ZOS WHY? Unleashed Terror Nerf Request

kaithuzar

Why did you think this was a good idea???
This ranks right up there with some of the WORST ideas, to include but not limited to... the introduction of proc sets, poisons, & the "lighting patch".

Unleashed Terror (Medium)
2 – Adds 129 Weapon Damage
3 – Adds 1096 Maximum Stamina
4 – Adds 1096 Maximum Stamina
5 – When you deal direct damage with a Charge, Leap, Teleport, or Pull ability, you cut your enemy, causing them to bleed for 10 seconds, dealing 19728 Physical Damage over the duration. This ability can occur once every 10 seconds per target.

Firstmep

I've tested this already, does like 600-800 dmg a tick, definetly doesn't need nerfs.

kaithuzar

Firstmep wrote: »

I've tested this already, does like 600-800 dmg a tick, definetly doesn't need nerfs.

You've tested with full gold gear & the mythic ring that buffs +25% ?

Firstmep

kaithuzar wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

I've tested this already, does like 600-800 dmg a tick, definetly doesn't need nerfs.

You've tested with full gold gear & the mythic ring that buffs +25% ?

I didn't use it with malacath but gilded out body Armour, I mean even with malacath, it will only do as much dmg as venomous, which by itself already wasn't too hard to deal with.
Thing is, you kinda wanna use this with vma 2h frontbar, which makes it harder to fit in malacath, or a Monster piece.
For reference, stone husk monster set has the same dmg as this 5pc, and it also gives you some wpd.

Anyway compared to other stuff, like sheer venom this set just isn't that great.
The easy application is about the only good thing about it.

sMuggle

kaithuzar wrote: »

Firstmep wrote: »

I've tested this already, does like 600-800 dmg a tick, definetly doesn't need nerfs.

You've tested with full gold gear & the mythic ring that buffs +25% ?

Yes, and it's not any higher / stronger than existing, new and revamped stat sets. Some "much" stronger. Even paring with Maelstorm Battle Axe and Blooddrinker's Set.(i.e. venomous smite, widowmaker, ect..) Initially UT did it's damage in 5s... It was adjusted to 10s.

universal_wrath

Niw, how good it is to be used with mealstrom axe in PvE? It is worth it?

ecru

It's less damage than some other proc sets that I'm not going to mention and it requires slotting an ability (for most classes, I'll get to this) that most usually don't slot to get it to work. It's also from a vet dlc dungeon which makes it a little bit harder to get than an overland set, which is something.. I guess. In my opinion more dots in eso are a good thing, even if they are from proc sets.

I'm currently using two proc sets (thank ZOS) and I'm not using this set because I don't think it's good enough to use.

That said, I think this set is broken, but only on certain classes. Allowing it to work on teleports like streak was a major mistake. Streak is already an extremely overloaded ability and allowing it to land a 20k dot shouldn't have been implemented. It's an escape, gap closer, unblockable stun, also does damage, and now it's landing a 20k dot--unacceptable IMO. This is fine for something like crit charge because crit charge is a niche ability that most don't want to slot, as it's only a gap closer, not an escape, not a stun, and is clunky to use in melee range due to the short delay in using abilities after. I also think it's fine on Leap because Leap is an ult, so whatever. It makes streak way, way too overloaded though.

I might be forgetting some gap closers but that's really the only one that I think it shouldn't be on.

universal_wrath wrote: »

Niw, how good it is to be used with mealstrom axe in PvE? It is worth it?

I think this would be an interesting setup, but I wouldn't depend on the ground aoe from crit charge to do anything useful. Most targets will run out of it right away. This is why the pillar of nirn set is mostly worthless IMO. I thought it'd be good due to the high dot tooltip on the proc, but in reality with players always moving, they've already moved out of the proc after the "1 second" has gone by for it to spawn and apply the dot to them, meaning you only get the damage on like 1 in 3 procs if you're lucky.

katorga

Actual damage in pvp is pretty meh. It does the same dps as every other proc set - they all do ~2K per second before battle spirit. You can come up with decent builds that use it, but only because the additional dot enhances the other, more important, set in the build.

ManDraKE

By itself is not that broken, but if you put a vMA axe with double dot poision, you basically get 5 dots on a target by pressing 1 button: Axe bleed + vMA Dot + unleashed terror dot + double dot posions. This set allow some digusting combinations.

katorga

ManDraKE wrote: »

By itself is not that broken, but if you put a vMA axe with double dot poision, you basically get 5 dots on a target by pressing 1 button: Axe bleed + vMA Dot + unleashed terror dot + double dot posions. This set allow some digusting combinations.

