Bring back bonus damage from stealth.

Shadowasrial

As it is now, it’s hard to gank anyone in pvp today. Not because of lack of skill but because of the way meta has driven us. The heavy armor healing meta prevents ganking from being a thing due to high health and big heals. By the time you get a target low enough to execute the player has more than enough time to throw up a heal. The only people you can gank are the people running around in medium armor or a light armor player without shields up. But with heavy armor you can forget it.

Now I get it yea heavy armor is supposed to be highly defensive. But not to the point where every fight takes 5-10 minutes to kill a player. I kid you not I fought a Warden as a nb with 6k weapon damage and this warden was able to take full burst and sustained damage to the point it rarely dropped below 40% health. It’s heals popped it right back to full. Now when I tried ganking him I got him to 30% health after the full burst combo had hit.

If bonus stealth damage had been reintroduced I bet I could have gotten him down to 10% or even killed him outright with the gank. That’s after a sneak surprise attack incap heavy weave surprise attack killers Blade and he popped right back up to full health. He wasn’t taken down to 30% in 1-2 hits it was a full rotation. Time and time again I hit people with a perfect rotation despite the cast times and it fails to gank the target.

Gilvoth

no.
i know you are talking about MASS TANK builds, but for the rest of the population thats too much damage.
the extra damage from stealth just adds MORE to that and is far too strong and fast for people to even have a chance to react and defend themselves.
in pvp right now you can do alot of Damage by the animation canceling.
no one should be able to kill others instantly with MASS damage in what seems like 1 hit.

Fur_like_snow

This is not the way. The devs have to address the different forms of damage mitigation and healing not increase stealth damage arbitrarily.

Moonsorrow

You do realize that ZOS has done many things to exactly stop gankers and ganking potential in general and all in purpose. Only full glass targets can be ganked, no Impen and so on.. and they intended it that way and even for that ganker has to go full glass cannon themselves too, so high risk for fast death also if caught.

And i do not see them going back on any of those adjustments. With many things clearly protecting the casual & sensitive about deaths -players of these days, most likely eventually they will nerf Cloak-play hard and put an end to that playstyle.

Shadowasrial

Gilvoth wrote: »

no.
i know you are talking about MASS TANK builds, but for the rest of the population thats too much damage.
the extra damage from stealth just adds MORE to that and is far too strong and fast for people to even have a chance to react and defend themselves.
in pvp right now you can do alot of Damage by the animation canceling.
no one should be able to kill others instantly with MASS damage in what seems like 1 hit.

I’m sorry but that’s where your wrong. Ganking has been a part of pvp since the beginning and even if you don’t like it there is strategy involved in it. And if you read my rotation then you know that there is plenty of time to react. As a nightblade it is very rare for be to be ganked in medium armor no shields of any kind. So I’m sorry it comes down to learning to play and react. If you break free the initial stun and then dodge you can either dodge again and throw up a heal or you can try to counter with damage. I get ganked maybe once every week and that’s nothing. And half the time it’s only ever if I’m engaged by another target and I get picked off by a nb in the back. There used to be a good reason for ganking. Taking out players on siege who are by themselves or on the rim of the group. Taking out a unprotected healer. I’m much more frustrated by unloading an entire ulti and burst combo on a target with 6k weapon damage and a *** ton of penetration and the target just shrugging it off. And because I refuse to run heavy armor their damage does sooo much more to me compared to what I do to them.

Shadowasrial

Moonsorrow wrote: »

You do realize that ZOS has done many things to exactly stop gankers and ganking potential in general and all in purpose. Only full glass targets can be ganked, no Impen and so on.. and they intended it that way and even for that ganker has to go full glass cannon themselves too, so high risk for fast death also if caught.

And i do not see them going back on any of those adjustments. With many things clearly protecting the casual & sensitive about deaths -players of these days, most likely eventually they will nerf Cloak-play hard and put an end to that playstyle.

If they do they will loose almost every nightblade. Cloak is the core skill that every nightblade utilizes except for nb tanks and even then some of them do.

Shadowasrial

Ganking has its place in pvp. It’s the one thing nbs excelled at. And I’d even go so far as to say were designed for it. Stealth play needs buffs. It’s not on par with heavy meta. I didn’t roll a nb to be a heavy armor 2 handed wielding berserker. I built it to be a striker/assassin. To quickly deal heavy damage to a target and get out. I’m fine with being squishy. But if I can elude hits which I do the the point of low stamina and still land my hits then I see no reason why stealth play shouldn’t be a viable combat style. It has no place in pve.

