CP Rework and current XP.

Kittytravel

I noticed on the PTS that my CP level did not change. I would like an answer as to why? Using numerical XP values and changing the formula should mean that I either lose or gain levels through this shift.

Most notably my concern is that for those of us above 810 CP we are essentially being shirked the 'extra' experience we have gained and are instead being started at our current CP level rather than the one we would be at with all our combined experience.

This gap is more noticeable the more 'overleveled' someone is and I think it'd be rather unfair if someone ground out the necessary amount to get to that point only to have it be called the same.

To clarify my question; it currently takes 906,764,092 or so EXP to reach CP level 1210. Will it also take that exact amount of XP to reach CP 1210 currently or because of the new XP curve are people going to be left at CP 1210 and lose out on the experience they earned?

Edit: My reasoning for all this is based on this quote.
"The CP cap per update has been lifted, and you can now spend up to the 3600 point cap. We’ve adjusted the rate at which you gain CP to accommodate for the cap lift."

Mayrael

This is really good question! If they will simply adjust CP gain curve we all going to be screwed over our time spent into the game, but this was the case always with CP cap increase and I guess this time it won't be different.

honey_badger82

Being that it's not just a 30 point cap gain I would think it only fair that they set our CP level to where it would be under the new system. I am sure those of us over 810 would not lose levels but stand to gain more for the effort we have already put in. However since ZoS is under the impression everyone who plays the game just loves the grind I doubt I will be past whatever CP level I am when it goes live. Hopefully by then I will be over 1k as now I am 920ish

tmbrinks

my understanding is that the XP curve will be adjusted.

It hasn't yet on PTS.

Probably week 3.

Ekzorka

honey_badger82 wrote: »

Being that it's not just a 30 point cap gain I would think it only fair that they set our CP level to where it would be under the new system. I am sure those of us over 810 would not lose levels but stand to gain more for the effort we have already put in.

Haha, just like a vMA weapon.
Since we've getting more and more content for newbies, I doubt that an old players will be taken into account.

Olupajmibanan

Sad answer for you: XP curve will be adjusted, your current CP will not.

We don't know yet how will the curve be adjusted. But it seems like 0-1200 will be adjusted, post 1200 will be the same, but this has not been officialy stated by Zenimax. However what was officially stated by Zenimax is that your current CP level stays the same regardless of XP curve changes. Simply, they won't rescale your CP to new system, they want you to grind.

Official Zenimax statement - https://clips.twitch.tv/ClearLivelyTroutKappaRoss

Nordic__Knights

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

Sad answer for you: XP curve will be adjusted, your current CP will not.

We don't know yet how will the curve be adjusted. But it seems like 0-1200 will be adjusted, post 1200 will be the same, but this has not been officialy stated by Zenimax. However what was officially stated by Zenimax is that your current CP level stays the same regardless of XP curve changes. Simply, they won't rescale your CP to new system, they want you to grind.

Official Zenimax statement - https://clips.twitch.tv/ClearLivelyTroutKappaRoss

hes asked if at 500cp , and tbh if you are only 500 cp you should stay 500cp but now if your OVER CP CAP then you should see an add as your being held back and having -% xp debuff added to you once you hit cap making it so your FULL xp aint being used to gain next cp

AMeanOne

It will be extremely stupid in the new system that two players with the same total xp earned, could be different cp level. Since the announcement of this new system I've lost the urge to play, knowing that there is a vertical progression grind to around 2700. Im a daily player for 4 years and have 1400 cp, I don't have any desire to grind another 1400 to get back to the same power level as I already am.

Maggusemm

If they dont recalculate the CP based on the XP already earned with the new curve many players will leave. I think around CP 1600 is equal to the experience of CP 3600 of the new game.

So it would be fair to recalculate it. People want content and not stupid grind.

Maggusemm

I am pretty sure that the statement that the CP will not be recalculate will be reverted. Too many players will just leave.

Kittytravel

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

Sad answer for you: XP curve will be adjusted, your current CP will not.

We don't know yet how will the curve be adjusted. But it seems like 0-1200 will be adjusted, post 1200 will be the same, but this has not been officialy stated by Zenimax. However what was officially stated by Zenimax is that your current CP level stays the same regardless of XP curve changes. Simply, they won't rescale your CP to new system, they want you to grind.

Official Zenimax statement - https://clips.twitch.tv/ClearLivelyTroutKappaRoss

If that's what they are going with then everyone should be far more upset imo about it than they seem to be.
I'm essentially being told
"Hey I'm glad you've leveled really hard past the cap and continued playing our game. But screw your time investment and screw you for being a continued loyal player to our game"

The higher you are above cap the more time you're being told doesn't matter and was wasted.

