PvP Healer Discussion (Builds, Strats, Positioning)

AmoralOne

I main healer, I am wanting to talk to/about healing in Cyrodil. I normally group up with randoms, I never really play with a ball group, or zerg (but im not against healing you if I am nearby) I get complimented a lot on my healing, and how tanky I am. Also people point out how much of a front liner I can be versus other healers who stay in the back.

I wanted to talk about what you other healers use for your set up, and are you on the front line, or do you hang out in the back? Also what is your reasoning for that?

My reason I feel fine being in the front line is because im super tanky. really good sustain, and just all around hard to kill.

My current set up is: Kags, Wizards Riposte, and Bogden. Heavy on everything aside from a light waist, and medium gauntlet to make up the undaunted passive. I front bar Sword and Board, and back bar a Resto.

I have 30k health, 30K phy, and mag Resistance, along with 3k Crit Resistance.

I know there are other set ups out there, and healers play a lot of ways! So whats your style healers?

Iskiab

XxNINJAMANxD wrote: »

I main healer, I am wanting to talk to/about healing in Cyrodil. I normally group up with randoms, I never really play with a ball group, or zerg (but im not against healing you if I am nearby) I get complimented a lot on my healing, and how tanky I am. Also people point out how much of a front liner I can be versus other healers who stay in the back.

I wanted to talk about what you other healers use for your set up, and are you on the front line, or do you hang out in the back? Also what is your reasoning for that?

My reason I feel fine being in the front line is because im super tanky. really good sustain, and just all around hard to kill.

My current set up is: Kags, Wizards Riposte, and Bogden. Heavy on everything aside from a light waist, and medium gauntlet to make up the undaunted passive. I front bar Sword and Board, and back bar a Resto.

I have 30k health, 30K phy, and mag Resistance, along with 3k Crit Resistance.

I know there are other set ups out there, and healers play a lot of ways! So whats your style healers?

I primarily play a pvp healer. It’s probably the most rewarding playstyle in pvp, just because you get the feeling that if you aren’t there things will fall apart.

Do you use combat metrics? I’ve been curious what numbers people pull. I average 8k or so and spike up to 27k without overhealing, so think I do well but I’m really curious.

I think the best way to spec depends on setting, class and role. It’s a great subject and I think I’ve min-maxed the heck out of it but I’m curious about how I stack up to others.

buzzclops

I’ve played healer builds many time and from the experience that I got it really depends on the play style. By being tanky you will most definitely have lower tooltips on your heals but being on the frontlines make it that it’s easier to peel your allies with cc and body block. Your heals tho will be weaker for peak damage situation and you’ll rely on your ultimate often! By playing in the back you can push way higher stats and use positioning and others as your body blocks while you throw fat heals! I don’t think there is a better play style. It depends on who’s around you and which class you’re healing. Tanky healers are good with stamina builds. But let’s say in a bg with 3 mag builds a high stats healer will definitely be better imo.

Edit: high stats healer are good when ppl around you know you’re healing them and stay close and cc ppl off you. Otherwise when you play with ppl running like headless chickens go the tankier route lmao

Also I think having hybrid approach on heal builds are pretty nice these days! This is my stamina archer healer! https://youtu.be/w1cWbKbS37I

Iskiab

buzzclops wrote: »

I’ve played healer builds many time and from the experience that I got it really depends on the play style. By being tanky you will most definitely have lower tooltips on your heals but being on the frontlines make it that it’s easier to peel your allies with cc and body block. Your heals tho will be weaker for peak damage situation and you’ll rely on your ultimate often! By playing in the back you can push way higher stats and use positioning and others as your body blocks while you throw fat heals! I don’t think there is a better play style. It depends on who’s around you and which class you’re healing. Tanky healers are good with stamina builds. But let’s say in a bg with 3 mag builds a high stats healer will definitely be better imo.

Edit: high stats healer are good when ppl around you know you’re healing them and stay close and cc ppl off you. Otherwise when you play with ppl running like headless chickens go the tankier route lmao

Also I think having hybrid approach on heal builds are pretty nice these days! This is my stamina archer healer! https://youtu.be/w1cWbKbS37I

Very nice. I agree too, in BGs as a healer you need to be able to do damage too. All you really need to do is keep some hots up and burst heal if someone’s focused.

People are responsible for their own healing in BGs. If someone sees you’re a healer and stops healing themselves let them die. Most pure healer specs are used in premades by weaker players who haven’t figured the game out yet and want a carry.

