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Does anyone enjoy the vVateshran Minotaur boss?

fred4
fred4
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It's the second boss in the green section. For what it's worth, I think that fight is an ill-conceived pile of garbage, because the boss constantly changes color and you barely get any damage in. Feels like a fight designed for a group - the kind that stops you from soloing a dungeon or world boss not because it can't be done, but because it's just so tedious. I got Flawless on vMA by the way - a place I quite enjoy.

Part of this may be due to being a PvPer. I will never get the highest scores in vMA, because I don't have the DPS nor am I interested in honing that. These days I go to test out my latest PvP builds, usually with only minor changes, against something consistent. As I play light / medium, fairly high damage characters, that works. I typically get a vMA score in the 400K to 450K range.

This fight seems to be designed for laying down ground DOTs in advance and doing as much DPS as possible, the kind of thing true endgame PvEers do. At the same time, as Alcast says, it's also a stamina-intensive fight, which actually suits PvP-derived builds. It's a pain in the behind for both types of players, the squishy high-damage PvEer and the somewhat tankier PvPer who brings some stamina sustain, even on a magicka build. At any rate, if you don't bring the damage, the fight is interminable. I hate how high-end content tends to be a DPS race. This is not a DPS check as such, but the longer the fight goes on, the more likely you slip up from sheer boredom.
Edited by fred4 on November 24, 2020 2:07AM
PC EU (EP): Magicka NB (main), Stamina DK, Stamina Sorcerer, Magicka Warden, Magicka Templar, Stamina Templar (currently PvE tank)
PC EU (AD): Stamina NB, doesn't know what she's doing yet
PC NA (EP): Magicka NB
  • stefj68
    stefj68
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    too much hp's on that boss, but well
  • fred4
    fred4
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    stefj68 wrote: »
    too much hp's on that boss, but well
    Does the order you do the sections in have any influence on that?
    PC EU (EP): Magicka NB (main), Stamina DK, Stamina Sorcerer, Magicka Warden, Magicka Templar, Stamina Templar (currently PvE tank)
    PC EU (AD): Stamina NB, doesn't know what she's doing yet
    PC NA (EP): Magicka NB
  • Tannus15
    Tannus15
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    I have no dramas with it personally, but then I'm one of those squishy PvE mag builds with no stamina.

    I only bash 2 of the mages each time they channel and make sure to move to the two platforms that won't be filled with fire and use that time to burn the boss.
    the boss will almost always colour swap after the interrupts so be ready to grapple back to the other safe platform and then you get a solid 30 seconds to burn.
  • JamieAubrey
    JamieAubrey
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    Its the grapple I hate, other than that its fine
    -PC/EU/AD-
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  • Tsar_Gekkou
    Tsar_Gekkou
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    I'd be fine with him if he didn't knock you down when landing anywhere near you after you grapple.
    Xbox NA healer main
    vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMoL HM | vHoF HM | vAS+2 | vCR+3 | vBRP | vSS HM | vKA HM |
    Flawless Conqueror | Spirit Slayer | Dro-mA'thra Destroyer | Immortal Redeemer |
  • zvavi
    zvavi
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    I mean. With enough damage, on the mag rout, you see him change colour only twice (once getting his first color, second time changing that color once).
    I'd be fine with him if he didn't knock you down when landing anywhere near you after you grapple.

    block.
    Edited by zvavi on November 24, 2020 7:25AM
  • Tsar_Gekkou
    Tsar_Gekkou
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    zvavi wrote: »
    I mean. With enough damage, on the mag rout, you see him change colour only twice (once getting his first color, second time changing that color once).
    I'd be fine with him if he didn't knock you down when landing anywhere near you after you grapple.

    block.

    That costs stam, and interrupting all four of the casters means grappling and blocking three times in a row, and then chances are that he'll change color immediately after all the interrupts which means another grapple and another block. I know I shouldn't need to interrupt all of the casters, but with how buggy this game is, I don't take chances.
    Xbox NA healer main
    vAA HM | vHRC HM | vSO HM | vMoL HM | vHoF HM | vAS+2 | vCR+3 | vBRP | vSS HM | vKA HM |
    Flawless Conqueror | Spirit Slayer | Dro-mA'thra Destroyer | Immortal Redeemer |
  • zvavi
    zvavi
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    zvavi wrote: »
    I mean. With enough damage, on the mag rout, you see him change colour only twice (once getting his first color, second time changing that color once).
    I'd be fine with him if he didn't knock you down when landing anywhere near you after you grapple.

    block.

    That costs stam, and interrupting all four of the casters means grappling and blocking three times in a row, and then chances are that he'll change color immediately after all the interrupts which means another grapple and another block. I know I shouldn't need to interrupt all of the casters, but with how buggy this game is, I don't take chances.

