Rant About The News Regarding Vampire

arena25

*Note: The following thread may be hard-to-read and very confusing. It may also upset some folks. It is therefore advised that people who read at a third grade level Go Try French Opera instead. Also, noobie discretion is advised.*

So I just got done reading the article previewing the changes coming to Vampire skill line...and I will have to say, I am a bit concerned and perhaps a bit angry.

Now, before we begin to dive in, I will say that I have not had the chance to test out the actual changes on the PTS...I am going purely based off the article, so it is likely that once Greymoor releases my opinions may change. I would also like to point out that my main toon is a Vampire (and a Stage 4 one at that), so some of these changes are going to affect me personally.

Ok, now let's do this.

First, based off the article, the ultimate ability, and many active abilities are going to be added, replaced, and/or updated. This could cause a problem, because if you are a vampire (and my main is a vampire), it will mean that you will have to spend another 100,000 gold or however many crowns it is on a respec. And then there is the obvious question...why vampires and not werewolves as well?

Second, you put in some Justice system reactions when you reach Vampirism Stage 4...why not Werewolves either? If Tamriel hates the undead, then why isn't werewolves not getting the same Justice System treatment?

As an additional note to my second point above, with how Stage 4 Vampirism works in the new update, you can expect that many vampires who could just about get by on Stage 4 will have no choice but to, hours before the servers are taken offline for patch maintenance, will have to find a town with lots of enemy NPCs and feed on them to drastically reduce their stage...they won't be able to log out in a town because they'll be accosted/killed by guards as soon as they log in after servers come back up (if Zeni somehow pulls off this remote deployment of the update, but that's banter for the various maintenance threads that will pop up next week, not this thread).

And finally, with this change, I do not see many people who will want to be a vampire. It is little wonder why the Vampire Curse was on sale in the Crown Store...so people would buy it all right up and then you'll announce some major overhauls, forcing people to pay full price to cure it or be forced to live with it, because they can't pay the 100,000 gold fee required to cure it by a Priest of Arkay.

Actually, one more note...the way feeding works in the new update, it seems we'll have to choose between vampire and blade of woe when sneaking up. Or the game will decide for you, which could mean a person you need to kill via Blade of Woe is instead going to be fed off of instead.

I just don't see why Zeni felt the need to change everything regarding Vampires. Sure, Vampire skills were quite weak compared to other skill lines, but they weren't useless.

Rant done. I will see you all next week after I am sent on yet another forum vacation. Arena25 out!

TX12001rwb17_ESO

First of all the Respec is around 12k and Werewolves are also being effected by the Justice System.

Vampires will not get attacked at stage 4, they only get attacked for using 1 of 3 different abilities which reveal their Vampirism, at stage 4 NPCs will just refuse to speak to them which in the case of merchants can be overcome by using Mezmorize on them.

esotoon

arena25 wrote: »

First, based off the article, the ultimate ability, and many active abilities are going to be added, replaced, and/or updated. This could cause a problem, because if you are a vampire (and my main is a vampire), it will mean that you will have to spend another 100,000 gold or however many crowns it is on a respec. And then there is the obvious question...why vampires and not werewolves as well?

Chances are ZOS will make respeccing cheap for a week, like they usually do when there’s a number of skill changes, or remove all skill points from your vamp skill line, as they did on the PTS.

]As an additional note to my second point above, with how Stage 4 Vampirism works in the new update, you can expect that many vampires who could just about get by on Stage 4 will have no choice but to, hours before the servers are taken offline for patch maintenance, will have to find a town with lots of enemy NPCs and feed on them to drastically reduce their stage...they won't be able to log out in a town because they'll be accosted/killed by guards as soon as they log in after servers come back up (if Zeni somehow pulls off this remote deployment of the update, but that's banter for the various maintenance threads that will pop up next week, not this thread).

On the PTS you were reset to stage 1 upon login. I would hope they will do the same for Greymoor.

MartiniDaniels

Oh no, all those miriads of people, who were vampires "for RP reasons, not because of passives which had big downsides", will decided to cure in mass? how this might happen?

tomofhyrule

arena25 wrote: »

*Note: The following thread may be hard-to-read and very confusing. It may also upset some folks. It is therefore advised that people who read at a third grade level Go Try French Opera instead. Also, noobie discretion is advised.*

So I just got done reading the article previewing the changes coming to Vampire skill line...and I will have to say, I am a bit concerned and perhaps a bit angry.

Now, before we begin to dive in, I will say that I have not had the chance to test out the actual changes on the PTS...I am going purely based off the article, so it is likely that once Greymoor releases my opinions may change. I would also like to point out that my main toon is a Vampire (and a Stage 4 one at that), so some of these changes are going to affect me personally.

Ok, now let's do this.

First, based off the article, the ultimate ability, and many active abilities are going to be added, replaced, and/or updated. This could cause a problem, because if you are a vampire (and my main is a vampire), it will mean that you will have to spend another 100,000 gold or however many crowns it is on a respec. And then there is the obvious question...why vampires and not werewolves as well?

