Belgium and lootbox ban....

bulcke10

Hi all
I'm from Belgium and the last couple weeks I'm unable to buy crown crates because Belgium lootboxes ban... Are there any other solutions that I can give a try to buy crown crates or is bethesda or Zos working on something so that we Belgium players or other countries with the same ban could buy again crates? Hope so 😁

Danikat

I haven't heard about any plans to accommodate players in Belgium or other countries with similar restrictions.

I think they'll have to do something sooner or later because these bans are going to get more common as more countries realise their current gambling legislation is out of date and needs to catch up to the realities of the modern world. But I suspect at the moment a lot of games studios see it as being in their best interest to make the ban seem as restrictive and impractical for players as possible in the hope that they can shift public opinion back to seeing loot boxes as the lesser of two evils.

bulcke10

Danikat wrote: »

I haven't heard about any plans to accommodate players in Belgium or other countries with similar restrictions.

I think they'll have to do something sooner or later because these bans are going to get more common as more countries realise their current gambling legislation is out of date and needs to catch up to the realities of the modern world. But I suspect at the moment a lot of games studios see it as being in their best interest to make the ban seem as restrictive and impractical for players as possible in the hope that they can shift public opinion back to seeing loot boxes as the lesser of two evils.

Next week the new crates are in store and we are unable to buy 😭 think Warzone and black ops and spellbreak are my games to go instead of eso 🤔

vestahls

Just say no, dude.

Grandchamp1989

Personly I hope they get banned everywhere as it's basicly gambling.

That way people can specificly buy the item they want/need from the crown store if they wish to do so.

Sarannah

Personally I think loot boxes are bad as well, I would have bought most of the radiant apex mounts outright if it was possible... now I have 0.

ESO's lootbox system is quite fair though, because when you are aiming for something specific, you can always exchange crowns for it(except for radiant apex *sigh* ).

IneedaDollar

Better thank Belgium government for saving your money instead of finding a way to buy crown crates XD
I don't know maybe you can try gifting?
You are technically not buying them yourself so maybe that works.

jecks33

what's the problem of buying crown crates in Belgium?

Banana

It should be every country

vibeborn

I know I'm probably alone in this, but I feel sorry for Belgium on that part

Yes, it's considered gambling, but NO government of ANY country should decide what people spend their OWN money on.

And if someone has a problem with buying too many? (I'm close to that point, because I LOVE crown crates) then there are ways they can be helped, and I guess the reason Belgium has decided to ban them, is to help those with problem gambling But punishing/denying EVERYBODY really is nothing but 4th grade teacher mentality.

Oathunbound

Best odds are to get in one of the discord crown trade groups and ask for crown for crown trade from someone who isn't restricted, after explaining your situation you should find some who is willing to help

etchedpixels

vibeborn wrote: »

I
Yes, it's considered gambling, but NO government of ANY country should decide what people spend their OWN money on.

So I should be allowed to buy [snip] ?

For many people with gambling problems it's as bad or worse than [snip] and like drug addicts they tend not to just spend their own money.

Now whether they ought to offer people in such countries (and there will soon be far more - the UK proposals have gotten bunged up in Covid19 as have other nations) something like the ability to just buy crown gems and price the stuff at the actual cost for trying to get it from crates, that is another question IMHO.

[Edite to remove Inappropriate Content]

vibeborn

etchedpixels wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

I
Yes, it's considered gambling, but NO government of ANY country should decide what people spend their OWN money on.

So I should be allowed to buy [snip] ?

For many people with gambling problems it's as bad or worse than [snip] and like drug addicts they tend not to just spend their own money.

Now whether they ought to offer people in such countries (and there will soon be far more - the UK proposals have gotten bunged up in Covid19 as have other nations) something like the ability to just buy crown gems and price the stuff at the actual cost for trying to get it from crates, that is another question IMHO.

