Dungeons not fit for pugs : stone gardens

Recent

Some of us pug groups for many reasons.
1. Times we play when guildies or friends are not on that particular night when it's a pledge
2. We may not be in a guild for personal reasons
3. Our friends might not be the level required to do dlc dungeons or not want to

Anyhow i was just stating some reasons to make a point. There are dungeons we can solo 😉😆....some are challenging in pugs but very doable...then theres the nightmare dlc dungeons where pugs dont cut it....this means some of us miss out on enjoying this content.

Please make dungeons more pug friendly and solo friendly.......there are many players that dont have many friends they can count on to do these more mech. heavy dungeon bosses.

Firstmep

I was plugging ice reach earlier yesterday, we had 6 ppl joining the grp and leaving before they even attempted the dungeon.
Mind you I practically soloed the place and the other 2 guys who stuck with me from the start were doing okay as well.
I don't get why ppl are so afraid of dlc dungeons at least give them a try, most of them are very easy on normal.

colossalvoids

Not sure what part of it is not enough pug friendly?

Zatox

New dungeons are too easy even on vet (IR, UG, CT, SG), normal mode is not a problem for PUG.

Paramedicus

how about running it on normal, before asking for nerf?

Nairinhe

Newer DLC dungeons are delightfully easy to duo on normal even for those who are dead stuck on Mylenne in nMHK.

AyaDark

Hard mod is really hard on last boss.
Some attacks one shot for no reason - i see 3 k damage in death log and i die with full hp and shields on me.
I even can not understand what killed me.

The next problem is wolfs part on hm, just do not understand what us going on.

Tank get a lot of damage. I as DD have only problemwith wolfs stage - can not understand it yet.

But was only second time there in that DLC.

2 first bisses are easy on HM.

If pugs - tank and 1 of DD must play good to pass it. With out hm it is not hard but Tank get a lot of damage.

Recent

Firstmep wrote: »

I was plugging ice reach earlier yesterday, we had 6 ppl joining the grp and leaving before they even attempted the dungeon.
Mind you I practically soloed the place and the other 2 guys who stuck with me from the start were doing okay as well.
I don't get why ppl are so afraid of dlc dungeons at least give them a try, most of them are very easy on normal.

Firstmep wrote: »

I was plugging ice reach earlier yesterday, we had 6 ppl joining the grp and leaving before they even attempted the dungeon.
Mind you I practically soloed the place and the other 2 guys who stuck with me from the start were doing okay as well.
I don't get why ppl are so afraid of dlc dungeons at least give them a try, most of them are very easy on normal.

Some are easy yes i agree, some are not.😊

Recent

Paramedicus wrote: »

how about running it on normal, before asking for nerf?

😂😂😂😂

Recent

Firstmep wrote: »

I was plugging ice reach earlier yesterday, we had 6 ppl joining the grp and leaving before they even attempted the dungeon.
Mind you I practically soloed the place and the other 2 guys who stuck with me from the start were doing okay as well.
I don't get why ppl are so afraid of dlc dungeons at least give them a try, most of them are very easy on normal.

Lol a dungeon only has 4 people ...6 cannot go in so it shows you are telling fibs 😄😅

UntilValhalla13

AyaDark wrote: »

Hard mod is really hard on last boss.
Some attacks one shot for no reason - i see 3 k damage in death log and i die with full hp and shields on me.
I even can not understand what killed me.

The next problem is wolfs part on hm, just do not understand what us going on.

Tank get a lot of damage. I as DD have only problemwith wolfs stage - can not understand it yet.

But was only second time there in that DLC.

2 first bisses are easy on HM.

If pugs - tank and 1 of DD must play good to pass it. With out hm it is not hard but Tank get a lot of damage.

The right most ability is your heal. Pop it first thing. It eventually turns into an ice breath after a few attacks. The first ability is a taunt. Second is a gap closer. Third is an interrupt that should only be used if the husks start channel their poison attack up into the air. Only one person needs to do this, per poison attack. Popping your ulti refreshes the interrupt cooldown. Fourth skill is used to destroy the round shock mines.