AmoralOne

Iskiab wrote: »

XxNINJAMANxD wrote: »

Do you use combat metrics? I’ve been curious what numbers people pull. I average 8k or so and spike up to 27k without overhealing, so think I do well but I’m really curious.

I think the best way to spec depends on setting, class and role. It’s a great subject and I think I’ve min-maxed the heck out of it but I’m curious about how I stack up to others.

From what I have seen I hit about these numbers, I think I prefer the Tanky healer over the back line light armor healer that is healing 2k-3k more than than my HoT, When I play I want to be in the thick of it. That way I am tossing Cleanses, I also run shards for Synergies/Sustain. Sometimes I will run Orbs, right now I am running propelling shields for increased range for the ranged characters around me.

My Skills are as followed:
Front Bar S&B
Breath, Extended, Channeled, Mist Form, Meditate, Barrier Ult (Meditate, and Barrier are my optional skills)
Back Bar Resto Staff
Entropy, Propelling, Combat Prayer, Illustrious Healing, Mutagen, Lights Champion Ult (Entropy, Shield are my optional skills)

GimpyPorcupine

Kag's, Transmutation, Nightflame, 5 heavy, 2 light. I like the stats from the extra piece of light better than the 2% from a piece of medium.

Heavy Kag's FTW, you can really stand in stupid and get the rezz.

Fully proc'd, I'm hitting 2400 mag regen, and on a Breton, I never run out.

I also carry and can swap Rkugamz or Earthgore for the Nightflame, and Sanctuary for the Transmutation if I'm in a group that has Trans already. Working on getting Gossamer jewelry to have that as an option as well.

AmoralOne

GimpyPorcupine wrote: »

Heavy Kag's FTW, you can really stand in stupid and get the rezz.
.

Kags is everything! It would take a lot to rip it off my body.

Oh you bombed? Cool bro, let me just resto ult and get two rez's while I cant be killed and you are not ready for my speed

GimpyPorcupine

Don't usually use Panacea: Solar Disturbance for the Major maim, and Barrier on my Resto Bar, mostly for the extra regen.

AmoralOne

GimpyPorcupine wrote: »

Don't usually use Panacea: Solar Disturbance for the Major maim, and Barrier on my Resto Bar, mostly for the extra regen.

I had a weird idea for a healer.

Thurvokan, Duroks Bane, and Kags

Major, Minor Defile almost always 100% up, Just a thought, I havent tested it as I dont have the shoulder piece for Thurvokan

45% defile, they are either going to leave you alone, and the person you are next to (body blocking for) or they are going to have no heals and die.

Iskiab

That setup looks good. You might be able to tweak it a couple ways, here’s some suggestions I’d try:

RAT is pretty valuable for a bit of speed. I usually like putting it on my resto bar.

Restoring aura is pretty good too, really underrated. Basicly it applies minor magic steal to everyone around you without having to target them. Wardens will do major breach so it’s better then ele drain. The minor resource return buffs are decent too.

Cleanse I like putting on my weapon bar. It’s a great skill but costs a ton so I like putting it on my barrier bar to stack mag regen bonus’ from the support line. Cleanse is super important, basicly whenever you see a colossus cleanse 3 times or so, people are stunned and about to get Ult dumped.

Ritual of rebirth is good too for countering Ult dumps but the range sucks, and if you’re fighting 40+ the server bottlenecks and drops packets so it stops working well.

Another thing that’s pretty awesome is 3x infused mag regen jewellery. Then with support passives you should be about 3-4k mag regen. Always go ritual mundus too because it boosts healing a lot.

WoppaBoem

I use, secuder, bright boast, troll king on an argonian sorc, 5 light, really don't need to stand in stupid, but got major expedition always up and are really good at awerness I usually don't die. Reason for this is to output a lot of heals on large groups 30+ and upkeep siege shield plus purge requires a lot of sustain. Sorc for having the healing negate. Its a fun build.

I played with templar as well and with 5 light was tanky as *** don't need heavy for that but thats maybe me.

Iskiab

WoppaBoem wrote: »

I use, secuder, bright boast, troll king on an argonian sorc, 5 light, really don't need to stand in stupid, but got major expedition always up and are really good at awerness I usually don't die. Reason for this is to output a lot of heals on large groups 30+ and upkeep siege shield plus purge requires a lot of sustain. Sorc for having the healing negate. Its a fun build.

