Malacath's is strongest damage buff in game?

katorga

With the pass through major/minors, Malacath's Band is now the strongest damage buff in the game?

VoidCommander

Yes, but actually no. Crit is still better by far in non-pvp applications.

katorga

VoidCommander wrote: »

Yes, but actually no. Crit is still better by far in non-pvp applications.

Probably for PVE. Depends on if the crit rate changes result in a net reduction in crit rate, and how much, versus net increase to critical damage through Brittle debuff, and its availability.

Jodynn

Crit is ~100% damage with the absurdly easy to access force x crit rate which at base with no modifiers other than cp and buffs is around 40% so 40% damage inc. versus 25%.

With modifiers you get like 115, 125, depending on class, mundus, precise and what not so some classes like 60, 70, even 80% then also add in brittle and ele catalyst so.. yeah.. crit is far better in PvE.

Waffennacht

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

Crit is ~100% damage with the absurdly easy to access force x crit rate which at base with no modifiers other than cp and buffs is around 40% so 40% damage inc. versus 25%.

With modifiers you get like 115, 125, depending on class, mundus, precise and what not so some classes like 60, 70, even 80% then also add in brittle and ele catalyst so.. yeah.. crit is far better in PvE.

All of which is correct and unfortunately doesn't matter.

Becausr its the best buff in PvP, im sure it'll be nerfed. Its already borderline OP

Gaggin

Its not a buff its a gearset. You lose a slot and cant crit so for pvp you have to build carefully around it.

universal_wrath

Gaggin wrote: »

Its not a buff its a gearset. You lose a slot and cant crit so for pvp you have to build carefully around it.

Its benefits outweigh its downsides especially after the recent buffs to proc sets. You don't need to carefully build around it. Just equip any 2 proc sets and enjoy the slaughter house. You would have like 2.5k-3.5k WD or somewhere around 2k SD, but that does not matter, because you will do more damage than a person with 5k+ WD. In PvP no CP, typical crit rating is around 30% quite low to depend on critical damage, having 25% flat out more damage done without relying on inconsistamt critical damage is by far better. Also, you can still critically heal which it should not be the case imo.

Waffennacht

@univerisal_wrath is correct. Essentially it makes all your proc sets "crit" when they couldnt before; your abilities get the same buff; at the expense of essentially nothing if you run sub 50% crit chance + or - potential modifiers

katorga

Waffennacht wrote: »

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

Crit is ~100% damage with the absurdly easy to access force x crit rate which at base with no modifiers other than cp and buffs is around 40% so 40% damage inc. versus 25%.

With modifiers you get like 115, 125, depending on class, mundus, precise and what not so some classes like 60, 70, even 80% then also add in brittle and ele catalyst so.. yeah.. crit is far better in PvE.

All of which is correct and unfortunately doesn't matter.

Becausr its the best buff in PvP, im sure it'll be nerfed. Its already borderline OP

That is where I was headed, despite all of the gnashing of teeth on the forums about malacath and proc sets in pvp, they went and made Malacath the literally strongest damage buff in the game. Ironic.

Tannus15

I have a suspicion that they intended malacath to be the strongest damage buff in the game, since it comes with a huge trade off, no crit.

Then when it wasn't, they realised that crit was too easy to obtain making malacath terrible in any situation where "things can crit". hence the nerf to baseline crit %

ebix_

depends on to your build , like if you play a build on 5 heavy then it is a really good buff especially since you wont need to worry about having major savagery or prophesy but on some classes it dosent work like stamblade or magsorc bcs they heavily focus on crit, but I still prefer malacath on my magsorc in no cp
also it buffs proc sets and allows some broken playstyles to be possible.
btw I'm talking about pvp . in pve malacath is not even close to replace crit atm .

x48rph

Tannus15 wrote: »

I have a suspicion that they intended malacath to be the strongest damage buff in the game, since it comes with a huge trade off, no crit.

Then when it wasn't, they realised that crit was too easy to obtain making malacath terrible in any situation where "things can crit". hence the nerf to baseline crit %

Typical development pattern for them. Release something new, and then nerf everything else to make sure it's better

Vevvev

In PVE I pull larger damage numbers without Malacath's ring, but in PVP the set is very strong against crit resistance stacking foes. Reason why is it'll always deal 25% increased damage whereas if you fight a regular player that damage bonus varies. Undergeared players will get shredded by crit builds while the PVP geared players will just have the crits deal close to regular damage.

Even with the changes on the PTS this'll still hold true since by default critical damage is at 50% bonus damage.

Jodynn

PVE ring is useless next to crit.

PVP
25% more on proc sets doesn't kill me, it just shows me the person I'm fighting with has less stats and is easier to melt since they sacrificed not only a 5 piece bonus for a proc set, but also malacath so they can't crit me so I know their numbers will never jump, they'll always be constant, so if I live through one burst, I know how to time all of their bursts.

When a lot of people are using it, sure you will probably die, but 1v5 hardly ever turns out well if they have any skill at all, if they're all potatoes, then a proc set and Malacath ring isn't going to save them.

As far as I can tell it gives bad, newer, or learning people a crutch.. that's about it; anyone skilled will do better with buff sets easily, even if one of those sets are indeed Malacath, it's just a different option than figuring out how to do crit well, and it's never felt too overpowered to me one way or the other.

I die more to lag or forgetting there is a 3 sec cooldown on some of my skills more than anything.

Waffennacht

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

PVE ring is useless next to crit.

PVP
25% more on proc sets doesn't kill me, it just shows me the person I'm fighting with has less stats and is easier to melt since they sacrificed not only a 5 piece bonus for a proc set, but also malacath so they can't crit me so I know their numbers will never jump, they'll always be constant, so if I live through one burst, I know how to time all of their bursts.

