Remove the stun from 'Streak'

Kel

I'm hoping this is a tongue in cheek poke at the "gap closers shouldn't stun" posts.

Either way, seriously, no more nerfs

AMeanOne

Its early in the day, but I think it's safe to say this is the dumbest thing I'll read today.

GhostofDatthaw

Let's revert every combat change to 1.6

jadarock

Kel wrote: »

I'm hoping this is a tongue in cheek poke at the "gap closers shouldn't stun" posts.

Either way, seriously, no more nerfs

Was my first thought to

kringled_1

The vertical on the stun could stand to be toned down. Not a fan of being stunned in towers by someone safely a floor below. Otherwise the request seems as ridiculous as the leap request.

Ragnarock41

Kel wrote: »

I'm hoping this is a tongue in cheek poke at the "gap closers shouldn't stun" posts.

Either way, seriously, no more nerfs

Well if the nerfs go at this level I'm sure we'll come to a point where people will say ''gapclosers shouldn't gapclose''. Its just a matter of time.

First it was the templar shard stun, then c.frags aaand look at where we are now.

Rahar

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Kel wrote: »

I'm hoping this is a tongue in cheek poke at the "gap closers shouldn't stun" posts.

Either way, seriously, no more nerfs

Well if the nerfs go at this level I'm sure we'll come to a point where people will say ''gapclosers shouldn't gapclose''. Its just a matter of time.

First it was the templar shard stun, then c.frags aaand look at where we are now.

What, you think gap closers should actually gap close? Seriously, just l2p and sprint. If you have to equip a skill to cover distance instead of just hitting one button, you're the exact kind of player that dies to gap closing anyway. Wow DK players are so biased.

this is fun

Shaloknir

With nerf to shields, I have no trouble killing sorcerers. Streak is fine in my opinion. Every class should have some powerful class-defining skill. In short, I disagree with the OP.

ketsparrowhawk

If you want every PVP sorc main to immediately quit the game then yeah I guess..

Just needs to be made blockable again. It came as quite a surprise when they made this change. Was not necessary at all.. Streak was already on every Sorc's bar.

Joy_Division

markusloveFTM wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Skill has worked fine for 6 years and now all of sudden needs to be nerfed. Yeah, ok.

Has it worked fine for 6 years though? Sorcerer has been the best class both PvE and PvP since the game was released.

Just seems kind of crazy that the class would have a wait till the enemy is on 20% HP execute, gap closer/escape tool, shields, crazy burst from easy proc crystal fragments, pets at their disposal, AoE immobilization.

It's not like Sorcerer would lose their ability to stun, they can spec into crystal blast or rune prison for a stun.

Yes, the only time when Streak has not worked fine is when ZOS bugged the skill and made traveling through doorways as adventurous as the old Templar Charge and didn't fix it for like 6 months,

I can attest to this because I have actually played this game since before it was released. Anyone who has would know that once ultimate cost reduction bug was fixed, sorcerers were the worst class in both PvP and PvE until ZOS overhauled the game with the 1.6 update. Yes, with their "OP" streak, Crystal Frags stunning, 20 second shield duration, the class was terrible.

If you think playing one is so easy, go ahead and spec into Crystal Blast and try to Rune Prison people. We have a 5 star DC on PC NA who has done that for years and it's quite amusing to run into him.

NBrookus

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

NBrookus wrote: »

Streak does not need a nerf. Sorc needs a reliable stun.

Everybody needs a reliable stun. However everyone also needs counterplay of some sort. Streak stun does not need to be unblockable. I'm not saying remove the stun, I'm saying the buff to make it unblockable not only made rune prison a pointless ability , but also removed the only counterplay against streak stun.

Abilities like d.swing/draining shot/reverb bash are no good as CC anymore, but even when they were at their strongest, these abilities were both blockable and dodgeable. You could make an argument for fossilize, which recently had a cost nerf, however you can not use fossilize as a gapcloser or escape.

