I feel punished...
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sliabh✭✭The overpowered become more overpowered . The casual gamer will now be less powered . I wonder if the devs actualy know what they are doing1 -
Grimhallow✭✭✭This complaint is like buying a car for $25,000 and driving it for six months, then seeing that the price of the car has dropped to $18,000 and whining about how the dealership stole $7,000 from you.
No. What? Though cars lose value as they age, our ESO account is supposed to appreciate in value as you use it, gain levels, grind gear, and purchase crown store items.
So like, your analogy is literally the opposite of reality.
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Ittrix✭✭✭
No, people "lost" experience.Icy_Waffles wrote: »They literally just expanded CP and made it EASIER to level up. You haven’t lost anything. They ADDED to the game. It’s like getting an expansion and being made the additions weren’t given to you.
I'm currently CP 1000. I gained that by grinding out 300,000,000 experience over the course of two years. Under the new system, 300,000,000 experience would put a player at CP 2000. For me to reach CP 2000, I will need to grind out another 200,000,000 experience, or 500,000,000 experience in total. To get to the same CP as a theoretical 'new' CP 2000 player, I'll need to have almost double their experience.
So where did the half of my experience go that isn't being counted towards CP? It's not being applied towards any kind of system. If that doesn't mean lost I'm not sure what does.2 -
Ittrix✭✭✭
Yeah, I lost thousands of experience before the new CP system launched. Annoying, but enh, it's just thousands of experience.Yeah...here we go again.
Second, each time the spendable cap was raised, the XP curve was adjusted. So, you already "lost" thousands of XP before the new CP system even launched.
This patch I lost approximately 200 million experience. So now I'm annoyed.1 -
smittyhd60Soul ShrivenSince most of the people who are posting do not state their current CP level or what type of a player they are, it is impossible to get a feel for where they are coming from. I do think posting your CP and type player will help the other players understand where you are coming from. Let me start by saying that I am currently at CP 855 and have been more on the casual player side but with intentions to improve to do trials and more end game content. What follows is what I see that affects players around my level. If you are already at CP 1800 or above or just starting out the CP levels, then the change to CP 2.0 will not have as much of an affect on you. But it does have a pretty big affect on players in the middle. Let me explain:
This is a question that was answered by @ZOS_SamL "5. Total DPS output seems lower in CP2.0. What’s the reasoning for this? The overall goal was to reduce the power of high end damage and efficiency by 15-20% with CP 2.0, as there is a significant delta in power between many players."
I am puzzled as why ZoS thought this was such a game breaking issue that they decided to nerf DPS a flat 15-20% across the board for all players with this update. CP helps your DPS of course, but so does gear set choices to include the improvement level (epic or legendary), the trait & the enchantment. Add in your skill choices, your rotation, mundus stone & if you are doing a light attacks between each skill. All these play an important role. There are some players who work harder to learn and improve than other players do. There will always be a big DPS gap no matter what ZoS changes. Casual players will never compete DPS wise with the dedicated end game content players. Nor should they!
So what did ZoS do to accomplish the flat 15-20% DPS nerf. ZoS took this out of the CP side of the house.
1. ZoS reduced the maximum number of CP points you can put into any given star.
2. ZoS reduced the maximum value you receive from maxing out any given star.
3. ZoS requires players to spend their CP points on lower-level Stars to access Stars higher up in the tree.
These three changes are the main issue because they remove the ability for each player to customize their characters like we could in CP 1.0. Unless you really want or need the lower level Star, you are needlessly spending your very limited CP points and you will not be able to optimize your build until you have leveled up closer to the soft CP Cap of CP 1800. At my CP 855 level, I have only 285 CP points to spend out of a maximum of 1200 points per tree.
This brings me to this quote from @ZOS_SamL “If you’re at CP1.0 810, you should be able to do all of the exact same content with CP2.0.”
If the DPS nerf is anywhere close to the 15% to 20% ZoS was shooting for and add in the above 3 items, a CP 810 level player is back to about a CP 182 level. Going from 810 to 3600 CP points is a 77.5% increase, now a CP 810 player only has 22.5% of the available CP point to spend, (270 /1200 = 22.5% and 22.5% of 810 is 182.25). With such a limited amout of CP points to spend (add in the added stars) most player will not be able to spread the points around enough to mitigate the nerf. For a lot of players, the work that was put into building and maximizing their characters for CP 810 has been destroyed by this update.
