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Is being a vampire worth it? Mag Dps wise (pve)
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SlimeBro1✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
There are plenty of people who play Vampires and enjoy it.
So I would not listen to all this advice on here that suggest Vampires are terrible and only good for overland RPing. That's just not the case.
But it is the case though.
And there are plenty of people that play with a two handed sword and use magicka abilities. Does that mean it is good for end game PvE?4 -
SlimeBro1✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
Yup pretty much. Don't listen to the singular person on this thread trying to say vampire is all fine and dandy. I would believe all of the others saying that there are issues with the skill line before that person.
The vampire skill line is not very useful unless you plan to use Eviscerate, Ultimate for PvE. Or mist form for PvP
Everything else about the kit, including the passives, are quite weak.
The invisibility passive is cool, but quite pointless if you aren't running in a group that can all turn invis and run past trash mobs. I've also found it to be quite meh in PvP too, as literally any AoE can bring you out of it.3 -
Wildberryjack✭✭✭✭✭
✭What bothers me about this new vampire is in myth and lore vampires are stronger and harder to kill than regular humans. But with this rework in the game vampires are weaker and easier to kill than regular humans. It's backward. I'm not seeing any advantages to being a vampire anymore other than maybe as a NB thief. The downside out weights the upside by a country mile now. It's very disappointing.Edited by Wildberryjack on July 19, 2020 6:59PMThe purpose of art is washing the dust of daily life off our souls. ~Pablo Picasso6 -
SlimeBro1✭✭✭✭Wildberryjack wrote: »What bothers me about this new vampire is in myth and lore vampires are stronger and harder to kill than regular humans. But with this rework in the game vampires are weaker and easier to kill than regular humans. It's backward. I'm not seeing any advantages to being a vampire anymore other than maybe as a NB thief. The downside out weights the upside by a country mile now. It's very disappointing.
Also kind of funny how many abilities we have that prevent healing, right? I've never seen an NPC vampire use an ability that stops them from healing.4 -
Fur_like_snow✭✭✭✭✭
✭Wildberryjack wrote: »What bothers me about this new vampire is in myth and lore vampires are stronger and harder to kill than regular humans. But with this rework in the game vampires are weaker and easier to kill than regular humans. It's backward. I'm not seeing any advantages to being a vampire anymore other than maybe as a NB thief. The downside out weights the upside by a country mile now. It's very disappointing.
The way vampire works now is that blood is a poison/drug that makes your character weaker the more you indulge in it(increased fire damage, increased cost to known skills, no health regen at rank4) Instead of drinking blood to surpress the beast within to fit into society now drinking blood turns you into a weak drug addicted blood fiend who’s trademark skill is running away. Even the ultimate is a lesser form of the NPC scions. They gave us a blood fiend simulator.Edited by Fur_like_snow on July 19, 2020 7:39PM3 -
SlimeBro1✭✭✭✭Fur_like_snow wrote: »Wildberryjack wrote: »What bothers me about this new vampire is in myth and lore vampires are stronger and harder to kill than regular humans. But with this rework in the game vampires are weaker and easier to kill than regular humans. It's backward. I'm not seeing any advantages to being a vampire anymore other than maybe as a NB thief. The downside out weights the upside by a country mile now. It's very disappointing.
The way vampire works now is that blood is a poison/drug that makes your character weaker the more you indulge in it(increased fire damage, increased cost to known skills, no health regen at rank4) Instead of drinking blood to surpress the beast within to fit into society now drinking blood turns you into a weak drug addicted blood fiend who’s trademark skill is running away. Even the ultimate is a lesser form of the NPC scions. They gave us a blood fiend simulator.
Im pretty jealous that the NPC scions have unique abilities in their form meanwhile we're stuck hitting people with our sticks.3 -
RedTalon✭✭✭✭✭For a mage dps and so on likely not much depending on what you are doing I am finding it useful for clearing a lot of old content fast since you can by pass a lot of npcs on your way to boss, and skyshard clearing on my new nord vampire is a cakke walk, cleared out some stuff I hadn't on my werewolf do to tine sinking also.0 -
UGotBenched91✭✭✭✭✭Kittytravel wrote: »What are your thoughts? I was considering on swapping to vampire, I dont really understand a lot of the changes.
My advice would be to go online and take a look at the Vampire Skills. If any of them look good to you - or like something you would actually use - then I would try it out. If not - then I wouldn't bother.
I'm a Vampire myself and love it. But how much mileage you get out of it depends a lot on your specific build and play style.
I wouldn't listen to this advice. He's wanting to play as a magicka dps. The only two skills that will be relevant to him are the Ultimate and BfB, all other skills are kinda trash for mag dps.
Blood Frenzy can work sometimes, but generally isn't worth taking in dungeons/trials.
And as it stands, at the moment BfB is the best magicka damage ability in the game for PvE. But if this next patch goes through it will quickly become the worse.
The ultimate, by itself, isn't worth the cost nor being a stage 1 vampire. It's good, but if you're a dps there are plenty of other ultimates to get.
[snip]
Just because you don't like the skills doesn't mean the OP won't. There was nothing wrong with my advice for him or her to give the skills a look over to see if any of them interest him or her, then to try them out if they do. The best way to find out if you like something is to try out it out for yourself.
And remember, not everything on the PTS makes it to live.
So I wouldn't listen to your advice either. Because if some of the skills do interest the OP, it couldn't hurt to try them out. And that is literally all I said in that post.
The OP didn't ask about the skills or if they are interesting... the title of the post explicitly states "Is being a vampire worth it? Mag Dps wise (pve)"
So SlimeBro's post is extremely relevant to the initial question while yours is more from the vantage point of play how you like. The factual answers for achieving highest end game DPS unfortunately don't conform to "play how you like" as much as I wish it did.
I'm not saying you are wrong for your opinion but as far as the two suggestions go one does carry more weight in reference to this.
To add my own piece to the thread; BFB wasn't all that important for every magicka class; Sorcs and Templars didn't really slot the skill so it depends highly on what your mag DPS class is.