This video was super helpful for the wolf phase. Just have each person taunt an add and stack them together. Someone interrupts when the poison attack starts.

https://youtu.be/DBW_0Q1huKY

AyaDark

UntilValhalla13 wrote: »

AyaDark wrote: »

Hard mod is really hard on last boss.
Some attacks one shot for no reason - i see 3 k damage in death log and i die with full hp and shields on me.
I even can not understand what killed me.

The next problem is wolfs part on hm, just do not understand what us going on.

Tank get a lot of damage. I as DD have only problemwith wolfs stage - can not understand it yet.

But was only second time there in that DLC.

2 first bisses are easy on HM.

If pugs - tank and 1 of DD must play good to pass it. With out hm it is not hard but Tank get a lot of damage.

The right most ability is your heal. Pop it first thing. It eventually turns into an ice breath after a few attacks. The first ability is a taunt. Second is a gap closer. Third is an interrupt that should only be used if the husks start channel their poison attack up into the air. Only one person needs to do this, per poison attack. Popping your ulti refreshes the interrupt cooldown. Fourth skill is used to destroy the round shock mines.

This video was super helpful for the wolf phase. Just have each person taunt an add and stack them together. Someone interrupts when the poison attack starts.

https://youtu.be/DBW_0Q1huKY

TY.

I even did not know about mines.

We try to seporate them, i think some thing like enrage will start if we do not.

Stratti

No.

If you cannot complete it in Vet. Then do not play it, leave the difficult content for us.

Pevey

Firstmep wrote: »

I was plugging ice reach earlier yesterday, we had 6 ppl joining the grp and leaving before they even attempted the dungeon.
Mind you I practically soloed the place and the other 2 guys who stuck with me from the start were doing okay as well.
I don't get why ppl are so afraid of dlc dungeons at least give them a try, most of them are very easy on normal.

Because some people were never into puzzle/adventure games. DLC dungeons are too long, too tedious, and too filled with ridiculous “mechanics” that some people are not interested in. Having one such puzzle or unique fight design in a final boss is one thing, but an entire experience of it is just not some people’s idea of fun. Random group or not.

Taleof2Cities

Recent wrote: »

Paramedicus wrote: »

how about running it on normal, before asking for nerf?

😂😂😂😂

You may not like to hear it, @Recent, but completing the dungeon on normal mode is way better than an incomplete run on veteran mode.

That’s why normal mode exists ... for those times that you can’t run with guildies or a pre-made group.

WeerW3ir

If Everyone could solo everything, or do everything because the difficulty of the game is so low, even a cake could do it too!
At that point the game would be so CHALLANGELEsS, there would be no point of playing it. Because no challanges, no hard content. And sadly recently the game is going that way. Please do not go that way even further...

OOJIMMY

Pevey wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

I was plugging ice reach earlier yesterday, we had 6 ppl joining the grp and leaving before they even attempted the dungeon.
Mind you I practically soloed the place and the other 2 guys who stuck with me from the start were doing okay as well.
I don't get why ppl are so afraid of dlc dungeons at least give them a try, most of them are very easy on normal.

Because some people were never into puzzle/adventure games. DLC dungeons are too long, too tedious, and too filled with ridiculous “mechanics” that some people are not interested in. Having one such puzzle or unique fight design in a final boss is one thing, but an entire experience of it is just not some people’s idea of fun. Random group or not.

So we should be able to walk into a dungeon talk to an npc and get the victory!

Grandchamp1989

Stone Garden:

Meh on healer
Somewhat challenging on DPS
A freaking nightmare for tanks.

On the final boss adds spawn in the room at random you have to grab before they cleave your team. It isn't a nice open field - no there's pillars and mechanical stuff everywhere that blocks your view. You also hold adds and bosses that one-shot you.
And this is not even taking HM into account.

I see this every new dungeon they put more and more pressure on the tanks while every other role is a breeze compared to the hell the tanks has to endure and juggle.

Stanx

Recent wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

I was plugging ice reach earlier yesterday, we had 6 ppl joining the grp and leaving before they even attempted the dungeon.
Mind you I practically soloed the place and the other 2 guys who stuck with me from the start were doing okay as well.
I don't get why ppl are so afraid of dlc dungeons at least give them a try, most of them are very easy on normal.