AMeanOne wrote: »

It will be extremely stupid in the new system that two players with the same total xp earned, could be different cp level. Since the announcement of this new system I've lost the urge to play, knowing that there is a vertical progression grind to around 2700. Im a daily player for 4 years and have 1400 cp, I don't have any desire to grind another 1400 to get back to the same power level as I already am.

@AMeanOne I think you are misunderstanding. In the current system you are level 1400. That means you have a total of 1,222,857,671 EXP in the live server. Let's say after the CP rework adjustment that because the curve is lowered for obtaining levels that would mean you get raised to something like CP 1900 due to how 'over experience' you are.

That video is essentially telling you 'Nah you stay at 1400'. They aren't adjusting the curve to be more difficult they are adjusting it to be less because of how many more levels are now available.

I'd really appreciate a dev answer on why this can't be done. Everyones numerical XP value is stored so I don't understand why it can't just be carried over and adjusted on the new system? We haven't abandoned XP it's still the defining factor in determining your level.

AMeanOne

You are misunderstanding kitty.

Kittytravel

AMeanOne wrote: »

You are misunderstanding kitty.

Can you... explain why?...

AMeanOne

Kittytravel wrote: »

AMeanOne wrote: »

You are misunderstanding kitty.

Can you... explain why?...

It seems you think I'm disagreeing with you. I'm not. I said it would be stupid to have two people with different cp levels but the same total xp earned.

Kittytravel

AMeanOne wrote: »

Kittytravel wrote: »

AMeanOne wrote: »

You are misunderstanding kitty.

Can you... explain why?...

It seems you think I'm disagreeing with you. I'm not. I said it would be stupid to have two people with different cp levels but the same total xp earned.

Ah I see. I thought you meant you'd have to regrind to 1400. I can see how I got confused now.

I really hope more of the player base jumps on this. If anything this is something that once they choose to execute it can't be reverted so we've got one shot to change their mind essentially.

Universe

I believe veteran players deserve compensation because of the champion system rework.
You can check my suggestion in my discussion here:
https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/560918/suggestion-champion-points-compensation-for-veteran-players-when-update-29-launch#latest

honey_badger82

I guess we will just see how many actually jump ship when it goes live and your CP level has not changed. Personally I believe if they are not going to raise our levels to match our CP in the new system then they should adjust the curve RIGHT NOW since they will be implementing this new CP system in some form.
I have a guild I run and 100% of the new players I have invited to join from the starting areas have completely quit playing before passing lvl 40. So good luck replacing loyal paying players with ones that quit in 2 weeks.

Kittytravel

honey_badger82 wrote: »

I guess we will just see how many actually jump ship when it goes live and your CP level has not changed. Personally I believe if they are not going to raise our levels to match our CP in the new system then they should adjust the curve RIGHT NOW since they will be implementing this new CP system in some form.
I have a guild I run and 100% of the new players I have invited to join from the starting areas have completely quit playing before passing lvl 40. So good luck replacing loyal paying players with ones that quit in 2 weeks.

A lot of the talk on the forums has been a lot like this. It's daunting enough as a player right now reaching 810. While 3600 isn't the end-game goal anymore I believe 2450 is the minimum needed to acquire the 8 needed full-rank combat bar champion point stars and all the passives in the red and blue trees.

On this end I just don't under why adjusting the XP currently to the new curve isn't a good idea?
If someone currently has the needed theoretical 1900 CP levels needed to be equivalent to the new 3600 CP then why not just start them at max level again? The only issue you could state with this is "It widens the gap between CP pvp and makes it harder for lower level CP players to engage in."
To which the obvious answer will always be "And... that will happen anyways. It's always going to happen you're just prolonging the inevitable in the favor of shirking your veteran players."

Kurat

I don't think many people will quit because of the changes. People come and go anyways. I've noticed alot more activity at all grinding spots. On PC/NA theres already more people grinding Alikir's dolms than when warden and necro was released. There used to be just below lvl50 mostly to level alts but now half the people are high cp. Same at Skyreach. Huge gatherings in front, cp810s grouping together, not just carrying low levels. Also dungeon queues have gone longer for tanks. People doing randoms and fake tanking. Xp pots and their ingredients like perfect roe prices have also gone up quite abit since the announcement. People seem to have started hoarding already. This is going to be crazy at first. Not sure if many people even gunna do any actual content. Everyone seems to be focusing about grinding.
Elder Grind Online lmao

DaveMoeDee

This isn't the first time that the XP to CP curve has changed. It changed in the past when max CP was increased. When it was changed in the past, did was CP re-computed? I don't believe so. So why do it now? Anyone who was grinding before already should have known that any increase in the cap would lead to easier accumulation for people after the change.

Kittytravel

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

This isn't the first time that the XP to CP curve has changed. It changed in the past when max CP was increased. When it was changed in the past, did was CP re-computed? I don't believe so. So why do it now? Anyone who was grinding before already should have known that any increase in the cap would lead to easier accumulation for people after the change.

