Dont let Ring of the Pale Order get out the way it is

its_Chalman

Ring of the Pale Order
1 – Restore 15% of the damage you deal as health. You cannot be healed by anyone but yourself.

This set will break the pve... Healers will be no need it at all

Just think better>>

BFB costs health = Infinit sustain
Ring of the Pale Order recover health with any damage = Any dot will be a op over heal

BFB with the ring will be = Infinite sustain and health

Healers will not be required.. We wil run 2 tanks and 10 dps.. with that ring.. 2 dps in suport sets.. with resto bar just for prayer

80k damage in trial IS NOT HARD.. and youll have 12k heals per second... its just TOO MUCH

Put a cooldown on it.. please. or DRASTICLY reduce the amount of healing potention on that set.!!!

TX12001rwb17_ESO

Why?

I prefer to play a solo Mageblade Vampire whose primary attack is Blood for Blood which as you know prevents outside healing so healers were already on the losing end for Vampire Players, for some of us this ring is a godsend.

its_Chalman

think in a trial envoiroment
..

TX12001rwb17_ESO

In a trial players will be using sets optimized for a trial, they will not be using Blood for Blood or this ring and need i remind you of the AOE cooldowns currently in effect, if they become the standard then some builds may find it incredibly difficult to heal given all restoration staff abilities are AOE, this ring would help them greatly.

Sirvaleen

Did you test it on PTS ? Some actual feedback would be nice before getting the torchs out and ask for a nerf on what could be a nice alternative to resto backbar for some solo players...

Paradisius

its_Chalman wrote: »

Ring of the Pale Order
1 – Restore 15% of the damage you deal as health. You cannot be healed by anyone but yourself.

This set will break the pve... Healers will be no need it at all

Just think better>>

BFB costs health = Infinit sustain
Ring of the Pale Order recover health with any damage = Any dot will be a op over heal

BFB with the ring will be = Infinite sustain and health

Healers will not be required.. We wil run 2 tanks and 10 dps.. with that ring.. 2 dps in suport sets.. with resto bar just for prayer

80k damage in trial IS NOT HARD.. and youll have 12k heals per second... its just TOO MUCH

Put a cooldown on it.. please. or DRASTICLY reduce the amount of healing potention on that set.!!!

This is a pretty knee-jerk response, no?
The ring is fine given that it takes up a slot and therefore replaces a 5pc/monster helm set. I personally dont see any trial groups taking this because you cant be healed ever. In this Blood for blood example (which is already not used) you cant be healed while having the debuff on, thats controllable as just dont use the ability, with this ring you cannot be healed the entire fight. Who in their right mind would cut off all outside healing for an entire fight just to have better sustain? People in trial scenarios can sustain fine enough to not need it (assuming of course they cured Vampirism) and would much rather have an offensive monster/5pc bonus and still be healed by their healers.

The ring is fine, its good in solo arenas and the like if you cant sustain your health well enough.

Nairinhe

I can almost see everyone's desire to waste a slot for some healing

Strider__Roshin

Sounds like a great mythic. Is it truly 15% in PvP or does battle spirit effect it twice?

MincVinyl

16% apparently

ealdwin

Considering that there is more to healers than healing (group buffs, debuffs, and other support), I really don't think this will replace healers in any capacity. Where this ring will see use is for solo pve'ers and in pvp. Calling for drastic nerfs this early, seems extremely harsh and premature.

Kittytravel

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

In a trial players will be using sets optimized for a trial, they will not be using Blood for Blood or this ring and need i remind you of the AOE cooldowns currently in effect, if they become the standard then some builds may find it incredibly difficult to heal given all restoration staff abilities are AOE, this ring would help them greatly.

Isn't that for PvP only? Or did they move that to all aspects of the game?

its_Chalman

Paradisius wrote: »

its_Chalman wrote: »

Ring of the Pale Order
1 – Restore 15% of the damage you deal as health. You cannot be healed by anyone but yourself.

This set will break the pve... Healers will be no need it at all

Just think better>>

BFB costs health = Infinit sustain
Ring of the Pale Order recover health with any damage = Any dot will be a op over heal

BFB with the ring will be = Infinite sustain and health

Healers will not be required.. We wil run 2 tanks and 10 dps.. with that ring.. 2 dps in suport sets.. with resto bar just for prayer

80k damage in trial IS NOT HARD.. and youll have 12k heals per second... its just TOO MUCH

Put a cooldown on it.. please. or DRASTICLY reduce the amount of healing potention on that set.!!!

This is a pretty knee-jerk response, no?
The ring is fine given that it takes up a slot and therefore replaces a 5pc/monster helm set. I personally dont see any trial groups taking this because you cant be healed ever. In this Blood for blood example (which is already not used) you cant be healed while having the debuff on, thats controllable as just dont use the ability, with this ring you cannot be healed the entire fight. Who in their right mind would cut off all outside healing for an entire fight just to have better sustain? People in trial scenarios can sustain fine enough to not need it (assuming of course they cured Vampirism) and would much rather have an offensive monster/5pc bonus and still be healed by their healers.