It's not that much to respec. It's 50 gold per point you have.

The vampires are actually getting this revamp since the werewolves did get a decent overhaul back in the Wolfhunter patch. And they're still getting a few tunes as well.

Second, you put in some Justice system reactions when you reach Vampirism Stage 4...why not Werewolves either? If Tamriel hates the undead, then why isn't werewolves not getting the same Justice System treatment?

They are. Transforming in town is about to be illegal.

As an additional note to my second point above, with how Stage 4 Vampirism works in the new update, you can expect that many vampires who could just about get by on Stage 4 will have no choice but to, hours before the servers are taken offline for patch maintenance, will have to find a town with lots of enemy NPCs and feed on them to drastically reduce their stage...they won't be able to log out in a town because they'll be accosted/killed by guards as soon as they log in after servers come back up (if Zeni somehow pulls off this remote deployment of the update, but that's banter for the various maintenance threads that will pop up next week, not this thread).

They've already said that everyone will be reset to stage 1 on rollout, and the only way to go up is to feed or drink the disastrously bloody mara (which is getting a rename).

And finally, with this change, I do not see many people who will want to be a vampire. It is little wonder why the Vampire Curse was on sale in the Crown Store...so people would buy it all right up and then you'll announce some major overhauls, forcing people to pay full price to cure it or be forced to live with it, because they can't pay the 100,000 gold fee required to cure it by a Priest of Arkay.

This will drastically reduce the number of vampires, no doubt. Part of the point is that right now, you're not able to be an endgame player (especially for PvP) without the vampire passives. It's at the point now where vampirism is all pros, and the only potential con is that it washes out your tattoos (okay, the fire weakness, but that's significantly outweighed by the recovery).

The new update is designed to make it less mandatory for endgame. True, you can have your debates over whether they've gone too far with the passives like the cost increase, but they're still being tuned a bit as well - the latest PTS patch dropped the cost increase down for each stage.

And of course, RPers will still have reasons to take it.

And in terms of the cure, again it's nowhere near that much (I think it's on the order of 1000), and you get the skill points refunded now.

Actually, one more note...the way feeding works in the new update, it seems we'll have to choose between vampire and blade of woe when sneaking up. Or the game will decide for you, which could mean a person you need to kill via Blade of Woe is instead going to be fed off of instead.

This is always a problem, just nobody ever fed until now since there was no point to reducing your vampire skill below 4. It works based on distance currently. If you have vampirism and Balde of Woe, you just keep sneaking behind them until you see the popup, and then you make sure it says what you want it to say before you hit X.

I don't know if they'll change it up since the current animation for 'feed' is a ranged thing and that's going to go to a new animation where you actually bite them, but you will still have a different action at different ranges. You'll just have to look at the popup before you activate.

I just don't see why Zeni felt the need to change everything regarding Vampires. Sure, Vampire skills were quite weak compared to other skill lines, but they weren't useless.

Becuase the skills were weak, but the passives were absolutely not. They wanted vampirism to be something that would be a choice, not something you needed to do endgame PvP/PvE. Again, you can argue whether they've gone too far, but they've tried to set it up that a vampire will be encouraged to actually use the vampire skills now.

Also remember vamp currently has only three skills, one of which is an ultimate. They're remaking it to have five slottable skills, and are giving a cost decrease to those as you rank up your vampirism level.

Isarii

OP you should probably look into the changes that are coming more thoroughly before making anger posts.

theyancey

My main is a vamp too. Once again my game enjoyment is being sacrificed on the altar of PvP balancing. Over the years I have come to despise PvP, PvPers, and the devs who cater to them. The one and only solution is to completely divorce PvP from PvE. Give all players a one time choice as to what realm each toon should be assigned to. Then ZOS can destroy PvP classes and races to their heart's content without harming mine.

SosRuvaak

Isarii wrote: »

OP you should probably look into the changes that are coming more thoroughly before making anger posts.

he wrote soo much cant you just play along with the narrative for his sake?

Vevvev

Isarii wrote: »

OP you should probably look into the changes that are coming more thoroughly before making anger posts.

This ^

There are so many things that are just wrong with it, especially regarding the werewolves not getting the justice treatment. They are!

Alpheu5

Indoril_Nerevar wrote: »

😂

I've never seen an italicized emoji and it's quite unsettling for some reason.

nk125x

theyancey wrote: »

My main is a vamp too. Once again my game enjoyment is being sacrificed on the altar of PvP balancing. Over the years I have come to despise PvP, PvPers, and the devs who cater to them. The one and only solution is to completely divorce PvP from PvE. Give all players a one time choice as to what realm each toon should be assigned to. Then ZOS can destroy PvP classes and races to their heart's content without harming mine.

I mainly pvp and I can assure you the new Vamp is a pile of horse manure.

starkerealm

esotoon wrote: »

On the PTS you were reset to stage 1 upon login. I would hope they will do the same for Greymoor.

