Heavy Attack Set Exploiting Not Fixed

sabresandiego_ESO

Older heavy attack sets are still being doubled by dual wield, making these newer heavy attack sets that require a setup less desirable than their older bugged counterparts (seargents mail, undaunted infiltrator)

View video clip below from 1:37 to 1:38 to see this bugged setup (Seargent/Infiltrator combined with master dw) instantly bursting someone down in battlegrounds from mid range and around a corner.

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/725328696?t=1h37m2s

And here is a second clip of a DK with similar setup that was also bugged (Sunderflame) to double proc on dual wield heavies going 51 and 1 in chaos ball by 1-2 shotting everyone. (sunderflame has since been changed)

https://m.twitch.tv/videos/571788234

Mobius0

Staff heavies are boosted by it even more.

sabresandiego_ESO

Mobius0 wrote: »

Staff heavies are boosted by it even more.

Dual wield heavies land at the same time for instant burst damage. Channeled Staff heavies are damage over time. They are not in the same ballpark and that’s why set’s like the old viper were changed into DOT’s.

Arcanasx

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Mobius0 wrote: »

Staff heavies are boosted by it even more.

Dual wield heavies land at the same time for instant burst damage. Staff heavies are damage over time. They are not in the same ballpark and that’s why set’s like the old viper were changed into DOTs

Dual wield heavies require you to run up close to your target to land them. The staff heavies can be done from ranged, restore more resources, and the channeled ones have most of their damage ticks undodgeable. And by the way, not every set needs to be a DOT set. I understand that necromancers have a 15% boost to DOT damage and also a reduction to incoming DOT damage as well, so the more DOTs out there the more necromancers will benefit. Burst setups need to be viable as well, as much as you may disagree with that.

sabresandiego_ESO

These bugged DW heavies hit harder than Dizzy swings and cost 0 resources. The exploit also makes only one stamina weapon viable for heavy attack builds since it receives double the bonuses.

Arcanasx

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

These bugged DW heavies hit harder than Dizzy swings and cost 0 resources. The exploit also makes only one stamina weapon viable for heavy attack builds since it receives double the bonuses.

Heavy attack sets are also better for lightning and resto staves, which you keep leaving out. And sets such as sheer venom are better suited for bow do to how it makes it easier to proc on multiple players from a distance, and that a single poison inject will proc it twice as well, yet you aren't complaining about that. You've also never tried a heavy attack build for yourself, so stop pretending to care that heavy attack sets happen to be more viable for some weapon types.

Edit: I also see that you've added a link now. Nice cherry picking example you provided to continue your absurd, personally motivated attack on a build you find threatening to your own performance in BGs.

Firstmep

Arcanasx wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

These bugged DW heavies hit harder than Dizzy swings and cost 0 resources. The exploit also makes only one stamina weapon viable for heavy attack builds since it receives double the bonuses.

Heavy attack sets are also better for lightning and resto staves, which you keep leaving out. And sets such as sheer venom are better suited for bow do to how it makes it easier to proc on multiple players from a distance, and that a single poison inject will proc it twice as well, yet you aren't complaining about that. You've also never tried a heavy attack build for yourself, so stop pretending to care that heavy attack sets happen to be more viable for some weapon types.

To be fair with the empower change on pts, heavy attack builds both melee and ranged are about to get a bit ridiculous.
But I 100% agree that ppl need to play these builds to see how "strong" they are.
If sergeant granting its bonuses to dw heavies is a bug, than those heavies missing half the time due position desyncs is a bug as well.
Also on DK in no cp its not super easy to get off balanced, as all the available sources of off balance require some sacrafices.
Meanwhile on pts my magplar can have 100% empower uptime, easy access to off balance both via lightning wall or toppling charge.

Waffennacht

You havent proven its an exploit (definitely not confirmed by ZoS) could you at least say "potential" exploit?

JinxxND

Here we go again...

Tolino

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Older heavy attack sets are still being doubled by dual wield, making these newer heavy attack sets that require a setup less desirable than their older bugged counterparts (seargents mail, undaunted infiltrator)

And the newer heavy attack sets deal whitout Buff similar dmg than the old ones with malacath, offbalance and molten armaments on dw...
Actually, we should rather buff them to adjust them to the new standards

sabresandiego_ESO

Arcanasx wrote: »

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

These bugged DW heavies hit harder than Dizzy swings and cost 0 resources. The exploit also makes only one stamina weapon viable for heavy attack builds since it receives double the bonuses.

Heavy attack sets are also better for lightning and resto staves, which you keep leaving out. And sets such as sheer venom are better suited for bow do to how it makes it easier to proc on multiple players from a distance, and that a single poison inject will proc it twice as well, yet you aren't complaining about that. You've also never tried a heavy attack build for yourself, so stop pretending to care that heavy attack sets happen to be more viable for some weapon types.

Where in the linked video clip would a channeled staff heavy attack killed the victim nearly instantly the same way the bugged double heavies did with burst damage?

Mobius0

DW heavies are so easy to avoid!

If you are not using a staff with a heavy attack build, you are doing it wrong IMO. Kinda funny how people are complaining about DW heavies when they take like 5 years to charge up and it cancels their run speed boosts during that period.

sabresandiego_ESO

Mobius0 wrote: »

DW heavies are so easy to avoid!

If you are not using a staff with a heavy attack build, you are doing it wrong IMO. Kinda funny how people are complaining about DW heavies when they take like 5 years to charge up and it cancels their run speed boosts during that period.

Video evidence from the clip linked in this thread contradicts your narrative. A highly skilled stam sorc streamer dies twice in the span of a minute to this exploit.

ecru

Mobius0 wrote: »

DW heavies are so easy to avoid!

