Ice/Frost spells. -_-

ESO_Nightingale

Flubbles wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

Will we ever see a proper Ice magic in this game? The lack of Ice magic available to players and the fact that majority of NPCS have better looking Ice magic than Players really irks me to wrong way every time. I get what Warden has "Ice Magic" but IMO it just feels so out of place and just doesn't look that great for me to roll a Warden.

You guys could have put frost magic in Necromancer skill at least there it makes more sense than Warden with the death theme they got going on.

Frost/Ice Skills you could have incorporated into necromancers:

Ice Wraith: Instead of that horrible Flame Skull that looks like you just copied Ghost Riders skull.
Frostbite
Wall of Frost
Frost Rune
Icy Spear
Ice Storm
Frost Thrall
Blizzard

Come on guys...
I get these are mainly Skyrim abilities but come on the new classes Warden and Necromancers will always Irk me from a visual stand point.

I think Screaming Cliff Racer should be an Ice Wraith. It's an animal. What can i say?

Totally agree 100% makes more sense IMO.



Imagine that as ability way more cooler than chucking crappy Cliff Racers at enemies.

where's that artwork from btw

Lughlongarm

Flubbles wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

Will we ever see a proper Ice magic in this game? The lack of Ice magic available to players and the fact that majority of NPCS have better looking Ice magic than Players really irks me to wrong way every time. I get what Warden has "Ice Magic" but IMO it just feels so out of place and just doesn't look that great for me to roll a Warden.

You guys could have put frost magic in Necromancer skill at least there it makes more sense than Warden with the death theme they got going on.

Frost/Ice Skills you could have incorporated into necromancers:

Ice Wraith: Instead of that horrible Flame Skull that looks like you just copied Ghost Riders skull.
Frostbite
Wall of Frost
Frost Rune
Icy Spear
Ice Storm
Frost Thrall
Blizzard

Come on guys...
I get these are mainly Skyrim abilities but come on the new classes Warden and Necromancers will always Irk me from a visual stand point.

I think Screaming Cliff Racer should be an Ice Wraith. It's an animal. What can i say?

Totally agree 100% makes more sense IMO.



Imagine that as ability way more cooler than chucking crappy Cliff Racers at enemies.

Well, there is a set with that exact effect, I would have loved if the selene set animation, could have been part of the Warden kit as well.

Slimebrow

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

where's that artwork from btw

I just googled "ESO Ice Wraith" in images and it was in the second line down. I think its concept art for Skyrim.
https://videogamesartwork.com/games/elder-scrolls-v-skyrim/ice-wraith-rough-sketch

Slimebrow

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

[quote="

i think we should improve on what we have. and what we have is Animal Companions and Winter's Embrace

Honestly If they made major improvements to it I would be all up for it.

changes like this?

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fWoOX0S4yrR_KFZcjBAvHvR2K6T__6LrIGiaERV8NQA/edit?usp=sharing

They are gana need to do better than that to win me over IMO

given the history of changes, i don't think we will ever manage more than this.

If they want us to purchase their new classes then they need to bring more to the table than just half arsing classes and skills on release. Seriously whats my incentive to play a Warden or Necro when Sorcs and Templar seem to do the job way better IMO.

ESO_Nightingale

Lughlongarm wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

Will we ever see a proper Ice magic in this game? The lack of Ice magic available to players and the fact that majority of NPCS have better looking Ice magic than Players really irks me to wrong way every time. I get what Warden has "Ice Magic" but IMO it just feels so out of place and just doesn't look that great for me to roll a Warden.

You guys could have put frost magic in Necromancer skill at least there it makes more sense than Warden with the death theme they got going on.

Frost/Ice Skills you could have incorporated into necromancers:

Ice Wraith: Instead of that horrible Flame Skull that looks like you just copied Ghost Riders skull.
Frostbite
Wall of Frost
Frost Rune
Icy Spear
Ice Storm
Frost Thrall
Blizzard

Come on guys...
I get these are mainly Skyrim abilities but come on the new classes Warden and Necromancers will always Irk me from a visual stand point.