TequilaFire

IDK, my stamblade still kicks ass.

Gilvoth

it's not us nightblades that need worked on and tweeked.
its the tweeking of Tank builds being able to out heal our damage is the problem.
They need made to heal less and defend less is where it needs work, not us.

ArchMikem

You just admitted you had no problem ganking light and medium armor builds. You want them to suffer even more just so you can gank everyone?

JamieAubrey

Fjorynn

You pretty much want to oneshot people without them being able to react or respond, do you even like/know how to PVP?

L_Nici

Unbelieveable. NBs are already super annoying with their 100% Critrate out of cloak and you want even Bonus Damage on top of that? Can't you ever get enough? Learn to play in an open battle and don't expect to oneshot everything just because you are a sneaking coward.

jadarock

^lol

It would bring back the snipe meta and we dont need that

LucyferLightbringer

I am against giving anything to nightblades. They are already the most annoying and least fun class to pvp against. They can pick their fights as they please and choose moment of attack, they can chose to abort the fight at any moment, they should not get huge damage on top of it.

Moonsorrow

Shadowasrial wrote: »

Moonsorrow wrote: »

You do realize that ZOS has done many things to exactly stop gankers and ganking potential in general and all in purpose. Only full glass targets can be ganked, no Impen and so on.. and they intended it that way and even for that ganker has to go full glass cannon themselves too, so high risk for fast death also if caught.

And i do not see them going back on any of those adjustments. With many things clearly protecting the casual & sensitive about deaths -players of these days, most likely eventually they will nerf Cloak-play hard and put an end to that playstyle.

If they do they will loose almost every nightblade. Cloak is the core skill that every nightblade utilizes except for nb tanks and even then some of them do.

Well, Wings was a class defining thing for DK, reflecting projectiles.. yet, ZOS changed that to a mitigation skill. They could very well do same thing to Cloak, to act as a mitigation buff against a certain damage type instead of Invisibility.

You know they have and can do things like that.. no class is safe from the big changes if their vision demands it.

Sanguinor2

Oh yeah lets bring back onslaught oneshots from Stealth, sounds like a crazy good idea!!!!
(Sarcasm if anyone cant tell)

Karmanorway

If u see a class with shield, or a necro or warden then dont bother, problem solved 👍 personally im almost dead If i get hit by 2 siprise attacks, and im in medium with 30k resists so no thank you, l2p in the open instead of crutching on invisibility.

ArchMikem

Sanguinor2 wrote: »

Oh yeah lets bring back onslaught oneshots from Stealth, sounds like a crazy good idea!!!!
(Sarcasm if anyone cant tell)

When did those ever leave? Onslaught still wrecks.

jcm2606

Moonsorrow wrote: »

Shadowasrial wrote: »

Moonsorrow wrote: »

You do realize that ZOS has done many things to exactly stop gankers and ganking potential in general and all in purpose. Only full glass targets can be ganked, no Impen and so on.. and they intended it that way and even for that ganker has to go full glass cannon themselves too, so high risk for fast death also if caught.

And i do not see them going back on any of those adjustments. With many things clearly protecting the casual & sensitive about deaths -players of these days, most likely eventually they will nerf Cloak-play hard and put an end to that playstyle.

If they do they will loose almost every nightblade. Cloak is the core skill that every nightblade utilizes except for nb tanks and even then some of them do.

Well, Wings was a class defining thing for DK, reflecting projectiles.. yet, ZOS changed that to a mitigation skill. They could very well do same thing to Cloak, to act as a mitigation buff against a certain damage type instead of Invisibility.

You know they have and can do things like that.. no class is safe from the big changes if their vision demands it.

And who were the ones who brought on the wings nerf by whining on the forums? Sorcs and NB's. Only a matter of time before the pendulum swings back in their direction, and they get a taste of what DK dealt with by losing wings.

TheUndeadAmulet

This post is literally the OP whining that he can't instagib everyone.

susmitds

Dunno bout that, my man. Even right now, I can gank just about anyone if I wish so.

max_only

As a delegate from Bosmer nation please note that op is not amongst our members, Bosmer would like the stealth radius reduction instead of stealth detection. We are not advocating for the return of bonus damage. I yield the remainder of this bait to the gentleman from Gank City.