Magknight and Magwarden especially rely on BFB currently for sustain issues while classes like Magcro and Magblade relied on it a little less heavily but still utilized the ability.
The Vampire has skills that do damage. So nah, it was a strange and pointless criticism. The kind of thing someone would write if they are just looking for a disagreement where one doesn't actually exist.
Also: I didn't even really put an opinion forth. All I did was simply tell the poster to take a look at the skills and if any of them appealed to them to give it a try. How such a benign and utterly uncontroversial comment as that could warrant you and that other person's criticism is just baffling to me. You both must be really bored is all I can think.
No, stop it. They don't. Vampires literally have: Ultimate (if you take swarming scion) and Eviscerate.
None of their other skills 'deal damage'. (Why Im responding to this post, even. I don't want OP seeing it and getting the wrong idea.)
And once again, you're saying 'take a look at the skills and if any of them are appealing, giving it a try'. That is NOT the point of this thread, which is why I pointed you out in my original post. And also your insistence that the vampire skill line is in a wonderful place also contributes to why I pointed you out. OP deserves to know the raw truth and quite plainly, his post is asking for a specific thing that has nothing to do with 'just look at the skills and see if you like any'. Im pretty sure that idea went through OP's mind, but he's wanting to know the specifics if it's worth for magicka dps or not.
So therefore I agree with @Kittytravel.
You agree with Kittytravel? Wow. That's a surprise. Shocking.
And did you really just say none of the Vampire Skills "deal damage"?
I know a lot of Vampires who DPS using Vampire Skills who would disagree with you about that....
The " raw truth" here is that Vampire is for some people, and not for others. In order to find out which one they are - it can't hurt to try them out and see for yourself. That's the best way to figure it out, at least in my opinion. Why on earth you have such a problem with me suggesting that is just beyond me. It's actually kind of funny at this point.
I genuinely do not believe you know people that DPS using Vampiric drain or Blood Mist, the only other two skills in the vampire skill line that deal ""damage"". In the guilds I'm in we've kicked people from trials for using either of those skills as a dps or have asked them to change to actual damage abilities.
And no, I said no other skills in the line except for swarming scion or eviscerate deal damage. And Im absolutely correct.
The raw truth here is that if this patch goes through, you will most likely never see a vampire in end game content. Want to know why? Because eviscerate is carrying the skill line really hard right now. This is due to the skill line being badly designed. Without it being very good, the skill line is useless for end game content.
I have a problem with you suggesting it because you still aren't getting that isn't the point of this thread. The OP is literally asking if vamp is worth or not for a magicka sorc dps. He isn't asking "Hey guys, should I try out vamp on my sorc or not?"
And the answer to that is very simple: Is he going to build for eviscerate that may or may not be punted into oblivion next patch? Then no, he doesn't need to try vamp sorcerer to know if it is good or not for end game content.
You mean you likely don’t see vampires in endgame hardcore PVE content. There’s other endgames other than chasing score boards and sweating over DPS numbers.
Your guild sounds fun....0 -
SlimeBro1✭✭✭✭UGotBenched91 wrote: »Kittytravel wrote: »What are your thoughts? I was considering on swapping to vampire, I dont really understand a lot of the changes.
My advice would be to go online and take a look at the Vampire Skills. If any of them look good to you - or like something you would actually use - then I would try it out. If not - then I wouldn't bother.
I'm a Vampire myself and love it. But how much mileage you get out of it depends a lot on your specific build and play style.
I wouldn't listen to this advice. He's wanting to play as a magicka dps. The only two skills that will be relevant to him are the Ultimate and BfB, all other skills are kinda trash for mag dps.
Blood Frenzy can work sometimes, but generally isn't worth taking in dungeons/trials.
And as it stands, at the moment BfB is the best magicka damage ability in the game for PvE. But if this next patch goes through it will quickly become the worse.
The ultimate, by itself, isn't worth the cost nor being a stage 1 vampire. It's good, but if you're a dps there are plenty of other ultimates to get.
[snip]
Just because you don't like the skills doesn't mean the OP won't. There was nothing wrong with my advice for him or her to give the skills a look over to see if any of them interest him or her, then to try them out if they do. The best way to find out if you like something is to try out it out for yourself.
And remember, not everything on the PTS makes it to live.
So I wouldn't listen to your advice either. Because if some of the skills do interest the OP, it couldn't hurt to try them out. And that is literally all I said in that post.
The OP didn't ask about the skills or if they are interesting... the title of the post explicitly states "Is being a vampire worth it? Mag Dps wise (pve)"
So SlimeBro's post is extremely relevant to the initial question while yours is more from the vantage point of play how you like. The factual answers for achieving highest end game DPS unfortunately don't conform to "play how you like" as much as I wish it did.
I'm not saying you are wrong for your opinion but as far as the two suggestions go one does carry more weight in reference to this.
To add my own piece to the thread; BFB wasn't all that important for every magicka class; Sorcs and Templars didn't really slot the skill so it depends highly on what your mag DPS class is.
Magknight and Magwarden especially rely on BFB currently for sustain issues while classes like Magcro and Magblade relied on it a little less heavily but still utilized the ability.
The Vampire has skills that do damage. So nah, it was a strange and pointless criticism. The kind of thing someone would write if they are just looking for a disagreement where one doesn't actually exist.
Also: I didn't even really put an opinion forth. All I did was simply tell the poster to take a look at the skills and if any of them appealed to them to give it a try. How such a benign and utterly uncontroversial comment as that could warrant you and that other person's criticism is just baffling to me. You both must be really bored is all I can think.
No, stop it. They don't. Vampires literally have: Ultimate (if you take swarming scion) and Eviscerate.
None of their other skills 'deal damage'. (Why Im responding to this post, even. I don't want OP seeing it and getting the wrong idea.)