I think Screaming Cliff Racer should be an Ice Wraith. It's an animal. What can i say?

Totally agree 100% makes more sense IMO.



Imagine that as ability way more cooler than chucking crappy Cliff Racers at enemies.

Well, there is a set with that exact effect, I would have loved if the selene set animation, could have been part of the Warden kit as well.

there is a set with that effect, but there are ways to distinguish it. for example, changing the animation effects surrounding it and increasing the size and speed of the projectile.

ESO_Nightingale

Flubbles wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

[quote="

i think we should improve on what we have. and what we have is Animal Companions and Winter's Embrace

Honestly If they made major improvements to it I would be all up for it.

changes like this?

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1fWoOX0S4yrR_KFZcjBAvHvR2K6T__6LrIGiaERV8NQA/edit?usp=sharing

They are gana need to do better than that to win me over IMO

given the history of changes, i don't think we will ever manage more than this.

If they want us to purchase their new classes then they need to bring more to the table than just half arsing classes and skills on release. Seriously whats my incentive to play a Warden or Necro when Sorcs and Templar seem to do the job way better IMO.

i would go full on with suggestions, but i also want changes implemented. i have to go with the inbetween here. the craziest thing i suggested was the Arctic Blast suggestion which i call AB4.0. if the new stone giant was possible, than this definitely is.

Brandathorbel

Cliff racer should be changed from magic damage to frost damage. Take away the stupid distance modifier and add chance to chill. Change the animation making the bird more bluish leaving a snowy icy trail.

this would work into their new passive.

to me this seems like a no brainer

thadjarvis

I think when we start talking about ice/frost stuff people mix performance and RP. A magden using frost staffs and frost skills are more than capable of RPing anything. I just get lost after that.

Magden performance crowd: magden has probably been buffed relatively the most (save DK) among mag over the past 12 months and they’re getting an actual skill that makes Frost a DPS element.

ESO_Nightingale

xbobx15 wrote: »

Cliff racer should be changed from magic damage to frost damage. Take away the stupid distance modifier and add chance to chill. Change the animation making the bird more bluish leaving a snowy icy trail.

this would work into their new passive.

to me this seems like a no brainer

We had the idea for Rime Wraith. Which is SCR but it's off balance and distance related stuff is reversed to be less 7 meters away rather than more than 7 meters away. Damage is now frost and the animation is an ice wraith.

Gnortranermara

#1 thing they need to do for both DPS and tanks is to FIX THE ICE STAFF. Switching taunt to Frost Clench (swap with immobilize) and adding Minor armor debuffs would make the weapon functional (but still not BiS) for both DPS and tanks. Until then, it irredeemably sucks for both.

#2.... sure, Polar Bear and replacing the goofy Cliff Racer with an Ice Wraith sounds amazing. A DPS bump to Arctic Wind would be a good step, too. Together, that could finally make DPS Ice Warden a real thing in Skyrim. I'd love to see it.

ESO_Nightingale

SidewalkChalk5 wrote: »

#1 thing they need to do for both DPS and tanks is to FIX THE ICE STAFF. Switching taunt to Frost Clench (swap with immobilize) and adding Minor armor debuffs would make the weapon functional (but still not BiS) for both DPS and tanks. Until then, it irredeemably sucks for both.

#2.... sure, Polar Bear and replacing the goofy Cliff Racer with an Ice Wraith sounds amazing. A DPS bump to Arctic Wind would be a good step, too. Together, that could finally make DPS Ice Warden a real thing in Skyrim. I'd love to see it.

I think more major changes need to come to blast to make it a real damage ability that is used in both pvp and pve.

drakthir

Even if frost become better i'd still raise issue with most of the spells being melee range, thats not what you want from a frost mage lol
Maybe make the range morph of impaling shards baseline for the skills as that would still be a QoL buff for tanky types
Then make Northern Storm have an option to use at range...
Or just rework frost entirely, or remove from warden entirely...
Melee frost mage is no good, if you play as a frost mage the point is to blast while slowing and such but if you stood right next to them you're gonna get smashed anyway making the utility of frost worthless.

