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Leaving random dungeons early as a tank
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Sange13✭✭✭
You could avoid that by playing as a tank yourself and doing the quests on Normal.
thatk you for your advice but I will play the game as I want to and play the role I want to (btw it's usually heal). And I have many alts that need lvling, which elitists like you make extremely painful
I'm glad you see it that way. You want to selfishly play it "your way," but then cry that other people aren't queuing the least common role to carry you. I think it's funny that you consider it "elitist" that people won't let you waste their time with BS too. Good luck with that.IGN: Sange-134 -
daemonios✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Yeah OP, you're a regular hero. Only... If you have so many requirements, why do you queue with randoms at all? Do you realize by leaving you're probably making them wait a very long time for a replacement, or waste whatever time they've already spent in the dungeon? I agree that there are limits, but you can easily say in a polite way "sorry, I don't think this group can cut it" and leave instead of imposing unrealistic expectations on strangers and then drama-quitting.9 -
Sange13✭✭✭I've had groups start before I could get the quest before. I just leave. Simple as that. I'm not obligated to stay if I'm not going to get what I'm in there for. As for the group waiting a long time for a new tank, they probably won't have to wait too long since it puts them at the front of the queue. The only time you get a long wait time in that circumstance is when it's a dead time of day. Even so, you may think it unrealistic to expect those things, but there's only one or two things on the list that I wouldn't also leave for. Anyone who has played long enough knows that tanks don't just leave when people are doing what they are supposed to; they leave when people fail to do that.IGN: Sange-133
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jm42✭✭✭✭
You could avoid that by playing as a tank yourself and doing the quests on Normal.
thatk you for your advice but I will play the game as I want to and play the role I want to (btw it's usually heal). And I have many alts that need lvling, which elitists like you make extremely painful
I'm glad you see it that way. You want to selfishly play it "your way," but then cry that other people aren't queuing the least common role to carry you. I think it's funny that you consider it "elitist" that people won't let you waste their time with BS too. Good luck with that.
oh, we have a hero-savior here, who thinks that if he queue as a tank then he carries all the others) amazing how butt-hours ingame make ppl show their nature0 -
Tommy_The_Gun✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I mostly play a tank, but I also play as other roles. I have one simple rule when it comes to leaving group when the dungeon is incomplete (even if that means deserter penalty, I have a lot of time anyway) :
If you vote-kick some one who does not deserve it (wrong race, wrong gear - not min-maxing, too little dps, too little healing etc).
The idea is that if you vote-kick some one in a 4 man group, you need to find a replacement. But now you have to find the replacement for 2 people. 90% it ends in other person leaving too and disbanding the group. So you would learn not to kick people who are most likely learning & are doing dungeon 1st time. It is what you have to expect when using dungeon group finder.Edited by Tommy_The_Gun on May 24, 2020 1:49PM5 -
Glurin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭- If you have 10k hp with no food buff and you still don't use food after i tell you
- If you don't follow the tank and pull easily skippable trash
- If we're 3 mins into an easy boss fight and the boss is still at 70% because the group's dps is below 20k
- If we zone in and someone says brb bio, either kick or leave if it fails
- If we zone in and someone says brb getting pledge
- If i take my time to explain mechanics and after 3+ wipes you're still ignoring them like a bot
Being a good PUG tank requires that you have patience. If you don't have patience, don't PUG.
1. It's their character. They can do what they want as long as they get the job done.
2. The tank should be the one pulling anything, but maybe there's a reason they're pulling it. If it's easily killed trash, then just take the extra three seconds and kill it. No need to get too worked up over it.
3. Contrary to what seems like popular belief, not every hangup is strictly DPS meter related. I've been in many boss fights where all it took was a slight shift in tactics for him to drop like a ton of bricks.
4. So you're going to punish someone for having to pee? Are you expecting everyone in the game to be using a raiding chair now?
5. That one's annoying, but hardly ragequit worthy.
6. I'll give you that one. It's a side effect of elitists pushing the belief that brute forcing your way through is the best/only way to do things. If they're trying and failing, that's one thing. I can forgive seeing someone try to get behind the pillar or whatever and not making it in time. But yeah, if after having the mechanics explained they still clearly just ignore them and it has resulted in several wipes, there's not much point in continuing."He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster...when you gaze long into the abyss the abyss also gazes into you..."4 -
MartiniDaniels✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I mean. I don't agree. But it is acceptable, your choice. (Even though I think you should reconsider the bio one, dd queue can literally take hours)
Liko queues from third account. Types after porting in, bio, brb.
OP - leaves the group
Liko: ...