I played with templar as well and with 5 light was tanky as *** don't need heavy for that but thats maybe me.

It depends on your group imo. On PC-NA Drac is the dominant magball right now. They use speed as their defense and swing out and back into opposing groups all the time hitting people with Ult dumps. We can sometimes beat them but it requires staying on them all the time to break their coordination. They also target healers and stun from range leading into their dump so ‘just avoiding’ doesn’t work.

We could prob emulate them, like everyone else, but that’s no fun. All the run away and hope people chase groups are boring imo. I prefer the wrecking ball approach where we’re coming and staying aggressive.

Here’s my gossamer build I run as a sort of front line too, it works okay. I just wish Ritual of Rebirth was more consistent. I could prob tweak it more to improve it but I’m not sure how.

https://en.m.uesp.net/wiki/Special:EsoBuildData?id=207270

GimpyPorcupine

XxNINJAMANxD wrote: »

GimpyPorcupine wrote: »

Don't usually use Panacea: Solar Disturbance for the Major maim, and Barrier on my Resto Bar, mostly for the extra regen.

I had a weird idea for a healer.

Thurvokan, Duroks Bane, and Kags

Major, Minor Defile almost always 100% up, Just a thought, I havent tested it as I dont have the shoulder piece for Thurvokan

45% defile, they are either going to leave you alone, and the person you are next to (body blocking for) or they are going to have no heals and die.

I used to run Fasalla's Guile on a Warden healer/defiler. Major (from Corrupting Pollen) and Minor defile, plus lots of CP into Befoul, got healing received reduction to 66% (this was before CP changes to that tree.)

A specialized Defiler is a really nice addition to a group.

Austacker

I have tried so many sets my eyes water.

I'm a Breton Templar healer main and I cannot begin to tell you how much I hate - how much I DETEST - Healer based PVP in this game.

It feels like unless you're meta, you're screwed.

Unless you have X very specific gear sets and abilities, you're screwed.

Try to heal? Get focused - get wrecked.

Again and again and again.

The power of DPS over Healing in this game is a joke.

Doing the midyear madness event is just painful unless you're in Cyrodill.

I HATE
I HATE
I HATE
PVP in ESO.

And I say that as an old school 2200+ Arena Healer in WOW for 8 seasons.

Coming to ESO you don't realise just how GOD AWFUL the 'balance' is for PvP in this game.

Iskiab

Austacker wrote: »

I have tried so many sets my eyes water.

I'm a Breton Templar healer main and I cannot begin to tell you how much I hate - how much I DETEST - Healer based PVP in this game.

It feels like unless you're meta, you're screwed.

Unless you have X very specific gear sets and abilities, you're screwed.

Try to heal? Get focused - get wrecked.

Again and again and again.

The power of DPS over Healing in this game is a joke.

Doing the midyear madness event is just painful unless you're in Cyrodill.

I HATE
I HATE
I HATE
PVP in ESO.

And I say that as an old school 2200+ Arena Healer in WOW for 8 seasons.

Coming to ESO you don't realise just how GOD AWFUL the 'balance' is for PvP in this game.

It is a lot different then other games. Best thing to do is start in BGs and keep going.

People can self heal a ton compared to other games. Where it’s different is as a healer you’re just helping people when they get stunned and being bursted, with maybe some hots rolling otherwise. It’s also a good idea to have good damage options so you can help your team push and wipe other groups.

Solo queue too. Most new players when they see a healer expect you to be stronger then you are and let them never use their self heals. These players will try to find a healer to latch onto so they can get carried. Let them die so they can get better. Priorities go:

Don’t die > Don’t let your team die > Kill opposing teams. If someone overextends leave them.

Meta or you’re screwed is somewhat true these days, some classes are just better at it.

Austacker

I do queue BGs, it's terrible.

You go against endless pre-mades - you're trying to get 2nd place at best most of the time if you solo queue with randoms.

The standard tactic is the other group rolls around in 3 or 4 players, they focus the healer hard.

Often it's stun - burst and before you can react, dead.

Doesn't matter what your gear is. Doesn't matter what your defenses are.

I've tried all heavy, all light.

I currently run over 4k Crit Resist, 25000 Spell Resist, 20k Physical resist which you'd think it's overkill

But nope. Dead usually in 5 seconds.

Unless you're a vampire you only have RAT to get you out of trouble and of course that doesn't help jack if you're already stunned (unlike Wow's trinket).

