encountered a pvp fight where after 15ish min of nobody dying both groups walked away

idk

Kaysha wrote: »

Just let all buffs and debuffs be affected by battle spirit.

30% major protection --> 15% major protection
25% major mending --> 13% major mending
and so on

No more medium armor dodge rollers with 30% major protection and 30% speed.

You want to do damage? good, but you will die fast, too.
You want to be able to take some hits? Ok, but you won´t do a lot of damage.
Make armor weights count again!

First off, major mending is already cut in half since the heals they buff are cut in half by battle spirit.

Second, there is already a counter to many buffs. Major mending has major defile to counter it. Your idea would nerf major defile and in effect be a pointless change when skilled players with good builds are involved.

All that on top of having other damage buffs and regen buffs cut in half. The idea sounds great on paper until one actually takes a deeper look. I have provided some of the numbers below to point out how much is left out of the post I quoted.

Major Berserk 25% --> 12% (Zos is likely to round down based on other aspects of the game.)
Minor Berserk 8% --> 4%
Major Defile 30% --> 12%
Minor Defile 15% --> 7%

Major Brutality/Sorcery 20% --> 10%,
Minor Brutality/Sorcery 10% --> 5%
Major Intelect/Endurance 20% --> 10%
Minor Intelect/Endurance 10% --> 5%

And so on . . .

It is great making such a suggestion and leave out the buffs that increase our damage.

Fawn4287

So what is the fix? It sounds like everyone wants to nerf self healing, putting the final nail in the coffin for solo play. What about address the real issue that seems to get worse every update and that is the ease and raw number of healers running around and the huge power of off healing. 2 years ago it was rare to see a healer outside of a large ballgroup or giant pug zerg, now it seems you run in to a group of 4 and one is a healer. Throw in a templar circle, a necro tether and some sort of burst heal and then people complain about no one dying lol, of course they aren’t they have halfway to a trials team worth of healing. Butcher PvP off healing, dedicated healers will still pump out huge healing regardless, tank healers will become nothing more than tanks and stacking a few hots will not make a group close to invincible. You can nerf tankyness but at the end of the day block, dodge roll and mist form can make someone with no tankyness incredibly hard to kill.

Rikumaru

If you make self healing separated into it's own stat, you kill solo play. The only people from that point onwards who will play solo will be the gankers and you won't be able to deal with them unless your a healer as you will be unable to self heal. What a fun game that sounds like.

Overall damage needs to increase if you want people to actually die. ZOS went the wrong way of doing things by buffing DoTs in scalebreaker as only a few classes have viable means to counteract them. A good starting place for fixing overall damage output is by buffing spammables back up. Another is to nerf armor pots so they give major resolve / ward.

Infectious1X

1v1s always end in stalemates with decent players and it can take upwards to 3+ people just to have enough dps to kill 1 person. How in the actual heck is solo play NOT too powerful!?

Ironically, by wanting to buff or keep solo play stronger (whatever that even means), you actually encourage players to group just to have the dps to kill a “solo player.”

Buffing damage isn’t the solution as that would only solve 1v1 stalemates, but would hardly affect group play since not only does each individual in a group have access to their very own powerful heals, but also have the addition of their teammate’s heals as well. Hps in duels is slightly larger in 1v1s, but significantly larger in group fights due to this, even when there are no dedicated healers.

Infectious1X

Rikumaru wrote: »

If you make self healing separated into it's own stat, you kill solo play. The only people from that point onwards who will play solo will be the gankers and you won't be able to deal with them unless your a healer as you will be unable to self heal. What a fun game that sounds like.

The ability to self-heal wouldn’t change. You act as if separating the stats would completely remove that ability, when it only just makes it less effective. Ganking usually refers to NBs from disguise or from others getting the jump on you. This does not instantly = death, but just puts you at a small disadvantage and it is nearly nonexistant (in effectiveness) because of how ineffective attacks are if they don’t effectively one-shot you due to the ability to recover nearly instantly. It should be a valid playstyle that currently isn’t because I guess people hate dying in PvP?