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I have not completed a parse since CP 2.0 dropped yesterday, so I am not sure just how much of a nerf I have received but having only 23.75% of the available CP point to spend + the 3 changes mentioned above, I am positive I will not be able to do all the exact same content that I could do pre-CP 2.0. It is going to take a major overhaul of my characters, plus about 400 more levels to get my characters back to my pre-CP 2.0 level.
When I read comments by some veteran players saying they feel cheated with this change. I can understand where they are coming from. And no, it is not whining or crying or any of the other negative things people have posted. If CP 2.0 did not affect your build then good for you! But it did for a large group of players. And the saddest part is, it did not have to affect any player!
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Jeffrey530✭✭✭✭
No. What? Though cars lose value as they age, our ESO account is supposed to appreciate in value as you use it, gain levels, grind gear, and purchase crown store items.
So like, your analogy is literally the opposite of reality.
What you said doesn't even make sense. Once we bought our eso account there is no value, since we can't re-sell it to someone else.1 -
Agenericname✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭smittyhd60 wrote: »Since most of the people who are posting do not state their current CP level or what type of a player they are, it is impossible to get a feel for where they are coming from. I do think posting your CP and type player will help the other players understand where you are coming from. Let me start by saying that I am currently at CP 855 and have been more on the casual player side but with intentions to improve to do trials and more end game content. What follows is what I see that affects players around my level. If you are already at CP 1800 or above or just starting out the CP levels, then the change to CP 2.0 will not have as much of an affect on you. But it does have a pretty big affect on players in the middle. Let me explain:
This is a question that was answered by @ZOS_SamL "5. Total DPS output seems lower in CP2.0. What’s the reasoning for this? The overall goal was to reduce the power of high end damage and efficiency by 15-20% with CP 2.0, as there is a significant delta in power between many players."
I am puzzled as why ZoS thought this was such a game breaking issue that they decided to nerf DPS a flat 15-20% across the board for all players with this update. CP helps your DPS of course, but so does gear set choices to include the improvement level (epic or legendary), the trait & the enchantment. Add in your skill choices, your rotation, mundus stone & if you are doing a light attacks between each skill. All these play an important role. There are some players who work harder to learn and improve than other players do. There will always be a big DPS gap no matter what ZoS changes. Casual players will never compete DPS wise with the dedicated end game content players. Nor should they!
So what did ZoS do to accomplish the flat 15-20% DPS nerf. ZoS took this out of the CP side of the house.
1. ZoS reduced the maximum number of CP points you can put into any given star.
2. ZoS reduced the maximum value you receive from maxing out any given star.
3. ZoS requires players to spend their CP points on lower-level Stars to access Stars higher up in the tree.
These three changes are the main issue because they remove the ability for each player to customize their characters like we could in CP 1.0. Unless you really want or need the lower level Star, you are needlessly spending your very limited CP points and you will not be able to optimize your build until you have leveled up closer to the soft CP Cap of CP 1800. At my CP 855 level, I have only 285 CP points to spend out of a maximum of 1200 points per tree.
This brings me to this quote from @ZOS_SamL “If you’re at CP1.0 810, you should be able to do all of the exact same content with CP2.0.”
If the DPS nerf is anywhere close to the 15% to 20% ZoS was shooting for and add in the above 3 items, a CP 810 level player is back to about a CP 182 level. Going from 810 to 3600 CP points is a 77.5% increase, now a CP 810 player only has 22.5% of the available CP point to spend, (270 /1200 = 22.5% and 22.5% of 810 is 182.25). With such a limited amout of CP points to spend (add in the added stars) most player will not be able to spread the points around enough to mitigate the nerf. For a lot of players, the work that was put into building and maximizing their characters for CP 810 has been destroyed by this update.
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I have not completed a parse since CP 2.0 dropped yesterday, so I am not sure just how much of a nerf I have received but having only 23.75% of the available CP point to spend + the 3 changes mentioned above, I am positive I will not be able to do all the exact same content that I could do pre-CP 2.0. It is going to take a major overhaul of my characters, plus about 400 more levels to get my characters back to my pre-CP 2.0 level.
When I read comments by some veteran players saying they feel cheated with this change. I can understand where they are coming from. And no, it is not whining or crying or any of the other negative things people have posted. If CP 2.0 did not affect your build then good for you! But it did for a large group of players. And the saddest part is, it did not have to affect any player!
It isnt a nerf "across the board." It was targeted at "high end damage and efficiency."
They did nerf CP, but they added base level mitigation and weapon/spell damage so that it would less of an impact at lower-mid levels. They essentially made the players total output less dependent on CP.