The game is simply not designed at all to give healers an edge in PvP. Unless you're with another Premade group, it's largely a waste of time and horrible to play.

If you guys do PvP healing with a group, sure, I get how it might be a good time. Always nice to have a team that will protect the healer when getting bursted. But as a solo player? Dear god it's HORRIBLE!

Once this Midyear Mayhem rubbish is over I cannot wait to exit out of this frustrating tripe.

Healer PvP sucks. It's horrible. I hate it.

Iskiab

Austacker wrote: »

I do queue BGs, it's terrible.

You go against endless pre-mades - you're trying to get 2nd place at best most of the time if you solo queue with randoms.

The standard tactic is the other group rolls around in 3 or 4 players, they focus the healer hard.

Often it's stun - burst and before you can react, dead.

Doesn't matter what your gear is. Doesn't matter what your defenses are.

I've tried all heavy, all light.

I currently run over 4k Crit Resist, 25000 Spell Resist, 20k Physical resist which you'd think it's overkill

But nope. Dead usually in 5 seconds.

Unless you're a vampire you only have RAT to get you out of trouble and of course that doesn't help jack if you're already stunned (unlike Wow's trinket).

The game is simply not designed at all to give healers an edge in PvP. Unless you're with another Premade group, it's largely a waste of time and horrible to play.

If you guys do PvP healing with a group, sure, I get how it might be a good time. Always nice to have a team that will protect the healer when getting bursted. But as a solo player? Dear god it's HORRIBLE!

Once this Midyear Mayhem rubbish is over I cannot wait to exit out of this frustrating tripe.

Healer PvP sucks. It's horrible. I hate it.

Compared to other games self healing is crazy high yea. Usually what I do when someone tries to focus me is kite back and string them out. The game is setup so that each player can heal themselves as much as a dedicated healer would be able to and is not likely to change anytime soon. Basicly healers just increase the healing a bit and can also add to the group's damage a bit.

Austacker

Iskiab wrote: »

Compared to other games self healing is crazy high yea. Usually what I do when someone tries to focus me is kite back and string them out. The game is setup so that each player can heal themselves as much as a dedicated healer would be able to and is not likely to change anytime soon. Basicly healers just increase the healing a bit and can also add to the group's damage a bit.

Similiarly to PvE Healing in this game.

It's nice to have... but not essential at all until you get to the top tier in content

I know ZOS have been tinkering on the PvE side to make healers more relevant, but it's honestly not working at all and the impact is much heavier in PvP I find.

Tanks have a bigger role to play in PvP than Healers do is my experience and the 'fun factor' of healing in this game is minute compared to big, bursty DPS goodness.

In BGs with 4 man teams, my experience is if you're with a pre-made a healer can be an awesome addition.

But in BGs with Randoms? It's lol terribad as far as experiences go.

Don't get me wrong, I WANT to like PvP as a Healer in this game - I have spent many many hours trying to 'git gud' and experiment with different sets all golded out and configurations - spent (literally) millions of gold copying Meta builds and experimenting with my own.

But it feels like it just doesn't matter at the end of the day.

Unlike PvE where you can have a lot of success with various builds, options and playstyles, PvP in this game feels so one directional it's just frustrating.

I only do PvP now for the events like Midyear Mayhem, else I don't even waste my time with this rubbish.

ESO PvP heavily favours DPS. Unless you're playing that, you're going to be in for a rough time.

I've played many MMOs over the years (WoW was just a main one for a long time) and I've never played a MMO that screws up PvP more than ESO which is a real shame to be honest because so many other aspects of the game are really great too.

Oh well.

Iskiab

Austacker wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Compared to other games self healing is crazy high yea. Usually what I do when someone tries to focus me is kite back and string them out. The game is setup so that each player can heal themselves as much as a dedicated healer would be able to and is not likely to change anytime soon. Basicly healers just increase the healing a bit and can also add to the group's damage a bit.

Similiarly to PvE Healing in this game.

It's nice to have... but not essential at all until you get to the top tier in content

I know ZOS have been tinkering on the PvE side to make healers more relevant, but it's honestly not working at all and the impact is much heavier in PvP I find.

Tanks have a bigger role to play in PvP than Healers do is my experience and the 'fun factor' of healing in this game is minute compared to big, bursty DPS goodness.

In BGs with 4 man teams, my experience is if you're with a pre-made a healer can be an awesome addition.

But in BGs with Randoms? It's lol terribad as far as experiences go.

