DOTs have been nerfed to the ground and now sorc's are immortal

Moonsorrow

It is amusing all this while the whole Audit is still going on, you all know we gonna keep getting big changes all the way up to next Chapter, that is propably when even bigger things happen and the promised "class identity" changes to the other 3 classes that already have not gotten them.

Still keep wishing they would have done all these changes to all classes at once, no point making pvp be this far away from balanced and weird radical ups and downs.

Nerfing and buffing Msorc back and forth is not new PVP content that makes this game exciting to play.


*We have not gotten much fresh and fun things to pvp since Battlegrounds, and that is a long time ago. But i guess the endless fight between Msorcs and Nightblades nerfs will keep us entertained.

technohic

Went from DOTs being too strong and templars OP to DOTs too weak and sorc OP. Onslaught, Dizzy Swing kill people to quick to people dont die.

I'll hope for maybe something more evenly balanced some day but given the track record of overreaction to people crying, I'm just going to sit back with my popcorn. It's always going to be something

chrightt

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

chrightt wrote: »

*unintelligible sorc main noises*

*I am a DK main with DK sunglasses who can’t comprehend simple logic and English. Leap should get buffed to only cost 20 ultimate so I don’t need thumbs to grow legs*

Pointless speaking to the DK centered players here. The only thing that actually lifts sorc atm is just the matriarch heal, but since you like DKs so much I simply want to show how strong of a class DK is atm but I guess thumbless players are thumbless for a reason. Even if they do buff DKs you’ll still be at the bottom of the barrel so really just reroll sorcs, give it a try, and continue to stay at the bottom of the barrel.

chrightt

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

Ahhhhh again more pointless rambling other than l2p

FYI, I play all the mag toons,
I quit playing this patch, because as I stated my complaint is inconsistency in skill reworks,

All I see is inconsistency in your ***. “I play all mag toons” “I quit playing this patch”. “I know the game so well I quit playing because I have all mag toons and I still don’t want to play because there’s so much inconsistency in nothing that I have stated”. Nicely done. What do you want skills to read? 3000 Magicka deal 10000 damage? As far as I’m concerned there are plenty of strong specs in dragonhold and if you’re not actually playing the game don’t give me your crap that you even know jack about the current pvp situation. Just roll your magsorc and stfu before you actually know what’s what.

mursie

chrightt wrote: »

[....

A magsorc piloted by a terrible player will only feel slightly above average - still a huge step up from what a truly terrible player would experience on any other class, but not worthy of the overpowered rhetoric constantly discussed on the forums. For these terrible players, a nerf would seem out of line.

i've seen you in bg's on your magsorc. i understand why you don't want the class nerfed.

Davadin

mursie wrote: »

chrightt wrote: »

[....

A magsorc piloted by a terrible player will only feel slightly above average - still a huge step up from what a truly terrible player would experience on any other class, but not worthy of the overpowered rhetoric constantly discussed on the forums. For these terrible players, a nerf would seem out of line.

i've seen you in bg's on your magsorc. i understand why you don't want the class nerfed.

SirMewser

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

Get ready to be bombarded by "l2p" coming from Sorc mains who are absolutely not biased in any way.

A nerf to sorcs is a buff to me, so yes please!

PhoenixGrey

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

As much as I don't like the nerf sorc stuff and I know it's not sorc players fault but nyassa brings up some good points and the buffs to streak are a joke. Magnb my main got the like 900 dps dot taken from path because it also healed for like 1.2 and gave me movement speed. They said it "did too much"

Meanwhile the best mobility tool in the game they also at the same time think. "You know what this bomb ass skill needs? An unblockable aoe stun!"

I don't like thier inconsistency

i think the buffs to streak were necessary after the shield cost increase. I

SoixanteNeuf wrote: »

Endless fury proc-ing only from the caster's dmg as a start would be neat. It won't directly affect anything else about a magsorc.

About Streak cost reduction: Magsorcs with a decent stam pool (especially high elves) can Roll dodge -> Streak/Ball Lightning too. I don't think they accounted for that when they balanced Streak cost around Roll dodge.

I think the streak cost reduction is fair since shields are nerfed and sustain is still an issue even with overload.

