets flapping in my face, and having folks screaming "Fake Tank" at the top of their lungs... I just stopped queuing up for Dungeons... and in a few weeks I can just grab a friend and we can do dungeons with our companions. I can Tank or DPS or even heal, If I want to actually enjoy the work the devs put into a Dungeon I can, without hearing, "gogogogogogogogogoogo" the days of playing this game like a speed run vending machine is over.

    Certain people in the community did this to themselves, I for one have zero empathy about it.

    Edited by Klad on May 10, 2021 5:35PM
  • Fennwitty
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    Lots of people have success forming PUGs through /zone chat, then queuing when the group's full. Especially if you have some kind of dps parse or other sales pitch to let strangers know you won't be a carry.

    Also allows you to do agreed-upon fake roles that way.

    PC NA
  • Hexi
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    Worry not, in few weeks every single dungeon will be 2 DPS and their companions.

    Then they go into vet dungeons and get absolutely destroyed and then ZOS has to nerf Vet DLC dungeons to the ground and the only content left that requires a functioning frontal cortex will be Trials.
  • BazOfWar
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    I want to do the undaunted random normal/vets for the rewards/geodes but i am tired of waiting or getting groups with toxic people and people who drop from party for no reason.

    Is there a way to get these random normal/vets to port you solo?
  • Starlight_Whisper
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    Gundug wrote: »
    I’m not against adding a wildcard queue that has no role requirements, in addition to the regular queue. As long as everyone knows what they are getting into, I don’t see the harm.

    It’s somewhat unfortunate that dungeons were not designed with a scalable difficulty based on the number of people in the group. That would have eliminated wait times completely and accommodated more play styles.

    Wildcard jiy means make healers.more useless
  • Hexi
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    BazOfWar wrote: »
    I want to do the undaunted random normal/vets for the rewards/geodes but i am tired of waiting or getting groups with toxic people and people who drop from party for no reason.

    Is there a way to get these random normal/vets to port you solo?

    You could just join a guild and make friends.
  • Ceejengine
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    Klad wrote: »
    I used to Tank...

    But with all the pets flapping in my face, and having folks screaming "Fake Tank" at the top of their lungs... I just stopped queuing up for Dungeons... and in a few weeks I can just grab a friend and we can do dungeons with our companions.

    This right here is why I am so excited for companions as a tank, especially in vet dungeons.

    Everyone pointing out that there is a critical shortage of tanks is 100% correct. DPS community in this game is the most toxic group of people I have ever had to deal with. I started playing DAoC and have consistently played a tank or tanklike in every MMO I've played. I started WoW in BC as a warrior tank then a DK in the next xpac. Warrior -> Berserker in FF14. Paladin + reaver in Rift. Warrior in GW2. I played a damn tank in Ferentus. Realm Online. Tera. Defiance. I've tanked in games I can't even remember the name of.

    What I'm getting at is that I've been an endgame content tank for many years across many games for many communities. All communities have problem players and stereotypical toxic gamers. But for ESO I have never been so disappointed in an entire group of players as I am with the overall attitude and demeanor of DPS mains, especially PVP DPS mains.

    For the most part it seems to be mid-to-high CP DPS players with relatively low skill have a terrible elitist,, selfish attitude, and there seems to be a LOT of them. I have been in nfungal grotto 1 or darkshade 1 and have seen CP 810s (back when that was the cap) absolutely tear apart and belittle low level brand new players that are still learning how to play the game.

    I've seen people miss a single mechanic in a dungeon they've never been to and immediate get a vote kick prompt.

    I run 4 tanks and 1 DPS through their random + daily pledges. If I miss a single taunt, or a single 1-hit kill mechanic, the flaming immediately kicks up without fail.

    I just had a vet ICP run w/ no deaths until our healer missed a portal on LW and died. Neither DPS made any attempt ever to revive this player and as soon as we wiped, there was a vote kick initiated. Right after the vote to kick started these two idiots start reaming the healer.

    I bounced & regrouped w/ the random heals and 2 guild DPS and requeued.

    Like, what cards do they think they even hold? They're waiting 20+ mins on a good a day to get into a dungeon. My queue is the duration it takes me to press P and hit Queue.