I of course meant of things that aren't meant to be harmful, and call me overly optimist, but I don't think crown crates were designed to be harmful

And yeah there are people who have a serious problem with gambling, and they SHOULD be helped, but still denying EVERYBODY to gamble is 4th grade teacher mentality.
Like imagine you are in some place in Tamriel, and you think to yourself "Man, I've traveled far, I could really use a beverage" So you go to the nearest inn, only to learn that because some people drank a little to much, the innkeeper has decided to ban all drinking
I'm generally against that sort of mob punishment

But of course I agree that if people have an actual problem with gambling, drinking, whatever, then they should be helped before they play/drink all the money away

vestahls

vibeborn wrote: »

etchedpixels wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

I
Yes, it's considered gambling, but NO government of ANY country should decide what people spend their OWN money on.

So I should be allowed to buy [snip] ?

For many people with gambling problems it's as bad or worse than [snip] and like drug addicts they tend not to just spend their own money.

Now whether they ought to offer people in such countries (and there will soon be far more - the UK proposals have gotten bunged up in Covid19 as have other nations) something like the ability to just buy crown gems and price the stuff at the actual cost for trying to get it from crates, that is another question IMHO.

I of course meant of things that aren't meant to be harmful, and call me overly optimist, but I don't think crown crates were designed to be harmful

Alfred Nobel designed TNT to not be harmful, but to just be helpful in mining. He even wanted to call it "Nobel's Safety Powder". Look how his intentions turned out

The reality is that ZOS does not need to introduce gambling for people to spend their money. If a country wants to eliminate it, good.

Everstorm

vibeborn wrote: »

etchedpixels wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

I
Yes, it's considered gambling, but NO government of ANY country should decide what people spend their OWN money on.

So I should be allowed to buy [snip] ?

For many people with gambling problems it's as bad or worse than [snip] and like drug addicts they tend not to just spend their own money.

Now whether they ought to offer people in such countries (and there will soon be far more - the UK proposals have gotten bunged up in Covid19 as have other nations) something like the ability to just buy crown gems and price the stuff at the actual cost for trying to get it from crates, that is another question IMHO.

I of course meant of things that aren't meant to be harmful, and call me overly optimist, but I don't think crown crates were designed to be harmful

And yeah there are people who have a serious problem with gambling, and they SHOULD be helped, but still denying EVERYBODY to gamble is 4th grade teacher mentality.
Like imagine you are in some place in Tamriel, and you think to yourself "Man, I've traveled far, I could really use a beverage" So you go to the nearest inn, only to learn that because some people drank a little to much, the innkeeper has decided to ban all drinking
I'm generally against that sort of mob punishment

But of course I agree that if people have an actual problem with gambling, drinking, whatever, then they should be helped before they play/drink all the money away

How about the inkeeper giving you a completely random beverage instead of what you want?

vibeborn

Everstorm wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

etchedpixels wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

I
Yes, it's considered gambling, but NO government of ANY country should decide what people spend their OWN money on.

So I should be allowed to buy [snip] ?

For many people with gambling problems it's as bad or worse than [snip] and like drug addicts they tend not to just spend their own money.

Now whether they ought to offer people in such countries (and there will soon be far more - the UK proposals have gotten bunged up in Covid19 as have other nations) something like the ability to just buy crown gems and price the stuff at the actual cost for trying to get it from crates, that is another question IMHO.

I of course meant of things that aren't meant to be harmful, and call me overly optimist, but I don't think crown crates were designed to be harmful

And yeah there are people who have a serious problem with gambling, and they SHOULD be helped, but still denying EVERYBODY to gamble is 4th grade teacher mentality.
Like imagine you are in some place in Tamriel, and you think to yourself "Man, I've traveled far, I could really use a beverage" So you go to the nearest inn, only to learn that because some people drank a little to much, the innkeeper has decided to ban all drinking
I'm generally against that sort of mob punishment

But of course I agree that if people have an actual problem with gambling, drinking, whatever, then they should be helped before they play/drink all the money away

How about the inkeeper giving you a completely random beverage instead of what you want?