They need to seperate tank and frost mages, melee dk magic is fine as it fits well with the DK theme
Melee frost is just wrong

drakthir

Oh and ice staff/tri foxus is just a mess, the entire ice element shouldn't of been made for tankors
I get it though, it'll be incredibly hard to balance, right now if they buffed the damage it would absolutely destroy in pvp
In PVE the chilling/imob is pretty 90% useless, maybe if they did like in other game like if X is immune to control effect your ice spells deal more damage

I also don't get why ice magic was put in with Warden, it fits as much as fire or lightning with warden as they are all elements.
Warden should just be trees and animals, life and growth. Ice does not fit.

ESO_Nightingale

drakthir wrote: »

Even if frost become better i'd still raise issue with most of the spells being melee range, thats not what you want from a frost mage lol
Maybe make the range morph of impaling shards baseline for the skills as that would still be a QoL buff for tanky types
Then make Northern Storm have an option to use at range...
Or just rework frost entirely, or remove from warden entirely...
Melee frost mage is no good, if you play as a frost mage the point is to blast while slowing and such but if you stood right next to them you're gonna get smashed anyway making the utility of frost worthless.

They need to seperate tank and frost mages, melee dk magic is fine as it fits well with the DK theme
Melee frost is just wrong

I personally think melee range is fine, i even prefer it.

wardens usually play melee-medium range because of how shalks works and that doesn't deal frost damage... yet. If northern storm was a ranged cast it would be even more similar to the never-used icy rage. It would really hurt pvp damage stacking builds. Sleet storm isn't used very often in pve besides theme builds or solo builds because bear is generally more valuable in pve in a lot of scenarios i don't see tanks using it too often either. The utility of frost at the moment is defensively oriented. we wouldn't be smashed necessarily.

drakthir

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

drakthir wrote: »

Even if frost become better i'd still raise issue with most of the spells being melee range, thats not what you want from a frost mage lol
Maybe make the range morph of impaling shards baseline for the skills as that would still be a QoL buff for tanky types
Then make Northern Storm have an option to use at range...
Or just rework frost entirely, or remove from warden entirely...
Melee frost mage is no good, if you play as a frost mage the point is to blast while slowing and such but if you stood right next to them you're gonna get smashed anyway making the utility of frost worthless.

They need to seperate tank and frost mages, melee dk magic is fine as it fits well with the DK theme
Melee frost is just wrong

I personally think melee range is fine, i even prefer it.

wardens usually play melee-medium range because of how shalks works and that doesn't deal frost damage... yet. If northern storm was a ranged cast it would be even more similar to the never-used icy rage. It would really hurt pvp damage stacking builds. Sleet storm isn't used very often in pve besides theme builds or solo builds because bear is generally more valuable in pve in a lot of scenarios i don't see tanks using it too often either. The utility of frost at the moment is defensively oriented. we wouldn't be smashed necessarily.

For sure, thing is if all the skills were made ranged you could still play them in melee with no problems, it doesn't work the other way round. General frost mage theme in most games is the ability to keep enemies slowed or full on frozen and nuke the enemy from a distance, my point is that if you have to play it in melee, the chilled/immobalized enemies can still hit you which defeats the purpose of having the crowd control abilities, ruining the general theme of a frost mage.
Also things like icy rage aren't used because you would have to use frost staff and if you wanted to do that as a dps you wouldn't be able to have tri force and its jsut generally less damage because of fire/lightning passives.

ESO_Nightingale

drakthir wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

drakthir wrote: »

Even if frost become better i'd still raise issue with most of the spells being melee range, thats not what you want from a frost mage lol
Maybe make the range morph of impaling shards baseline for the skills as that would still be a QoL buff for tanky types
Then make Northern Storm have an option to use at range...
Or just rework frost entirely, or remove from warden entirely...
Melee frost mage is no good, if you play as a frost mage the point is to blast while slowing and such but if you stood right next to them you're gonna get smashed anyway making the utility of frost worthless.