You could avoid that by playing as a tank yourself and doing the quests on Normal.
thatk you for your advice but I will play the game as I want to and play the role I want to (btw it's usually heal). And I have many alts that need lvling, which elitists like you make extremely painful
You must make quests on normal. If you are experienced player, you should know that best time to do quests is during lvling to 50.
Well, if you know that quest requires just a few fast dialogue skips, which won't delay group more then for few seconds - no problem - you may do it on vet. But if you expect somebody to wait for you in vet, because you were lazy to do quests on normal... no thanks. I'll better vote kick such player and leave myself if vote kick failed. This is not about elitism, this is about respect inside group. If you know that quest for skill point is long and you purposefully slow down group just because of your laziness... this means you don't respect the group.3 -
Eifleber✭✭✭✭✭A bit harsh, if someone needs a break or doesn't skip some trash, who cares?
It's a first (or second or third) time for everyone.
Why the rush?
That said, if people do extremely low dps I can understand you don' t want to spend 2 hours in that dungeon.
Or if ppl have 10k health, die all the time and refuse food. I think about 18k is a good lower limit for the average vet dungeon.
*Edited by Eifleber on May 24, 2020 11:18AM❆
Playing since dec 2019 | PC EU0 -
anitajoneb17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So, people aren't like you (talking to OP here) would like them to be ?
You should consider yourself lucky to have MMOs that teach you the basics of social life.
I have only one rule that I think is universal and based on common sense : if you have expectations : DO NOT PUG.
And then there's people like you, who can't even follow this basic rule. And guess what ? It's your freedom, so I have to deal with it. End of story.
That being said, I'd like to emphasize that, in my experience in ESO, most players in PUGs are nice and make some sort of compromise with their respective expectations, which all ends up in nice, fun and successful runs.
Edited by anitajoneb17_ESO on May 24, 2020 12:01PM4 -
Thogard✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭
You could avoid that by playing as a tank yourself and doing the quests on Normal.
thatk you for your advice but I will play the game as I want to and play the role I want to (btw it's usually heal). And I have many alts that need lvling, which elitists like you make extremely painful
I think this is the kind of entitled attitude that OP was referring to. You can play how you want, and others can choose not to carry you.
OP was getting hate messages for leaving. Don’t send him any hate tells and everything will be just fine and you can wait again to find someone willing to carry you your way.PC NA - @dazkt - Dazk Ardoonkt / Sir Thogalot / Dask Dragoh’t / Dazk Dragoh’t / El Thogardo
Stream: twitch.tv/THOGARDvsThePeasants
YouTube: http://youtube.com/c/thogardpvp6 -
Lintashi✭✭✭✭✭Because of such people, many new players are discouraged to do dungeons. I entered my first dungeon at around 300cp. Before, I read alot on this forum, about newbies who go into dungeons, and drag behind with low damage, and how high is toxicity of players there, so I never tried, as I feared I would be kicked in a second anyway. Then, when I leveled up, all I heard, was about high cp players not knowing mechanics perfectly, and same amount of elitism and haterd. So I was reluctant to try dungeons at all. Just by chance, went to Arx Corinthum to help guildmate, and it was vet. I healed just fine, since I had solid build and some small group healing experience from cyro. Since then, I did all of them, and I pug 98% of the time. I never kick people, but it would be really good, if all people did quests on normals, not on vets. And yes, if you have expectations, do not pug.5 -
gatekeeper13✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭And why i do it
[*] If you don't follow the tank and pull easily skippable trash
When I tank and they dont follow, I just leave them get killed by the trash mobs they aggro. Skippable trash is not that of an issue. Most annoying is when they leave group and start sprinting forth, agrro-ing everything.
3 -
daemonios✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭FrancisCrawford wrote: »
It's not about having a right or not having a right. I can see many of OP's points, I just think they go straight for the nuclear option.
With regard to pulling, tanks usually have a rotation (who knew, right?) to get their buffs up, stack enemies, debuff them, buff the group, leash/chain/taunt stragglers... When DDs run ahead and pull randomly, it can actually take longer to clear trash than if you waited 2 seconds for the tank. It's incredibly annoying to have your bars set up to provide maximum utility for the group and to have a player negate it by selfishly pulling. Not to mention there is a positive correlation between DDs who pull ahead of the tank and ones who don't follow mechanics, can't take the heat of the stuff they pull, and/or never res team mates and expect tanks or healers to.4 -
jm42✭✭✭✭
go read my posts once more, mb finally you will notice something about altsMartiniDaniels wrote: »You must make quests on normal. If you are experienced player, you should know that best time to do quests is during lvling to 50.0 -
jm42✭✭✭✭
You could avoid that by playing as a tank yourself and doing the quests on Normal.
thatk you for your advice but I will play the game as I want to and play the role I want to (btw it's usually heal). And I have many alts that need lvling, which elitists like you make extremely painful
I think this is the kind of entitled attitude that OP was referring to. You can play how you want, and others can choose not to carry you.
