Off-Balance Changes : Another nail in the coffin for mDK

RamiroCruzo

Updated Off Balance to behave more consistently across content in the game.
Off Balance now lasts 7 seconds from player sourced abilities and sets.
Off Balance is no longer reapplied to a target for 15 seconds once the original source of Off Balance ends. This cooldown is displayed as a debuff on targets once they are affected.

7 seconds of off-balance with 15 seconds of cooldown. Combined with 3 seconds internal cool down of Power Lash, you can do 2 Power Lashes every 22 seconds.

50% cheaper Lashes twice every 22 seconds when it's the advertised sustain morph? When NB and Spec has much easier proc for Spectral Bow and Bound Armaments, doesn't involve additional mechanics? And don't even start with Molten Whip, it requires 3 costly skills to proc, whereas Spectral Bow/Bound Armaments just need LA/HA and last much longer.

Also, handing out the off-balance stun on Dizzy which was ripped off from Whip cause ZoS wanted to promote skillful gameplay and now they wanna give highest single Target spammable damage to a skill, off balance and stun? Sounds like planned murder of DK and introduction of noobs into PvP for filling coffers.

To be honest, as an mDK main, have given up hopes of buffs, but can you please not mess up the class even more?

Gnortranermara

Nail in the coffin of that skill, sure. Not for magDK. Crushing or Ele Wep works fine. They got a huge buff with Elf Bane + Zaan, at least for now. We'll see if that one survives PTS.

jcm2606

It's official, they're killing magDK with their negligence. I'm sure Flame Lash didn't even come to mind at any point during not only the pitch of this change, but also the implementation and testing.

Skjaldbjorn

Stamden was hit harder by this change. MUCH harder, and already arguably the lowest DPS before that.

jcm2606

SidewalkChalk5 wrote: »

Nail in the coffin of that skill, sure. Not for magDK. Crushing or Ele Wep works fine. They got a huge buff with Elf Bane + Zaan, at least for now. We'll see if that one survives PTS.

Yet another class skill lost to obsolescence through negligence. We shouldn't be settling for generic skills as replacements for class skills, the loss of any class skill is a nail in the coffin for that class.

jcm2606

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Stamden was hit harder by this change. MUCH harder, and already arguably the lowest DPS before that.

Bruh, the entire point of using Flame Lash was just destroyed, and Molten Whip doesn't synergise with the DK playstyle at all. This would be like putting a cooldown on Sub Assault.

Skjaldbjorn

jcm2606 wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Stamden was hit harder by this change. MUCH harder, and already arguably the lowest DPS before that.

Bruh, the entire point of using Flame Lash was just destroyed, and Molten Whip doesn't synergise with the DK playstyle at all. This would be like putting a cooldown on Sub Assault.

Bruh, they nerfed the damage of bird as well as our scaling % damage passive and "compensated" us with a bleed stack on birds tied to off-balance. Now nether hail or barrage fit the timer and our entire rotation is an abject disaster. We were already the lowest Stam DPS with a rotation that lined up on the timer.

Mag DKs are running Force Pulse right now anyway in a ton of content. At least you have a fallback option.

Skjaldbjorn

For THREE patches in a row Stamden DPS has gotten progressively worse. Hell, we don't even have meaningful access to the new Aegis set because both our core spammables are ranged.

jcm2606

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

jcm2606 wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Stamden was hit harder by this change. MUCH harder, and already arguably the lowest DPS before that.

Bruh, the entire point of using Flame Lash was just destroyed, and Molten Whip doesn't synergise with the DK playstyle at all. This would be like putting a cooldown on Sub Assault.

Bruh, they nerfed the damage of bird as well as our scaling % damage passive and "compensated" us with a bleed stack on birds tied to off-balance. Now nether hail or barrage fit the timer and our entire rotation is an abject disaster. We were already the lowest Stam DPS with a rotation that lined up on the timer.

Mag DKs are running Force Pulse right now anyway in a ton of content. At least you have a fallback option.

Stamden has Crushing Weapon or Wrecking Blow as a fallback option, too. Hell, I never even saw people seriously using the bird in proper content runs.

Whip is also half of what DK has in terms of good offensive tools, too, in terms of PvP. The only other good offensive tool DK has is leap.

Again, this would be like putting a cooldown on Sub Assault, because that's how central whip is to magDK's offense. You combo with Power Lash, just as you do Sub Assault.

Skjaldbjorn

jcm2606 wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

jcm2606 wrote: »

Skjaldbjorn wrote: »

Stamden was hit harder by this change. MUCH harder, and already arguably the lowest DPS before that.

Bruh, the entire point of using Flame Lash was just destroyed, and Molten Whip doesn't synergise with the DK playstyle at all. This would be like putting a cooldown on Sub Assault.