Streak is a class defining ability and thats fine. But class defining or not there should be something I can do about it. I can't run away from a sorc, I can't block, I can't dodge it, Its absurd that a stamsorc can ALWAYS streak into onslaught or a magsorc will have constant pressure against me as a Dk, who should be the ''attrition class''.

I get where you are coming from. It's particularly annoying having dedicated streakers in ball groups, uncounterably aoe stunning before the bomb hits. However giving sorcs an unblockable melee stun feels fine to me because it puts a class that would love to safely nuke you from range into a riskier melee range. They have a ranged stun which is more easily counterable.

Although I still think frag stun was a better playstyle for both magsorcs and those who fight them. True, the skill was overloaded with the other damage in the sorc toolkit but I still don't feel removing the stun was the best solution for playstyle options.

Blinkin8r

markusloveFTM wrote: »

I just feel like the stun from steak is overkill; I wouldn't mind it if it maybe applied minor maim (15% damage done debuff) or something to the enemy, but a stun? For a mobility tool? Seems a bit OP.

I mean, they already have their crystal fragments for a stun.

Sorry for the small post, I didn't know what else to say.

Crystal Frags hasn't had a stun for quite a while my guy. Maybe stay up to date on the game before calling for nerfs.

Ragnarock41

NBrookus wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

NBrookus wrote: »

Streak does not need a nerf. Sorc needs a reliable stun.

Everybody needs a reliable stun. However everyone also needs counterplay of some sort. Streak stun does not need to be unblockable. I'm not saying remove the stun, I'm saying the buff to make it unblockable not only made rune prison a pointless ability , but also removed the only counterplay against streak stun.

Abilities like d.swing/draining shot/reverb bash are no good as CC anymore, but even when they were at their strongest, these abilities were both blockable and dodgeable. You could make an argument for fossilize, which recently had a cost nerf, however you can not use fossilize as a gapcloser or escape.

Streak is a class defining ability and thats fine. But class defining or not there should be something I can do about it. I can't run away from a sorc, I can't block, I can't dodge it, Its absurd that a stamsorc can ALWAYS streak into onslaught or a magsorc will have constant pressure against me as a Dk, who should be the ''attrition class''.

I get where you are coming from. It's particularly annoying having dedicated streakers in ball groups, uncounterably aoe stunning before the bomb hits. However giving sorcs an unblockable melee stun feels fine to me because it puts a class that would love to safely nuke you from range into a riskier melee range. They have a ranged stun which is more easily counterable.

Although I still think frag stun was a better playstyle for both magsorcs and those who fight them. True, the skill was overloaded with the other damage in the sorc toolkit but I still don't feel removing the stun was the best solution for playstyle options.

I couldn't care less about this normally however every CC available to me have been gutted in some way or other, and skill reflect, was also taken from my class and given to sorcerers in the form of skill absorbtion , on the other morph of streak.

And risks? I guess thats as close to as it gets to risk for a sorc player then lmao.

Edit: To be completely honest I like that stamsorcs are decently strong right now and don't want the fun taken away from them. But you know, If I made a buff DK post certain sorc mains would be the first people to say that I need to l2p. Because having buffs or even reverts of any kind would be completely unacceptable, unless its for one's own class.

iJuacob

Lol this game aint no fun when we have cry babies who cant play their own characters so they blame others for it

WillhelmBlack

Remove the nerflings from the forums.

jcm2606

markusloveFTM wrote: »

NordSwordnBoard wrote: »

@markusloveFTM I used to think NBs were OP until I played as one - and doing so helped me understand how to defeat them much more effectively. Know your enemy.

You need to understand you're asking to nerf a class defining skill. You're also suggesting stun replacements like Blast, a telegraphed cast time stun and (over buffed then nerfed) rune prison which is also very obvious to enemies. You even admit you've never used anything you suggest as a viable replacement.

Streak does not need a nerf. They actually just adjusted the skill recently (and I am loving the cone effect) and left the stun part of the skill.

I've just watched a video of rune cage and it's instant cast with no more than a second delay, it looks perfect, on top of that, if they don't break out of it, they get damaged.

No, of course, this isn't enough, you need your stun built into your mobility tool. Hey, why doesn't critical charge and ambush stun too?