Lol a dungeon only has 4 people ...6 cannot go in so it shows you are telling fibs 😄😅

Pretty sure he meant 6 people joined and left the group when realising they'd ported into ice reach (probably looking for an easy non DLC).

Paramedicus

Grandchamp1989 wrote: »

Stone Garden:

Meh on healer
Somewhat challenging on DPS
A freaking nightmare for tanks.

On the final boss adds spawn in the room at random you have to grab before they cleave your team. It isn't a nice open field - no there's pillars and mechanical stuff everywhere that blocks your view. You also hold adds and bosses that one-shot you.
And this is not even taking HM into account.

I see this every new dungeon they put more and more pressure on the tanks while every other role is a breeze compared to the hell the tanks has to endure and juggle.

pro tip: kill secret "bosses"

xaraan

New dungeons are not designed well for the game to work as it is, this has always been an issue with DLC content, since the first time they put out new dungeons. That's why they often get nerfed over and over as time goes on or you hear zos commenting on things like WGT that they made changes based on details about how many groups stop at certain bosses and give up or don't even try certain dungeons.

They are designed, especially when you get to vet and then HMs to be challenging to players that have "extras" like discord/TS voice comms and often other add-ons. This is usually why doing pug runs of any DLC dungeons are a nightmare, not just because they are harder, but because the base game doesn't fundamentally offer key things that make not pug groups so much better at running them (outside of experience).

josiahva

Really? I have run vSG all of three times...pugged all 3 times(as tank) I don't really like the dungeon but it didn't seem hard by any stretch of the imagination. I mean, no, we didn't do the hardmodes, but its downright easy to pug

Zyva

I dont want things to be nerfed. To be honest, its already too easy. Maybe not for pug groups? But, I kind of think its fair to have different levels of difficulty the way it is. My group of friends got the trifecta in stone garden in less than a week. the newer dlc hard modes already feel easier mechanically than the older dlc hardmodes (cradle of shadows, bloodroot before they were nerfed to the ground, frost vault, depths of malatar, even lair of maars) , as if all they really wanted to do with the newer stuff is make it braindead but hit stupidly hard so we would actually bring a healer instead of three dps. Every boss but the last one you literally can just stand still and burn it.

Nerfing it might make it easier for pugs? but it would ruin it entirely for people that group with voice comms and build to excel at the game and min/max. There are veteran levels, and hard modes for a reason.

But it would be nice if they would make content challenging in new ways, and not just bosses hitting stupid hard. Adding puzzles or things that requires strategy and more than two braincells. or. they change cp system and make all content hard again for end game players (dont throw things at me XD) so we dont just out-dps every mechanic that is present.

Xebov

Recent wrote: »

Please make dungeons more pug friendly and solo friendly.......there are many players that dont have many friends they can count on to do these more mech. heavy dungeon bosses.

Even if all mechanics and health would be toned down ppl would still fail. The main reason PUGs fail in these dungeons is that tehy dont care about build and they dont care about mechanics. You can often see these "i was never here but i think jumping directly into vet is a good idea" players.

Diminish

I just ran Castle Thorn and Stone Garden with a PUG last night. I came back to the game after about an 8 month break, and have been mainly playing PVP. I ran Castle Thorn on vet with some friends like a week ago, but this was my first ever time in Stone Garden on vet, and only went in there on normal once before grinding skill points for a new PvP character. The group I got for the vet PUG last night were me and another 810 CP character, and 2 560ish CP characters. We didn't wipe once, and only had 1 death. It's definitely doable, and surely some groups will suffer more than others, but the same could be said with many other dungeons. I personally don't want over world difficulty content for newer veteran mode DLC content. I wouldn't even play it at that point.

zaria

Well the 50K health tank who got one shot in nMOS kind of interesting, yes he was <cp 200, he was an real tank who taunted and pulled but probably had crap armor and not much magic and stamina, and not blocking.

Don't pug vet DLC dungeons, except then pug 4 key and group is good.
Pug plenty of normals as so many in my guilds don't have ESO+ or use it as an excuse.