Bruh, they nerfed the damage of bird as well as our scaling % damage passive and "compensated" us with a bleed stack on birds tied to off-balance. Now nether hail or barrage fit the timer and our entire rotation is an abject disaster. We were already the lowest Stam DPS with a rotation that lined up on the timer.

Mag DKs are running Force Pulse right now anyway in a ton of content. At least you have a fallback option.

Stamden has Crushing Weapon or Wrecking Blow as a fallback option, too. Hell, I never even saw people seriously using the bird in proper content runs.

Whip is also half of what DK has in terms of good offensive tools, too, in terms of PvP. The only other good offensive tool DK has is leap.

Again, this would be like putting a cooldown on Sub Assault, because that's how central whip is to magDK's offense. You combo with Power Lash, just as you do Sub Assault.

There essentially is a cooldown on Sub Assault. We cast it every three seconds. Wrecking Blow is great in specific content. It's abysmal for a fair few fights. Channeled spammables are situational, as is 2her in a general sense. Crushing Weapon is horrendously bad on Stam. Stam Sorcs don't even run it and they don't have a class spammable.

If Warden hadn't gotten dumpstered the past three patches, this would be less of a problem. They specifically added this to give Wardens power back into their kit after removing it from several other places (bear when they added the damage passive, nerfed the damage passive, nerfed birds flat damage) and then destroyed the only actual functional way to utilize it one patch later.

Mag DKs will still be blowing up meters next patch. Stamdens haven't been truly relevant since Scalebreaker.

And Stamden still lacks a meaningful raid buff. There's no comparison here.

RamiroCruzo

Can ya fellas please make a new thread about how bad Warden is with most p2w skills and group utilities? As for DPS issues, I don't think DPS of any class increased in last few patches, so off ya guys go

Also, Sub has a 3 seconds delay, we have internal cool down of 3 seconds of Power Lash, add 19 seconds delay on Sub, make whip aoe and with Major Fracture/Breech then come and argue how both skills should be compared.

Skjaldbjorn

RamiroCruzo wrote: »

Can ya fellas please make a new thread about how bad Warden is with most p2w skills and group utilities? As for DPS issues, I don't think DPS of any class increased in last few patches, so off ya guys go

Also, Sub has a 3 seconds delay, we have internal cool down of 3 seconds of Power Lash, add 19 seconds delay on Sub, make whip aoe and with Major Fracture/Breech then come and argue how both skills should be compared.

Nah i'm chillin, gonna stay right here.

luen79rwb17_ESO

So many spammable skills that are useless! Makes me wanna miss the DOT patch

MentalxHammer

Revert off balance changes.

Revert dizzying swing changes.

These are not issues, no side of the community wants these nerfs. Your taking a really cool part of combat and throwing it out the window?? Why????!

Sordidfairytale

Just because you don't use Molten Whip doesn't mean it's not used by others. That being said, I do agree that Flame Lash needs to be looked at. Perhaps amplify it against a burning target, have it stack itself like Bound Armaments does.

ZarkingFrued

This is a terrible change for Stam classes in general and of course mdk gets slapped. Wouldn't be a patch without absurd changes that make no sense at all. That cool down is insanely long.

MyPrist

I can reaply off balance infenit before, for some targets, so it is more like a nerf now. But do not care about such changes.

A lot of changes are very very good by the way !!!

Octopuss

The whining by theorycrafters after every damn update never gets old.

MaskedHuman

Sordidfairytale wrote: »

Just because you don't use Molten Whip doesn't mean it's not used by others. That being said, I do agree that Flame Lash needs to be looked at. Perhaps amplify it against a burning target, have it stack itself like Bound Armaments does.

Terrible idea, molten whip is already a stacking ability, they need to either make it whenever you hit a rooted/stunned target you always get a power lash, or make flame lash a rule-breaking ability where it ignores the off-balance cooldown

MyPrist

MaskedHuman wrote: »

Sordidfairytale wrote: »

Just because you don't use Molten Whip doesn't mean it's not used by others. That being said, I do agree that Flame Lash needs to be looked at. Perhaps amplify it against a burning target, have it stack itself like Bound Armaments does.

Terrible idea, molten whip is already a stacking ability, they need to either make it whenever you hit a rooted/stunned target you always get a power lash, or make flame lash a rule-breaking ability where it ignores the off-balance cooldown

To use second part of the skill will be nice - like set of balance on 1 skill part with CD, and second part on stuned/root enemy, or some thing like this.

But even now all changes are pretty good for mdk. So for now all is fine for me. I hope that they will not bugg something again.

Dragonnord

ZOS talks about Class Identity but keep killing class legendary skills...
 

Sanguinor2

Yeah the offbalance Change really sucks for mdk. Knowing Zos Nothing will get done and they might aswell Change flame lash to stamwhip so atleast stamdks will be happy.