Stamina templar pvp state

Jaxaxo

Posting this for a friend who doesnt have acces to forum currently, but since it's sth relevant i guess i will just leave this here:

Stamina Templar is in a terrible state (PVP)

Since the latest change to Backlash and its morphs (especially Power of the Light), the ability is not worth slotting since its damage is very low on average compared to other classes' delayed burst abilities, such as Scorch or Blastbones which can deal 6k+ damage consistently every 3-4 seconds. And while Minor Breach is getting buffed in the upcoming patch, it's going to be available to everyone using Pierce Armor, which also applies Major Breach.

Burning Light is only somewhat impactful in 1v1 or Xv1 scenarios against immobile targets now, anyone that moves out of jab range will not get hit by enough ticks to activate the passive and in outnumbered scenarios it is completely useless.

Stamina Templar also has the worst healing of all stamina classes besides Nightblade, with no major healing buffs or passives available besides Minor Mending, which is only 10% (soon 8%) compared to Warden's Major Mending and strong active heals, or Dragonknight's Major Mending and an additional 12% Healing Received. The class does not have any mobility or mitigation tools to make up for the low healing, besides the purge from Cleansing Ritual which can't keep up with the amount of procs in the current PVP meta.

In fact, a lot of the templar passives are nearly or completely wasted on a stamina based setup, such as Mending, Enduring Rays, Prism and Illuminate (since no Dawn's Wrath abilities are worth slotting anymore).

Please consider reworking Backlash, Burning Light and some of the other Templar passives to make Stamina Templar viable again.

Grimlok_S

Truth. I've tried a lot of different builds since returning to the game this patch to get my Stamplar back on track, but simply put anything I put together that works decent, straight up performs better on other classes.

I mainly play no-CP pvp these days and PotL was weak enough there before. (Why does it scale with max stam when templar receives a unique 6% wpn dmg buff?)

Bang on post. Stamplar solidarity.

Drdeath20

In before all the people that never play the class come in and say jabs...

OlumoGarbag

Agree Stamplar is sub par on any aspect of PVP. Stamplar needs some major changes (and also some minor ones).

Jaxaxo

Drdeath20 wrote: »

In before all the people that never play the class come in and say jabs...

I never played the class, but just looking at passives and skills u can say there is sth really wrong with them atm

Grimlok_S

Drdeath20 wrote: »

In before all the people that never play the class come in and say jabs...

Don't get me wrong, Jabs is great! If and ONLY if you get a fully stam-drained opponent to eat a full CC duration. That's the only time you can hold them still long enough to get all 4 hits in to get a single burning light off Jabs alone.

Otherwise between the usual lag and location desyncs you'll get an average 1-2 jabs per cast, at least in my experience.

Also consider that you can't block or dodge roll during the channel. I've talked with several other seasoned Stamplars and we're all pretty underwhelmed atm.

West93

Backlash should be reworked. Delayed burst ability hitting for 2k average in pvp meanwhile blastbones can hit 4x times that much + major defile and no damage build up needed.

Dunning_Kruger

I have played stamplar since 2016. The only thing that is keeping this class from utterly imploding is eternal vigor. Also backlash is indeed trash compared to its delayed burst counter parts.

Hakkanistorm

Stamplar is the worst now

Firstmep

100% agree, stamplar needs help, it used to a be a decent dueling class so apparently Zos needed to nerf our dmg.
Meanwhile on stamden you can run some of the stupidest builds, like running over 40k hp in no cp and still getting top kills/dmg and be freaking unkillable with vines/Arctic blast.
Stamplar just doesn't have anything going for it right now.
Backlash should hit harder than Blastbones and shalks, it's a single target skill and only hits every 6 seconds.

Rhaegar75

you can just about be subpar if you use proc sets...without them Stamplar is just pure trash

very sad

Xiomaro

My Stamplar has been relegated to PVE tank and it's one of the worst classes for that too

Firstmep

Xiomaro wrote: »

My Stamplar has been relegated to PVE tank and it's one of the worst classes for that too

I see you in bgs dominate on stamsorc, and ive been doing the same pretty much, when i get fed up with stamplar i just hop on sorc and feel like an absolute god.
Dont even get me started on stamcro, where i just run a meme bow/bow build that just erases groups with blastones/colo/acid spray.
Meanwhile stamplar is just an absolute joke, anything that kinda works on it just works much better on literally any other class.

Husan

Just came here to say I agree. We are so far behind at this point a complete rework of half the passives and entire skill trees is needed (1 usable skill from dawns wrath skill line for stamina, 2 for from restorning light - 3/10! ). Hopefully we get access to class change tokens soon.

OlumoGarbag

Literally the only thing stamplar has left, is Aoe Weaponsbleed, If they intoduced a proc set that procs insane damage on bleeding targets, stamplar would be the best class for it.

- Worst defensive stam class
- almost worst AoE stam class
- Worst 1v1 stamclass (if you dont run duelling setup)
- Worst buffs/debuffs for procsetups
- no additional mobility
- no burst damage
- no class ult

Ariades_swe

Stamden and Stamnb is worse.

Morwaenna

Try being a mag player.

Berchelous

Ariades_swe wrote: »

Stamden and Stamnb is worse.

Lol is this a joke?

Drdeath20

This

Firstmep

OlumoGarbag wrote: »

Literally the only thing stamplar has left, is Aoe Weaponsbleed, If they intoduced a proc set that procs insane damage on bleeding targets, stamplar would be the best class for it.

- Worst defensive stam class
- almost worst AoE stam class
- Worst 1v1 stamclass (if you dont run duelling setup)
- Worst buffs/debuffs for procsetups
- no additional mobility
- no burst damage
- no class ult

I still remember when i first saw Dragons Appetite i though that would be pretty cool for jabs.