And once again, you're saying 'take a look at the skills and if any of them are appealing, giving it a try'. That is NOT the point of this thread, which is why I pointed you out in my original post. And also your insistence that the vampire skill line is in a wonderful place also contributes to why I pointed you out. OP deserves to know the raw truth and quite plainly, his post is asking for a specific thing that has nothing to do with 'just look at the skills and see if you like any'. Im pretty sure that idea went through OP's mind, but he's wanting to know the specifics if it's worth for magicka dps or not.
So therefore I agree with @Kittytravel.
You agree with Kittytravel? Wow. That's a surprise. Shocking.
And did you really just say none of the Vampire Skills "deal damage"?
I know a lot of Vampires who DPS using Vampire Skills who would disagree with you about that....
The " raw truth" here is that Vampire is for some people, and not for others. In order to find out which one they are - it can't hurt to try them out and see for yourself. That's the best way to figure it out, at least in my opinion. Why on earth you have such a problem with me suggesting that is just beyond me. It's actually kind of funny at this point.
I genuinely do not believe you know people that DPS using Vampiric drain or Blood Mist, the only other two skills in the vampire skill line that deal ""damage"". In the guilds I'm in we've kicked people from trials for using either of those skills as a dps or have asked them to change to actual damage abilities.
And no, I said no other skills in the line except for swarming scion or eviscerate deal damage. And Im absolutely correct.
The raw truth here is that if this patch goes through, you will most likely never see a vampire in end game content. Want to know why? Because eviscerate is carrying the skill line really hard right now. This is due to the skill line being badly designed. Without it being very good, the skill line is useless for end game content.
I have a problem with you suggesting it because you still aren't getting that isn't the point of this thread. The OP is literally asking if vamp is worth or not for a magicka sorc dps. He isn't asking "Hey guys, should I try out vamp on my sorc or not?"
And the answer to that is very simple: Is he going to build for eviscerate that may or may not be punted into oblivion next patch? Then no, he doesn't need to try vamp sorcerer to know if it is good or not for end game content.
You mean you likely don’t see vampires in endgame hardcore PVE content. There’s other endgames other than chasing score boards and sweating over DPS numbers.
Your guild sounds fun....
No? I'm talking about trials and DLC vet dungeons.
Yeah, if someone is using vampire for Blood mist/ Vampiric drain as a dps you will be asked to change abilities. Because they ARE NOT DPS ABILITIES. I'm unsure as to what is so hard to understand about that. Go ahead, try clearing Fang Lair or Moongrave with a dps that uses blood mist and vampiric drain.
And **once again for the third time** I'm not saying I don't see vampires at all. I'm saying I do not see vampire DPS using anything other than eviscerate or the ultimate. Because those are the only two abilities worth using as a DPS.
How did you miss that in my statement....?Edited by SlimeBro1 on July 19, 2020 8:35PM3 -
Runefang✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The best magblade parse on the pts I’ve seen is running arterial burst by the way. So vampire is still viable, just suboptimal in real content for most classes unless something changes.1 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
There are plenty of people who play Vampires and enjoy it.
So I would not listen to all this advice on here that suggest Vampires are terrible and only good for overland RPing. That's just not the case.
But it is the case though.
And there are plenty of people that play with a two handed sword and use magicka abilities. Does that mean it is good for end game PvE?
I wouldn't listen to this advice, either. ^^
I personally know players who do "endgame" as a Vampire and do it well. So no - it is not the case.
If it looks interesting to you then give it a try. It can't hurt - and then you'll know for sure. If you need a bite send me a private message, I'll be happy to give you one.Edited by Jeremy on July 19, 2020 8:50PM0 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Kittytravel wrote: »What are your thoughts? I was considering on swapping to vampire, I dont really understand a lot of the changes.
My advice would be to go online and take a look at the Vampire Skills. If any of them look good to you - or like something you would actually use - then I would try it out. If not - then I wouldn't bother.
I'm a Vampire myself and love it. But how much mileage you get out of it depends a lot on your specific build and play style.
I wouldn't listen to this advice. He's wanting to play as a magicka dps. The only two skills that will be relevant to him are the Ultimate and BfB, all other skills are kinda trash for mag dps.
Blood Frenzy can work sometimes, but generally isn't worth taking in dungeons/trials.
And as it stands, at the moment BfB is the best magicka damage ability in the game for PvE. But if this next patch goes through it will quickly become the worse.
The ultimate, by itself, isn't worth the cost nor being a stage 1 vampire. It's good, but if you're a dps there are plenty of other ultimates to get.
[snip]
Just because you don't like the skills doesn't mean the OP won't. There was nothing wrong with my advice for him or her to give the skills a look over to see if any of them interest him or her, then to try them out if they do. The best way to find out if you like something is to try out it out for yourself.
And remember, not everything on the PTS makes it to live.
So I wouldn't listen to your advice either. Because if some of the skills do interest the OP, it couldn't hurt to try them out. And that is literally all I said in that post.
The OP didn't ask about the skills or if they are interesting... the title of the post explicitly states "Is being a vampire worth it? Mag Dps wise (pve)"
So SlimeBro's post is extremely relevant to the initial question while yours is more from the vantage point of play how you like. The factual answers for achieving highest end game DPS unfortunately don't conform to "play how you like" as much as I wish it did.
I'm not saying you are wrong for your opinion but as far as the two suggestions go one does carry more weight in reference to this.
To add my own piece to the thread; BFB wasn't all that important for every magicka class; Sorcs and Templars didn't really slot the skill so it depends highly on what your mag DPS class is.
Magknight and Magwarden especially rely on BFB currently for sustain issues while classes like Magcro and Magblade relied on it a little less heavily but still utilized the ability.
I am using a sorcerer class which is getting boring and under performing by all other classes from my experience in end game pve. So i figured maybe vampire would have some good dps skills for end game pve, but im not sure which skills are good.
Surge + bfb/artieral burst is really popular in end game PvE right now. But if this current patch goes through, BfB will be quite useless.
Honestly, I wouldn't recommend going vampire unless you find smacking someone with your stick fun and entertaining. The only ability sorcs really use from the vamp tool kit is eviscerate, which isn't worth the downsides. From the sounds of it, you want a good, effective build that is also fun to play.