D0PAMINE

You can be tanky in light or medium armor.

D0PAMINE

max_only wrote: »

As a delegate from Bosmer nation please note that op is not amongst our members, Bosmer would like the stealth radius reduction instead of stealth detection. We are not advocating for the return of bonus damage. I yield the remainder of this bait to the gentleman from Gank City.

Keep fighting the good fight

brandonv516

I can't get behind this right now, especially with the Snipe desync still not being addressed.

Ankael07

1) Cloak guarantees your next attack to be crit

2) Hemorrhage passive gives you 10% more crit damage and about 5% crit chance when you deal crit

3) Master Assassin gives you 10% weapon/spell damage while in sneak/invisible


What more do you want?

Mr_Walker

So cowardly nightblades/bow desynch cheats can be even more stupid? No thanks.

MattT1988

Shadowasrial wrote: »

Moonsorrow wrote: »

You do realize that ZOS has done many things to exactly stop gankers and ganking potential in general and all in purpose. Only full glass targets can be ganked, no Impen and so on.. and they intended it that way and even for that ganker has to go full glass cannon themselves too, so high risk for fast death also if caught.

And i do not see them going back on any of those adjustments. With many things clearly protecting the casual & sensitive about deaths -players of these days, most likely eventually they will nerf Cloak-play hard and put an end to that playstyle.

If they do they will loose almost every nightblade. Cloak is the core skill that every nightblade utilizes except for nb tanks and even then some of them do.

LOL not every nightblade is a grubby arse ganker, and not all PvP Blades need to utilise cloak.

I’m glad ganking is now a lot harder, no one should be able to one shot kill anybody before they can react, especially with how bad the server performance is, sometimes the sound lags to the point where the audio cue of an attack is delayed or flat out doesn’t work, which gives the ganker an unfair advantage. As long as there are these kind of issues then I will always encourage changes that makes ganking less appealing and harder to play.

bmnoble

Shadowasrial wrote: »

Gilvoth wrote: »

no.
i know you are talking about MASS TANK builds, but for the rest of the population thats too much damage.
the extra damage from stealth just adds MORE to that and is far too strong and fast for people to even have a chance to react and defend themselves.
in pvp right now you can do alot of Damage by the animation canceling.
no one should be able to kill others instantly with MASS damage in what seems like 1 hit.

I’m sorry but that’s where your wrong. Ganking has been a part of pvp since the beginning and even if you don’t like it there is strategy involved in it. And if you read my rotation then you know that there is plenty of time to react. As a nightblade it is very rare for be to be ganked in medium armor no shields of any kind. So I’m sorry it comes down to learning to play and react. If you break free the initial stun and then dodge you can either dodge again and throw up a heal or you can try to counter with damage. I get ganked maybe once every week and that’s nothing. And half the time it’s only ever if I’m engaged by another target and I get picked off by a nb in the back. There used to be a good reason for ganking. Taking out players on siege who are by themselves or on the rim of the group. Taking out a unprotected healer. I’m much more frustrated by unloading an entire ulti and burst combo on a target with 6k weapon damage and a *** ton of penetration and the target just shrugging it off. And because I refuse to run heavy armor their damage does sooo much more to me compared to what I do to them.

All well and good having a strategy but you have to remember the people you are complaining about have redesigned their builds in part to counter yours.

They are trading damage potential for survivability, playing defensively tends to be more resource intensive, if you can't keep up the pressure to make them use up their resources your not going to win the fight and should move on to another target or work with a group instead of expecting to solo every opponent you encounter.


You would really like targeting one of my healers for instance, that uses Mark of the Pariah, Ancient Dragon Guard, Mighty Chudan and is a stage 4 vampire, you might drop my health quite a bit one press of Green Dragon blood and all that work getting me into execution stage is gone for the most part.

Leaving you open for a counter attack, even with my crappy damage, if your build is a glass canon, I might just manage to kill you or slow you down enough for someone else to kill you.

More often than not I swap out Pariah for other sets though, I only put it on when I start running into lots of Night blades.

Sanguinor2

ArchMikem wrote: »

When did those ever leave? Onslaught still wrecks.

Does it crit you for 30k from Stealth without even seeing your Opponent tho? Cuz thats what you could do pre morro with it.