It was actually.
http://esoacademy.com/faq/veteran-rank-champion-rank-conversion/

People of corresponding VR ranks were given an incremental boost in compensation for the systems transition. Keep in mind when this was made the max rank wasn't CP 810. In addition CP itself was added in March 3 2015 and the full transition didn't occur until May 31 2016 giving players a full year to reach the appropriate CP cap. Keep in mind back during this point the cap was set to 570 to begin with and slowly raised over the years with major Updates.

So to answer your question, yes in a way they did re-compute for their newer system when they transitioned and there isn't any reason they shouldn't do it again. At the very least they should introduce the new curve and give the player base some time to catch up to the new 'softcap' of 2450 to continue doing content we are already doing at the current pace we enjoy.

I don't count the raising of the cap the same way here. We're talking an incremental 30 level increase between literal months of content VS an increase of 2000+ levels in a single moment.

smittyhd60

The new CP System dropped today and SADLY ZOS did not adjust our CP levels based on our current XP as many has suggested above.
I have spent some time today and at CP 855 and I am showing that I need 231,255 XP to make the next level. This was 705,900 XP yesterday. I did some calculations in excel and the soft CP cap is now 1800 not 1200 as some above thought. For comparison, to reach CP 855 in CP 1.0 required just over 226 million XP, CP 2.0 requires just over 113 million XP, a massive 50% reduction! 226 million XP is equal to CP 1261 in the new system.
The other major gripe that I have is the same as a few above have stated. You have to basically waste some CP points on items you may not want in order to get access to items you want. The base CP cost is 8, 10 or 15 with 10 being the most common first increment. And there are some that are 50, 75 and 100 to unlock once you move up higher.
I agree with what @AMeanOne stated above "It will be extremely stupid in the new system that two players with the same total xp earned, could be different cp level. Since the announcement of this new system I've lost the urge to play"
I have also experienced the same as @honey_badger82 stated with new players that quit before they reach level 50. The grind to level CP810 scared a bunch of new players away. The grind to CP3600 will scare more newer players away and some vet players as well! No CP PvP will be very popular now and players will hate it.

nublife01

I was at 820cp before the patch. Now in order to actually be competitive in cp pvp I have to gain 600cp levels as level 1400cp players have all the necessary cp traits which I barely even have half. It honestly makes me want to quit the game because despite spending around 600k gold on proper skyreach run gear, I don't want to spend hours of exp grinding to be relevant in the endgame content that actually keeps me playing this game. I know a whole lot of pvp players around my cp that have the same level of frustration that I do. And it will be why there is a very high chance I will be taking a break from the game indefinitely because I just don't have the time of day to get to where I need to be to enjoy the game again. It's just not fun grinding hundreds of levels of exp which is what everyone is being forced to do. This is probably the worst change I have ever seen come to the game. I really hope it is reverted so I can play the game again how I did a week ago. Even if I have to farm 200 or so levels of experience that is much less horrible that 600.

ZoS you need to really think about the changes you are making. Sure people will come back to the game with a new CP tree. But think about how many people will quit again when they realize they need to grind hundreds of levels of EXP to enjoy what they like to play in the game. As someone who has played your game since its beta release, I strongly encourage you to give these experience levels to the playerbase that as mentioned earlier has been robbed from them.

nublife01

Kurat wrote: »

I don't think many people will quit because of the changes. People come and go anyways. I've noticed alot more activity at all grinding spots. On PC/NA theres already more people grinding Alikir's dolms than when warden and necro was released. There used to be just below lvl50 mostly to level alts but now half the people are high cp. Same at Skyreach. Huge gatherings in front, cp810s grouping together, not just carrying low levels. Also dungeon queues have gone longer for tanks. People doing randoms and fake tanking. Xp pots and their ingredients like perfect roe prices have also gone up quite abit since the announcement. People seem to have started hoarding already. This is going to be crazy at first. Not sure if many people even gunna do any actual content. Everyone seems to be focusing about grinding.
Elder Grind Online lmao

Yea but do you think these people actually enjoy the exp grinding? Should exp grinding be the way this game should be played? No of course not. Everyone I have spoke to within the cp pvp community greatly dislikes these changes though are being forced to grind cp. Because if you were at 810 cp cap before the changes, you have to grind 600 levels to be competitive in pvp. Even cp 1200 players are getting squashed by cp 1400 players, I have spoken to a few of them. Dude like if it was a 200cp change I would be all for it. But 600 levels?! It's horrible man. Not everyone has time for that grind and grinds are not enjoyable gameplay. Raiding your favorite dungeon or arena to get that cool item or progress with your guild, delving into cyrodiil or imperial city to compete with players for either gold ap or just for the fun of it, that is how this game is meant to be enjoyed--not a mindless cp grind because the devs have basically forced us to.