    Grappling+interrupting 2 casters means blocking only once, on the last platform. Even when and if I am interrupting all 4 casters, I need only to block on the last platform. if at all, usually the last platform is the one I started on so i don't even need to interrupt, you can just run out before he reaches it. The block is not even needed, it is just more comfortable to ground dot him while blocking.
  • highkingnm
    highkingnm
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    Other than buggy grapple, I think it is absolutely fine. The knock downs can be blocked, the colour changes are a way of preventing it being a burn fest and, on my stam toons and even on my 10k stam mag toon, I can do all four interrupts without running out of stamina and use stam pots if needed.

    There’s nothing there which is horrendous. I actually find the first green boss considerably harder due to the amount of damage sources by the end. Not sure how this has become the “oh god I hate it” boss, but maybe it’s because I’ve just had good fortune on my runs and avoided bugs.
    CP 810 - PC-NA
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  • MajThorax
    MajThorax
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    Indeed, it's tedious. Even if I choose it as the first portal, it bores the hell out of me.
  • Stahlor
    Stahlor
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    It's just completely buuged.
    - You get killed while grappling and in the air and you can only watch your dead body floating back to the platform where you came from.
    - You get not completely killed, but you still float back to the platform where you came from.
    - As soon as you land on the next platform, you get knocked down by the boss, although it hasn't even arrived yet on your platform.
    - etc...
  • notyuu
    notyuu
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    the part of it that kills it for me personally is the having to grapple to another colour every 30 seconds which just drags the fight feel less...tatical and more just padded, ya know like that blood monster in castle thorn with its invncibility phase that lasts for waaay too long even after you mop up the adds, so you're left just standing there waiting.
  • croakie
    croakie
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    I actually got to enjoy it. He was the last boss I need on vet before final so he was the hardest. There's a rhythm to it though. Use lots of dots. I'm a stamplar so POTL as much as possible. After he does his charge drop Endless Hail on him and hit him. Move when he moves from platform to platform. When the mages start up bash/grapple all the way around, you should be able to grapple to the next platform and bash before he catches up with you and do it all again. If he goes from ice to fire just move to the opposite platform. Try to keep your dots on him as much as possible and hit him when you can. It's not a dps race, you just have to keep ahead of him.
  • Grandchamp1989
    Grandchamp1989
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    Fight last longer than the fun of doing it.
    It's a fun fight but it's so long by the end of it I just want it to end.
  • SillyPlay
    SillyPlay
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    think the boss is ok and fun. just fix some of the still existing grapple bugs and make him not instantly change colors/get immune on a new platform
  • spartaxoxo
    spartaxoxo
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    SillyPlay wrote: »
    think the boss is ok and fun. just fix some of the still existing grapple bugs and make him not instantly change colors/get immune on a new platform

    I think there should be a period of time after the grapple phase where he maybe loses colors or something for a few seconds it would be better. It wouldn't have to be crazy long but the ability to just start fighting him again after the grapple phase, no matter your platform, would go a long way to make that fight better.

    As it is, you quite often have to finish bashes, wait for him to land on your platform, go the next platform because he's immune, watch him change colors again, and then switch platforms again. It's only then that you get to dps. And by then he's wasted half your time before channeling starts back up.

    That's what makes it annoying. That's not difficult it's just time consuming. They fix that it would actually be fun. The early part of the fight before the channeling starts is actually enjoyable.
    Edited by spartaxoxo on November 24, 2020 12:40PM
  • phbell
    phbell
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    fred4 wrote: »
    It's the second boss in the green section. For what it's worth, I think that fight is an ill-conceived pile of garbage, because the boss constantly changes color and you barely get any damage in. .

    I enjoy the fight. It is important to know the mechanics though. pretty easy with the grappling bow buff.
  • fred4
    fred4
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    Eedat wrote: »
    I have zero issues with that boss tbh. I think the first boss in the green area is harder than the Minotaur.
    Interesting. I think that depends on the class. Wasn't that easy on my stam DK, but on magplar it was a doddle. Basically just Sweeps and then Toppling Charge to interrupt the spriggans.
    PC EU (EP): Magicka NB (main), Stamina DK, Stamina Sorcerer, Magicka Warden, Magicka Templar, Stamina Templar (currently PvE tank)
    PC EU (AD): Stamina NB, doesn't know what she's doing yet
    PC NA (EP): Magicka NB
  • Jaimeh
    Jaimeh
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    It's not a difficult fight, but I agree that it's a very tedious one, and you need to manage your stamina well. If you don't have a lot of damage, it will just take longer. Make sure to have a lot of single target damage because besides the jumping/colour change, the boss also moves around with his charging, and the player moves around as well to avoid the charge and heavy attacks, so I find that a lot of (costly) AoE goes wasted. Also, always cast your ulti after his does the colour change.
    Edited by Jaimeh on November 24, 2020 1:14PM
    @stargold

    PC/NA CP810

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  • fred4
    fred4
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    highkingnm wrote: »
    I actually find the first green boss considerably harder due to the amount of damage sources by the end. Not sure how this has become the “oh god I hate it” boss.
    Because hard isn't a turn off, but tedium is. Fights where you have to juggle more adds that are moving around, that perhaps hit hard but that can also be easily killed, those fights I enjoy. This boss - nothing is really threatening unless you mess up. It's just really tedious how slowly it progresses.