If you need help with a good magicka sorc build though, I recommend checking out this one: https://dottzgaming.com/build/apothis-magicka-sorcerer-pve-build/
I see a lot of sorcs use it in vet dungeons. It's a pretty good set up. I hope it can help! Don't get baited into using vampire skills on your sorc (unless you're going an eviscerate build) in end game stuff, you will be putting out so little damage that your group might not like that.
They don't.
BfB doesn't proc Frags, so it actually LOWERS your dps. No well-built magsorc would use it.
Oh? Well that's why I also said arterial too. Tbh I couldn't remember which it was, but I know one of those morphs + surge is mega strong.
It's BfB. Arterial burst misses out on the status effect procs.
You could drop your HP to near-death to profit from BfB's damage multiplier. That could increase your dps on the dummy, but it's just not realistic in trials. If your sustain is REALLY bad, BfB being "free" can also increase your dps. But then you're not ready for vet trials, anyway.2 -
SlimeBro1✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
There are plenty of people who play Vampires and enjoy it.
So I would not listen to all this advice on here that suggest Vampires are terrible and only good for overland RPing. That's just not the case.
But it is the case though.
And there are plenty of people that play with a two handed sword and use magicka abilities. Does that mean it is good for end game PvE?
I wouldn't listen to this advice, either. ^^
I personally know players who do "endgame" as a Vampire and do it well. So no - it is not the case.
If it looks interesting to you then give it a try. It can't hurt - and then you'll know for sure. If you need a bite send me a private message, I'll be happy to give you one.
Wouldn't listen to this advice 2x either ^
But oh really? You know people that use Blood Mist and Vampiric drain as a dps at end game PvE content? Prove it then.
Because while you say you know these people, I know plenty of guild groups where running either of those abilities as a DPS will get you either kicked or asked to change to an *actual* build. How come I see literally no vet dungeon or trial clearing groups using vampiric drain or blood mist? Wanna explain that one to me?
Or maybe you want to somehow try to convince me a 2k per tick channel drain is worth taking in high end PvE content as a dps when your light attacks deal more damage?
1 -
SlimeBro1✭✭✭✭Kittytravel wrote: »What are your thoughts? I was considering on swapping to vampire, I dont really understand a lot of the changes.
My advice would be to go online and take a look at the Vampire Skills. If any of them look good to you - or like something you would actually use - then I would try it out. If not - then I wouldn't bother.
I'm a Vampire myself and love it. But how much mileage you get out of it depends a lot on your specific build and play style.
I wouldn't listen to this advice. He's wanting to play as a magicka dps. The only two skills that will be relevant to him are the Ultimate and BfB, all other skills are kinda trash for mag dps.
Blood Frenzy can work sometimes, but generally isn't worth taking in dungeons/trials.
And as it stands, at the moment BfB is the best magicka damage ability in the game for PvE. But if this next patch goes through it will quickly become the worse.
The ultimate, by itself, isn't worth the cost nor being a stage 1 vampire. It's good, but if you're a dps there are plenty of other ultimates to get.
[snip]
Just because you don't like the skills doesn't mean the OP won't. There was nothing wrong with my advice for him or her to give the skills a look over to see if any of them interest him or her, then to try them out if they do. The best way to find out if you like something is to try out it out for yourself.
And remember, not everything on the PTS makes it to live.
So I wouldn't listen to your advice either. Because if some of the skills do interest the OP, it couldn't hurt to try them out. And that is literally all I said in that post.
The OP didn't ask about the skills or if they are interesting... the title of the post explicitly states "Is being a vampire worth it? Mag Dps wise (pve)"
So SlimeBro's post is extremely relevant to the initial question while yours is more from the vantage point of play how you like. The factual answers for achieving highest end game DPS unfortunately don't conform to "play how you like" as much as I wish it did.
I'm not saying you are wrong for your opinion but as far as the two suggestions go one does carry more weight in reference to this.
To add my own piece to the thread; BFB wasn't all that important for every magicka class; Sorcs and Templars didn't really slot the skill so it depends highly on what your mag DPS class is.
Magknight and Magwarden especially rely on BFB currently for sustain issues while classes like Magcro and Magblade relied on it a little less heavily but still utilized the ability.
I am using a sorcerer class which is getting boring and under performing by all other classes from my experience in end game pve. So i figured maybe vampire would have some good dps skills for end game pve, but im not sure which skills are good.
Surge + bfb/artieral burst is really popular in end game PvE right now. But if this current patch goes through, BfB will be quite useless.
Honestly, I wouldn't recommend going vampire unless you find smacking someone with your stick fun and entertaining. The only ability sorcs really use from the vamp tool kit is eviscerate, which isn't worth the downsides. From the sounds of it, you want a good, effective build that is also fun to play.
If you need help with a good magicka sorc build though, I recommend checking out this one: https://dottzgaming.com/build/apothis-magicka-sorcerer-pve-build/
I see a lot of sorcs use it in vet dungeons. It's a pretty good set up. I hope it can help! Don't get baited into using vampire skills on your sorc (unless you're going an eviscerate build) in end game stuff, you will be putting out so little damage that your group might not like that.
They don't.
BfB doesn't proc Frags, so it actually LOWERS your dps. No well-built magsorc would use it.
Oh? Well that's why I also said arterial too. Tbh I couldn't remember which it was, but I know one of those morphs + surge is mega strong.
It's BfB. Arterial burst misses out on the status effect procs.
You could drop your HP to near-death to profit from BfB's damage multiplier. That could increase your dps on the dummy, but it's just not realistic in trials. If your sustain is REALLY bad, BfB being "free" can also increase your dps. But then you're not ready for vet trials, anyway.
Ah fair enough! So simply further evidence that vampire on DPS isn't really viable for trials.0 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Kittytravel wrote: »What are your thoughts? I was considering on swapping to vampire, I dont really understand a lot of the changes.
My advice would be to go online and take a look at the Vampire Skills. If any of them look good to you - or like something you would actually use - then I would try it out. If not - then I wouldn't bother.