And that's the real problem. Watching a video of a skill, or reading a tooltip of a skill, is not enough. Jump on that class, spend some serious time on that class, so that you can form a coherent understanding and opinion of how the whole class functions. This goes to everybody who blindly squeals "nerf this, is OP!" without actually having any experience on that class.

Rune Cage is not a good stun, because that second delay is a telegraph that practically screams "DODGE ME". Sure, potatoes will get caught in it, but any player who recognises the visual and knows what to do will not be locked down by it, unless you get perfect timing.

Of course, there's no way of knowing this without actually spending time on the class, so jump off whatever class you're on now, go play magsorc for a bit, try Rune Cage out, and come back to us.

Oh, and as far as that last bit is concerned, Toppling Charge would like a word.

Tolino

jcm2606 wrote: »

Rune Cage is not a good stun, because that second delay is a telegraph that practically screams "DODGE ME". Sure, potatoes will get caught in it, but any player who recognises the visual and knows what to do will not be locked down by it, unless you get perfect timing.

Rune Cage is better as you think. Sure, you can easily dodge it. But at the same time you can burn down the Stampool realy fast!
But Streak is at the moment just better.
The stun on Streak is fine. The unblockable Stun is to strong!

jcm2606

Tolino wrote: »

jcm2606 wrote: »

Rune Cage is not a good stun, because that second delay is a telegraph that practically screams "DODGE ME". Sure, potatoes will get caught in it, but any player who recognises the visual and knows what to do will not be locked down by it, unless you get perfect timing.

Rune Cage is better as you think. Sure, you can easily dodge it. But at the same time you can burn down the Stampool realy fast!
But Streak is at the moment just better.
The stun on Streak is fine. The unblockable Stun is to strong!

Which doesn't help when the point of magsorc is to burst someone down from 100-0 with a bunch of delayed burst that all hits at once.

Moonsorrow

Gilvoth wrote: »

Moonsorrow wrote: »

markusloveFTM wrote: »

Seems a bit OP.

Nah, it is working as intended like it has for years, so no it is not overpowered but instead your own performance is just underpowered.

You can fix that problem with training, so do not be sad. Learning to use your own strenghts is more rewarding than trying to change the game to your level.

the stunn is overkill and it is also unblockable, and in no way is your insult that we need to learn in training legitimate.

Now now, it is not an insult if it is true.. and if you feel it as such, i am sorry if i hurt your feelings somehow. Now toughen up soldier and get back to the fight and learn to deal with different class skills.

People are asking nerfs to Cloak, i am there then also saying they need some training in their own performance instead of nerf to Cloak. I am defending all class defining skills since i play all classes. I suggest you would too, it opens eyes a lot. Some years in all classes and no need to anymore take someone saying needing training as insult anymore, but maybe thinks that it might also be true if others not see an issue with same skill, and.. if only people who see issue are rather inexperienced and/or main-limited people, you know that a good training can actually change it.

I mean all well when i say these, sometimes with just too many topics like this it might seem a bit blunt.. i wonder if one more year of ESO and all my posts are "L2P" anymore since i am like a tired forum Gollum by then if the trend of nerf post amounts continues like this. Do people even play in the game and try to get better anymore or are nerf posts the modern way of sort of getting good?

Destroying Streak from sorcs is same as destroying whole Cloak-play from NB.. i think both should be left alone. Fighting a Streaking sorc can be annoying yes (as i play plenty of magblade), but so is fighting Cloaker, or fighting a Sweeps spamming metaplar, or any other class who know how to use their class strenghts..

ALL classes have their own cheese (strong class skill or ulti). It is just convenient to everyone to forget their own and demand the other class to be nerfed.

jcm2606

Moonsorrow wrote: »

Gilvoth wrote: »

Moonsorrow wrote: »

markusloveFTM wrote: »

Seems a bit OP.

Nah, it is working as intended like it has for years, so no it is not overpowered but instead your own performance is just underpowered.

