The New Sets Would Be Good...

Skjaldbjorn

If we weren't changing the entire dynamic of the game. Let's take a look at the stamina set as an example;

(5) Dealing Critical Damage grants you a stack of Giant's Endurance, up to once per second. Each stack of Giant's Endurance adds X stamina recovery, and stacks up to X times. Dealing damage with a fully-charged Heavy Attack removes Giant's Endurance and grants Giant's Might for X seconds, increasing your Weapon Damage by X per stack removed. You cannot have Giant's Endurance and Might active at the same time.

So this set is actually interesting, but not if the proposed changes go through, where heavy attacks as a regular theme are encouraged. Where this set is actually dynamic and interesting is the current climate. Tracking your stacks and timing them appropriately, using a heavy (DPS loss) to boost yourself through a DPS gain for burn phases is actually really interesting and engaging, especially as you can't rebuild stacks while the effect is active, thus making it infinitely more important to hold those stacks for a few seconds if there's an important DPS burn phase approaching.

In that context, this set is actually really interesting, especially if the new Major Slayer set kills Lokke. That becomes a super engaging dynamic where you have to make a decision as to whether or not it's the right time to drop that heavy attack, burn your regen stacks and get the buff.

Instead, we're getting another "square peg, round hole" set that tries to shoehorn a meta that (based on the feedback I have seen) the bulk of the community is against, and doesn't encourage new playstyles or bridge any of the gaps Zenimax keeps talking about. The gap isn't LA damage, it's sustain. Has been for ages, but no one seems to get that.

LiquidPony

I've said it a hundred times already, but seeing so much *regen* focus on various new PvE sets, along with the new *regen* focused Light Attacks ... it scares me.

I have a feeling Greymoor is going to do what Morrowind did and gut our natural sustain somehow, so that we have to build it out via LAs and sets.

Skjaldbjorn

LiquidPony wrote: »

I've said it a hundred times already, but seeing so much *regen* focus on various new PvE sets, along with the new *regen* focused Light Attacks ... it scares me.

I have a feeling Greymoor is going to do what Morrowind did and gut our natural sustain somehow, so that we have to build it out via LAs and sets.

That's such a bad direction. That's terrifying. The polar opposite needs to happen. Buff up our in-kit sustain, remove it from attacks entirely and keep some sustain on sets for preferential building.

Cinbri

LiquidPony wrote: »

I've said it a hundred times already, but seeing so much *regen* focus on various new PvE sets, along with the new *regen* focused Light Attacks ... it scares me.

I have a feeling Greymoor is going to do what Morrowind did and gut our natural sustain somehow, so that we have to build it out via LAs and sets.

Morrowind didnt gut sustain, it removed rudiculously brainless oversustaining. When you could run heavy armor with 3 offensive/damage sets + triple spd/wpd enchantments and dont drop below 50% of resource even without heavy attacks, it was sign that there is something wrong.
Neither do I see those sutain nerfs in next update. In current iteration of how light attacks works - it giant buff to sustain, especially with new overpowered off-balance.

LiquidPony

Cinbri wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

I've said it a hundred times already, but seeing so much *regen* focus on various new PvE sets, along with the new *regen* focused Light Attacks ... it scares me.

I have a feeling Greymoor is going to do what Morrowind did and gut our natural sustain somehow, so that we have to build it out via LAs and sets.

Morrowind didnt gut sustain, it removed rudiculously brainless oversustaining. When you could run heavy armor with 3 offensive/damage sets + triple spd/wpd enchantments and dont drop below 50% of resource even without heavy attacks, it was sign that there is something wrong.
Neither do I see those sutain nerfs in next update. In current iteration of how light attacks works - it giant buff to sustain, especially with new overpowered off-balance.

Morrowind didn't gut sustain ... it just ... removed a bunch of sustain ...?

That makes a lot of sense.

I must've just been imagining the whole heavy attack meta that came with that patch because no one could sustain LA rotations anymore, then.

I am speculating that all of the new regen sources (Yandir's Might, the new stamina DPS Trial set, has a 4-piece stam regen bonus and a 5-piece with a regen proc; Kyne's Wind, the new healer Trial set, has a sustain-oriented 5-piece; and of course the massive sustain boost of Light Attacks; etc.) indicate that sustain is going to be nerfed elsewhere. Otherwise all of that new sustain is utterly useless.

MashmalloMan

Cinbri wrote: »

LiquidPony wrote: »

I've said it a hundred times already, but seeing so much *regen* focus on various new PvE sets, along with the new *regen* focused Light Attacks ... it scares me.