Don't get me wrong, I WANT to like PvP as a Healer in this game - I have spent many many hours trying to 'git gud' and experiment with different sets all golded out and configurations - spent (literally) millions of gold copying Meta builds and experimenting with my own.

But it feels like it just doesn't matter at the end of the day.

Unlike PvE where you can have a lot of success with various builds, options and playstyles, PvP in this game feels so one directional it's just frustrating.

I only do PvP now for the events like Midyear Mayhem, else I don't even waste my time with this rubbish.

ESO PvP heavily favours DPS. Unless you're playing that, you're going to be in for a rough time.

I've played many MMOs over the years (WoW was just a main one for a long time) and I've never played a MMO that screws up PvP more than ESO which is a real shame to be honest because so many other aspects of the game are really great too.

Oh well.

Well screwing it up is a matter of perspective. In almost every pvp game I’ve played one of the chief complaints was always ‘Whine... I need a healer to be competitive’. It was true, even though it was whiney, because of the trinity MMOs are based on. You need a tank, healer and dps.

WoW broke this mold and became really solo friendly which made it a smash hit. ESO pvp is basicly trying to do the same thing with pvp. Everyone’s a healer, tank and dps at the same time. Some classes can do some of those things better than others, but the builds that sacrifice too much to specialize in one facet of that suffer.

In starter BGs full healers work okay, cyrodiil larger groups they work well. However as you do more BGs and your MMR rank goes up I’ve found full healer builds uncompetitive. People can bounce between 20 percent to full health in a couple seconds, adding damage to people’s burst as a healer can make the difference between wiping a ball of 4 and being wiped.

Another way of looking at it is in pvp roles are switched around (traditionally). Damage dealers are straight forward, healers are the tanks, and the tanks specialize in cc and debuffs. It’s how it works out in pvp against competent players.

Austacker

Iskiab wrote: »

Well screwing it up is a matter of perspective. In almost every pvp game I’ve played one of the chief complaints was always ‘Whine... I need a healer to be competitive’. It was true, even though it was whiney, because of the trinity MMOs are based on. You need a tank, healer and dps.

WoW broke this mold and became really solo friendly which made it a smash hit. ESO pvp is basicly trying to do the same thing with pvp. Everyone’s a healer, tank and dps at the same time. Some classes can do some of those things better than others, but the builds that sacrifice too much to specialize in one facet of that suffer.

In starter BGs full healers work okay, cyrodiil larger groups they work well. However as you do more BGs and your MMR rank goes up I’ve found full healer builds uncompetitive. People can bounce between 20 percent to full health in a couple seconds, adding damage to people’s burst as a healer can make the difference between wiping a ball of 4 and being wiped.

Another way of looking at it is in pvp roles are switched around (traditionally). Damage dealers are straight forward, healers are the tanks, and the tanks specialize in cc and debuffs. It’s how it works out in pvp against competent players.

"However as you do more BGs and your MMR rank goes up I’ve found full healer builds uncompetitive."

Yep, I mostly play in BGs and I've progressively watch my healer get cremated more by not just higher MMR players, but the premade groups which ZOS just cannot stop from streamrolling pugs in BGs.

I think if you're a pure DPS, you can pretty much have a decent time at any MMR if you're a solo player, but those higher MMR brackets are just brutal for the specialist roles.

Maybe tank has a better time of it, but my experience as a healer just has me hating PvP in ESO. It's really not fun at all for a number of reasons and to be frank and honest, I've basically given up on it now and just get in - do the dailies - get out.

If I want to PvP, I'll switch to a DPS toon and actually enjoy the experience I think.

I'll leave the healer out for PvE and save my sanity.

I think if I was in a PvP guild and could roll with guildie pre-mades in group chat being heals would be awesome fun.

But if you're stuck solo and have to PUG your way through, it's just bad all round and not fun.

Gravord

Necro heal:

In the vid - Thurvokun, Pariah, Gossamer (yup! 25% aoe dmg reduction for everyone in my team perma uptime as necro healer). Since that vid ive tweaked a bit hotbars by adding mage light to the front for more heal crits and swapped Pariah for Ancient Dragonguard, not as tanky as before but way better heal output. If team would have a tank doing maims Thurvokun could be swapped for Bloodspawn or one of the healing monster sets.

Taleof2Cities

Gravord wrote: »

Since that vid ive tweaked a bit hotbars by adding mage light to the front for more heal crits and swapped Pariah for Ancient Dragonguard, not as tanky as before but way better heal output.