OP was getting hate messages for leaving. Don’t send him any hate tells and everything will be just fine and you can wait again to find someone willing to carry you your way.
why you decide that I need to be carried?) because I don't pug as a tank as that guy demanded for me to feel all his "pain"? I pug as a heal to get fast pop up (real heal), and who are you here to demand ppl what role they have to play? thats what I wanted to say with the words "I will how I want to"Edited by jm42 on May 24, 2020 12:09PM0 -
zvavi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭- If you have 10k hp with no food buff and you still don't use food after i tell you
- If you don't follow the tank and pull easily skippable trash
- If we're 3 mins into an easy boss fight and the boss is still at 70% because the group's dps is below 20k
- If we zone in and someone says brb bio, either kick or leave if it fails
- If we zone in and someone says brb getting pledge
- If i take my time to explain mechanics and after 3+ wipes you're still ignoring them like a bot
As a person that tanks vDLC a lot for pugs, I sometimes leave myself, rarely, but I do. But.
1. Food buff is an acceptable demand. Usually I try to vote kick first if they refuse to eat. Many dlc dungeons have sometimes unavoidable relatively high damage, it means that the person with 10k hp is guaranteed to drop. I am very sorry but that's not something other people in a group should be putting up with.
2. Skipping trash is group choice, while imo u could skip some, accidents happen. I won't leave cause of it.
3. Ye this one is fair too. Dps checks exist, and wipes after wipes cause group doesn't have dmg are not fun. Dds should really stop queuing for things 2 of their caliber literally can't pass because of dps checks. I mean, not being elitist at all btw, because most dungeons can be done with tank+1dd, so expecting a dd to have half the damage of that 1 guy, while they have the support of a healer, is totally acceptable imo.
4. Dd queue is long, I am fine with it, but I ain't waiting, usually it is "let's kill trash then"
5. This one I am less fine than bio break, I mean, many times I am all like "is this a pledge?" And when they answer yes, that's it. We just continue. I agree that wasting people's time is not nice. I don't want to be stuck in loading screens while group is waiting... I won't leave because of 1 entitled ass though.
6. This one hit close to home. While i have much higher tolerance for those things, if they ignore mechanics every single time you mention them...at some point I say "k last try for me, if we wipe because someone ignores X mechanic I leave" funny story, after the tanks says that they usually start following mechanics.4 -
Varana✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭FrancisCrawford wrote: »
It's not about having a right or not having a right. I can see many of OP's points, I just think they go straight for the nuclear option.
With regard to pulling, tanks usually have a rotation (who knew, right?) to get their buffs up, stack enemies, debuff them, buff the group, leash/chain/taunt stragglers... When DDs run ahead and pull randomly, it can actually take longer to clear trash than if you waited 2 seconds for the tank. It's incredibly annoying to have your bars set up to provide maximum utility for the group and to have a player negate it by selfishly pulling. Not to mention there is a positive correlation between DDs who pull ahead of the tank and ones who don't follow mechanics, can't take the heat of the stuff they pull, and/or never res team mates and expect tanks or healers to.
But the implied context was not pulling ahead of the tank but instead of skipping - the tank wanted to skip while the others may not have wanted to do that.2 -
daemonios✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭FrancisCrawford wrote: »
It's not about having a right or not having a right. I can see many of OP's points, I just think they go straight for the nuclear option.
With regard to pulling, tanks usually have a rotation (who knew, right?) to get their buffs up, stack enemies, debuff them, buff the group, leash/chain/taunt stragglers... When DDs run ahead and pull randomly, it can actually take longer to clear trash than if you waited 2 seconds for the tank. It's incredibly annoying to have your bars set up to provide maximum utility for the group and to have a player negate it by selfishly pulling. Not to mention there is a positive correlation between DDs who pull ahead of the tank and ones who don't follow mechanics, can't take the heat of the stuff they pull, and/or never res team mates and expect tanks or healers to.
But the implied context was not pulling ahead of the tank but instead of skipping - the tank wanted to skip while the others may not have wanted to do that.
