Had to vote kick a toxic rusher twice today

Jeremy

Nairinhe wrote: »

If you pug, you do what the group does.

I hope the group doesn't decide to jump off a cliff.

kargen27

Nairinhe wrote: »

If you pug, you do what the group does. If they rush - you rush, if they do the quest and loot every container - you wait for them.
If you want to run how you want to run - you need a premade.

So what happens when one wants to rush to the last boss, one is in for the first time and wants to listen to the quest dialog and the other two don't care about speed but want to kill all the bosses and mobs?

For people that want a quick run it is real easy to fill group in zone chat if you advertise you are doing a quick run. For DPS announcing you are looking for a group to carry on a random usually gets you a group quicker than the queue will and you know they all are there to run with you.

Jeremy

SidraWillowsky wrote: »

Nairinhe wrote: »

If you pug, you do what the group does. If they rush - you rush, if they do the quest and loot every container - you wait for them.
If you want to run how you want to run - you need a premade.

Why is it not the opposite? If you want to rush and skip everything, why don't YOU make your own group?

Agreed. Just because the rest of the group may want to suicide run through the dungeon doesn't mean I'm about to do it. So they can just kick me if they want (in fact I would prefer it). Because the more people who put up with this the more people who are inevitably going to do it.

Red_Feather

My first dungeon today was a rusher. 3 of us were left behind and one died. The tank then said it was a speedrun. I left the group and it blocked me from queuing again for 13 minutes. It is hard to know how to handle these situations now.

Jeremy

Red_Feather wrote: »

My first dungeon today was a rusher. 3 of us were left behind and one died. The tank then said it was a speedrun. I left the group and it blocked me from queuing again for 13 minutes. It is hard to know how to handle these situations now.

Yeah the penalty is a problem. And it's harder for DPS to put their foot down since they can have long queue times. As a tank: it's a lot easier for me to stand up to people who do this since I have instant queues and boss fights are easier with me around: it can also take a bit to get a new tank sometimes. So I have a lot more leverage than say the average DPS who just sat over 20 minutes in a queue and can be quickly replaced if he or she decides to leave. So I need to keep that in mind and be more understanding of those who decide to put up with this.

I miss the old days in MMORPGs when pulls weren't just considered "trash". They were actual combat situations that required strategy and if players tried to just run through them they would get annihilated.

cyclonus11

Red_Feather wrote: »

My first dungeon today was a rusher. 3 of us were left behind and one died. The tank then said it was a speedrun. I left the group and it blocked me from queuing again for 13 minutes. It is hard to know how to handle these situations now.

Funny thing is I'm the tank and it's always some DPS that runs off ahead. I went into the side passage to fight the spriggan boss in vEH1 for example and after a few seconds I realized I was fighting the boss by myself (everyone else just charged on without me). Same thing happened with vCOH1 lich boss.

Zatox

Can you explain to me, who is "rushers"? Complete the dungeon as fast as possible is goal of every competent player. So, if player can't hold fast tempo, he is need to git gud.

Jeremy

cyclonus11 wrote: »

Red_Feather wrote: »

My first dungeon today was a rusher. 3 of us were left behind and one died. The tank then said it was a speedrun. I left the group and it blocked me from queuing again for 13 minutes. It is hard to know how to handle these situations now.

Funny thing is I'm the tank and it's always some DPS that runs off ahead. I went into the side passage to fight the spriggan boss in vEH1 for example and after a few seconds I realized I was fighting the boss by myself (everyone else just charged on without me). Same thing happened with vCOH1 lich boss.

Yeah, they do that to me a lot also. It's annoying too because as a tank your damage is so low it takes forever to whittle bosses down by yourself.

I wish they would just add a speed run option to the activity finder so players who want to play like that can pick it and leave the rest of us to play dungeons as was intended. Because I've had my fill of "speed runs" back when I played Final Fantasy 14 and I'm not about to start doing it on this game. I'll quit before I conform to it here.

F22nickell

Mariusghost84 wrote: »

nukk3r wrote: »

Cirantille wrote: »

I don't get the reason for queueing if you are gonna run like a madlad.

Obviously you are capable of doing thing solo so do it alone.

I always either farm alone or ask my friends if they are available...

I don't rush when I'm with PUGs but I can understand the rushers. If it's a random normal, then the reason is 10 crystals. Imagine someone having 10 characters, minimum wait time for a DD is 15 min. That's 2.5 hours spent in queue. No one wants to waste 20 min in FG1 or whatever.

Wait what? One gets GUARANTEED 10 crystals for 1 random daily pr character now?![/quote]

Yep ... Same change they instituted the sticker book function. Prior to the change, you used to get 1 transmute stone in the mail when you completed the Premium (Purple) Random Dungeon queue per toon, now it is 10 stones ...

cyclonus11

Zatox wrote: »

Can you explain to me, who is "rushers"? Complete the dungeon as fast as possible is goal of every competent player. So, if player can't hold fast tempo, he is need to git gud.

Lol, no. It's not that we can't hold a fast tempo, it's that we want to loot everything.

Miszou

Zatox wrote: »

Can you explain to me, who is "rushers"? Complete the dungeon as fast as possible is goal of every competent player. So, if player can't hold fast tempo, he is need to git gud.

Everest_Lionheart

I check group condos at the start, if I see low levels I ask if they need quest. High levels I already assume it’s going to be some form of speedrun especially when we get the long dungeons like ICP, lair of maarselok, etc.