When you say “way better heal output”, @Gravord, how do you quantify that?

Since Thurvokun and Ancient Dragonguard don’t have any Max Magicka bonuses, I think you might be surprised how much you’re actually healing with only a 23k magicka pool.

Gravord

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Since that vid ive tweaked a bit hotbars by adding mage light to the front for more heal crits and swapped Pariah for Ancient Dragonguard, not as tanky as before but way better heal output.

When you say “way better heal output”, @Gravord, how do you quantify that?

Since Thurvokun and Ancient Dragonguard don’t have any Max Magicka bonuses, I think you might be surprised how much you’re actually healing with only a 23k magicka pool.

Blood sacrifice buffed by resto heavy attack in bg changed from 6.5k best crits to 9k crits. Almost 50% big heal increase due to Ancient Dragonguard spell power bonuses. In exchange for 5-15% dmg reduction depending on my health status.

Iskiab

Gravord wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Since that vid ive tweaked a bit hotbars by adding mage light to the front for more heal crits and swapped Pariah for Ancient Dragonguard, not as tanky as before but way better heal output.

When you say “way better heal output”, @Gravord, how do you quantify that?

Since Thurvokun and Ancient Dragonguard don’t have any Max Magicka bonuses, I think you might be surprised how much you’re actually healing with only a 23k magicka pool.

Blood sacrifice buffed by resto heavy attack in bg changed from 6.5k best crits to 9k crits. Almost 50% big heal increase due to Ancient Dragonguard spell power bonuses. In exchange for 5-15% dmg reduction depending on my health status.

I’ve never gone that tanky, but in general healing done modifiers are the best way to go, along with crit in CP.

I’d say for healing... in CP at least, it goes Healing done > crit > Spell power > magicka. Though in group play you’d be surprised how much a big mag pool helps sustain.

I was messing around with my MagWarden in a dps spec, and with Necro and BTB I was able to have really good group support with cleanse.

Another interesting thing I figured out, with enough healing done modifiers it’s possible for nirnhoned to pull ahead of powered on your weapons for healing power. It's one of those things where as you stack a ton of healing done modifiers (minor mending, major mending HA resto, keep bonus, etc...) spell power gets stronger since healing done is a multiple of your base healing amount.

Gravord

Iskiab wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Since that vid ive tweaked a bit hotbars by adding mage light to the front for more heal crits and swapped Pariah for Ancient Dragonguard, not as tanky as before but way better heal output.

When you say “way better heal output”, @Gravord, how do you quantify that?

Since Thurvokun and Ancient Dragonguard don’t have any Max Magicka bonuses, I think you might be surprised how much you’re actually healing with only a 23k magicka pool.

Blood sacrifice buffed by resto heavy attack in bg changed from 6.5k best crits to 9k crits. Almost 50% big heal increase due to Ancient Dragonguard spell power bonuses. In exchange for 5-15% dmg reduction depending on my health status.

I’ve never gone that tanky, but in general healing done modifiers are the best way to go, along with crit in CP.

I’d say for healing... in CP at least, it goes Healing done > crit > Spell power > magicka. Though in group play you’d be surprised how much a big mag pool helps sustain.

I was messing around with my MagWarden in a dps spec, and with Necro and BTB I was able to have really good group support with cleanse.

Another interesting thing I figured out, with enough healing done modifiers it’s possible for nirnhoned to pull ahead of powered on your weapons for healing power. It's one of those things where as you stack a ton of healing done modifiers (minor mending, major mending HA resto, keep bonus, etc...) spell power gets stronger since healing done is a multiple of your base healing amount.

I play mainly bgs and non cp cyro/ic to have it consistent.

Iskiab

Gravord wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Since that vid ive tweaked a bit hotbars by adding mage light to the front for more heal crits and swapped Pariah for Ancient Dragonguard, not as tanky as before but way better heal output.

When you say “way better heal output”, @Gravord, how do you quantify that?

Since Thurvokun and Ancient Dragonguard don’t have any Max Magicka bonuses, I think you might be surprised how much you’re actually healing with only a 23k magicka pool.

Blood sacrifice buffed by resto heavy attack in bg changed from 6.5k best crits to 9k crits. Almost 50% big heal increase due to Ancient Dragonguard spell power bonuses. In exchange for 5-15% dmg reduction depending on my health status.

I’ve never gone that tanky, but in general healing done modifiers are the best way to go, along with crit in CP.