If you are not using a staff with a heavy attack build, you are doing it wrong IMO. Kinda funny how people are complaining about DW heavies when they take like 5 years to charge up and it cancels their run speed boosts during that period.

yes just don't be in melee range for one and a half seconds, ever, then you can avoid a dw heavy.

Arcanasx

sabresandiego_ESO wrote: »

Mobius0 wrote: »

DW heavies are so easy to avoid!

If you are not using a staff with a heavy attack build, you are doing it wrong IMO. Kinda funny how people are complaining about DW heavies when they take like 5 years to charge up and it cancels their run speed boosts during that period.

Video evidence from the clip linked in this thread contradicts your narrative. A highly skilled stam sorc streamer dies twice in the span of a minute to this exploit.

You can clearly see after the second time I killed him he took fall damage, and the reason why that heavy landed was because his streak didnt work, so its misleading to try and push the idea that I easily killed him twice within a minute when theres other variables at play. And by the way, you calling it an "exploit" isn't a confirmed fact or even a bug and is just your incredibly biased and flawed opinion.

Edit: Also, the fact that you would actually post in another thread that wasn't commented in nearly 3 months, when you have already made multiple topics/posts in other threads and continue to hyperbolically conflate a lot of factors that have nothing inherently do to with the heavy attack sets, including undaunted which has literally always worked the way it does since it first came out itself just reeks of desperation.

Mobius0

That applies to any damage, really. But in the case of a heavy attack, they are sacrificing multiple GCDs.

They are also sacrificing the ability to weave light attacks in those GCDs.

It's probably a good build in certain niche PvP scenarios, but it doesn't look more powerful than other current builds, when you are dealing with moving targets and dodge roll.

Either way, your problem is not the armor sets or DW but the DK passive. I guarantee you anyone that is giving you a problem is a DK. Granted if they were smarter they'd be using a staff.

katorga

Mobius0 wrote: »

That applies to any damage, really. But in the case of a heavy attack, they are sacrificing multiple GCDs.

They are also sacrificing the ability to weave light attacks in those GCDs.

It's probably a good build in certain niche PvP scenarios, but it doesn't look more powerful than other current builds, when you are dealing with moving targets and dodge roll.

Either way, your problem is not the armor sets or DW but the DK passive. I guarantee you anyone that is giving you a problem is a DK. Granted if they were smarter they'd be using a staff.

This is nothing new, and it is really only feasible on DK. There is no substitute for that 50% damage buff. There are heavy attack build threads going back for years for both pve and pvp.

The only difference is slight buffs to Sergeants Mail, and big buffs to the Infiltrator/Unweaver sets and Noble Duelist.

Mobius0

katorga wrote: »

Mobius0 wrote: »

That applies to any damage, really. But in the case of a heavy attack, they are sacrificing multiple GCDs.

They are also sacrificing the ability to weave light attacks in those GCDs.

It's probably a good build in certain niche PvP scenarios, but it doesn't look more powerful than other current builds, when you are dealing with moving targets and dodge roll.

Either way, your problem is not the armor sets or DW but the DK passive. I guarantee you anyone that is giving you a problem is a DK. Granted if they were smarter they'd be using a staff.

This is nothing new, and it is really only feasible on DK. There is no substitute for that 50% damage buff. There are heavy attack build threads going back for years for both pve and pvp.

The only difference is slight buffs to Sergeants Mail, and big buffs to the Infiltrator/Unweaver sets and Noble Duelist.

Yes, but nerfing DW heavies, or those sets, impacts everyone that uses them that isn't a DK, when it's just one passive that is ACTUALLY the issue.

Merforum

That isn't a bug. That is a typical tactic to run around a corner and spinning around and firing off a heavy on the guy chasing you. It works because the chaser doesn't expect it, especially when their healing up after losing half health from falling. BTW that other dudes was just better.

MincVinyl

My boi @Arcanasx holdin it down in bgs still.

Good thing zos wants to make this game lower apm and they think focusing on all of these light and heavy attack mechanics will help lower skilled players not have to learn the game.

Edit: I want to also add that I think someone running proc sets spamming bombard and magnum shot is just as bad if not worse for the game, If we want to talk about abusing mechanics with little counterplay or skill involved.

JinxxND

Imagine complaining about melee telegraphed heavy attacks with all the overtuned stuff in the game

MincVinyl wrote: »

My boi @Arcanasx holdin it down in bgs still.

Good thing zos wants to make this game lower apm and they think focusing on all of these light and heavy attack mechanics will help lower skilled players not have to learn the game.

Edit: I want to also add that I think someone running proc sets spamming bombard and magnum shot is just as bad if not worse for the game, If we want to talk about abusing mechanics with little counterplay or skill involved.

After playing these BG's and seeing stam necros use 4 proc sets spamming gap closers with vMA that lock on to people proccing 2 proc sets with unleashed and mericless charge and magnum shot with BRP and syvarras scales I would say the skill level and APM is at an all time low due to proc sets vs a stamDK with one heal slotted in vigor and without a purge trying to land melee heavy attacks amid all the ranged proc spam and magsorcs now using oblivion foe from max range

sabresandiego_ESO

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler

The two video clips speak for themselves in regards to how broken/exploitative the dual wield doubling of heavy attack set modifiers is, particularly when combined with molten armaments (or off-balance and now empower). Gina clearly states that Seargent's Mail was not intended to boost offhand damage back in 2017 in this post here:

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/368280/the-sergeant-set-and-dual-wield-heavy-attacks

Psiion

Greetings,

As there is already a thread open on this subject, we've gone ahead and closed this one down. Please refer to the open thread here for further discussion on this topic.