They need to seperate tank and frost mages, melee dk magic is fine as it fits well with the DK theme
Melee frost is just wrong

I personally think melee range is fine, i even prefer it.

wardens usually play melee-medium range because of how shalks works and that doesn't deal frost damage... yet. If northern storm was a ranged cast it would be even more similar to the never-used icy rage. It would really hurt pvp damage stacking builds. Sleet storm isn't used very often in pve besides theme builds or solo builds because bear is generally more valuable in pve in a lot of scenarios i don't see tanks using it too often either. The utility of frost at the moment is defensively oriented. we wouldn't be smashed necessarily.

For sure, thing is if all the skills were made ranged you could still play them in melee with no problems, it doesn't work the other way round. General frost mage theme in most games is the ability to keep enemies slowed or full on frozen and nuke the enemy from a distance, my point is that if you have to play it in melee, the chilled/immobalized enemies can still hit you which defeats the purpose of having the crowd control abilities, ruining the general theme of a frost mage.
Also things like icy rage aren't used because you would have to use frost staff and if you wanted to do that as a dps you wouldn't be able to have tri force and its jsut generally less damage because of fire/lightning passives.

if the utility is based around defence then being hit in melee range is fine imo. i don't think it defeats the purpose of CC. when you're defensively orientated you can take more damage overall and as it's currently designed for tanking, it works for locking down groups. i think the way most frost skills work from a damaging perspective is fine, but the tank related effects intergrated into the design are a bit frustrating in my personal opinion. not against ranged spells at all. but if i had to pick and chose only 1 i'd go melee ranged.

Slimebrow

drakthir wrote: »

Even if frost become better i'd still raise issue with most of the spells being melee range, thats not what you want from a frost mage lol
Maybe make the range morph of impaling shards baseline for the skills as that would still be a QoL buff for tanky types
Then make Northern Storm have an option to use at range...
Or just rework frost entirely, or remove from warden entirely...
Melee frost mage is no good, if you play as a frost mage the point is to blast while slowing and such but if you stood right next to them you're gonna get smashed anyway making the utility of frost worthless.

They need to seperate tank and frost mages, melee dk magic is fine as it fits well with the DK theme
Melee frost is just wrong

You have described the issue better than I could have. For me they need to rework Ice Skill line from the ground up or just remove it from Warden all together as it just doesn't make sense and stick to the nature/ earthy theme of it or give them more animal summoning options instead.

Also imagine how confusing it must be to new players when they see Warden for the first time you assume its all nature, earthy theme class with animal summoning sorta theme to it not ice magic from the design point of view.

Also from a visual stand point Necros look like they could do with better visuals. What better way than ice/frost magic with slow effects as you bombard enemies temporary minions?

ESO_Nightingale

Flubbles wrote: »

drakthir wrote: »

Even if frost become better i'd still raise issue with most of the spells being melee range, thats not what you want from a frost mage lol
Maybe make the range morph of impaling shards baseline for the skills as that would still be a QoL buff for tanky types
Then make Northern Storm have an option to use at range...
Or just rework frost entirely, or remove from warden entirely...
Melee frost mage is no good, if you play as a frost mage the point is to blast while slowing and such but if you stood right next to them you're gonna get smashed anyway making the utility of frost worthless.

They need to seperate tank and frost mages, melee dk magic is fine as it fits well with the DK theme
Melee frost is just wrong

You have described the issue better than I could have. For me they need to rework Ice Skill line from the ground up or just remove it from Warden all together as it just doesn't make sense and stick to the nature/ earthy theme of it or give them more animal summoning options instead.

Also imagine how confusing it must be to new players when they see Warden for the first time you assume its all nature, earthy theme class with animal summoning sorta theme to it not ice magic from the design point of view.

Also from a visual stand point Necros look like they could do with better visuals. What better way than ice/frost magic with slow effects as you bombard enemies temporary minions?

***, i'd want the frost magic stuff shifted to another class too but it is more unrealistic than most of the changes we have even suggested. it will absolutely never ever happen. We have to work with what we have and try to make that better.