MirandaSharp

Recent wrote: »

Some of us pug groups for many reasons.
1. Times we play when guildies or friends are not on that particular night when it's a pledge
2. We may not be in a guild for personal reasons
3. Our friends might not be the level required to do dlc dungeons or not want to

Anyhow i was just stating some reasons to make a point. There are dungeons we can solo 😉😆....some are challenging in pugs but very doable...then theres the nightmare dlc dungeons where pugs dont cut it....this means some of us miss out on enjoying this content.

Please make dungeons more pug friendly and solo friendly.......there are many players that dont have many friends they can count on to do these more mech. heavy dungeon bosses.

Just do them on normal and you'll get through with almost any pug. With the DLC dungeons you need to know the mechanics, so you need at least someone who's done it before or knows how it works.

Firstmep

Recent wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

I was plugging ice reach earlier yesterday, we had 6 ppl joining the grp and leaving before they even attempted the dungeon.
Mind you I practically soloed the place and the other 2 guys who stuck with me from the start were doing okay as well.
I don't get why ppl are so afraid of dlc dungeons at least give them a try, most of them are very easy on normal.

Lol a dungeon only has 4 people ...6 cannot go in so it shows you are telling fibs 😄😅

Yes, you got me, clearly i didnt mean that 6 different people joined via the grp finder 1by1 and all left 1by1.

We had 2354352345235 million people in the same dungeon.

I bet some people still couldnt do the dungeon with that many. KEKW

MirandaSharp

Diminish wrote: »

I just ran Castle Thorn and Stone Garden with a PUG last night. I came back to the game after about an 8 month break, and have been mainly playing PVP. I ran Castle Thorn on vet with some friends like a week ago, but this was my first ever time in Stone Garden on vet, and only went in there on normal once before grinding skill points for a new PvP character. The group I got for the vet PUG last night were me and another 810 CP character, and 2 560ish CP characters. We didn't wipe once, and only had 1 death. It's definitely doable, and surely some groups will suffer more than others, but the same could be said with many other dungeons. I personally don't want over world difficulty content for newer veteran mode DLC content. I wouldn't even play it at that point.

Castle Thorn isn't on the same scale as some other DLC dungeons in difficulty... It's actually maybe the easiest of the DLC dungeons.. I soloed it yesterday(on normal) and the only boss giving me trouble was that guy with his blood pool! With a group you can just burn him before the tedious(and annoying) mechanics kicks in.. I think they have listened to the players somewhat in regards to the huge gap between normal and DLC dungeons.. On normal they're all doable with any pug. DLC on vet is still a pug breaker, at least for me... (I'm not that experienced yet though)

Jeremy

Recent wrote: »

Some of us pug groups for many reasons.
1. Times we play when guildies or friends are not on that particular night when it's a pledge
2. We may not be in a guild for personal reasons
3. Our friends might not be the level required to do dlc dungeons or not want to

Anyhow i was just stating some reasons to make a point. There are dungeons we can solo 😉😆....some are challenging in pugs but very doable...then theres the nightmare dlc dungeons where pugs dont cut it....this means some of us miss out on enjoying this content.

Please make dungeons more pug friendly and solo friendly.......there are many players that dont have many friends they can count on to do these more mech. heavy dungeon bosses.

I would just pug the more difficult DLC dungeons on normal mode unless you're in a good mood and prepared to deal with some difficulties. Because as you say: doing Veteran DLC dungeons through the activity finder is often an arduous process. So make sure your calm and relaxed and have plenty of time before you queue up for a veteran DLC. haha

That being said, I would support removing a lot of the one-shot deaths from DLC dungeons. I think they go overboard with them - especially considering all of the visual obstructions this game has. I think these are more frustrating than challenging and a cheesy way to try and make your content difficult.

MirandaSharp

Jeremy wrote: »

That being said, I would support removing a lot of the one-shot deaths from DLC dungeons. I think they go overboard with them - especially considering all of the visual obstructions this game has. I think these are more frustrating than challenging and a cheesy way to try and make your content difficult.

I don't know. Those one-shot kills do force us to learn the mechanics.. That's why the normal vet dungeons are so easy, it's just (slightly)harder hitting bosses with more health really. On the other hand they should group the DLCs as different from the normals at least on vet.