Theres a post on the forums that shows the difference between noCP parses in 1.0 and 2.0 and with CP. The noCP parse is higher in 2.0 and the CP parse is lower. So your % over overall CP obtained is lower, but its effect on your DPS is as well.
It looks like they have reduced gap, which what they said they wanted.
I think its fair to say that some players feel cheated, but it is really preventing anyone from completing content that they were already doing prior to the patch? If so, I havent seen an example of it.2 -
Pink_Pixie✭✭✭I'm going to chime in here, seeing as I've done so on previous threads on PTS and on a couple here.
On CP 1.0 I was getting 79k dps with a bow/bow, I do suffer from a bad right hand and wrist, plus a high ping that is usually around 160-170 ish. Of course I was CP 810, and being stubborn I don't tend to follow guides. But it worked, I can and did do veteran trials with that build.
Coming into Connect a dot 2.0 with exactly the same gear and only CP 1005 I managed a very similar parse of 78k. However, that may look like it's not a loss and it really isn't but! Having no damage mitigation is where this all changes, and the four stars I do have slotted aren't maxed out as yet.
Yes I can almost do the same damage, perhaps more. Yet I feel the loss of mitigation is a huge change. Where as mitigation was grouped in the red tree and it offered actual choice. Now everything is clumped in the blue tree. The choice to play how we want has been removed, instead it's been replaced with very limited choices on how we'd like to play.
This is where there is another change, people feel robbed for losing experience that was earned fairly, in a game that required to do tasks to earn said experience. Some of these tasks are a one time gold and experience earning chance on one character.
Some players play many characters, some play a few or one. I'm one of those that play one character, and due to the experience I have earned being taken away. My single pay out for experience, not the gold, has been lost. And this is where the issue is, for me, as I cannot speak for everyone as I earned it fairly in the game. And having done all zone quests, dungeon quests and side quests there is hardly anything to do to regain what is lost.
So, the wait for the next DLC is a long long away, as there is not a lot to choose from to gain what was "Lost". Now, before people post "You've lost nothing" or "Socks cost less next year because..." the math is dead simple. I can see it, many many others can see it, yet people still insist on analogies to defend a bad decision from ZOS. Now, if it was not possible to keep said experience there should of been something in the works to help the player base, unlimited enlightenment until CP 1200 for example.
A game is here for fun, not work and the current patch is taking away that fun and replacing it with work in a sense. Having to work twice as hard in CP1.0 and then connect a dot 2.0 hits, and we've got the earn it again, so in essence that's three times as hard as CP1.0!
As a note, I used to play PvP, end game trials, questing, fishing, crafting and decorating my house.2 -
remosito✭✭✭✭✭aI really hate this new CP I have four (4) Characters that I cannot play as I did before.
With the old CP using the 810 CP I could Heal or DPS with just a simple bar swap for overland and Normal Dungeons & Trials. While for some Vet Trials a one bar weapon swap and a few skill changes depending on the Vet Trial and if I am Healing or DPS.
Have 1482 CP and its not anywhere near enough to be able to do this.
same for me and my 4 healers and 6 tanks. Serious degradation of play experience and fun.
But we both still could of they'd scaled our cp.ShutYerTrap (selectively mute NPC dialogues (stuga, companions); displayleads (antiquity leads location); UndauntedPledgeQueuer (small daily undaunted dungeon queuer window)0 -
smittyhd60Soul ShrivenOk, @Agenericname what is your CP level and what type of player are you? Be honest0
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Tannus15✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭a
same for me and my 4 healers and 6 tanks. Serious degradation of play experience and fun.
But we both still could of they'd scaled our cp.
your healers and tanks all gained 1k weapon and spell damage. They are much stronger in overland if you're adverse to spending 3k gold to respec them properly.0 -
Agenericname✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭smittyhd60 wrote: »Ok, @Agenericname what is your CP level and what type of player are you? Be honest
At the start of the patch, 1351. Content; mostly vet DLC dungeons/arenas, some trials, and some PvP.
Sometimes I pick flowers.
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remosito✭✭✭✭✭
your healers and tanks all gained 1k weapon and spell damage. They are much stronger in overland if you're adverse to spending 3k gold to respec them properly.
3k gold aint the issue. qol and time to respec is.
1k sp/w dmg aint gonna make me solo tough stuff easier. dps aint everything. my tank willl miss heal boosts and my healer mitigation.
+resources helps a bit obviously. but am falling seriously short to where i was.ShutYerTrap (selectively mute NPC dialogues (stuga, companions); displayleads (antiquity leads location); UndauntedPledgeQueuer (small daily undaunted dungeon queuer window)0 -
smittyhd60Soul ShrivenAgenericname wrote: »
At the start of the patch, 1351. Content; mostly vet DLC dungeons/arenas, some trials, and some PvP.