I get that most of your complaints with sorcs are due to bgs and it's due to the fact that mmr does not work and guess which class farms noobs the best. ? Sorc will find it the easiest to repeatedly farm the weak links in a team or spawn camp them even if that team has a couple of good players

I would probably recommend people to play some solo open world pvp for a couple of days.
It takes a really long time to kill anything decent and the problem is not just with sorcs.

Salix_alba

since when were sorcs not immortal? Aside from that one time that a patch broke shields so shield stacking sorcs were felled easily for a few days Good Times sigh.

Vajrak

NyassaV wrote: »

Sorc are immortal for reasons other than this. Ball Of Lightning got a huge buff for example and similar mobility skills such as a shade are still poopy in comparison.

And Immortal suggests they don't ever die (they do sometimes). As it is right now healing ward encourages shield stacking which sorc often does. Magblade struggles with that so yeah they may have a hard time. DK's might have a hard time staying on top of a sorc since Ball of Lightning is an overloaded skill.

There are lots of reasons sorc is good but to be frank I'll just say something that a lot of people overlook: Curse is busted. Curse goes through mistform and as far as I know it goes through evasion (which means it's an AOE?) and major/minor protection. Now if curse is an AOE it makes sense for that to bring me out of cloak but then it should be affected by evasion and it isn't. If It's a DOT than it should be suppressed by cloak and well it isn't (but to be fair I wouldn't consider it a DOT). So honestly IDK what curse is anymore but is persists even after dying which is weird too! Maybe don't nerf sorc and just nerf curse like they tried to do back in homestead before the ended up buffing the bloody thing since every sorc lost it when the patch notes came out.

Curse is a Delayed Damage (Timer) Direct Damage (like Power of the Light/Purifying Light) that has an AoE Burst Direct Damage rider around the initial target. So no, Evasion wouldn't effect it, and if it lands on you, it will bring you out of cloak because the effect is already on you, just the damage isn't on-hit, it's a few seconds after.

Curse can be purged.

5cript

Sorcs have just 3 options to gain health back (aside from potions)
- matriarch
- surge
- heal staff

as far as my experience goes, I dont see matriarch too often, I myself dont slot it or I have no damage
Everyone has access to the staff.

Leaves surge. Surge heal is strong, but you dont really build for crit, unless you wear Zaan, but that makes a sorc even squishier. So if anything you can take away surge from the sorcs.
Compare that to a templar self heal potential...

Shields have been nerfed over and over.

The only thing I notice that makes sorc tough is heal staff ult + brp staff + surge + shield.
But every class can do that, sorcs do it because the have nothing else.

Saying sorcs are tanky is a weird complaint, since most people complain about their perfectly lining up burst.

GhostofDatthaw

chrightt wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

Ahhhhh again more pointless rambling other than l2p

FYI, I play all the mag toons,
I quit playing this patch, because as I stated my complaint is inconsistency in skill reworks,

All I see is inconsistency in your ***. “I play all mag toons” “I quit playing this patch”. “I know the game so well I quit playing because I have all mag toons and I still don’t want to play because there’s so much inconsistency in nothing that I have stated”. Nicely done. What do you want skills to read? 3000 Magicka deal 10000 damage? As far as I’m concerned there are plenty of strong specs in dragonhold and if you’re not actually playing the game don’t give me your crap that you even know jack about the current pvp situation. Just roll your magsorc and stfu before you actually know what’s what.

I don't see your point, and the fact you seem so angry is comical. I'm not sure how me saying I have all mag toons geared out that I played, or that I quit this patch because I'm tired of the inconsistency in thier skill audits, somehow makes me inconsistent?

Classic "no u"

And you're also throwing straw man arguments there, I never suggested I want skills to be flat numbers and homogenized. You clearly missed my point in your hurry to be offended.

GhostofDatthaw

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

As much as I don't like the nerf sorc stuff and I know it's not sorc players fault but nyassa brings up some good points and the buffs to streak are a joke. Magnb my main got the like 900 dps dot taken from path because it also healed for like 1.2 and gave me movement speed. They said it "did too much"

Meanwhile the best mobility tool in the game they also at the same time think. "You know what this bomb ass skill needs? An unblockable aoe stun!"