It can be swapped out with other dot proc sets. Which means you could have been doing this last patch, just swap for Venomous Smite for example. My opinion is that if I can do the same thing with other sets, then this set is just fine.

Every proc set is generally does around ~2K dps. I.e. they are balanced with each other

Now, are proc sets in general doing way too much damage? A totally different question.

universal_wrath

ecru wrote: »

It's less damage than some other proc sets that I'm not going to mention and it requires slotting an ability (for most classes, I'll get to this) that most usually don't slot to get it to work. It's also from a vet dlc dungeon which makes it a little bit harder to get than an overland set, which is something.. I guess. In my opinion more dots in eso are a good thing, even if they are from proc sets.

I'm currently using two proc sets (thank ZOS) and I'm not using this set because I don't think it's good enough to use.

That said, I think this set is broken, but only on certain classes. Allowing it to work on teleports like streak was a major mistake. Streak is already an extremely overloaded ability and allowing it to land a 20k dot shouldn't have been implemented. It's an escape, gap closer, unblockable stun, also does damage, and now it's landing a 20k dot--unacceptable IMO. This is fine for something like crit charge because crit charge is a niche ability that most don't want to slot, as it's only a gap closer, not an escape, not a stun, and is clunky to use in melee range due to the short delay in using abilities after. I also think it's fine on Leap because Leap is an ult, so whatever. It makes streak way, way too overloaded though.

I might be forgetting some gap closers but that's really the only one that I think it shouldn't be on.

universal_wrath wrote: »

Niw, how good it is to be used with mealstrom axe in PvE? It is worth it?

I think this would be an interesting setup, but I wouldn't depend on the ground aoe from crit charge to do anything useful. Most targets will run out of it right away. This is why the pillar of nirn set is mostly worthless IMO. I thought it'd be good due to the high dot tooltip on the proc, but in reality with players always moving, they've already moved out of the proc after the "1 second" has gone by for it to spawn and apply the dot to them, meaning you only get the damage on like 1 in 3 procs if you're lucky.

this is for pillar of nirn

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvCizyPa6Mo&list=PLjYv7AayCD-5XgvzuaNRXWqx7cUNrgrn9&index=14&t=0s

He ^^ also made a video about unleash terror and I believe he said it does not work on streak, I'm not sure about it though.

it would be great if someone can confirm if it really proc of streak or not.

Firstmep

universal_wrath wrote: »

ecru wrote: »

It's less damage than some other proc sets that I'm not going to mention and it requires slotting an ability (for most classes, I'll get to this) that most usually don't slot to get it to work. It's also from a vet dlc dungeon which makes it a little bit harder to get than an overland set, which is something.. I guess. In my opinion more dots in eso are a good thing, even if they are from proc sets.

I'm currently using two proc sets (thank ZOS) and I'm not using this set because I don't think it's good enough to use.

That said, I think this set is broken, but only on certain classes. Allowing it to work on teleports like streak was a major mistake. Streak is already an extremely overloaded ability and allowing it to land a 20k dot shouldn't have been implemented. It's an escape, gap closer, unblockable stun, also does damage, and now it's landing a 20k dot--unacceptable IMO. This is fine for something like crit charge because crit charge is a niche ability that most don't want to slot, as it's only a gap closer, not an escape, not a stun, and is clunky to use in melee range due to the short delay in using abilities after. I also think it's fine on Leap because Leap is an ult, so whatever. It makes streak way, way too overloaded though.

I might be forgetting some gap closers but that's really the only one that I think it shouldn't be on.

universal_wrath wrote: »

Niw, how good it is to be used with mealstrom axe in PvE? It is worth it?

I think this would be an interesting setup, but I wouldn't depend on the ground aoe from crit charge to do anything useful. Most targets will run out of it right away. This is why the pillar of nirn set is mostly worthless IMO. I thought it'd be good due to the high dot tooltip on the proc, but in reality with players always moving, they've already moved out of the proc after the "1 second" has gone by for it to spawn and apply the dot to them, meaning you only get the damage on like 1 in 3 procs if you're lucky.

this is for pillar of nirn

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvCizyPa6Mo&list=PLjYv7AayCD-5XgvzuaNRXWqx7cUNrgrn9&index=14&t=0s

He ^^ also made a video about unleash terror and I believe he said it does not work on streak, I'm not sure about it though.

it would be great if someone can confirm if it really proc of streak or not.