I have a feeling Greymoor is going to do what Morrowind did and gut our natural sustain somehow, so that we have to build it out via LAs and sets.

Morrowind didnt gut sustain, it removed rudiculously brainless oversustaining. When you could run heavy armor with 3 offensive/damage sets + triple spd/wpd enchantments and dont drop below 50% of resource even without heavy attacks, it was sign that there is something wrong.
Neither do I see those sutain nerfs in next update. In current iteration of how light attacks works - it giant buff to sustain, especially with new overpowered off-balance.

You forget about ZOS's decissions so easily. Often times they buff, but it almost always follows a nerf.

Create a unique skill for stam sorc u24, remove light attack passive u26 because the active ability is "strong".

U24 give stam dks a spammable thats instant cast, but oddly the only 15m range spammable in the game on a melee oriented class with a passive that specifically increases melee ranged abilities to 7m from 5m, U25 make it 28m range, however, make 1/4 of the skill a cast time melee aoe ability.

Buff Dizzy animation time and dmg, nerf the dmg, remove the stun, buff the dmg, nerf the dmg, add back the stun on a second hit, add a snare after off balance is gutted.

U23 buff dots that no one ever touches in the game increasing build viability, however they're buffed to far at 2.5x the dmg of a spammable, u24 nerf all dots to 1.5x dmg of a spammable so most of them are barely worth slotting over direct dmg abilities, instead, it's wiser to slot fighters guild/mages guild to increase overall dmg output.

WHY?!?! Just why. Who comes up with this. They don't seem to listen to the feedback at all. Often times it takes them 3 patches to get to the result we suggested a day after patch notes released on PTS.

Conduit0

Actually the new sets fit in with the light/heavy attack changes. Currently the changes still favor a light attack weave since heavy attacks were not buffed enough to compensate for a slower heavy attack rotation. However it will be worthwhile to medium/heavy attack during off balance and I'd be willing to bet that the cooldown/stack rate on these new sets will lineup perfectly with off balance up times.

Skjaldbjorn

MashmalloMan wrote: »

U24 give stam dks a spammable thats instant cast, but oddly the only 15m range spammable in the game on a melee oriented class with a passive that specifically increases melee ranged abilities to 7m from 5m, U25 make it 28m range, however, make 1/4 of the skill a cast time melee aoe ability.

:criesinwarden

Kolzki

MashmalloMan wrote: »

Create a unique skill for stam sorc u24, remove light attack passive u26 because the active ability is "strong".

That change is so arbitraty in the context of the other pts changes. Everyone gets a light attack damage nerf of 78% except for stam sorcs that get an 80% light attack nerf? Why? The effect on dps is so tiny while taking away a small part of stam sorc's identity.

Were stam sorcs over performing? No. Are they overloaded with class passive buffs? Not last time I checked. Does buffing their weapon attack damage with daedric energy not fit with their class identity? I thought that was their class identity.

MashmalloMan

Kolzki wrote: »

MashmalloMan wrote: »

Create a unique skill for stam sorc u24, remove light attack passive u26 because the active ability is "strong".

That change is so arbitraty in the context of the other pts changes. Everyone gets a light attack damage nerf of 78% except for stam sorcs that get an 80% light attack nerf? Why? The effect on dps is so tiny while taking away a small part of stam sorc's identity.

Were stam sorcs over performing? No. Are they overloaded with class passive buffs? Not last time I checked. Does buffing their weapon attack damage with daedric energy not fit with their class identity? I thought that was their class identity.

Thats why it hurts so much... the difference of dps with these changes is probably abysmal... probably like 50 damage on a light attack lost? They took away something that was small, but unique to stam sorcs, I don't understand how they manage to take away class identity over time while telling us they're committed to making it more meaningful. They have shown they don't understand what that means.

Here's a thought.. Why remove the passive entirely, why not buff it, lower the stamina, but increase the light attack dmg to compensate for the heavy handed nerfs telling stam sorcs that a part of your class idenity is weaving light attacks.... YOU KNOW... For bound armaments that requires weaving to cast...

SMH

I'm still thinking back to how unique overload 3rd bar and implossion felt to use. Implossion had a proc chance on damage, so utilizing many ticks of damage like flurry and dots made sense to increase implossion procs. What does amplitude do, nothing for builds. If anything you just want to front load all your damage with a dizzy swing. We asked for more, they've given less.