    The first green fight is perhaps more build-dependent. Having an interrupt skill or at least a gap closer helps for the spriggans. Having good AOE - preferably some that also heals you, e.g. Sweeps / Sap - also helps a lot. It's actually a fight that was super easy on my PvP magplar:

    https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=293968
    PC EU (EP): Magicka NB (main), Stamina DK, Stamina Sorcerer, Magicka Warden, Magicka Templar, Stamina Templar (currently PvE tank)
    PC EU (AD): Stamina NB, doesn't know what she's doing yet
    PC NA (EP): Magicka NB
  • fred4
    fred4
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    spartaxoxo wrote: »
    I hate this boss because he changes colors far too frequently and it dramatically slows stuff down. It's not difficult just a slog. The same is true of the stupid hidden boss, although at least that one isn't as buggy. Thing hops around too much and it kills the enjoyment of an otherwise fun mechanic.
    I decided to stay on one platform for that one, just avoiding / tanking out the ground AOE. No point in chasing him, because he comes back frequently anyway.
    PC EU (EP): Magicka NB (main), Stamina DK, Stamina Sorcerer, Magicka Warden, Magicka Templar, Stamina Templar (currently PvE tank)
    PC EU (AD): Stamina NB, doesn't know what she's doing yet
    PC NA (EP): Magicka NB
  • UrbanMonk
    UrbanMonk
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    I do the green arena 1st so he has close to 3.5 mil HP only, and I burn him within 2 add spawning fire/ice on portals phases, so its whatever. Takes me abt 3 min tops to finish him.
    Though it shows how capable ZoS is to make a fight interesting when they want to avoid these bosses getting burned.
    On a 1-10 scale this fight is 2 at best in terms of engagement and design.
    But then The Triad Tree bosses are irritating as well, luckily they have only 1.4 mil HP combined and go down way faster. But mechanically this is way better fight than Mino.

    Urban.Monk

    -Monk I- Magden- AVA ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐
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    -Hot Nöödle- MagDK - AVA37
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    ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
    Balance for the Sake of Balance is no Balance at all.
  • ecru
    ecru
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    it's very easy now that grappling doesn't sheathe your weapon. the fight should go red/dps, blue/dps, red/dps + interrupt, jump blue where archer adds are + interrupt, jump blue + dps, jump red when he switches and then finish the fight. you probably need about 30k dps to manage this method (although since you can finish in about 2 minutes like this, total effective dps over the course of the fight can be around ~23k). this method also avoids dealing with any adds since only two platforms have them at this point.

    if you can't finish the fight on that last platform, you just repeat the pattern by interrupting on the last blue platform (when he switches), jumping to a red platform and interrupting, and then jumping to another red. this method will always place you on a safe platform to dps him until he switches again. when i see people do this fight the biggest mistake they seem to be making is not realizing that they can jump diagonally. your last jump is always going to be diagonal before you get a window to dps him again.
    Edited by ecru on November 24, 2020 2:06PM
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  • UrbanMonk
    UrbanMonk
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    Jaimeh wrote: »
    It's not a difficult fight, but I agree that it's a very tedious one, and you need to manage your stamina well. If you don't have a lot of damage, it will just take longer. Make sure to have a lot of single target damage because besides the jumping/colour change, the boss also moves around with his charging, and the player moves around as well to avoid the charge and heavy attacks, so I find that a lot of (costly) AoE goes wasted. Also, always cast your ulti after his does the colour change.

    Unless you position yourself between boss and on very edge of the platform, that way he has nowhere to go but towards the edge, and we know he can't fall down, so he always stays on ground dots or any Aoe ultimate. His HA block, charge- block or move out of the way.
    Urban.Monk

    -Monk I- Magden- AVA ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐
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    -Hot Nöödle- MagDK - AVA37
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    ___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
    Balance for the Sake of Balance is no Balance at all.
  • Tryxus
    Tryxus
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    Not the boss that I hate the most in vVH...

    But he does get annoying really fast due to having to interrupt the fight and grapple to another platform just to do damage to the boss again or to interrupt the casters, which just drags the fight out. And the boss itself doesn't have any interesting mechanics either other than the extra stam management from roll dodging his smash or blocking when he jumps.
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