That pillar of nirn test was on pts with high ping/delay. On live you can easily get out of the pillar if you see it.

Anyway sheer venom is much better.

precambria

It's sad to see the game in this state BG is pretty much all just stamsorcs with 2 dot proc sets spamming streak and rolling till it kills you, it would be counterable if there wasn't 4-5 in every game but that is just not the case. Streak is bugged now so that they just warp back and forth every time they use it making them untargetable, there have been times when I have 3-4 stacks of the same merciless charge unleashed and sheer venom from from separate people.....

They don't test in No CP is the only sensible conclusion that can be drawn from the current design direction the game is headed =/

Hotdog_23

Sheer venom is cancer in pvp period.

Be safe and have fun

Fawn4287

DOT metas are painful and cheesy af, I remember a few updates before DOTs were nerfed they were significantly buffed, getting a death recap of like 10 ticks of entropy for 12-13k, you seriously just need to run a cleanse, theres no way around it, especially with the healing taken nerfs. Just take comfort that recently ZOS usually gives things a solid buff before beating it in to an unusable state, hopefully thats about to happen to proc sets.

Tommy_The_Gun

kaithuzar wrote: »

5 – When you deal direct damage with a Charge, Leap, Teleport, or Pull ability, you cut your enemy, causing them to bleed for 10 seconds, dealing 19728 Physical Damage over the duration. This ability can occur once every 10 seconds per target.

Firstmep wrote: »

I've tested this already, does like 600-800 dmg a tick, definetly doesn't need nerfs.

kaithuzar wrote: »

You've tested with full gold gear & the mythic ring that buffs +25% ?

Ekhem...

https://eso-skillbook.com/skill/stampede
Launch across the earth and smash an enemy, dealing 565 Physical Damage to them and all nearby enemies. This attack is always a Critical Strike. After reaching your target, you sunder the ground beneath you, dealing 84 Physical Damage to all enemies in the area every 1 second for 10 seconds.

https://eso-sets.com/set/perfected-merciless-charge
(2 items) Adds 1190 Physical Penetration, Dealing damage with Critical Charge causes enemies to bleed for 10032 Physical Damage over 5 seconds.

Proc sets doing more damage than actual skills... Seems fair and balanced...

Mortiis13

Fawn4287 wrote: »

DOT metas are painful and cheesy af, I remember a few updates before DOTs were nerfed they were significantly buffed, getting a death recap of like 10 ticks of entropy for 12-13k, you seriously just need to run a cleanse, theres no way around it, especially with the healing taken nerfs. Just take comfort that recently ZOS usually gives things a solid buff before beating it in to an unusable state, hopefully thats about to happen to proc sets.

With the heal nerf we are not far away from the state of the past dot meta,The numbers are just smaller and the dots coming from sets.

Mortiis13

I think the problem of those sets is that they can go off all at the same time.
An separate CD system for proc sets would be a solid choice to balance it without making them useless even if u wear 2 or 3 of them.

Another option would to scale the dmg based on ur offensiv stats, so 1 proc set+ 1 stat set would be a solid choice.

Also it should be mentioned that the proc set buff opens up "health" +class builds.

katorga

I've already parked my dot proc sets. They seem to get purged way too often, and when I'm on the receiving end, I'm able to manage them effectively enough. They might be more effective in BG's, but haven't done one since the update.

I'm having more success with direct damage proc sets or crit builds.

They certainly buffed the heck of Vicious Death. Jeepers.

ecru

universal_wrath wrote: »

ecru wrote: »

It's less damage than some other proc sets that I'm not going to mention and it requires slotting an ability (for most classes, I'll get to this) that most usually don't slot to get it to work. It's also from a vet dlc dungeon which makes it a little bit harder to get than an overland set, which is something.. I guess. In my opinion more dots in eso are a good thing, even if they are from proc sets.

I'm currently using two proc sets (thank ZOS) and I'm not using this set because I don't think it's good enough to use.

That said, I think this set is broken, but only on certain classes. Allowing it to work on teleports like streak was a major mistake. Streak is already an extremely overloaded ability and allowing it to land a 20k dot shouldn't have been implemented. It's an escape, gap closer, unblockable stun, also does damage, and now it's landing a 20k dot--unacceptable IMO. This is fine for something like crit charge because crit charge is a niche ability that most don't want to slot, as it's only a gap closer, not an escape, not a stun, and is clunky to use in melee range due to the short delay in using abilities after. I also think it's fine on Leap because Leap is an ult, so whatever. It makes streak way, way too overloaded though.