You can fix that problem with training, so do not be sad. Learning to use your own strenghts is more rewarding than trying to change the game to your level.

the stunn is overkill and it is also unblockable, and in no way is your insult that we need to learn in training legitimate.

Now now, it is not an insult if it is true.. and if you feel it as such, i am sorry if i hurt your feelings somehow. Now toughen up soldier and get back to the fight and learn to deal with different class skills.

People are asking nerfs to Cloak, i am there then also saying they need some training in their own performance instead of nerf to Cloak. I am defending all class defining skills since i play all classes. I suggest you would too, it opens eyes a lot. Some years in all classes and no need to anymore take someone saying needing training as insult anymore, but maybe thinks that it might also be true if others not see an issue with same skill, and.. if only people who see issue are rather inexperienced and/or main-limited people, you know that a good training can actually change it.

I mean all well when i say these, sometimes with just too many topics like this it might seem a bit blunt.. i wonder if one more year of ESO and all my posts are "L2P" anymore since i am like a tired forum Gollum by then if the trend of nerf post amounts continues like this. Do people even play in the game and try to get better anymore or are nerf posts the modern way of sort of getting good?

Destroying Streak from sorcs is same as destroying whole Cloak-play from NB.. i think both should be left alone. Fighting a Streaking sorc can be annoying yes (as i play plenty of magblade), but so is fighting Cloaker, or fighting a Sweeps spamming metaplar, or any other class who know how to use their class strenghts..

ALL classes have their own cheese (strong class skill or ulti). It is just convenient to everyone to forget their own and demand the other class to be nerfed.

What is this "getting good" you speak of, and what skills need to be nerfed to "get good"?

Pelican

gUYs wE hAVe To NeRF sORc iTs toO OvERPowEreD uNliKE tHoSe oPPreSseD tEmPlaRS.

validifyedneb18_ESO

I would be down with this if the ability was also made smoother feeling to use. Its very jarring right now, the cast has you stand still, the cast time takes almost as much time as it would take to run that distance. Its faster to roll or cast an endurance ability.

NyassaV

Honestly Streak is fine. BoL is a little overloaded though

BaiterOfZergs

You know we reached the end times when people are complaining about streak

Ragnarock41

BaiterOfZergs wrote: »

You know we reached the end times when people are complaining about streak

Streak was complained about before many times, but not for the stun, but the mobility it provided. Which is very old news really.

These recent threads are a result of dev team systematically removing majority of the stuns from the game, and heavily nerfing the ones which they kept the CCs for. Nobody complained about streak stun when it was blockable and when everyone else had good CCs with counterplay. Reverb bash,d.swing,draining shot, these all had very easy counterplay yet got butchered for no other reason than complaints from community that didn't wanna learn how to deal with it.

People in this forum ask for horribly biased and ridicilous changes, and they usually get what they asked for, and after all is said and done, when the pendulum swings back and hits them, they all go suprised pikachu face.

Also hey, after nerfing practically every good CC in the game, they went ahead and buffed streak stun. Its just inconsistent and lazy changes no matter how you look at it.

markusloveFTM

Well, either classes need nerfing or Wardens and Necromancers need buffing, what stun reliable stun does necromancers have? Dragonknight fossilize seems a bit op as well considering it roots, making it so you must cc break and dodge roll. It's just annoying the people who didn't want to buy dlc argue for the first 4 classes being much stronger tham the new necromancer and warden.

Bobby_V_Rockit

Take the heal off puncturing sweep while you’re at it. Overkill

PhoenixGrey

markusloveFTM wrote: »

I mean, they already have their crystal fragments for a stun.

i didn't know sorc had a cc.

Aedaryl

This thread is ridiculous.

Almost every one has access to a really good CC (= Unblockable/undogeable or CC that allow true combo )

True combo : it's weaving by using a minimum charged heavy attack + your burst ability. The fact that the stun and the ability hit in the SAME GLOBAL COOLDOWN make the skill used having 100% chance to hit + the time the ennemy take for break free may lead to a second hit.