    Then you get these people coming onto forums and screaming about how its ZOS's fault no one wants to tank or heal. You get extremely rude people on these forums constantly making demands from ZOS, then attacking every single thing they put out as if its absolute trash.

    Then they flame and make these posts about how ZOS is trash because they don't actively communicate with players.

    I always sit here like "Yeah, I wouldn't want to talk to you about anything either."

    When I see people raging about long queue times and why doesn't anyone want to tank I always want to reply "You're right nobody wants to tank - for you."

    I loooove tanking in vet dungeons for friends and guildies. I even love farming dungeons that I need nothing out of just to help someone get a good set they want for their build.

    And I will be sooo ecstatic to replace awful people with NPC's that I can build however I need. Especially if we can get NPC dps numbers competitive with mid-to-low skill DPS players.

    In fact, I'd love to see them add a "duo queue with companions" option in the dungeon finder. It's all I would ever queue on. Pick a guildy or friend, build your companions to compliment team setup, and get in there and get your loot. I'd love it.

    I've found that all the kind hearted, friendly people tend to end up in great guilds that all play together constantly. If any of my guild mates or friends ask if anyone is willing to tank, I always drop what I'm doing to help. Because they're good people and I enjoy playing with them.

    I will lose 0 sleep over people with these godawful anonymous gamer attitudes experiencing an exponentially high queue time, or even an outright inability to get into randoms without asking or paying for help. They did it to themselves with self-centered whining and bullying everyone that wasn't a convenience to them.

    I've had people I don't even know message me in game respectfully ask me if I'd give them a hand in x vet content because they're having a hard time. 100% I'm there for you.

    I'll agree that I'd like ZOS to stop tuning out tanks for PvP. Patch after patch ZOS knocks out sustain and survivability and punishes clever tank builds to accommodate mid-to-low skilled PVP DPS players.

    This upcoming patch is halving the Dark Shade ability on my NB. Its not even a really good heal over time. But if you ask why, you can plainly see its because of DPS PVP folks coming in droves and complaining about how imbalanced it is that a player who builds defensively for survivability doesn't get immediately shredded by them.

    And now it's creating an awful precedent for PVP where every build is just CC -> Burst -> Execute. Variety is completely dead and I'll bet a dollar that within the next 1-2 yrs we're going to see yet another massive class overhaul to address the disparity.

    Lastly, if your queue times are getting out of hand, feel free to befriend a tank. Every one I've met so far is like me, patient and willing to help. If tanks are unwilling to play with you in PvE content, that's a personal problem, not a problem with the game.


    Man that was a lot longer than I expected. Thank you internet therapist.
    Edited by Ceejengine on May 10, 2021 7:17PM
  • BazOfWar
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    Hexi wrote: »
    BazOfWar wrote: »
    I want to do the undaunted random normal/vets for the rewards/geodes but i am tired of waiting or getting groups with toxic people and people who drop from party for no reason.

    Is there a way to get these random normal/vets to port you solo?

    You could just join a guild and make friends.

    Thanks for the input but that isn't what I asked.

  • Iccotak
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    1. The problem is simply that not enough people play tanks or healers
    2. Make Friends & Join a guild that does that content regularly

    when I do dungeons I ONLY play support roles. I am a competent tank and its faster for me.

    I am workin on DPS for Trials - because you never know what roles are available when joining a Trial group.
  • Tsar_Gekkou
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    Lots of decent tanks only play with premades because the average dps is horrible, and a lot of tanks don't want to sit in a dungeon for an hour when it could be done in 20 minutes.
    Xbox NA healer main
    vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMoL HM | vHoF HM | vAS+2 | vCR+3 | vBRP | vSS HM | vKA HM | vRG HM |
    Flawless Conqueror | Spirit Slayer | Dro-mA'thra Destroyer | Tick-Tock-Tormentor | Immortal Redeemer | Gryphon Heart | Godslayer | Dawnbringer | Planesbreaker |
  • Hexi
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    Lots of decent tanks only play with premades because the average dps is horrible, and a lot of tanks don't want to sit in a dungeon for an hour when it could be done in 20 minutes.

    Yup. When I have 20-25% damage done as a healer on first boss, I just leave *IF* it's Vet.
    Edited by Hexi on May 10, 2021 7:29PM
  • Xebov
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    I dont like the suggestion because its not solving any of the issues Tanks and Healers are facing that are key to the problem. It instead would just put a cosmetic sticker over it to cater towards DDs.