If you’d be so concerned with **** self healing, then build for more self healing. You shouldn’t passively gain that just by focusing purely on damage.

Infectious1X

dazee wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

dazee wrote: »

Healing should keep scaling on weapon/spell damage for the simple reason that changing it would destroy the playstyle of anyone who's not a meta chasing sheep.

Yep. Solo play would be finished if they separated healing effectiveness too much from damage.

That and it would support the idiotic idea that healers should not be doing damage.

If someone wants to be a pacifist healer who wont dps at all, its not my problem, as long as they keep us alive.

But if someone insists "Healers should never dps" then they can seriously throw themselves off a cliff because they want to ruin someone elses (more logical) playstyle.

You act as if this means healer dps would effectively = 0, which is not the case. Go look at a game like Classic WoW for comparison. Holy priests do **** for damage in comparison to a rogue or warrior, yet they can still kill if they need to.

Ironically enough, by having the mindset that everyone should be able to dps and heal, you effectively remove any specific roles (rolling as a “healer” in this case) and everyone ends up playing the same with some slight advantages in specific areas.

It also (logically) doesn’t make sense that healers should be able to keep entire teams alive while simultaneously killing as well as those who focus purely on killing. Should everyone not role as a “healer” in this case since they can effectively do everything at once? All I see is you wanting to be able to do more jobs at a single time than you should physically be able to because I guess you’re a solo player that focuses on a role designed for group play (wut)?

Paidkilla

I remember when there was softcaps, and people died. Cyro never actually lagged. Then came CP. Well there's your main ingredient for all the problems.

amir412

WacArnold wrote: »

Toc de Malsvi wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

Noctus wrote: »

self heal on heavy armor is problematic. whats also problematic is we dont have enough heal reducing skills and not enough reduction on skills.

seriously u dont even feel 30 % reduction of mayor defile becouse u have other buffs up working against it.

I would prefer healing be separated into its own stat block rather then linked to damage.

not even major defile access is the problem anymore, as more and more classes have access to cleanse.

when you think that ONLY templar had access to cleanse at launch, 1/4 classes, and every new class has had it included in their kit, now half of all classes can self cleanse.

same issue with things like snare removal or even worse things like race against time.

you just cannot debuff and lock people down anymore, thus a burst meta, and then a tank meta to counter the bust, and now nobody dies.

We have always been moving toward nobody dying. Every time someone died they complained until something got nerfed.

This is the problem when I first started playing this game people died, people complained, and nerfs. What needs to happen is now that this game has been out for a while and players understand how to play things need to go back to launch. Devs should nut up and stop listening to the forums about combat all that has resulted are changes that make every patch garbage.

90% still use light attack spam without any heals, this community will never learn how to play.
All they want is to be a braindead zergers.

Kidgangster101

Paidkilla wrote: »

I remember when there was softcaps, and people died. Cyro never actually lagged. Then came CP. Well there's your main ingredient for all the problems.

Yep that is a problem. And people crying over every little thing and always wanting everything "my healing my damage both need to be higher" lol people are pathetic.

Infectious1X wrote: »

dazee wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

dazee wrote: »

Healing should keep scaling on weapon/spell damage for the simple reason that changing it would destroy the playstyle of anyone who's not a meta chasing sheep.

Yep. Solo play would be finished if they separated healing effectiveness too much from damage.

That and it would support the idiotic idea that healers should not be doing damage.

If someone wants to be a pacifist healer who wont dps at all, its not my problem, as long as they keep us alive.

But if someone insists "Healers should never dps" then they can seriously throw themselves off a cliff because they want to ruin someone elses (more logical) playstyle.

You act as if this means healer dps would effectively = 0, which is not the case. Go look at a game like Classic WoW for comparison. Holy priests do **** for damage in comparison to a rogue or warrior, yet they can still kill if they need to.