I’d say for healing... in CP at least, it goes Healing done > crit > Spell power > magicka. Though in group play you’d be surprised how much a big mag pool helps sustain.

I was messing around with my MagWarden in a dps spec, and with Necro and BTB I was able to have really good group support with cleanse.

Another interesting thing I figured out, with enough healing done modifiers it’s possible for nirnhoned to pull ahead of powered on your weapons for healing power. It's one of those things where as you stack a ton of healing done modifiers (minor mending, major mending HA resto, keep bonus, etc...) spell power gets stronger since healing done is a multiple of your base healing amount.

I play mainly bgs and non cp cyro/ic to have it consistent.

Ah okay, if you ever get bored I’d try out CP pvp Cyro. It plays a lot differently and you can give up some tankiness for healing power.

I’ve also found your average healer is terrible and puts zero thought into their spec. It makes it fun to theorycraft and min-max the crap out of it because a good healer makes more of a difference, except there’s no ‘score’ at the end so it promotes lazy specs and carries.

Gravord

Iskiab wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Since that vid ive tweaked a bit hotbars by adding mage light to the front for more heal crits and swapped Pariah for Ancient Dragonguard, not as tanky as before but way better heal output.

When you say “way better heal output”, @Gravord, how do you quantify that?

Since Thurvokun and Ancient Dragonguard don’t have any Max Magicka bonuses, I think you might be surprised how much you’re actually healing with only a 23k magicka pool.

Blood sacrifice buffed by resto heavy attack in bg changed from 6.5k best crits to 9k crits. Almost 50% big heal increase due to Ancient Dragonguard spell power bonuses. In exchange for 5-15% dmg reduction depending on my health status.

I’ve never gone that tanky, but in general healing done modifiers are the best way to go, along with crit in CP.

I’d say for healing... in CP at least, it goes Healing done > crit > Spell power > magicka. Though in group play you’d be surprised how much a big mag pool helps sustain.

I was messing around with my MagWarden in a dps spec, and with Necro and BTB I was able to have really good group support with cleanse.

Another interesting thing I figured out, with enough healing done modifiers it’s possible for nirnhoned to pull ahead of powered on your weapons for healing power. It's one of those things where as you stack a ton of healing done modifiers (minor mending, major mending HA resto, keep bonus, etc...) spell power gets stronger since healing done is a multiple of your base healing amount.

I play mainly bgs and non cp cyro/ic to have it consistent.

Ah okay, if you ever get bored I’d try out CP pvp Cyro. It plays a lot differently and you can give up some tankiness for healing power.

I’ve also found your average healer is terrible and puts zero thought into their spec. It makes it fun to theorycraft and min-max the crap out of it because a good healer makes more of a difference, except there’s no ‘score’ at the end so it promotes lazy specs and carries.

Ive used to play CP, i know how it is. I play this game with many breaks since beta.
As for some healers not feeling tanky enough in high mmr games, keep in mind, 4 man setup should include a tank too, reducing dmg taken by the team.

Taleof2Cities

Gravord wrote: »

Blood sacrifice buffed by resto heavy attack in bg changed from 6.5k best crits to 9k crits. Almost 50% big heal increase due to Ancient Dragonguard spell power bonuses. In exchange for 5-15% dmg reduction depending on my health status.

OK.

Are you buffing your crit chance at all to hit those values on a consistent basis?

As your gear set bonuses don’t have any crit chance modifiers either ...

Gravord

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Blood sacrifice buffed by resto heavy attack in bg changed from 6.5k best crits to 9k crits. Almost 50% big heal increase due to Ancient Dragonguard spell power bonuses. In exchange for 5-15% dmg reduction depending on my health status.

OK.

Are you buffing your crit chance at all to hit those values on a consistent basis?

As your gear set bonuses don’t have any crit chance modifiers either ...

10% mage light, up to 20% from necro passive if team mates are low. Its not huge crit chance but its decent. Few % from Ancient Dragonguard. Almost 50% crit when team mates need big heals. Optional 5% bonus if theres a sorc around.

Iskiab

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

Gravord wrote: »

Blood sacrifice buffed by resto heavy attack in bg changed from 6.5k best crits to 9k crits. Almost 50% big heal increase due to Ancient Dragonguard spell power bonuses. In exchange for 5-15% dmg reduction depending on my health status.

OK.

Are you buffing your crit chance at all to hit those values on a consistent basis?

As your gear set bonuses don’t have any crit chance modifiers either ...