I don't like thier inconsistency

i think the buffs to streak were necessary after the shield cost increase. I

SoixanteNeuf wrote: »

Endless fury proc-ing only from the caster's dmg as a start would be neat. It won't directly affect anything else about a magsorc.

About Streak cost reduction: Magsorcs with a decent stam pool (especially high elves) can Roll dodge -> Streak/Ball Lightning too. I don't think they accounted for that when they balanced Streak cost around Roll dodge.

I think the streak cost reduction is fair since shields are nerfed and sustain is still an issue even with overload.

Im not against the skill, its strong but what ever, every class needs a defining skill. Tbh I would rather go back to frag stuns but that neither here or there. It just bothers me that they buff skills that tbh didn't need it, streak was already good, and then nerfing other skills because they "do to much"

To me they are just changing things for the sake for changing them at this point with no real direction. I would love it if they reverted all combat changed to the patches pre Morrowind, those to me were the most diverse and engaging PvP days

Abyssmol

ku5h wrote: »

To sum up all the posts above:
- Streak OP, need nerf
- Ward OP, need nerf
- Curse OP, need nerf
- Conversion OP, need nerf
- Fury OP, need nerf
I'll just add Nerf Frags in here, since we know it'll show up to sooner or later, so we've covered every single skill Sorc's use.
I think Sorc should be allowed only to LA. No HAs since Sorc sustain is already broken OP.

No LA. Sorc should have no weapons

PhoenixGrey

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

As much as I don't like the nerf sorc stuff and I know it's not sorc players fault but nyassa brings up some good points and the buffs to streak are a joke. Magnb my main got the like 900 dps dot taken from path because it also healed for like 1.2 and gave me movement speed. They said it "did too much"

Meanwhile the best mobility tool in the game they also at the same time think. "You know what this bomb ass skill needs? An unblockable aoe stun!"

I don't like thier inconsistency

i think the buffs to streak were necessary after the shield cost increase. I

SoixanteNeuf wrote: »

Endless fury proc-ing only from the caster's dmg as a start would be neat. It won't directly affect anything else about a magsorc.

About Streak cost reduction: Magsorcs with a decent stam pool (especially high elves) can Roll dodge -> Streak/Ball Lightning too. I don't think they accounted for that when they balanced Streak cost around Roll dodge.

I think the streak cost reduction is fair since shields are nerfed and sustain is still an issue even with overload.

Im not against the skill, its strong but what ever, every class needs a defining skill. Tbh I would rather go back to frag stuns but that neither here or there. It just bothers me that they buff skills that tbh didn't need it, streak was already good, and then nerfing other skills because they "do to much"

To me they are just changing things for the sake for changing them at this point with no real direction. I would love it if they reverted all combat changed to the patches pre Morrowind, those to me were the most diverse and engaging PvP days

Yeah streak or BOL didn't need a buff. I would take my elswyr sorc back any day as it was a much better solo class which could actually kill things.

This version just needs to keep running from anything half decent as it shields just dont hold up against more than a few players.

Yeah sorc got buffed for group play with pet heal but honestly who cares about that

pieratsos

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

pieratsos wrote: »

Ragnarock41 wrote: »

chrightt wrote: »

*unintelligible sorc main noises*

Yeah sure it's unintelligible but to be fair, rumbling about immortal sorcs in a tank meta is just as unintelligible and biased.

I mean, yeah you're right about the tank meta however from my observations , I believe the matriarch heal and bol is kinda overperforming and contribute to making magsorcs almost unkillable. Rest of their kit feels balanced. (again, if you just observe a fight that involves a well built sorcerer you can see this for yourself, if you disagree you can feel free to come to me with numbers and show me where I'm wrong though. I'm not a sorc player myself, I just share my observations.)

I wouldn't really call for specific nerfs to sorcs though, I believe pretty much every heal that was buffed to account for old dots needs to be tuned down back to what they used to be. Things like BRP resto/dw also need some limitation to their uptime.

To think steadfast hero was nerfed when those weapons remained the same makes me sad honestly.