I see your point and I agree. Must've been the sore spot I have with people pulling ahead of me when I'm tanking
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Khenarthi✭✭✭✭✭
✭I have been tanking both normal and non-DLC vet dungeons for a while (on and off, admittedly). Sometimes there are newbies without buff food, but I never had anyone refuse food when I offered to share mine. Why would they? It's a free buff!
I only ever votekick if someone is outright rude or afk for several minutes without warning.
As for leaving, some groups just do not synergise together. If it is clear we will not be able to beat the end boss together, I will say so, explain how we may be able to improve together, give it one final try... and then leave if we really cannot get things to improve. Luckily this does not happen often (also because I am aware of my limitations and steer clear of DLC dungeons).PC-EU0 -
CMDR_Un1k0rn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Yes to the former, no to the latter.
This happens a lot.In-game username: Un1korn | Happy member of the PCNA UESP guild (Resident Daggerfall Covenant enjoyer) | Main & basically only character: Crucian Vulpin, Imperial Dragonknight of the Daggerfall Covenant, and Undaunted Bulwark (I tank) | Mountain bike enjoyer and vulpine appreciator | If you know me from PCEU: No | To ZOS: THANK YOU FOR LETTING ME BRING MY HORSE INTO BATTLE!0 -
thorwyn✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Oh, look, another "Look at me, I'm a tank" diva post.
Playing a tank is just a role in a group, buddy. It doesn't make you special or the center of the universe, or the group leader or whatever else you might think. There are crappy tanks out there as well as crappy healers and crappy DD's. Nobody likes wasting time, we got that. Just do your job and drop your ego.
And if the dam breaks open many years too soon
And if there is no room upon the hill
And if your head explodes with dark forebodings too
I'll see you on the dark side of the moon1 -
Everest_Lionheart✭✭✭✭✭
✭Because of such people, many new players are discouraged to do dungeons. I entered my first dungeon at around 300cp. Before, I read alot on this forum, about newbies who go into dungeons, and drag behind with low damage, and how high is toxicity of players there, so I never tried, as I feared I would be kicked in a second anyway. Then, when I leveled up, all I heard, was about high cp players not knowing mechanics perfectly, and same amount of elitism and haterd. So I was reluctant to try dungeons at all. Just by chance, went to Arx Corinthum to help guildmate, and it was vet. I healed just fine, since I had solid build and some small group healing experience from cyro. Since then, I did all of them, and I pug 98% of the time. I never kick people, but it would be really good, if all people did quests on normals, not on vets. And yes, if you have expectations, do not pug.
I was one of those people discouraged to do dungeons early on. Somewhere around 200CP with only 1 5pc set I queued for my first random normal dungeon. Fang Lair with an amazing tank who walked us through it smoothly. My next PUG experience was an obvious group doing a speed run of Scalecaller. It was hard to even keep up with those guys in all their speed gear. They seemed happy to carry me I guess because half the trash was already dead before I made it to the battle. I accepted the free drops. They didn’t communicate really except to trade gear afterwards. My 3rd and final PUG experience was Frostvault with a healer that didn’t heal and we somehow won in spite of ourselves when he abruptly quit with about 10% remaining on the final boss. All the boss fights were grinds because the rest of us had to run extra self heals.
I’m at CP325 now and still discouraged to PUG anything because of reading stuff like this or seeing some of the chat in game and seeing some crazy expectations that I know I probably won’t be able to hit. It a weird situation needing certain equipment from dungeons to hit the marks people set for that particular dungeon.3 -
WeerW3ir✭✭✭✭✭
✭And why i do it- If you have 10k hp with no food buff and you still don't use food after i tell you
- If you don't follow the tank and pull easily skippable trash
- If we're 3 mins into an easy boss fight and the boss is still at 70% because the group's dps is below 20k
- If we zone in and someone says brb bio, either kick or leave if it fails
- If we zone in and someone says brb getting pledge
- If i take my time to explain mechanics and after 3+ wipes you're still ignoring them like a bot
That's all that comes to mind right now. Anyways, what prompted this thread was all the hate tells i get from people for choosing to not put myself through a miserable experience. I'm not your mom, i'm not your babysitter, i don't have to put up with your nonsense. I'm just another average joe trying to play video games to relax and de-stress and i won't allow you to ruin it, especially when i can press a button to take myself out a negative situation and do something else.
I fully understand that by queuing randoms i subject myself to all of this, but the option to leave group is there for a reason and i will use it.
im okay with your points except 2. so because youre in group. the others cannot go to pee or cannot do irl because it will mess up your run? oh boy... you have no shame i see.0 -
FrancisCrawford✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭FrancisCrawford wrote: »
It's not about having a right or not having a right. I can see many of OP's points, I just think they go straight for the nuclear option.