An unblocable/undogeable stun does not allow to guaranteed the burst skill that follow to hit. Using streak to stun then firing a procced frag will lead to have the frag blocked or dodged 100% of the time if the ennemy is good.

A skill that stun take 1 GCD to be used and breaking free take less than 1 GCD. That's mean you have the time to break the stun and dodge/block by the time the skill used right after the stun land on you.

An uncounterable stun make the stun non avoidable, but make the following burst coming right after ALWAYS counterable if you are a good player.

A medium attack weaved into the burst can be countered if you see it coming BUT if it lands,it make the burst 100% guaranted.

One have a 100% chance to stun but up to 0% chance to land the burst while the other have a chance to not stun but 100% chance to land the burst if it stun.


Every stamina class have access to a uncounterable stun called Turn Evil.

Every stamina class have access to a true combo stun from dizzing swing off balance.

A stamina boi hwo complain about not having a good stun available is a boi hwo need to L2P.

Magicka NB have fear ( uncounterable) (stamblade have off balance stun)

Magicka DK have fossilize (uncounterable) (can be used by stam dk too)

Magicka Necro have fear totem (uncounterable) - this one is very bad and poorly designed because the 2s delay

Magicka sorc have streak (uncounterable) (can be used by stamsorc too)

Only templar and warden doesn't have a uncounterable/true combo stun.

Magicka Templar still have toppling charge which is still a good stun because all the effect around

Magicka Warden are *** hard.

Theze 3 class left offen use vampire drain with cut anim as a decent stun.



There is no reason to cry about streak stun, because streak stun does not allow to combo a skilled player.

Also remember that the delay after streak + 180° turn + crystal frag minimum travel time + cyrstal frag true travel time make the sorc "burst" even more avoidable than classical 1 GCD stun skills.

Ragnarock41

Aedaryl wrote: »

This thread is ridiculous.

Almost every one has access to a really good CC (= Unblockable/undogeable or CC that allow true combo )

True combo : it's weaving by using a minimum charged heavy attack + your burst ability. The fact that the stun and the ability hit in the SAME GLOBAL COOLDOWN make the skill used having 100% chance to hit + the time the ennemy take for break free may lead to a second hit.

An unblocable/undogeable stun does not allow to guaranteed the burst skill that follow to hit. Using streak to stun then firing a procced frag will lead to have the frag blocked or dodged 100% of the time if the ennemy is good.

A skill that stun take 1 GCD to be used and breaking free take less than 1 GCD. That's mean you have the time to break the stun and dodge/block by the time the skill used right after the stun land on you.

An uncounterable stun make the stun non avoidable, but make the following burst coming right after ALWAYS counterable if you are a good player.

A medium attack weaved into the burst can be countered if you see it coming BUT if it lands,it make the burst 100% guaranted.

One have a 100% chance to stun but up to 0% chance to land the burst while the other have a chance to not stun but 100% chance to land the burst if it stun.


Every stamina class have access to a uncounterable stun called Turn Evil.

Every stamina class have access to a true combo stun from dizzing swing off balance.

A stamina boi hwo complain about not having a good stun available is a boi hwo need to L2P.

Magicka NB have fear ( uncounterable) (stamblade have off balance stun)

Magicka DK have fossilize (uncounterable) (can be used by stam dk too)

Magicka Necro have fear totem (uncounterable) - this one is very bad and poorly designed because the 2s delay

Magicka sorc have streak (uncounterable) (can be used by stamsorc too)

Only templar and warden doesn't have a uncounterable/true combo stun.

Magicka Templar still have toppling charge which is still a good stun because all the effect around

Magicka Warden are *** hard.

Theze 3 class left offen use vampire drain with cut anim as a decent stun.



There is no reason to cry about streak stun, because streak stun does not allow to combo a skilled player.

Also remember that the delay after streak + 180° turn + crystal frag minimum travel time + cyrstal frag true travel time make the sorc "burst" even more avoidable than classical 1 GCD stun skills.

Oh , look who's here Now that(snip) SnB got absolutely butchered, you start calling l2p on people when they do the same for your precious zoo sorcerer, (snip).

(edited for baiting comment)