I did have a tank today over extend a few pulls in depths of malatar. The boss fights were easy but he really stretched the add pulls to their limits. I was keeping up throwing shards to the tank but the healer and other dps didn’t have near the same running speed to keep up so they had to lag behind all the trash. I ended up dying once because I got overwhelmed with AOE’s while the healer caught up. I couldn’t jab myself out of the situation on my Templar. Tank had a nice chuckle and thanked me for all the shards before I died.

My low level healer had a high level tank pull all the way to the second boss on FG1. I was the only other person that made it though all the trash to that fight, so it took us a while to take that boss down befor the others could revive. And the. He took off for the final boss spamming bird of prey. I made it there a little behind and the 2 dps made it to the last boss at about 70% health.

That’s how pugs can be sometimes though and these transmute awards that are attached to using GF are the cause of these wildly disorganized speed runs. Don’t get me wrong I love a good speedrun but the people less I g the charge need to know the limitations of the group before going all in on some of the pulls. Not everyone in the group can handle 47 adds all stacked on on a boss, or even dodge and weave their way through those adds to get there sometimes.

VaranisArano

Zatox wrote: »

Can you explain to me, who is "rushers"? Complete the dungeon as fast as possible is goal of every competent player. So, if player can't hold fast tempo, he is need to git gud.

Typically speaking, most dungeon groups want to finish the dungeon as quickly as they can as a group. Individual players often want to do the quest, get gear, or, yeah, just get it over with. This means you kill mobs and necessary bosses together as a group of four, wait for anyone who says they have the quest to click through their dialogue, and get it done. Together. As long as there is decent DPS, everyone can hold a pretty fast tempo because, hey, four people working together can mow down a boss pretty fast.


"Rushers", then, are people who run ahead of the rest of the group and engage the bosses without anyone else there, usually making a train of aggroed mobs behind them. Its rare for them to offer so much as a warning that they intend to speedrun before they take off, expecting their group to tag along. Sometimes, but not always, they've got the DPS to burn the boss down before their group catches up after fighting through the pack of aggroed mobs. Rare polite rushers nuke the train of mobs, and wait for their group members before fighting the boss.

"Rushing" is very much taking a solo approach to a "group" activity, where the rusher is completely the dungeon as fast as possible on their own and expecting their groupmates to match their pace or be left behind. Often, they view it as doing their "group" a favor or that their slower groupmates are incompetent because they didn't keep up without so much as a word of warning.

Unsurprisingly, some players like being carried by the rusher and some players really dislike being expected to catch up or be left behind/lose loot without so much of a by-your-leave. Players tend to get really annoyed if the rusher is depriving them of loot by killing the boss before they can get there instead of doing it as a group - for reasons I hope are obvious.


A polite rusher can be a joy to run with. As a tank, I love getting the player who asks for a speedrun and can handle it. Smooth run FTW!

A rude rusher can a nightmare for their groupmates, who have to kick the player or else get dragged through trains of aggroed mobs or else lose out on their loot and rewards, and if they make the fight in time, are usually out of stamina and thus unable to really contribute much.


Though I will say this: Players who rush ahead and then can't handle the bosses are absolutely hilarious!

I had one "healer" decide he was going to rush ahead in Spindleclutch 1, despite the questing, low level DDs in the group. He'd run ahead and hit the boss while me and the DDs were dealing with mobs like normal, and we'd watch his health bar plummet. When we got there - and we were going at what I'd consider normal speed for decent DPS - I'd tank the boss while rezzing him, and then we'd all kill the boss together.

He got so salty when I said maybe he'd live longer if he stuck with the group after the third boss he tried that on.

Nairinhe

Jeremy wrote: »

Nairinhe wrote: »

If you pug, you do what the group does.

I hope the group doesn't decide to jump off a cliff.

What about bloodport in Sunspire?

kargen27 wrote: »

Nairinhe wrote: »

If you pug, you do what the group does. If they rush - you rush, if they do the quest and loot every container - you wait for them.
If you want to run how you want to run - you need a premade.

So what happens when one wants to rush to the last boss, one is in for the first time and wants to listen to the quest dialog and the other two don't care about speed but want to kill all the bosses and mobs?

For people that want a quick run it is real easy to fill group in zone chat if you advertise you are doing a quick run. For DPS announcing you are looking for a group to carry on a random usually gets you a group quicker than the queue will and you know they all are there to run with you.

It would be logical for the two to stick with the quester and kick the rusher

Zatox wrote: »

Can you explain to me, who is "rushers"? Complete the dungeon as fast as possible is goal of every competent player. So, if player can't hold fast tempo, he is need to git gud.

Maybe completing the dungeon as fully as possible is the goal? The only thing I want to ask when I see such "gud == fast" opinion is, like, are you striving to do everything as quick as possible?

YstradClud

The only vote kick I have seen initiated during this event was against a lowbie tank who was going slow and getting lost. I declined the vote however and tried to help him learn the dungeon.

SeaGtGruff

Zatox wrote: »

Can you explain to me, who is "rushers"? Complete the dungeon as fast as possible is goal of every competent player. So, if player can't hold fast tempo, he is need to git gud.

Uh, no.

First of all, "competent player" is a matter of opinion, and speaking about anything in absolute terms of "everyone" or "no one" is just stupid hyperbole in my opinion, because there will almost always be an exception, and all it takes is a single exception to make the statement untrue.

But trying to say that so-called "competent" players want to complete a dungeon or other content as fast as possible is pretty insulting-- not to mention, it flies in the face of all those so-called "competent" players who are constantly whining about their need for more challenging content that they can't just one-shot their way through.

"Everything's so easy that it's ridiculous! I need harder enemies so the fights take longer!"

"You're taking too long to run this dungeon! You need to git gud and keep up with me!"

Those two attitudes are completely contradictory with each other, and are hypocritical to boot.