With regard to pulling, tanks usually have a rotation (who knew, right?) to get their buffs up, stack enemies, debuff them, buff the group, leash/chain/taunt stragglers... When DDs run ahead and pull randomly, it can actually take longer to clear trash than if you waited 2 seconds for the tank. It's incredibly annoying to have your bars set up to provide maximum utility for the group and to have a player negate it by selfishly pulling. Not to mention there is a positive correlation between DDs who pull ahead of the tank and ones who don't follow mechanics, can't take the heat of the stuff they pull, and/or never res team mates and expect tanks or healers to.
True, but irrelevant to my point.
I was responding to his insistance on entirely skipping trash mobs.0 -
FrancisCrawford✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭You sound like a classic example of somebody who should queue for specific dungeons -- perhaps pledges -- rather than random ones.
I almost never queue for random dungeons, and even so some of my poorer experiences have been when queueing for random dungeons.Everest_Lionheart wrote: »Because of such people, many new players are discouraged to do dungeons. I entered my first dungeon at around 300cp. Before, I read alot on this forum, about newbies who go into dungeons, and drag behind with low damage, and how high is toxicity of players there, so I never tried, as I feared I would be kicked in a second anyway. Then, when I leveled up, all I heard, was about high cp players not knowing mechanics perfectly, and same amount of elitism and haterd. So I was reluctant to try dungeons at all. Just by chance, went to Arx Corinthum to help guildmate, and it was vet. I healed just fine, since I had solid build and some small group healing experience from cyro. Since then, I did all of them, and I pug 98% of the time. I never kick people, but it would be really good, if all people did quests on normals, not on vets. And yes, if you have expectations, do not pug.
I was one of those people discouraged to do dungeons early on. Somewhere around 200CP with only 1 5pc set I queued for my first random normal dungeon. Fang Lair with an amazing tank who walked us through it smoothly. My next PUG experience was an obvious group doing a speed run of Scalecaller. It was hard to even keep up with those guys in all their speed gear. They seemed happy to carry me I guess because half the trash was already dead before I made it to the battle. I accepted the free drops. They didn’t communicate really except to trade gear afterwards. My 3rd and final PUG experience was Frostvault with a healer that didn’t heal and we somehow won in spite of ourselves when he abruptly quit with about 10% remaining on the final boss. All the boss fights were grinds because the rest of us had to run extra self heals.
I’m at CP325 now and still discouraged to PUG anything because of reading stuff like this or seeing some of the chat in game and seeing some crazy expectations that I know I probably won’t be able to hit. It a weird situation needing certain equipment from dungeons to hit the marks people set for that particular dungeon.
0 -
Thannazzar✭✭✭✭✭
✭In addition:
You don't know dlc tactics, don't respond to a request asking if you know tactics until the second wipe, or don't follow tactics even when they are explained to you, even though you have the chat skills to say 'looking for x set'.4 -
Sarannah✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭A long time ago, I got kicked for not using food. Which was stupid, as the character had absolutely no use for any of the foods. With hp food he would still be one-shot in major attacks, and resource-food wasn't needed as his sustain was ultra high. This was actually my only character on which food wouldn't make a difference. I do agree though, that with any character on which food is usefull, it should be mandatory. especially in veteran dungeons.
"Skippable trash"... as a tank myself, I hate it when others pull. But, skipping mobs takes longer than actually killing them 9 out of 10 times. As someone usually pulls them anyways, in which case they scatter around, making it take even longer. The route around mobs also takes more time than killing them. So unless you are in a terrible DPS group, I recommend killing them. When someone dc's or is kicked, the new person has to know what you skipped. Which could take them ages to get to you, as they keep dying. So as a tank, I don't skip anything. Which makes for very fluid runs.
Accidently pulling something should never be a reason to kick someone, in my opinion.
Bio breaks happen, especially for DPS with 40-60 min queue's. Can't fault them for it. Shouldn't be a reason to kick. Some people have medical conditions too.
What I never see, and never do myself, is ask for mechanics or say it was/is my first time in a dungeon.... because there are often people who will kick firsttimers instead of giving them a try. What I do as a tank is simply state the one or two need-to-know mechanics(if there are any), before attacking the boss. *Note: I have actually had DPS rush in to attack the boss, while I was still typing mechanics.*
PS: There are ofcourse bosses for which I myself keep forgetting the mechanics, no matter how often I did them. *Sorry!*
PPS: Don't let anything discourage you try queue for dungeons, especially normals!Edited by Sarannah on May 24, 2020 5:18PM2