    Besides the obvious player made problems there are lots of design issues that are never adressed, and even worse often not even acknowledged by DD players. So there is limited support and interest in solving all the issues.

    I assume that everyone knows what iam talking about so ill not list stuff up. As long as DD players act like support players are beneath them and their servants and the devs do zero to help support players this situation will not change.
  • Hexi
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    Xebov wrote: »
    I dont like the suggestion because its not solving any of the issues Tanks and Healers are facing that are key to the problem. It instead would just put a cosmetic sticker over it to cater towards DDs.

    Besides the obvious player made problems there are lots of design issues that are never adressed, and even worse often not even acknowledged by DD players. So there is limited support and interest in solving all the issues.

    I assume that everyone knows what iam talking about so ill not list stuff up. As long as DD players act like support players are beneath them and their servants and the devs do zero to help support players this situation will not change.

    Bad players are bad no matter what role you play. It's not fun as DD to tank everything because the Tank has no clue whatsoever, nor is it fun to die to static damage because the healer is too busy healing himself because he cannot dodge out of the fire.

    It's also not fun to peel agro off of idiot DD who can't wait 1 second for the tank to get agro, nor is it fun to heal people who are too focused on "muh deeps" to get out of AoE.

    I've done Vet DLC dungeons on tank, heal and dps. Bad players are a burden to the group regardless of their role.
  • Klad
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    Hexi wrote: »
    I've done Vet DLC dungeons on tank, heal and dps. Bad players are a burden to the group regardless of their role.

    So you must be ecstatic about companions then, that's refreshing. I just don't get the folks who hate being matched up with who they say are Bad players, yet go nuts about said players being able to use companions instead...

    That is why I think often times it is more about the ability to rage than the actual issue.



  • Zulera301
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    they should do what FFXIV does with the dungeon finder and split them up into categories. It has a section for raids/trials, which would clear out Craglorn chat and make a lot of normal clears much easier to do, and it's got the base game dungeons and the expansion/DLC dungeons in different categories as well.

    The absolute Achilles' Heel of ESO+ is that it adds the DLC dungeons to the queue, meaning that you're a bit more hesitant to take your lv.45 characters or your CP100s into the random roulette because there's like a 9 in 10 chance it'll give you Moon Hunter Keep or Frostvault or such (perhaps a little hyperbole? perhaps not though), when you were probably just hoping for a quick run through Tempest Island or maybe even Crypt of Hearts II (hoping for Fungal Grotto I would just be too much to ask).

    although admittedly there might still be problems because XIV does the class system differently, insomuch that your role is enforced based on what class you are. While I personally like the system (due to the fact that tank classes are specially equipped to tank, healer classes are specially equipped to heal, and DPS classes are specially equipped to do DPS, thus eliminating a HUGE bulk of the fake or incompetent tanks & healers), I can see where that might cause contention in a game that prides itself on a (dubious) "anyone can be anything" mindset. It also helps soften the wait times by showing you what the average wait time for your selected role is (even as a solo DPS I've never waited more than 18 minutes, thus far).

    but again, while I can see the drawbacks of trying to use such a system in ESO, I know one of the driving factors that keeps me away from queueing (and I mostly main tanks and healers, no less) is the fear of a quick 15-25 minute levelling session turning into a 45-60 minute slogfest because most pugs don't know the DLC dungeon mechanics (because they avoid them the same way I do).
    Heck, if they separated the base game and DLC dungeons, people might actually queue for random vet dungeons for once.
    Shortly after the formation of the Ebonheart Pact, a Nord woman was given a tour of the Tribunal Temple. When later asked about the experience, she seemed upset. Suffice to say, the Dunmer were not pleased to hear this, and thus they inquired further.
    "Well," the Nord frowned, "the priests were very angry and unwelcoming. They kept shouting things at me like "you can't drink that mead in here!" and "somebody stop her, she's running naked!" and "we can't catch her; she's covered in grease!""
  • AlnilamE
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    Zulera301 wrote: »
    they should do what FFXIV does with the dungeon finder and split them up into categories. It has a section for raids/trials, which would clear out Craglorn chat and make a lot of normal clears much easier to do, and it's got the base game dungeons and the expansion/DLC dungeons in different categories as well.