The ring is fine, its good in solo arenas and the like if you cant sustain your health well enough.

Blood for blood you can heal your self.. you cant just be healed by others.. if you use like swallow soul one time and spam blood for blood you will be healed. by the tick of swallow soul..

the way the ring is right now.. blood for blood wil deals magicka damage.. and you will get a 15% of it as heal

its_Chalman

ealdwin wrote: »

Considering that there is more to healers than healing (group buffs, debuffs, and other support), I really don't think this will replace healers in any capacity. Where this ring will see use is for solo pve'ers and in pvp. Calling for drastic nerfs this early, seems extremely harsh and premature.

it will..

Suport skill will be done by dps/suports..

as all damage you put out.. will heal the caster.. no need for a healer run springs.. energy orbs. or other hot..

If all dps use that ring.. suport dps will use olorime and mk or wahtever suport set.. keeping minor and major as do damage.. and not heal the group anymore.. as they will not need any heals..

its_Chalman

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

In a trial players will be using sets optimized for a trial, they will not be using Blood for Blood or this ring and need i remind you of the AOE cooldowns currently in effect, if they become the standard then some builds may find it incredibly difficult to heal given all restoration staff abilities are AOE, this ring would help them greatly.

aoe cooldowns will be jsut for cyrodil..doesnt aply to trials or pve content

Paradisius

its_Chalman wrote: »

Blood for blood you can heal your self.. you cant just be healed by others.. if you use like swallow soul one time and spam blood for blood you will be healed. by the tick of swallow soul..

the way the ring is right now.. blood for blood wil deals magicka damage.. and you will get a 15% of it as heal

And the rest of my post? the fact that you have to sacrifice a 5pc effect and will have to rely on pure self healing in a trial scenario? It still doesnt make the ring overpowered, sustain isnt so bad that people would risk not getting any outside healing. If self healing was so subtantial with a 15% damage convert, why arent trial groups using blood for blood, and slotting a self heal? because its not as effective as going pure offensive and not worth the risk of not having any burst heals if things go south, because sustain isnt that bad.

stefj68

well they could maybe add a condition like when you are alone!

i like it on pts

TX12001rwb17_ESO

its_Chalman wrote: »

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

In a trial players will be using sets optimized for a trial, they will not be using Blood for Blood or this ring and need i remind you of the AOE cooldowns currently in effect, if they become the standard then some builds may find it incredibly difficult to heal given all restoration staff abilities are AOE, this ring would help them greatly.

aoe cooldowns will be jsut for cyrodil..doesnt aply to trials or pve content

Only now because it is in a testing phase, if it turns out it was the cause of lag it will likely spread to everyother part of the game.

redspecter23

Any player that puts this on in a trial and will take 15% healing over what the healer would give them (hint, it's much more) would be crazy outside of niche situations. Also, any buffs the healer applies that require the target to be healed would be lost.

Healers will still be needed for both heals and buffs and this ring isn't helping anyone that wears it in a trial. It's only hurting them... unless their healer is horrible anyway, but that's another situation.

Olupajmibanan

Seems like OP never tried harder content than vAA with a craglorn pug.

You know what I imagine when thinking about your proposal for 10 DDs to put on the set and be done with it? I only imagine Lord Falgravn on Hard Mode wiping the floor with all 10 of these wannabe-immortal-dds during execute phase.

Waffennacht

PvP .... Probably not. 15% heals that's further cut down by battlespirit? Much rather run Malacath's band or just a stat padding set than this.

In PvE, id only run it only on a class that doesnt get passive healing and cant use abilities during a solo boss phase

HiroTenKai

Not gonna lie. The ring is hot garbage from what I have seen. But we shall see if they work on it. That is the whole point of PTS after all.

vgabor

I don't think 10DD in a trial will have much success with this ring, but on the other hand in 4 men content with a self-healing tank and 3DD might be viable to put it on the tank...

Celestro

As been mentioned, the circumstances for using it in some content don't make sense at all. Not even including in circumstances where you can't deal damage due to a mechanic, you're even more likely to die.

I assume this is largely Zos' attempt at finally giving vampires that use Blood for Blood or the Blood Frenzy skills some solid self healing, which is pretty overdue (and still waiting for some implementation of Major Lifesteal...). Its not entirely unreasonable given the stacking boost of Shimmering Frenzy could overtake set bonuses I suppose. Still pretty iffy but not as bad as before, especially combined with AoE since it doesn't seem to have a cap like Briarheart's healing.