When a lot of people are using it, sure you will probably die, but 1v5 hardly ever turns out well if they have any skill at all, if they're all potatoes, then a proc set and Malacath ring isn't going to save them.

As far as I can tell it gives bad, newer, or learning people a crutch.. that's about it; anyone skilled will do better with buff sets easily, even if one of those sets are indeed Malacath, it's just a different option than figuring out how to do crit well, and it's never felt too overpowered to me one way or the other.

I die more to lag or forgetting there is a 3 sec cooldown on some of my skills more than anything.

Why do people think you give up a set for malacath? In PvP you just slot the 5th piece on the back bar and have it carry over to the front (I.e. alchemist, briar, procs, very long list etc)

Atm: minor vul, minor berserk, mala, fire/frost/lightning/poison passive modifiers, +50% dmg on proc can be common (not including other modifiers)

Not all procs are equal, but they are not less than stat based sets.

katorga

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

PVE ring is useless next to crit.

PVP
25% more on proc sets doesn't kill me, it just shows me the person I'm fighting with has less stats and is easier to melt since they sacrificed not only a 5 piece bonus for a proc set, but also malacath so they can't crit me so I know their numbers will never jump, they'll always be constant, so if I live through one burst, I know how to time all of their bursts.

It definitely works more often than not. Periodically I throw on unleashed, vMA 2H axe, Plague Slinger and either Malacath or Wild hunt...I'd put it on par with my stat/crit oriented build in terms of effectiveness, but a lot easier to use.
Hence the popularity.

Jodynn

katorga wrote: »

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

PVE ring is useless next to crit.

PVP
25% more on proc sets doesn't kill me, it just shows me the person I'm fighting with has less stats and is easier to melt since they sacrificed not only a 5 piece bonus for a proc set, but also malacath so they can't crit me so I know their numbers will never jump, they'll always be constant, so if I live through one burst, I know how to time all of their bursts.

It definitely works more often than not. Periodically I throw on unleashed, vMA 2H axe, Plague Slinger and either Malacath or Wild hunt...I'd put it on par with my stat/crit oriented build in terms of effectiveness, but a lot easier to use.
Hence the popularity.

And I would not put it on par for me, it's easier to use but it's not as effective and once you understand the mechanics behind the procs you can easily counter them and it's a one-trick thing you have and can expect every x seconds especially since they removed most proc chances and made them mostly cooldown based, if you have stat bonuses you have more versatility and a way to throw off your opponent.

While it's strong, and viable, it's not the best and only option.

Ariades_swe

It's more like 17-19% buff to abilities in pvp than 25%. Only procsets gets the full 25% bonus.
It's a great set on most classes though.

universal_wrath

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

katorga wrote: »

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

PVE ring is useless next to crit.

PVP
25% more on proc sets doesn't kill me, it just shows me the person I'm fighting with has less stats and is easier to melt since they sacrificed not only a 5 piece bonus for a proc set, but also malacath so they can't crit me so I know their numbers will never jump, they'll always be constant, so if I live through one burst, I know how to time all of their bursts.

It definitely works more often than not. Periodically I throw on unleashed, vMA 2H axe, Plague Slinger and either Malacath or Wild hunt...I'd put it on par with my stat/crit oriented build in terms of effectiveness, but a lot easier to use.
Hence the popularity.

And I would not put it on par for me, it's easier to use but it's not as effective and once you understand the mechanics behind the procs you can easily counter them and it's a one-trick thing you have and can expect every x seconds especially since they removed most proc chances and made them mostly cooldown based, if you have stat bonuses you have more versatility and a way to throw off your opponent.

While it's strong, and viable, it's not the best and only option.

https://clips.twitch.tv/BetterHandsomePigeonSeemsGood

People now spam 1 skill and proc 3-4 dots, is that not good enough? You can have up to 7 dots from 1 player just by using 2 skill, and all these dots get increased by 25% from malacath.

katorga

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

katorga wrote: »

brandoncoffmannub18_ESO wrote: »

PVE ring is useless next to crit.

PVP
25% more on proc sets doesn't kill me, it just shows me the person I'm fighting with has less stats and is easier to melt since they sacrificed not only a 5 piece bonus for a proc set, but also malacath so they can't crit me so I know their numbers will never jump, they'll always be constant, so if I live through one burst, I know how to time all of their bursts.

It definitely works more often than not. Periodically I throw on unleashed, vMA 2H axe, Plague Slinger and either Malacath or Wild hunt...I'd put it on par with my stat/crit oriented build in terms of effectiveness, but a lot easier to use.
Hence the popularity.

And I would not put it on par for me, it's easier to use but it's not as effective and once you understand the mechanics behind the procs you can easily counter them and it's a one-trick thing you have and can expect every x seconds especially since they removed most proc chances and made them mostly cooldown based, if you have stat bonuses you have more versatility and a way to throw off your opponent.

While it's strong, and viable, it's not the best and only option.

True nuff. People who are a lot better players than me will get more mileage out doing things by hand. Proc sets would degrade their performance. At my skill level they come out about even.

Canned_Apples

It's called P2W, bro.

ZoS has joined the ranks of all those other unfortunate p2w MMOs.

Tannus15

Canned_Apples wrote: »

It's called P2W, bro.

ZoS has joined the ranks of all those other unfortunate p2w MMOs.

No it's not.

It's called "expansions have good things". P2W would be if you could only buy it in the store.
If malacath is P2W then using literally any set outside the base game is P2W.