Yea I agree with Gravord in the sense that health % heals are really powerful. I think it’s been done that way to differentiate healers from dps, and those who haven’t picked up on it are missing out.

An example is cleanse, 5% base heal per effect removed. Most people dismissed that as too low because they’re stacking damage stats.

Stack healing done instead and that 5% becomes 7% per effect. 3 effects and that’s 21% per player hit.

30k health * 21% = ~6300. Add on crits doubling the healing amount and healing received modifiers and it’’a good. Not as good as when people were trying to use all dots and he being farmed hard, but good.

exeeter702

Austacker wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Well screwing it up is a matter of perspective. In almost every pvp game I’ve played one of the chief complaints was always ‘Whine... I need a healer to be competitive’. It was true, even though it was whiney, because of the trinity MMOs are based on. You need a tank, healer and dps.

WoW broke this mold and became really solo friendly which made it a smash hit. ESO pvp is basicly trying to do the same thing with pvp. Everyone’s a healer, tank and dps at the same time. Some classes can do some of those things better than others, but the builds that sacrifice too much to specialize in one facet of that suffer.

In starter BGs full healers work okay, cyrodiil larger groups they work well. However as you do more BGs and your MMR rank goes up I’ve found full healer builds uncompetitive. People can bounce between 20 percent to full health in a couple seconds, adding damage to people’s burst as a healer can make the difference between wiping a ball of 4 and being wiped.

Another way of looking at it is in pvp roles are switched around (traditionally). Damage dealers are straight forward, healers are the tanks, and the tanks specialize in cc and debuffs. It’s how it works out in pvp against competent players.

"However as you do more BGs and your MMR rank goes up I’ve found full healer builds uncompetitive."

Yep, I mostly play in BGs and I've progressively watch my healer get cremated more by not just higher MMR players, but the premade groups which ZOS just cannot stop from streamrolling pugs in BGs.

I think if you're a pure DPS, you can pretty much have a decent time at any MMR if you're a solo player, but those higher MMR brackets are just brutal for the specialist roles.

Maybe tank has a better time of it, but my experience as a healer just has me hating PvP in ESO. It's really not fun at all for a number of reasons and to be frank and honest, I've basically given up on it now and just get in - do the dailies - get out.

If I want to PvP, I'll switch to a DPS toon and actually enjoy the experience I think.

I'll leave the healer out for PvE and save my sanity.

I think if I was in a PvP guild and could roll with guildie pre-mades in group chat being heals would be awesome fun.

But if you're stuck solo and have to PUG your way through, it's just bad all round and not fun.

Well as someone with 15 years of small scale mmo pvp healer experience under their belt. I assure you, ESO is never going to provide with the type of satifysing pvp experiences where each player player carries an equal degree of burden of performance ie the philosophy in game design where the larger / more numerous player count involved, the less each player ACTUALY has the opportunity to allow thier personable skill / ability to dictate the outcome of a pvp exchange. Wow arena and its smaller bgs and swtor with its WZ and 4v4 arenas handled this very well and made healer very skillful and in depth.

In ESO, it's small scale instanced format is a wash in terms of getting that same level of satisfaction for the mere fact that it lumps all its various game modes (including tdm) into each bg map and more importantly bgs are 4v4v4 which will never by virtue of simply existing, be competivte in any way whatsoever.

In cyrdodil satisfying fights where the opportunity to outplay other players are too infrequent. You have small groups of good players making plays against larger groups of casual players but that in itself is only satisfying from a spectator's perspective since you are winning in what is otherwise unfavorable odds. General rule of thumb in games that have wide open pvp areas is eventually it boils down to attrition where one side will inevitably generate more heads and simply reset the entire process in another location until one side no longer is interested in congregating at in a given active location.

Anyone that truly wants to get into an exchange where they can outplay an opponent that is not a potatoe can try and fish for said scenarios in ic or cyrdodil but it's an exception to the rule. Cyrdoil is far more concerned with the idea and spectacle of being in a big battle, where players can do the most uninvolved undemanding actions and say they are helping all while being caught up in the "war aspect" of playing siege equipment all the while someone in chat is unknowingly RPing as some kind of field commander making nonsensical strategical commands as if they even matter in the grand scheme of things.

You wont find what you are looking for here in eso unfortunately. Not in the same capacity anyways. Pvp healing has its satisfying moments in small group play, but their are far too many avenues when experienced players get into an exchange between 2 evenly matched groups where it ends in a stalemate.