Dusk_Coven

its_Chalman wrote: »

Ring of the Pale Order
1 – Restore 15% of the damage you deal as health. You cannot be healed by anyone but yourself.

This set will break the pve... Healers will be no need it at all

Given that a lot of players just aim for more DPS to the exclusion of other roles, this is certainly a consideration IMO.
Now we'll need healers even less than we already do.

"Cannot be healed by anyone but yourself" isn't as big a deal when you can self-heal just fine for a lot of content and still be shielded.

Could be it'll get people excited to buy Greymoor for Antiquities access... then they nerf it later.

LashanW

its_Chalman wrote: »

Healers will not be required.. We wil run 2 tanks and 10 dps.. with that ring.. 2 dps in suport sets.. with resto bar just for prayer

I don't think this will happen in more serious trials as tanks do need the heals from healers from time to time (it's not just about keeping the DDs alive you know). Also some trials have invulnerability phases where you cannot be on the offensive.

1 tank 3dd dungeon runs however, oof (poor healers)

Epona222

It's clearly for situations in which people want to run solo, which is great, I don't see the issue. I certainly wouldn't run this in a group setting and miss getting proper heals.

YandereGirlfriend

There's always someone out there arguing for why we can't have nice things.

This is a Mythic item and that means sacrificing your monster set or making other exotic alterations to your build that will likely lower your DPS.

And then you have all the buffs and de-buffs that the Healers are providing and now you're trying to distribute them all to the DPS, resulting in set and skill choices that will further lower individual DPS.

No, I think you are crying wolf and I sincerely hope that ZOS does not listen to you.

Saubon

Paradisius wrote: »

And the rest of my post? the fact that you have to sacrifice a 5pc effect and will have to rely on pure self healing in a trial scenario?

In this case you should compare 8 monster sets+major courage+minor berserk(+minor toughness if it is needed) vs 2 support DDs.



Honestly I don't think it will be OP. Yes there will be some groups running 10 DDs, but it is useless for encounters with dmg downtimes or boss immune phases or bosses with tank heavy healing

lozq

Someone more numerate than me will run the numbers and conclude that:

a) 15% of your DPS as healing is massive overkill if you're putting out decent damage, and doesn't help to heal you when mechanics prevent you from dealing damage.

b) healers put out a fair whack of damage themselves, so it's not a question of 'replacing two non-damage dealers with dedicated damage dealers'

c) I might be wrong, but I guess this would prevent you from getting combat prayer and other buffs from outside sources?

d) reducing your damage by 15% AND sacrificing a 5 piece bonus or monster set is just too much of a handicap.

Like others have said I think this will be used predominately by casual and lower level players soloing world bosses and the like. Just as lots of people jumped on malacath's band because they saw '25% more damage, I need that!' and didn't realise until after how much crit damage they were actually doing. I foresee people grinding this out and quickly abandoning it 99% of the time because they realise that they're overhealing themselves constantly and it's not worth the damage handicap.

That said I could be totally wrong and it'll be the new trials meta - we shall see

Erraln

lozq wrote: »

Someone more numerate than me will run the numbers and conclude that:

a) 15% of your DPS as healing is massive overkill if you're putting out decent damage, and doesn't help to heal you when mechanics prevent you from dealing damage.

b) healers put out a fair whack of damage themselves, so it's not a question of 'replacing two non-damage dealers with dedicated damage dealers'

c) I might be wrong, but I guess this would prevent you from getting combat prayer and other buffs from outside sources?

d) reducing your damage by 15% AND sacrificing a 5 piece bonus or monster set is just too much of a handicap.

Like others have said I think this will be used predominately by casual and lower level players soloing world bosses and the like. Just as lots of people jumped on malacath's band because they saw '25% more damage, I need that!' and didn't realise until after how much crit damage they were actually doing. I foresee people grinding this out and quickly abandoning it 99% of the time because they realise that they're overhealing themselves constantly and it's not worth the damage handicap.

That said I could be totally wrong and it'll be the new trials meta - we shall see

Can't agree, you're selling the idea of having so much incoming healing that you don't know what to do with it as a bad thing? In the context of raid builds, you know what happens then, right? You despec from self heals and maybe even from damage mit and put those armor choices / skill choices/ etc into more damage, and crutch on the ring. And there's so much crutch to lean on, here. If you're completely mediocre and do 40k DPS with group buffs that's still 6k incoming HPS, which invalidates a lot of threat. The better you are, the better it performs.

I'd love to play with this on live but for the sake of the Healer role's continued existence it needs to be something like, Single-Target Direct-Damage only to proc the heal. Otherwise you're a god if you can do a rotation, or if you're damaging any sort of add clump.

olsborg

Whats most broken about it is if this ring will make your proccsets heal you. Like if you dot someone up with 3 proccsets, will all that dmg also heal you.... f aids.