Hmm you have a point there
Still I'd hate it if all what's considered gambling or drinking got banned in my country, I don't think banning the stuff is the way to go, I'd go more for a sort of informative approach (which I know can be hard in some cases)

AcadianPaladin

I choose not to buy crates but prefer that the choice be mine; not that of politicians who think they are smarter than those they represent.

Everstorm

vibeborn wrote: »

Everstorm wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

etchedpixels wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

I
Yes, it's considered gambling, but NO government of ANY country should decide what people spend their OWN money on.

So I should be allowed to buy [snip] ?

For many people with gambling problems it's as bad or worse than [snip] and like drug addicts they tend not to just spend their own money.

Now whether they ought to offer people in such countries (and there will soon be far more - the UK proposals have gotten bunged up in Covid19 as have other nations) something like the ability to just buy crown gems and price the stuff at the actual cost for trying to get it from crates, that is another question IMHO.

I of course meant of things that aren't meant to be harmful, and call me overly optimist, but I don't think crown crates were designed to be harmful

And yeah there are people who have a serious problem with gambling, and they SHOULD be helped, but still denying EVERYBODY to gamble is 4th grade teacher mentality.
Like imagine you are in some place in Tamriel, and you think to yourself "Man, I've traveled far, I could really use a beverage" So you go to the nearest inn, only to learn that because some people drank a little to much, the innkeeper has decided to ban all drinking
I'm generally against that sort of mob punishment

But of course I agree that if people have an actual problem with gambling, drinking, whatever, then they should be helped before they play/drink all the money away

How about the inkeeper giving you a completely random beverage instead of what you want?

Hmm you have a point there
Still I'd hate it if all what's considered gambling or drinking got banned in my country, I don't think banning the stuff is the way to go, I'd go more for a sort of informative approach (which I know can be hard in some cases)

They could start with informing us about the odds. IIRC Zos has refused to do that so far.

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO

bulcke10 wrote: »

Hi all
I'm from Belgium and the last couple weeks I'm unable to buy crown crates because Belgium lootboxes ban... Are there any other solutions that I can give a try to buy crown crates or is bethesda or Zos working on something so that we Belgium players or other countries with the same ban could buy again crates? Hope so 😁

I would assume players from other countries can gift them to you

IWinWithPewPew

etchedpixels wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

I
Yes, it's considered gambling, but NO government of ANY country should decide what people spend their OWN money on.

So I should be allowed to buy [snip] ?

For many people with gambling problems it's as bad or worse than [snip] and like drug addicts they tend not to just spend their own money.

Now whether they ought to offer people in such countries (and there will soon be far more - the UK proposals have gotten bunged up in Covid19 as have other nations) something like the ability to just buy crown gems and price the stuff at the actual cost for trying to get it from crates, that is another question IMHO.

Well....... find the odd-one out.

Went from [snip] xD

[Edited to remove Inappropriate Content]

Ackwalan

etchedpixels wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

I
Yes, it's considered gambling, but NO government of ANY country should decide what people spend their OWN money on.

So I should be allowed to buy [snip] ?

For many people with gambling problems it's as bad or worse than [snip] and like drug addicts they tend not to just spend their own money.

Now whether they ought to offer people in such countries (and there will soon be far more - the UK proposals have gotten bunged up in Covid19 as have other nations) something like the ability to just buy crown gems and price the stuff at the actual cost for trying to get it from crates, that is another question IMHO.

Since you used the strawman argument. People also have a problem with drinking, so ban alcohol. Problem with over eating, no problem, mandate an eating plan. Some people don't exercise, here comes the mandate. I'm sure there a plenty of rules your neighbors would like to put on you.