I'm a Vampire myself and love it. But how much mileage you get out of it depends a lot on your specific build and play style.
I wouldn't listen to this advice. He's wanting to play as a magicka dps. The only two skills that will be relevant to him are the Ultimate and BfB, all other skills are kinda trash for mag dps.
Blood Frenzy can work sometimes, but generally isn't worth taking in dungeons/trials.
And as it stands, at the moment BfB is the best magicka damage ability in the game for PvE. But if this next patch goes through it will quickly become the worse.
The ultimate, by itself, isn't worth the cost nor being a stage 1 vampire. It's good, but if you're a dps there are plenty of other ultimates to get.
[snip]
Just because you don't like the skills doesn't mean the OP won't. There was nothing wrong with my advice for him or her to give the skills a look over to see if any of them interest him or her, then to try them out if they do. The best way to find out if you like something is to try out it out for yourself.
And remember, not everything on the PTS makes it to live.
So I wouldn't listen to your advice either. Because if some of the skills do interest the OP, it couldn't hurt to try them out. And that is literally all I said in that post.
The OP didn't ask about the skills or if they are interesting... the title of the post explicitly states "Is being a vampire worth it? Mag Dps wise (pve)"
So SlimeBro's post is extremely relevant to the initial question while yours is more from the vantage point of play how you like. The factual answers for achieving highest end game DPS unfortunately don't conform to "play how you like" as much as I wish it did.
I'm not saying you are wrong for your opinion but as far as the two suggestions go one does carry more weight in reference to this.
To add my own piece to the thread; BFB wasn't all that important for every magicka class; Sorcs and Templars didn't really slot the skill so it depends highly on what your mag DPS class is.
Magknight and Magwarden especially rely on BFB currently for sustain issues while classes like Magcro and Magblade relied on it a little less heavily but still utilized the ability.
I am using a sorcerer class which is getting boring and under performing by all other classes from my experience in end game pve. So i figured maybe vampire would have some good dps skills for end game pve, but im not sure which skills are good.
Surge + bfb/artieral burst is really popular in end game PvE right now. But if this current patch goes through, BfB will be quite useless.
Honestly, I wouldn't recommend going vampire unless you find smacking someone with your stick fun and entertaining. The only ability sorcs really use from the vamp tool kit is eviscerate, which isn't worth the downsides. From the sounds of it, you want a good, effective build that is also fun to play.
If you need help with a good magicka sorc build though, I recommend checking out this one: https://dottzgaming.com/build/apothis-magicka-sorcerer-pve-build/
I see a lot of sorcs use it in vet dungeons. It's a pretty good set up. I hope it can help! Don't get baited into using vampire skills on your sorc (unless you're going an eviscerate build) in end game stuff, you will be putting out so little damage that your group might not like that.
They don't.
BfB doesn't proc Frags, so it actually LOWERS your dps. No well-built magsorc would use it.
Oh? Well that's why I also said arterial too. Tbh I couldn't remember which it was, but I know one of those morphs + surge is mega strong.
It's BfB. Arterial burst misses out on the status effect procs.
You could drop your HP to near-death to profit from BfB's damage multiplier. That could increase your dps on the dummy, but it's just not realistic in trials. If your sustain is REALLY bad, BfB being "free" can also increase your dps. But then you're not ready for vet trials, anyway.
Ah fair enough! So simply further evidence that vampire on DPS isn't really viable for trials.
Not on magsorc, no. At least it's not good. Viable, sure, but you could do better. For every other class, it's meta.0 -
Jeremy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
There are plenty of people who play Vampires and enjoy it.
So I would not listen to all this advice on here that suggest Vampires are terrible and only good for overland RPing. That's just not the case.
But it is the case though.
And there are plenty of people that play with a two handed sword and use magicka abilities. Does that mean it is good for end game PvE?
I wouldn't listen to this advice, either. ^^
I personally know players who do "endgame" as a Vampire and do it well. So no - it is not the case.
If it looks interesting to you then give it a try. It can't hurt - and then you'll know for sure. If you need a bite send me a private message, I'll be happy to give you one.
Wouldn't listen to this advice 2x either ^
But oh really? You know people that use Blood Mist and Vampiric drain as a dps at end game PvE content? Prove it then.
Because while you say you know these people, I know plenty of guild groups where running either of those abilities as a DPS will get you either kicked or asked to change to an *actual* build. How come I see literally no vet dungeon or trial clearing groups using vampiric drain or blood mist? Wanna explain that one to me?
Or maybe you want to somehow try to convince me a 2k per tick channel drain is worth taking in high end PvE content as a dps when your light attacks deal more damage?
Again: I would not listen to this advice x what ever number.
I know people who do "endgame" as a Vampire DPS and they do it well. They don't use Vampiric Drain and Blood Mist to do damage of course... but who would? Those are not abilities meant to do good DPS with. So the viability or effectiveness of Vampire DPS should not be judged by those two abilities.
As I originally said in this thread - if Vampire looks interesting to you just give it a try for yourself. Some people like it, others don't. It's not for everyone. But it's also not for nobody. And there was absolutely nothing wrong with that advice. I have friends who do very good damage as a Vampire.Edited by Jeremy on July 19, 2020 9:47PM0 -
buttaface✭✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
No. You are seeing a very lopsided view of the vampire changes championed by a -handful- of squeaky forum wheels in repetitive -short- threads on this topic. I'll wager that many players such as myself are working up and are using plenty of vampire dps variations, and the majority like the new vamp changes.1 -
Lord-Otto✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
No. You are seeing a very lopsided view of the vampire changes championed by a -handful- of squeaky forum wheels in repetitive -short- threads on this topic. I'll wager that many players such as myself are working up and are using plenty of vampire dps variations, and the majority like the new vamp changes.
And your dps with that is...?5 -
UGotBenched91✭✭✭✭✭UGotBenched91 wrote: »Kittytravel wrote: »What are your thoughts? I was considering on swapping to vampire, I dont really understand a lot of the changes.