Sadly the set is pretty mediocre.

Hakkanistorm

I'm just wondering if it’s as useless on CP as on Noncp? POTL hits ~ 2k, it's just some kind of joke?very often in pvp burnig light does not proc after 4 hits

Daggerfell0929

What if there is a passive they did where its like

" Increase your health recovery by 100 per Stamina templar ability slotted"

would be pretty cool

Daggerfell0929

Daggerfell0929 wrote: »

What if there is a passive they did where its like

" Increase your health recovery by 100 per Stamina templar ability slotted"

would be pretty cool

Not to mention it would help Stamplar tanks, aswell as stamplars in pvp with sustain

Joy_Division

These same complaints are all I heard when I was a rep. We communicated them to ZOS and after awhile both versions of templar were legit specs. I take a break from the game because I was sick and tired of 5 second skill delays and proc sets and come back only to see both versions of templars are trash and these same complaints have returned. Though I do hear PTS stamplar is a target dummy champion. Whoop-dee-do.

What a waste of a year and a half.

mav1234

Burning light change really sucks

Firstmep

Up until last patch it wasn't too bad, but Stonethorn brought the biggest nerfs I've ever seen any class receive.
Coupled with the 20% overall healing reduction and probably the worst proc meta I've seen ever, and yeah, here we are.
I've been saying for a long time that Templar, especially stamina only had its offensive power and very little defenses, but now they have taken even our offensive strength away.
And the fact that most of the changes were listed as either fixes or reworkks is pretty sad.
Clearly the devs think the new burning light is on par with the old one.
Really hoping next update after Markarth will bring some much needed love to templars, and many of our long time concerns will be addressed.
@ZOS_BrianWheeler @ZOS_Gilliam

Grimlok_S

Joy_Division wrote: »

These same complaints are all I heard when I was a rep. We communicated them to ZOS and after awhile both versions of templar were legit specs. I take a break from the game because I was sick and tired of 5 second skill delays and proc sets and come back only to see both versions of templars are trash and these same complaints have returned. Though I do hear PTS stamplar is a target dummy champion. Whoop-dee-do.

What a waste of a year and a half.

Wasn't a waste if at least we had a good patch. Unfortunately I was away from the game for most of Peak Stamplar, but nevertheless I appreciate the effort you and all the other reps put into the program. Thanks from all of us, Joy.

UppGRAYxDD

Templar atm: Masters of nothing, Jack of no trades... passives need a complete overhaul and class identity is basically ZoS’s middle child...

Waffennacht

Ive been eyeballing stam templar.

What do you gents think you want the most?

What's missing and why?

Drdeath20

Waffennacht wrote: »

Ive been eyeballing stam templar.

What do you gents think you want the most?

What's missing and why?

What i would want the most is a reason to play stamplar. Sounds pretty vague but i will get to it in due time.

What we are most missing: Offhealing, ultimate selection, burst skills, utility skills, defensive skills, unique buffs and in general a playstyle. I'll elaborate:

Stamplars lost their off healing from ritual of retribution for a ~800 dps gain. They have 1 other skill that is quasi off healing in eclipse but that skill has been adjusted and nerfed soo many times that its very weak and not worth a bar slot. I can deal with relying on vigor and rally as my only source of healing and the tradeoff is that my stamplar's skills hit 6% harder (passive).

Out of the 6 ultimates 1 (crescent sweep) is definitely designed for stamplars. we also have a statue heal (remembrance), that stamplars make work but its not ideal. if we immediately break it with block we get the instant heal and the major protection. The problem is it cost 150 ultimate, its a burst heal and major protection just got nerfed. Both these ultimates have cast time or channel times. Heres where we start to realize there is a big problem. yet another mediocre cost, burst offensive ultimate (dawnbreaker, onslaught and now crescent) but no real options for anything else.

Templars burst skill lost its unique status now that minor fracture is attached to many other things. It takes your entire aresnal to fill up the burst and the payoff is middling. Other players are not gonna let you unload 6 seconds of full on offense on them without some sort of counterplay. Soo in general filling it up completely is highly unlikely. Something as simple as purging removes this. Soo while it is cheap, it requires far too much to ever make it worth slotting.

When i say utility i mean really just anything useful. Stamplars are lacking when it comes to alot of the important buffs/debuffs and things that are needed in pvp. Its not necessarily 1 specific thing missing, its a lack of most of it that makes them a less desirable choice.

As a stamplar the minute you fall on your back bar you are in big trouble bcz all your class defensive skills have been gutted. Eclipse is not effective and blazing shield is far too impratical now (nerf to shields and nerf to damage) that neither are worth slotting. That leaves me javelin but 1 stun, that is often dodged doesnt turn a fight. Soo for a templar this makes having high damage a priority.

Stamplars only gain benefit from only a handful of passives and our biggest damage passive (burning light) got a severe nerf. Losing a chance to land burning light on every aedric spear attack. Soo our offense just took a huge nerf. Yes we get a 6% increase in damage but as i already said its a tradeoff for not having any kind of in class healing.

Lastly their general playstyle is just sit back and wait for 1 onslaught burst + Jabs over and over again. Ive built my front bar with all fighters guilds abilities to have more than enough power in my onslaught/jab burst. Everyone hates it, including templars but we have nothing else.

Soo when you ask for suggestions i could lay out a list of 6-7 medium size changes (that ZoS would never even consider) and it still wouldnt be good enough to make a big impact on the entire class toolkit. Im not trying to be all doom and gloom but templars have some serious problems. It would take more than the developers have ever done to make an impact.

Can you play as a templar? Yes
Can you get kills with a templar? Yes
Are the flawed soo badly and held together by 1 skill? Yes

Daggerfell0929

What are the 6-7 ideas?