IWinWithPewPew

Im from Belgium too i honestly couldnt care less! Micro payment is what makes game companies greedy, by extorting a few People that cant resist buying loot boxes. South park made an excellent episode about this haha. And for what? Virtual zeros and ones. You're buying nothing.

What would be 'Nice' (still don't care Just an Idea.) is : stelling loot boxes where u can Pick content from. At least that way you pay, but you Always het what u want.

woufff

That's funny, like the OP I am also located in Belgium (for the moment) and -although I am only buying crates VERY rarely- of course I tried it out

Well, when I am clicking on "buy crates" it brings me to another part of the Crown Store... thus no sales of crates in Belgium anymore.

Will ZOS survive without this important customer base?

daemonios

vibeborn wrote: »

call me overly optimist, but I don't think crown crates were designed to be harmful

[snip] Loot crates, multi-tiered currency, solution selling, time-limited exclusives and many other tactics plaguing the game industry are thoroughly researched to become as addictive as possible and generate as many impulse sales as possible. There are no good microtransactions, only some that aren't quite as outrageous as others.

[Edited to remove Baiting]

vibeborn

daemonios wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

call me overly optimist, but I don't think crown crates were designed to be harmful

[snip] Loot crates, multi-tiered currency, solution selling, time-limited exclusives and many other tactics plaguing the game industry are thoroughly researched to become as addictive as possible and generate as many impulse sales as possible. There are no good microtransactions, only some that aren't quite as outrageous as others.

So the industry WANTS people to become addicted to loot boxes and other gambling effects? That's messed up. I've only ever seen crown crates as things to open, and if you're lucky you're lucky, and if you're not, well better luck next time.

(I am aware though of certain practices gambling companies use to keep people in their grip, and yes it's disgusting)

Morwaenna

Solution: go to a Casino

NeillMcAttack

vibeborn wrote: »

I know I'm probably alone in this, but I feel sorry for Belgium on that part

Yes, it's considered gambling, but NO government of ANY country should decide what people spend their OWN money on.

And if someone has a problem with buying too many? (I'm close to that point, because I LOVE crown crates) then there are ways they can be helped, and I guess the reason Belgium has decided to ban them, is to help those with problem gambling But punishing/denying EVERYBODY really is nothing but 4th grade teacher mentality.

And no government should be able to make people wear seatbelts, or helmets, or safety harness’ at work. In fact, I should be able to drive on whatever side of the road I want.

Loot boxes are predatory, these companies make more money making you gamble for items than they would selling them directly. In this instance, If they were banned everywhere, consumers would be much better off.

Everstorm

vibeborn wrote: »

daemonios wrote: »

vibeborn wrote: »

call me overly optimist, but I don't think crown crates were designed to be harmful

[snip] Loot crates, multi-tiered currency, solution selling, time-limited exclusives and many other tactics plaguing the game industry are thoroughly researched to become as addictive as possible and generate as many impulse sales as possible. There are no good microtransactions, only some that aren't quite as outrageous as others.

So the industry WANTS people to become addicted to loot boxes and other gambling effects? That's messed up. I've only ever seen crown crates as things to open, and if you're lucky you're lucky, and if you're not, well better luck next time.

They want you to spend money. They don't care, let alone take responsibility, for the consequences for their customers.

Sarannah

From the Netherlands here... The EU is working on banning lootboxes in all it's countries, so it would be wise for ZOS to come up with some sort of new way to incorporate crowncrate stuff into the game. While still making money ofcourse.

Especially since EU is their largest customer base.

Moloch1514

This conversation appears to be heavily censored/moderated. Interesting!

npuk

Sarannah wrote: »

.... so it would be wise for ZOS to come up with some sort of new way to incorporate crowncrate stuff into the game. While still making money ofcourse.

One way that I would like be to be able to convert daily rewards in to a small amount of crowns, say 15 per daily reward, giving people 1 crate a month for free, that would make crown crate available in game & give us something more productive to do with the items that we would otherwise trash.