My advice would be to go online and take a look at the Vampire Skills. If any of them look good to you - or like something you would actually use - then I would try it out. If not - then I wouldn't bother.
I'm a Vampire myself and love it. But how much mileage you get out of it depends a lot on your specific build and play style.
I wouldn't listen to this advice. He's wanting to play as a magicka dps. The only two skills that will be relevant to him are the Ultimate and BfB, all other skills are kinda trash for mag dps.
Blood Frenzy can work sometimes, but generally isn't worth taking in dungeons/trials.
And as it stands, at the moment BfB is the best magicka damage ability in the game for PvE. But if this next patch goes through it will quickly become the worse.
The ultimate, by itself, isn't worth the cost nor being a stage 1 vampire. It's good, but if you're a dps there are plenty of other ultimates to get.
[snip]
Just because you don't like the skills doesn't mean the OP won't. There was nothing wrong with my advice for him or her to give the skills a look over to see if any of them interest him or her, then to try them out if they do. The best way to find out if you like something is to try out it out for yourself.
And remember, not everything on the PTS makes it to live.
So I wouldn't listen to your advice either. Because if some of the skills do interest the OP, it couldn't hurt to try them out. And that is literally all I said in that post.
The OP didn't ask about the skills or if they are interesting... the title of the post explicitly states "Is being a vampire worth it? Mag Dps wise (pve)"
So SlimeBro's post is extremely relevant to the initial question while yours is more from the vantage point of play how you like. The factual answers for achieving highest end game DPS unfortunately don't conform to "play how you like" as much as I wish it did.
I'm not saying you are wrong for your opinion but as far as the two suggestions go one does carry more weight in reference to this.
To add my own piece to the thread; BFB wasn't all that important for every magicka class; Sorcs and Templars didn't really slot the skill so it depends highly on what your mag DPS class is.
Magknight and Magwarden especially rely on BFB currently for sustain issues while classes like Magcro and Magblade relied on it a little less heavily but still utilized the ability.
The Vampire has skills that do damage. So nah, it was a strange and pointless criticism. The kind of thing someone would write if they are just looking for a disagreement where one doesn't actually exist.
Also: I didn't even really put an opinion forth. All I did was simply tell the poster to take a look at the skills and if any of them appealed to them to give it a try. How such a benign and utterly uncontroversial comment as that could warrant you and that other person's criticism is just baffling to me. You both must be really bored is all I can think.
No, stop it. They don't. Vampires literally have: Ultimate (if you take swarming scion) and Eviscerate.
None of their other skills 'deal damage'. (Why Im responding to this post, even. I don't want OP seeing it and getting the wrong idea.)
And once again, you're saying 'take a look at the skills and if any of them are appealing, giving it a try'. That is NOT the point of this thread, which is why I pointed you out in my original post. And also your insistence that the vampire skill line is in a wonderful place also contributes to why I pointed you out. OP deserves to know the raw truth and quite plainly, his post is asking for a specific thing that has nothing to do with 'just look at the skills and see if you like any'. Im pretty sure that idea went through OP's mind, but he's wanting to know the specifics if it's worth for magicka dps or not.
So therefore I agree with @Kittytravel.
You agree with Kittytravel? Wow. That's a surprise. Shocking.
And did you really just say none of the Vampire Skills "deal damage"?
I know a lot of Vampires who DPS using Vampire Skills who would disagree with you about that....
The " raw truth" here is that Vampire is for some people, and not for others. In order to find out which one they are - it can't hurt to try them out and see for yourself. That's the best way to figure it out, at least in my opinion. Why on earth you have such a problem with me suggesting that is just beyond me. It's actually kind of funny at this point.
I genuinely do not believe you know people that DPS using Vampiric drain or Blood Mist, the only other two skills in the vampire skill line that deal ""damage"". In the guilds I'm in we've kicked people from trials for using either of those skills as a dps or have asked them to change to actual damage abilities.
And no, I said no other skills in the line except for swarming scion or eviscerate deal damage. And Im absolutely correct.
The raw truth here is that if this patch goes through, you will most likely never see a vampire in end game content. Want to know why? Because eviscerate is carrying the skill line really hard right now. This is due to the skill line being badly designed. Without it being very good, the skill line is useless for end game content.
I have a problem with you suggesting it because you still aren't getting that isn't the point of this thread. The OP is literally asking if vamp is worth or not for a magicka sorc dps. He isn't asking "Hey guys, should I try out vamp on my sorc or not?"
And the answer to that is very simple: Is he going to build for eviscerate that may or may not be punted into oblivion next patch? Then no, he doesn't need to try vamp sorcerer to know if it is good or not for end game content.
You mean you likely don’t see vampires in endgame hardcore PVE content. There’s other endgames other than chasing score boards and sweating over DPS numbers.
Your guild sounds fun....
No? I'm talking about trials and DLC vet dungeons.
Yeah, if someone is using vampire for Blood mist/ Vampiric drain as a dps you will be asked to change abilities. Because they ARE NOT DPS ABILITIES. I'm unsure as to what is so hard to understand about that. Go ahead, try clearing Fang Lair or Moongrave with a dps that uses blood mist and vampiric drain.
And **once again for the third time** I'm not saying I don't see vampires at all. I'm saying I do not see vampire DPS using anything other than eviscerate or the ultimate. Because those are the only two abilities worth using as a DPS.
How did you miss that in my statement....?
....because you said end game content which leaves a lot to be interpreted. You didn’t list DLC dungeons or vet trials as your comparison.
You don’t have to try to be condescending in every reply. Just state your point and have a nice civil discussion.0 -
BRCOURTN✭✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
There are plenty of people who play Vampires and enjoy it.
So I would not listen to all this advice on here that suggest Vampires are terrible and only good for overland RPing. That's just not the case.
But it is the case though.
And there are plenty of people that play with a two handed sword and use magicka abilities. Does that mean it is good for end game PvE?
I wouldn't listen to this advice, either. ^^
I personally know players who do "endgame" as a Vampire and do it well. So no - it is not the case.