This is, almost certainly, going to happen. There was a "racial skill points refunded" note on login, which indicated a forced respec of the vampire skill line when you logged in. As you pointed out, it also knocked you down to Stage 1, and I don't think this was accidental.

Players logging in after the patch will, almost certainly, find their spent vampire skill points refunded, and their stage set to 1.

Failing that, I would recommend players who intend to keep vampires, stock up on Double Bloody Maras. Last I checked, those still force your stage down by one, making them more useful than they used to be.

Lintashi

My main problem with new justice system, that it can easily butcher logic, and kill immersion. Imagine, stage 4 vamp, enters the city, while wearing full heavy armor with helmet. And NPC's all around, somehow, just know that this player is a vampire. Same with skins. Many of my characters wear skins, and it is extremely weird, that NPC's react as if they suddenly able to see past them. However, since we get increased skill cost, it is not viable for tanks, healers, archers, and everyone who wants to do vet content, to be vampire anyway, especially on stage 4, so I doubt, that many people will go stage 4 at any time.

starkerealm

Lintashi wrote: »

My main problem with new justice system, that it can easily butcher logic, and kill immersion. Imagine, stage 4 vamp, enters the city, while wearing full heavy armor with helmet. And NPC's all around, somehow, just know that this player is a vampire. Same with skins. Many of my characters wear skins, and it is extremely weird, that NPC's react as if they suddenly able to see past them. However, since we get increased skill cost, it is not viable for tanks, healers, archers, and everyone who wants to do vet content, to be vampire anyway, especially on stage 4, so I doubt, that many people will go stage 4 at any time.

Yeah, that's been an issue since TES3. Maybe TES2 as well, but I don't think I was ever a vampire in Daggerfall.

It'd be nice if the game recognized when you were hiding your face entirely, but still.

Myyth

It costs less than 1000g to be cured in the mage guild. I don't know where you are saying it costs 100,000G to cure. Are they going to increase the cost with the expac?

Pyr0xyrecuprotite

Also note that all current Vampires will have their skill points in the skill line refunded on launch; you will need to reapply skill points into the skill line (and level up the new skills). This addresses the OP's concern about the new ultimate.

Note that the new vampire effects increasing your non-vamp skills and decreasing your vampire skill costs have been significantly adjusted in the most recent PTS patch - more changes are possible before launch.

Paradisius

I dont quite understand where you got this information. Firstly, once the update hits live vampires (and I believe WWs too) get all of their skill points refunded for free and set to stage 1 vampirism. Secondly, Stage 4 doesnt automatically give you a bounty. The only innate "Justice" interactions with stage 4 is bankers and merchants wont talk to you (But you can cast mesmerize on them to use them, though on the PTS thats kinda wacky rn). The first two points mentioned takes care of the stage 4 in a city on live problem. And finally, yes Vampirism will not be appealing to everyone, that is the point. They intend to make it an optional class line for those who either think they can make use of the skills, or like the fantasy of being a Vampire.

Gabrielzavadski

theyancey wrote: »

My main is a vamp too. Once again my game enjoyment is being sacrificed on the altar of PvP balancing. Over the years I have come to despise PvP, PvPers, and the devs who cater to them. The one and only solution is to completely divorce PvP from PvE. Give all players a one time choice as to what realm each toon should be assigned to. Then ZOS can destroy PvP classes and races to their heart's content without harming mine.

Bruh, go play Skyrim... Also, the vampire remake is trash, and many players will cure their "condition". They should had just added the Justice System, plus the new animations... the skills will be really useless, and the stages's passives are unreliable in most of the game content (unless they nerfed it recently)...

The best solution was to add the remake as a new vampiric bloodline/disease, acquired only with the Greymoor questline; and leaving the other bloodline/disease alone, maybe with a few tweaks.

But its easier to make players angry and *** with everyone's build... Also, why from the nowhere I'm a vampire lord, for no reason. ZoS tossing Lore in the trashbin

Sephyr

Vampirism isn't changing from it's current iteration from PTS as per said by Gina on the Livestream. We're stuck with it, folks.

imnottrolling

I'm confused. Is this a troll post?

akdave0

theyancey wrote: »

My main is a vamp too. Once again my game enjoyment is being sacrificed on the altar of PvP balancing. Over the years I have come to despise PvP, PvPers, and the devs who cater to them. The one and only solution is to completely divorce PvP from PvE. Give all players a one time choice as to what realm each toon should be assigned to. Then ZOS can destroy PvP classes and races to their heart's content without harming mine.

What I cant wrap my head around is this:
Battle Spirit
PVE should not be affected by any means, in fact, all things like damage shields, Bastion, VMA weapons, anything that has ever been nerfed to "balance" pvp should be reverted back to their original state.

redgreensunset

I find it ironic that they've messed up vamps so hard when the whole year is supposed to be about them.

ZOS_RogerJ

We understand that everyone has their own opinions they want to express, but we also want the forums to be a constructive platform for ESO and its community. As such, we have closed this thread given its non-constructive nature.