Ironically enough, by having the mindset that everyone should be able to dps and heal, you effectively remove any specific roles (rolling as a “healer” in this case) and everyone ends up playing the same with some slight advantages in specific areas.

It also (logically) doesn’t make sense that healers should be able to keep entire teams alive while simultaneously killing as well as those who focus purely on killing. Should everyone not role as a “healer” in this case since they can effectively do everything at once? All I see is you wanting to be able to do more jobs at a single time than you should physically be able to because I guess you’re a solo player that focuses on a role designed for group play (wut)?

Exactly this. Seperating the damage and healing is probably the easiest solution. No one should build for Max damage and out heal a pure healer. Most games I have played have a "healing" stat along with a "damage" stat.

The whole "solo" at style is ultimately ruining this game. You want a solo game go play solo games...... You are in a MMO after all. The game should never be balanced around a 1v1 because THE ONLY 1v1 we actually have is a duel....... Everything else is GROUP play.

Destyran

amir412 wrote: »

Noctus wrote: »

self heal on heavy armor is problematic. whats also problematic is we dont have enough heal reducing skills and not enough reduction on skills.

seriously u dont even feel 30 % reduction of mayor defile becouse u have other buffs up working against it.

what if i told u that i have more healings on medium armor?

It’s probably weapon damage the stamplar ritual heals for heaps on a crazy weapon damage build

Abyssmol

Destyran wrote: »

amir412 wrote: »

Noctus wrote: »

self heal on heavy armor is problematic. whats also problematic is we dont have enough heal reducing skills and not enough reduction on skills.

seriously u dont even feel 30 % reduction of mayor defile becouse u have other buffs up working against it.

what if i told u that i have more healings on medium armor?

It’s probably weapon damage the stamplar ritual heals for heaps on a crazy weapon damage build

They should have never changed ritual to scale with weapon damage. What do think happens when stamina builds with 5 to 6k weapon damage use this ability. Ritual was meant for magicka, which would never reach a 5 to 6k spell damage.

Cathexis

Battlespirit was a band-aid fix that most players think didn't fix anything, I don't feel like what we need is more cowbell here.

There is no fever for more cowbell.

Iskiab

Separating healing and damage stats is too old school I think. Right now there’s no trinity in pvp, I’m good with that. Forced grouping thinking is sorta outdated.

Neoauspex

Make Soldier of Anguish way better against groups and not particularly useful in a 1v1: multiply the effect for every target it hits, etc.

jadarock

Paidkilla wrote: »

I remember when there was softcaps, and people died. Cyro never actually lagged. Then came CP. Well there's your main ingredient for all the problems.

You've been around that long yet dont remember when they straight up disabled cp in the campaigns? The lag was NO better. None.

Funny it's gotten steadily worse since morrowind
and the common theme is new classes skills and gearsets

Kidgangster101

jadarock wrote: »

Paidkilla wrote: »

I remember when there was softcaps, and people died. Cyro never actually lagged. Then came CP. Well there's your main ingredient for all the problems.

You've been around that long yet dont remember when they straight up disabled cp in the campaigns? The lag was NO better. None.

Funny it's gotten steadily worse since morrowind
and the common theme is new classes skills and gearsets

Nah a lot of it is cp. Too much calculations for the server to handle tbh. In a 50 v 50 fight it has to calculate 100 people's cp every .5-1 second possibly more when you add moves that give midigation or bonus damage. That is causing so much stress it's crazy no way it's not on their coding.

A lot of it is so few campaigns and allowing 3 bars in them. If you go to a campaign with 1 bar in it, it's nearly not as bad.

The answer is to make more campaigns and lower it from 3 bars to 1 bar. Spread people out by forcing it.

Q_Q

I walk away a lot if I am 1v1 or 1vxing and skills don’t go off. They get the hint when I hop away and they can’t damage me. (Most of the time, xv1 is real out there)