I might be forgetting some gap closers but that's really the only one that I think it shouldn't be on.

universal_wrath wrote: »

Niw, how good it is to be used with mealstrom axe in PvE? It is worth it?

I think this would be an interesting setup, but I wouldn't depend on the ground aoe from crit charge to do anything useful. Most targets will run out of it right away. This is why the pillar of nirn set is mostly worthless IMO. I thought it'd be good due to the high dot tooltip on the proc, but in reality with players always moving, they've already moved out of the proc after the "1 second" has gone by for it to spawn and apply the dot to them, meaning you only get the damage on like 1 in 3 procs if you're lucky.

this is for pillar of nirn

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvCizyPa6Mo&list=PLjYv7AayCD-5XgvzuaNRXWqx7cUNrgrn9&index=14&t=0s

He ^^ also made a video about unleash terror and I believe he said it does not work on streak, I'm not sure about it though.

it would be great if someone can confirm if it really proc of streak or not.

pillar of nirn might work in a duel, but it does not work well in cyrodiil. i used it for a few days and it rarely hit my targets.

edit: the reason for this is pretty simple--if your target is moving in one direction when it procs and continues moving in that direction, pillar of nirn will usually not hit the target.

Firstmep

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

5 – When you deal direct damage with a Charge, Leap, Teleport, or Pull ability, you cut your enemy, causing them to bleed for 10 seconds, dealing 19728 Physical Damage over the duration. This ability can occur once every 10 seconds per target.

Firstmep wrote: »

I've tested this already, does like 600-800 dmg a tick, definetly doesn't need nerfs.

kaithuzar wrote: »

You've tested with full gold gear & the mythic ring that buffs +25% ?

Ekhem...

https://eso-skillbook.com/skill/stampede
Launch across the earth and smash an enemy, dealing 565 Physical Damage to them and all nearby enemies. This attack is always a Critical Strike. After reaching your target, you sunder the ground beneath you, dealing 84 Physical Damage to all enemies in the area every 1 second for 10 seconds.

https://eso-sets.com/set/perfected-merciless-charge
(2 items) Adds 1190 Physical Penetration, Dealing damage with Critical Charge causes enemies to bleed for 10032 Physical Damage over 5 seconds.

Proc sets doing more damage than actual skills... Seems fair and balanced...

Yeah in the case of unleashed etc its an entire 5pc bonus.
I don't like that sets do more dmg than skills, however unleashed is not that strong.
Like I already said there are better sets out there.

olsborg

ZOS dont want skills to deal the dmg, they want the items to do it. F stupid imo, but there u have it.

hakan

After farming so hard for pillar of nirn, i must say its meh for BGs. And bad for Cyrodiil.

Also farmed hard for Unleashed Terror, which is better than pillars and its just ehh. DK with Terror+ Merciless charge+stampede + malacath kinda good but nothing spectacular.

I mean the tooltip sounds insane but in reality it isnt.

Mayrael

Sheer Venom + Venomous Smite would like to have a chat with you guys. Instant, same as strong or even stronger, can be applied from range ))

Davadin

is this another Stuhn's fiasco? OP in PTS, slight nerf in Live, now no one uses it?

aww I'm in middle of farming this set. is this no good? I have Venom Smite and also Malacath and tested it all throughout CP PvP........

DoT is still meh. got cleaned a lot. and I never have a problem just tanking it when other people do it on me.

Davadin

Tommy_The_Gun wrote: »

kaithuzar wrote: »

5 – When you deal direct damage with a Charge, Leap, Teleport, or Pull ability, you cut your enemy, causing them to bleed for 10 seconds, dealing 19728 Physical Damage over the duration. This ability can occur once every 10 seconds per target.

Firstmep wrote: »

I've tested this already, does like 600-800 dmg a tick, definetly doesn't need nerfs.

kaithuzar wrote: »

You've tested with full gold gear & the mythic ring that buffs +25% ?

Ekhem...

https://eso-skillbook.com/skill/stampede
Launch across the earth and smash an enemy, dealing 565 Physical Damage to them and all nearby enemies. This attack is always a Critical Strike. After reaching your target, you sunder the ground beneath you, dealing 84 Physical Damage to all enemies in the area every 1 second for 10 seconds.

https://eso-sets.com/set/perfected-merciless-charge
(2 items) Adds 1190 Physical Penetration, Dealing damage with Critical Charge causes enemies to bleed for 10032 Physical Damage over 5 seconds.

Proc sets doing more damage than actual skills... Seems fair and balanced...

does Stampede still crit even when wearing Malacath?