If it looks interesting to you then give it a try. It can't hurt - and then you'll know for sure. If you need a bite send me a private message, I'll be happy to give you one.
Wouldn't listen to this advice 2x either ^
But oh really? You know people that use Blood Mist and Vampiric drain as a dps at end game PvE content? Prove it then.
Because while you say you know these people, I know plenty of guild groups where running either of those abilities as a DPS will get you either kicked or asked to change to an *actual* build. How come I see literally no vet dungeon or trial clearing groups using vampiric drain or blood mist? Wanna explain that one to me?
Or maybe you want to somehow try to convince me a 2k per tick channel drain is worth taking in high end PvE content as a dps when your light attacks deal more damage?
the honest truth i believe is that outside of score pushing, all other content in this game can be completed with half the dps than most trial groups require. So using these abilities wouldn't prevent any group with coordination and knowledge from clearing content.
The point is that if you learned to use it well, it would be completely viable. It just sounds like you haven't met anyone who's practiced with it and made it usable.0 -
SlimeBro1✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
No. You are seeing a very lopsided view of the vampire changes championed by a -handful- of squeaky forum wheels in repetitive -short- threads on this topic. I'll wager that many players such as myself are working up and are using plenty of vampire dps variations, and the majority like the new vamp changes.
What majority? Are we reading the same thread? Go look at the PTS side of the forums, are we even on the same forum? How come every person I've ran into using vamp in game says they hate it?
Imagine thinking that the majority like a thing when literally every thread about said thing is negative. Like dude. The polls on the PTS side of the forum show you guys as less than 30%. Kinda confused how that overrules the 70% of people who said the vamp rework needs work and isn't that great.Edited by SlimeBro1 on July 20, 2020 1:13AM1 -
Vevvev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭This thread has gone on for a while and we've mainly gone over the skills. When we look at the passives we don't really see much going for vampires in endgame PVE DPS. Strike from the Shadows makes mistform usable to increase damage but there is a small problem where the passive only lasts for 6 seconds. Mistform unlike Blood Frenzy is tied to the global cooldown so during parses you're giving up a second to give yourself 300 weapon and spell damage for 6 seconds.
The stage 3 passive is probably my favorite passive due to the fact is can make a DPS slightly less squishy but it comes at the cost of 13% extra flame damage and 8% increased cost on all your skills. Health regen at stage 3 is also -60% but if you're doing endgame PVE stuff odds are you have a healer so that debuff is inconsequential. Also if you are at 56% health your damage mitigation will equal the flame damage increase of 13%, which theoretically negates it but I have not tested it.
Stage 4 is worthless in all endgame mag DPS since the buff is mostly a PVP or solo based perk, and its debuffs are just not worth the benefits. Now it does make the initial health cost of Blood Frenzy lower giving you more time to leave it on, but you need to build into that ability to make good use of it.PC NA - Ceyanna Ashton - Breton Vampire MagDK0 -
SlimeBro1✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
There are plenty of people who play Vampires and enjoy it.
So I would not listen to all this advice on here that suggest Vampires are terrible and only good for overland RPing. That's just not the case.
But it is the case though.
And there are plenty of people that play with a two handed sword and use magicka abilities. Does that mean it is good for end game PvE?
I wouldn't listen to this advice, either. ^^
I personally know players who do "endgame" as a Vampire and do it well. So no - it is not the case.
If it looks interesting to you then give it a try. It can't hurt - and then you'll know for sure. If you need a bite send me a private message, I'll be happy to give you one.
Wouldn't listen to this advice 2x either ^
But oh really? You know people that use Blood Mist and Vampiric drain as a dps at end game PvE content? Prove it then.
Because while you say you know these people, I know plenty of guild groups where running either of those abilities as a DPS will get you either kicked or asked to change to an *actual* build. How come I see literally no vet dungeon or trial clearing groups using vampiric drain or blood mist? Wanna explain that one to me?
Or maybe you want to somehow try to convince me a 2k per tick channel drain is worth taking in high end PvE content as a dps when your light attacks deal more damage?
the honest truth i believe is that outside of score pushing, all other content in this game can be completed with half the dps than most trial groups require. So using these abilities wouldn't prevent any group with coordination and knowledge from clearing content.
The point is that if you learned to use it well, it would be completely viable. It just sounds like you haven't met anyone who's practiced with it and made it usable.
Nope, I've met with a few people that have tried to make Blood Mist and Vampiric Drain work in not-super-hardcore end game PvE content. The fact of the matter is those abilities are absolutely trash and horrible for dps.
I don't understand what's so hard about accepting that. How exactly is my group going to play around me dealing 2k dmg for 3 seconds and nothing else? How are they going to work around me dealing 1k dmg around me and being unable to cast anything else?
They dont. Because the abilities are trash.Edited by SlimeBro1 on July 20, 2020 12:12AM1 -
BRCOURTN✭✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
There are plenty of people who play Vampires and enjoy it.
So I would not listen to all this advice on here that suggest Vampires are terrible and only good for overland RPing. That's just not the case.
But it is the case though.
And there are plenty of people that play with a two handed sword and use magicka abilities. Does that mean it is good for end game PvE?
I wouldn't listen to this advice, either. ^^
I personally know players who do "endgame" as a Vampire and do it well. So no - it is not the case.
If it looks interesting to you then give it a try. It can't hurt - and then you'll know for sure. If you need a bite send me a private message, I'll be happy to give you one.
Wouldn't listen to this advice 2x either ^
But oh really? You know people that use Blood Mist and Vampiric drain as a dps at end game PvE content? Prove it then.
Because while you say you know these people, I know plenty of guild groups where running either of those abilities as a DPS will get you either kicked or asked to change to an *actual* build. How come I see literally no vet dungeon or trial clearing groups using vampiric drain or blood mist? Wanna explain that one to me?
Or maybe you want to somehow try to convince me a 2k per tick channel drain is worth taking in high end PvE content as a dps when your light attacks deal more damage?
the honest truth i believe is that outside of score pushing, all other content in this game can be completed with half the dps than most trial groups require. So using these abilities wouldn't prevent any group with coordination and knowledge from clearing content.