    And do they also have a "random" queue that gives you rewards for helping other players? Or do people just queue for specific dungeons all the time?
    The Moot Councillor
  • Arkew
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    One of main problem on Eso after a lot of year of playing is DPS is always the king in all situation.

    You are healer who not wear SPC/olo/hollowfang/Blade symphony or not use battle prayer/war honr and instead use more your class skill and vanus set, your just gonna be trashed by other dps elitist because they want big number for defeat more fast the boss for not have to deal with mechanic.

    Near same thing for tank if you not wear yol/alkosh (before nerf)/powerfull assault, you gonna be trashed by dps but less than a healer because if you left they know they gonna wait near forever because tank is rare as medusa fire staff.
    and the second problem of tank they can't feel tanky in dungeon because you can build with max mitigation + near 100 k health, any heavy attacks of DLC dungeon mobs can just insta kill you.

    Overland not help healer and tank too but encourage for playing DPS.

    Bad DPS too encourage DPS yourself.

    Result tank and healer become rare as medusa fire staff, it's a vicious cycle.
  • Brrrofski
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    Less play people tank or healer.

    Because for most people, they're boring roles. You can get by on them without doing much if you want. People think tanking is taunt and hold block, which is boring. Not enough people have a rotation which helps the group in some way.

    I enjoy tanking, especially with how I've set up a saptank which also does damage.

    But most people just like doing DPS.

    Don't know how you fix it to be honest. If you force tanking/healing to require move rotations and needing more input, it might just put other players off entirely.
  • PrimusTiberius
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    I agree, the wait time for DPS is absolutely atrocious but this has been an on going issue for the last 5 years (that I've been playing). ZOS says they've made changes to improve wait times and queueing up characters with the same (or close to) level but from a players stand point, it never got any better nor do I think they'll put any effort into improving the situation.

    If I need a particular set or an item from a set, I'll pull out my tank and repeatedly grind the dungeon.

    I believe if the wait times for DPS were improved to 5 minutes, we wouldn't have the issues we have with fake tanks / healers, just my opinion on the matter.
    Everyone is going in one direction, I'm going the other direction


  • ResidentContrarian
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    Blame the fact that tanking and healing are two roles that:

    1. Aren't really enjoyable
    2. Aren't really needed the more experienced players get (thank hard DPS checks, one shots, etc.)
    3. Aren't good outside a group
    4. Require more gear sets than damage roles
    5. Aren't really that good in PvP
    6. Ultimately aren't profitable, esp. when paired with terrible damage dealers

    The sad reality is that healing and tanking is a role that isn't emphasized properly by the game developers at this stage in the game and it won't be for some time. The game emphasizes doing damage too much, and thus the end result is that players emphasize it too.
  • PizzaCat82
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    Odovacar wrote: »
    if you're queued for more than 15 minutes requeue and one should pop-up soon. Also, if you queue for a specific dungeon expect your times to be longer. Big tip: find some guildies or even zone chat players to give you a hand...get a few in the group and the remaining roles should fill up quicker for you.

    Good luck OP!

    This is the opposite of what should happen. Thank you ZOS.

    Waiting patiently in the queue while you port and quest and fight monsters = Hours of queue time, high chance of getting kicked out of the finder queue.

    Waiting a short time then just requeuing until you get a group = short time, no chance of getting kicked out.

  • Vercingetorix
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    Solving the queue issue in ESO requires 2 things IMO:

    - Make being a Tank no longer feel like a punishment outside of group content. This will encourage more players to have a tank character if they know they can still do basic combat in the overland against world bosses and questing.

    - Separate the dungeon queues into a base game list and a DLC list so that players can have more agency over the challenge level they are comfortable with. This will satisfy dps players capable of no-tanking a quick Normal and also satisfy players looking to do more difficult content that requires a more traditional group configuration.
    “Let your plans be dark and impenetrable as night, and when you move, fall like a thunderbolt.”
  • Thechuckage
    Thechuckage
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    Additionally, separate PvE/PvP balance. Unkillable tank in dungeon or trial = Awesome! Unkillable tank in Cyro = BS class, NERF!!!

    This goes hand in hand with no longer catering to DPS races. As long as mechanics can be bypassed by sufficient damage, tanks and healers will always be less desirable.

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