Sometimes I pick flowers.
as i said in my post, I thought that I needed about 400 more levels in order to get back to where i felt I was in CP 1.0. You are proof of that with your CP 1351 level. My thinking is with your more advanced level of play and the better gear you have probably collected and with the 165 extra CP points per tree, has allowed you to basically be level or ahead of where you were in CP 1.0. So, this change to CP 2.0 did not really affect you as predicted. I felt that CP 1200 was about the break over point for CP 1.0 vs CP 2.0.
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Agenericname✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭smittyhd60 wrote: »
as i said in my post, I thought that I needed about 400 more levels in order to get back to where i felt I was in CP 1.0. You are proof of that with your CP 1351 level. My thinking is with your more advanced level of play and the better gear you have probably collected and with the 165 extra CP points per tree, has allowed you to basically be level or ahead of where you were in CP 1.0. So, this change to CP 2.0 did not really affect you as predicted. I felt that CP 1200 was about the break over point for CP 1.0 vs CP 2.0.
We are not ahead of where we were in CP1.0. The patch was a nerf. I simply don't think that its nearly as dire as others do. They increased our stats without CP and decreased our DPS with CP. The net result is CP has less of an effect on us now, but there are noticeable differences. I believe the question boils down to "can we clear the same content we were before?"
In my case, I am the tank. We take more damage from magic and some things cost us more, like block and dodge. It hasn't prevented us from clearing anything, yet. You're correct, in that role (DD) I would be a poor example, I do have perfected gear and it is gold. 2 of our group are sub 810 (post patch). One parsed at 90k prior to the patch and 76K post patch. They're also not wearing trial gear at all, in fact, one set is crafted. Right now that's a loss of just under 16% total damage and I feel like once they sort through all the new that number will be even smaller.
In the context of damage done, the only contribution my CP makes is my ability to live. The DPS isn't a product of my CP.
I believe that your assessment about 1200 being the number that puts you the closest to where you were is probably right, but I do not think that you're as far away now you may think. You won't get an accurate measurement translating the % that way.
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Dark_Lord_Kuro✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Here we go yet again
Its no different than any other time they raised the cap in the past
A player in one of the many other thred pointed out that at the release of cp 1.0 it took roughly 8 billion xp to reach 3600 and every update the soft cap was raised by 30 flatening the curve. By the time they stoped increasing it every update it was down to about 5 billion. Cp2.0 reduce it even more to 2.2 billion
Xp are a currency you exchange for a cp
The price for a cp just dropped noting more0 -
Ittrix✭✭✭
You say it dropped like it was no big deal. It took me two years to gain 1000 CP. 300,000,000 experience. You can't compare that to the time they raised the cap from 780 to 810. That wasn't thousands of CP that could've been gotten in half the time. It wasn't hundreds of millions of experience.Dark_Lord_Kuro wrote: »Here we go yet again
Its no different than any other time they raised the cap in the past
A player in one of the many other thred pointed out that at the release of cp 1.0 it took roughly 8 billion xp to reach 3600 and every update the soft cap was raised by 30 flatening the curve. By the time they stoped increasing it every update it was down to about 5 billion. Cp2.0 reduce it even more to 2.2 billion
Xp are a currency you exchange for a cp
The price for a cp just dropped noting more0 -
Minalan✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭This complaint is like buying a car for $25,000 and driving it for six months, then seeing that the price of the car has dropped to $18,000 and whining about how the dealership stole $7,000 from you.
Bad analogy. In this case the devs stole my loaded out sporty $25,000 car and replaced it with a cheap base model. It no longer has a backup camera, heated seats, air conditioning, power steering, airbags, or a sound system. I get to pay money for all of that *** all over again.0 -
Dark_Lord_Kuro✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭You say it dropped like it was no big deal. It took me two years to gain 1000 CP. 300,000,000 experience. You can't compare that to the time they raised the cap from 780 to 810. That wasn't thousands of CP that could've been gotten in half the time. It wasn't hundreds of millions of experience.
It is no big deal
Its just some number used to determine your next cp
What matter are the cp wich you didnt lost any
And it took me since console launch in 2015 to get to 1300
Accourding to the new curve i would be around 1800 but dod not earn 1800 cp, i earned 1300
No to free cp0 -
Provin915✭✭✭It's a MMO.. New updates can bring ''more'' levels. I''m not saying it's completely fair but it's part of the genre.0