The point is that if you learned to use it well, it would be completely viable. It just sounds like you haven't met anyone who's practiced with it and made it usable.
Nope, I've met with a few people that have tried to make Blood Mist and Vampiric Drain work in not-super-hardcore end game PvE content. The fact of the matter is those abilities are absolutely trash and horrible for dps.
I don't understand what's so hard about accepting that. How exactly is my group going to play around me dealing 2k dmg for 3 seconds and nothing else? How are they going to work around me dealing 1k dmg around me and being unable to cast anything else?
They dont. Because the abilities are trash.
Why in the world would you only be doing 2k damage for 3s?0 -
SlimeBro1✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
There are plenty of people who play Vampires and enjoy it.
So I would not listen to all this advice on here that suggest Vampires are terrible and only good for overland RPing. That's just not the case.
But it is the case though.
And there are plenty of people that play with a two handed sword and use magicka abilities. Does that mean it is good for end game PvE?
I wouldn't listen to this advice, either. ^^
I personally know players who do "endgame" as a Vampire and do it well. So no - it is not the case.
If it looks interesting to you then give it a try. It can't hurt - and then you'll know for sure. If you need a bite send me a private message, I'll be happy to give you one.
Wouldn't listen to this advice 2x either ^
But oh really? You know people that use Blood Mist and Vampiric drain as a dps at end game PvE content? Prove it then.
Because while you say you know these people, I know plenty of guild groups where running either of those abilities as a DPS will get you either kicked or asked to change to an *actual* build. How come I see literally no vet dungeon or trial clearing groups using vampiric drain or blood mist? Wanna explain that one to me?
Or maybe you want to somehow try to convince me a 2k per tick channel drain is worth taking in high end PvE content as a dps when your light attacks deal more damage?
the honest truth i believe is that outside of score pushing, all other content in this game can be completed with half the dps than most trial groups require. So using these abilities wouldn't prevent any group with coordination and knowledge from clearing content.
The point is that if you learned to use it well, it would be completely viable. It just sounds like you haven't met anyone who's practiced with it and made it usable.
Nope, I've met with a few people that have tried to make Blood Mist and Vampiric Drain work in not-super-hardcore end game PvE content. The fact of the matter is those abilities are absolutely trash and horrible for dps.
I don't understand what's so hard about accepting that. How exactly is my group going to play around me dealing 2k dmg for 3 seconds and nothing else? How are they going to work around me dealing 1k dmg around me and being unable to cast anything else?
They dont. Because the abilities are trash.
Why in the world would you only be doing 2k damage for 3s?
That, my friend, is vampiric drain. 2k every 1 second for 3 seconds.
If you buff yourself up and get real lucky, you can turn that into around 4k with crits.
Tell me why anyone would sit there and do that as a DPS when light attacking deals more?1 -
Vevvev✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Some would make the claim "Its a healing skill!" Slime, but if that's the case its a pretty poor healing ability. Vampiric Drain is outclassed by things like Burning Embers that does half a spammable's worth of damage upfront, applies a pretty decent DoT, applies the Burning status effect, and then heals you for over 75% of all the damage it has done when it ends. Compared to the Vampiric Drain channel its superior in every way and that's just one example of many. ((Especially when we delve into the Spammables that heal you.))PC NA - Ceyanna Ashton - Breton Vampire MagDK1 -
BRCOURTN✭✭✭✭✭barney2525 wrote: »So... after reading all the responses ...
they created an entire year of content ... based around vampires and supernatural creatures ... and changed them so no one wants to play one ?
Is that about right ?
There are plenty of people who play Vampires and enjoy it.
So I would not listen to all this advice on here that suggest Vampires are terrible and only good for overland RPing. That's just not the case.
But it is the case though.
And there are plenty of people that play with a two handed sword and use magicka abilities. Does that mean it is good for end game PvE?
I wouldn't listen to this advice, either. ^^
I personally know players who do "endgame" as a Vampire and do it well. So no - it is not the case.
If it looks interesting to you then give it a try. It can't hurt - and then you'll know for sure. If you need a bite send me a private message, I'll be happy to give you one.
Wouldn't listen to this advice 2x either ^
But oh really? You know people that use Blood Mist and Vampiric drain as a dps at end game PvE content? Prove it then.
Because while you say you know these people, I know plenty of guild groups where running either of those abilities as a DPS will get you either kicked or asked to change to an *actual* build. How come I see literally no vet dungeon or trial clearing groups using vampiric drain or blood mist? Wanna explain that one to me?
Or maybe you want to somehow try to convince me a 2k per tick channel drain is worth taking in high end PvE content as a dps when your light attacks deal more damage?
the honest truth i believe is that outside of score pushing, all other content in this game can be completed with half the dps than most trial groups require. So using these abilities wouldn't prevent any group with coordination and knowledge from clearing content.
The point is that if you learned to use it well, it would be completely viable. It just sounds like you haven't met anyone who's practiced with it and made it usable.
Nope, I've met with a few people that have tried to make Blood Mist and Vampiric Drain work in not-super-hardcore end game PvE content. The fact of the matter is those abilities are absolutely trash and horrible for dps.
I don't understand what's so hard about accepting that. How exactly is my group going to play around me dealing 2k dmg for 3 seconds and nothing else? How are they going to work around me dealing 1k dmg around me and being unable to cast anything else?
They dont. Because the abilities are trash.
Why in the world would you only be doing 2k damage for 3s?
That, my friend, is vampiric drain. 2k every 1 second for 3 seconds.
If you buff yourself up and get real lucky, you can turn that into around 4k with crits.
Tell me why anyone would sit there and do that as a DPS when light attacking deals more?
Lol I mean, you would have 30k of dots going at the time. But it seems like that's more of a tank skill for ulti gen. Blood for blood could be easily used by nightblades to great advantage. Again, if youre min maxing then no... but my point is that people shouldn't be min maxing anyways.0