Slimebrow

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

drakthir wrote: »

Even if frost become better i'd still raise issue with most of the spells being melee range, thats not what you want from a frost mage lol
Maybe make the range morph of impaling shards baseline for the skills as that would still be a QoL buff for tanky types
Then make Northern Storm have an option to use at range...
Or just rework frost entirely, or remove from warden entirely...
Melee frost mage is no good, if you play as a frost mage the point is to blast while slowing and such but if you stood right next to them you're gonna get smashed anyway making the utility of frost worthless.

They need to seperate tank and frost mages, melee dk magic is fine as it fits well with the DK theme
Melee frost is just wrong

You have described the issue better than I could have. For me they need to rework Ice Skill line from the ground up or just remove it from Warden all together as it just doesn't make sense and stick to the nature/ earthy theme of it or give them more animal summoning options instead.

Also imagine how confusing it must be to new players when they see Warden for the first time you assume its all nature, earthy theme class with animal summoning sorta theme to it not ice magic from the design point of view.

Also from a visual stand point Necros look like they could do with better visuals. What better way than ice/frost magic with slow effects as you bombard enemies temporary minions?

***, i'd want the frost magic stuff shifted to another class too but it is more unrealistic than most of the changes we have even suggested. it will absolutely never ever happen. We have to work with what we have and try to make that better.

If that's how their class design philosophy works why should I support this company in the first place? When other mmos have designed those classes in a better form that's represents those classes much better. If they don't wan't to listen to class feedback that's their choice but yeah I won't support any content they churn out unless they are properly addressed and looked at from a visual stand point.

As it stands we do pay AAA price for Necro and Warden and both seem to be unsatisfying to play for me and lack the visual appeal when Sorc and Templar do the job much better.

Seriously look at the classes from WOW or GW2 they have a structure and not just mishmash of abilities slapped together. In other words the abilities from those classes make sense the way they are tied to each other so old players as well as new players who don't understand what a "Druid" or "Ranger" are from a lore point of view, the visual tells them what that class is all about with the use simple format called a "THEME".

ESO_Nightingale

Flubbles wrote: »

ESO_Nightingale wrote: »

Flubbles wrote: »

drakthir wrote: »

Even if frost become better i'd still raise issue with most of the spells being melee range, thats not what you want from a frost mage lol
Maybe make the range morph of impaling shards baseline for the skills as that would still be a QoL buff for tanky types
Then make Northern Storm have an option to use at range...
Or just rework frost entirely, or remove from warden entirely...
Melee frost mage is no good, if you play as a frost mage the point is to blast while slowing and such but if you stood right next to them you're gonna get smashed anyway making the utility of frost worthless.

They need to seperate tank and frost mages, melee dk magic is fine as it fits well with the DK theme
Melee frost is just wrong

You have described the issue better than I could have. For me they need to rework Ice Skill line from the ground up or just remove it from Warden all together as it just doesn't make sense and stick to the nature/ earthy theme of it or give them more animal summoning options instead.

Also imagine how confusing it must be to new players when they see Warden for the first time you assume its all nature, earthy theme class with animal summoning sorta theme to it not ice magic from the design point of view.

Also from a visual stand point Necros look like they could do with better visuals. What better way than ice/frost magic with slow effects as you bombard enemies temporary minions?

***, i'd want the frost magic stuff shifted to another class too but it is more unrealistic than most of the changes we have even suggested. it will absolutely never ever happen. We have to work with what we have and try to make that better.

If that's how their class design philosophy works why should I support this company in the first place? When other mmos have designed those classes in a better form that's represents those classes much better. If they don't wan't to listen to class feedback that's their choice but yeah I won't support any content they churn out unless they are properly addressed and looked at from a visual stand point.

As it stands we do pay AAA price for Necro and Warden and both seem to be unsatisfying to play for me and lack the visual appeal when Sorc and Templar do the job much better.

Seriously look at the classes from WOW or GW2 they have a structure and not just mishmash of abilities slapped together. In other words the abilities from those classes make sense the way they are tied to each other so old players as well as new players who don't understand what a "Druid" or "Ranger" are from a lore point of view, the visual tells them what that class is all about with the use simple format called a "THEME".

It's probably best that you find a new mmo that matches what you want. I for one definitely don't blame you. But I'm going to stay to try and get it done here by suggesting, by reporting and by criticising.