UrbanMonk

Not it doesnt.

Xiomaro

I didn't want to give a knee jerk reaction. But I feel like I've now tested it enough.

It initially looked amazing on paper then after trying it with my first set up, it felt like high pressure but not enough to confirm kills compared with other gear options. I was playing it in BGs, Cyrodiil and IC - so a good spread of different playstyles. In IC and Cyrodiil it was decent for killing bad players but then so is any gear set so that proves almost nothing. In high MMR BGs, I just couldn't confirm kills so I ended up shelfing the set for a bit. For the record, this was on a StamSorc with Torc, Venomous Smite and Maelstrom 2h. So pretty cheesy stuff but it was thoroughly underwhelming.

That changed when I decided to throw in Malacath and Sheer Venom.

Genuinely, this is the most overtuned combo I've played. My burst combo goes something like: Stampede > Streak > LA > Poison Injection

With a double dot poison on the Maelstrom Battle axe and Foulness glyph for minor defile on the backbar, you can potentially stack up 7 dots. Before someone knows what hit them.

That alone is enough to kill less-than-optimally-built players. But the follow up pressure from the dots plus whatever else I'm doing is enough to put the opponent on the defense immediately. That gives you a huge advantage, even against good player.

Of course, this does get countered by cleanse. But, unlike Venomous Smite which has a 15 second cooldown, all of these sets only have proc limitations per target. So if you come across someone who cleanses in open world, you can just swap target.

I think the problem with these sets isn't the damage because other procs sets are comparable in damage. It's how lenient their cooldown conditions are. Sheer Venom and Unleashed need a harsher cooldown to be brought in line with other procs sets.

Mojomonkeyman

Xiomaro wrote: »

I didn't want to give a knee jerk reaction. But I feel like I've now tested it enough.

It initially looked amazing on paper then after trying it with my first set up, it felt like high pressure but not enough to confirm kills compared with other gear options. I was playing it in BGs, Cyrodiil and IC - so a good spread of different playstyles. In IC and Cyrodiil it was decent for killing bad players but then so is any gear set so that proves almost nothing. In high MMR BGs, I just couldn't confirm kills so I ended up shelfing the set for a bit. For the record, this was on a StamSorc with Torc, Venomous Smite and Maelstrom 2h. So pretty cheesy stuff but it was thoroughly underwhelming.

That changed when I decided to throw in Malacath and Sheer Venom.

Genuinely, this is the most overtuned combo I've played. My burst combo goes something like: Stampede > Streak > LA > Poison Injection

With a double dot poison on the Maelstrom Battle axe and Foulness glyph for minor defile on the backbar, you can potentially stack up 7 dots. Before someone knows what hit them.

That alone is enough to kill less-than-optimally-built players. But the follow up pressure from the dots plus whatever else I'm doing is enough to put the opponent on the defense immediately. That gives you a huge advantage, even against good player.

Of course, this does get countered by cleanse. But, unlike Venomous Smite which has a 15 second cooldown, all of these sets only have proc limitations per target. So if you come across someone who cleanses in open world, you can just swap target.

I think the problem with these sets isn't the damage because other procs sets are comparable in damage. It's how lenient their cooldown conditions are. Sheer Venom and Unleashed need a harsher cooldown to be brought in line with other procs sets.

Totally agree with this guy. Those sets make stacking overwhelming dps pressure a bit too easy. More restrictions/conditions on how to apply and/or keep those dots up without necessarily touching the dmg would be very welcome, imo.

Qbiken

Cyrodil and BG's with all overperforming procsets has made NOCP into a miserable joke. Sheer venom, venomous smite and skills such as snipe needs serious adjustments ASAP, or there will be few reasons to continue playing nocp for the next months. Procsets should be a way to add some extra flavour to a build, not carrying it completely.

Xiomaro

Qbiken wrote: »

Cyrodil and BG's with all overperforming procsets has made NOCP into a miserable joke. Sheer venom, venomous smite and skills such as snipe needs serious adjustments ASAP, or there will be few reasons to continue playing nocp for the next months. Procsets should be a way to add some extra flavour to a build, not carrying it completely.

Genuinely, Venomous Smite is over-rated compared to Sheer Venom and Unleashed. The only reason people hate it so much is because it's obvious when it's on you. The fact that you can't see Sheer Venom, Unleashed or Merciless Charge on you makes it even more deadly. Same goes for stuff like Azureblight, Draugrkin etc. They're all as strong or stronger than Venomous Smite but people only complain about Venomous Smite because the effect is super obnoxious.