As for OP he has a point with dot nerfs giving sorcs more freedom. When dots were strong sorcs had to cast their shields often limiting their sustain, now thats not the case though.

A well built sorc is just as unkillable as a well built DK or templar.

P.S. No, that is still the case and it will always be this way as long as shields function in the way they do now and as long as sorcs have to crutch on them. They are simply very expensive to keep up.

Kagukan

I can't kill someone. Nerf it! Any class can feel immortal depending on the build.
If you want to kill a sorc come find me. My build is made for the benefit of a team, not 1vX. If you can pull me out of a group you have a good chance of killing me.

mursie

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

I think sorc struggles to kill anything decent this patch

This version just needs to keep running from anything half decent as it shields just dont hold up against more than a few players.

Mag Sorc is S tier in running away. Probably bottom of the pile in everything else

Mag sorc is the easiest spec to kill this patch.

Do you know mag sorc is basically a one shot under pressure this patch unless you drain 8k mag per second to keep those shields up ?

Yeah sorc got buffed for group play with pet heal but honestly who cares about that

Why can't the sorcs on these forums take the buffs and enjoy a patch where mag sorc is not utter trash and go back to being garbage in 5 months time.

Fun fact for you. In no cp the bird heal right now outperforms healing from rapid regen, entropy and crit surge. Excited to bring back my zoo so that I can be relevant in bgs again

you are an embarrassment

PhoenixGrey

mursie wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

I think sorc struggles to kill anything decent this patch

This version just needs to keep running from anything half decent as it shields just dont hold up against more than a few players.

Mag Sorc is S tier in running away. Probably bottom of the pile in everything else

Mag sorc is the easiest spec to kill this patch.

Do you know mag sorc is basically a one shot under pressure this patch unless you drain 8k mag per second to keep those shields up ?

Yeah sorc got buffed for group play with pet heal but honestly who cares about that

Why can't the sorcs on these forums take the buffs and enjoy a patch where mag sorc is not utter trash and go back to being garbage in 5 months time.

Fun fact for you. In no cp the bird heal right now outperforms healing from rapid regen, entropy and crit surge. Excited to bring back my zoo so that I can be relevant in bgs again

you are an embarrassment

So you want to take all my comments out of context from multiple threads eh ? I firmly stand by those comments in separate threads and it's my opinion /troll

Your standard of playing this game and ideas of balance are out of date and really boring tbh !

I can show a whole bunch of videos out of context featuring the great mursie if you really want to go that route.

PhoenixGrey

mursie wrote: »

PhoenixGrey wrote: »

I think sorc struggles to kill anything decent this patch

This version just needs to keep running from anything half decent as it shields just dont hold up against more than a few players.

Mag Sorc is S tier in running away. Probably bottom of the pile in everything else

Mag sorc is the easiest spec to kill this patch.

Do you know mag sorc is basically a one shot under pressure this patch unless you drain 8k mag per second to keep those shields up ?

Yeah sorc got buffed for group play with pet heal but honestly who cares about that

Why can't the sorcs on these forums take the buffs and enjoy a patch where mag sorc is not utter trash and go back to being garbage in 5 months time.

Fun fact for you. In no cp the bird heal right now outperforms healing from rapid regen, entropy and crit surge. Excited to bring back my zoo so that I can be relevant in bgs again

you are an embarrassment

You should probably refrain from such obnoxious behavior in game or the forums

I would reckon your comments are worth something when you play at least one class at a certain standard in all 3 aspects of pvp ( openworld / duels and bgs )

chrightt

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

I don't see your point, and the fact you seem so angry is comical. I'm not sure how me saying I have all mag toons geared out that I played, or that I quit this patch because I'm tired of the inconsistency in thier skill audits, somehow makes me inconsistent?

Classic "no u"

And you're also throwing straw man arguments there, I never suggested I want skills to be flat numbers and homogenized. You clearly missed my point in your hurry to be offended.

No point talking to someone who doesn’t even have a clue what he is talking about. Also, btw I’m usually laughing my ass off at how dumb comments like yours are rather than being angry. They’re just so damn amusing I feel exasperated as I type.

mursie wrote: »

chrightt wrote: »

[....

i've seen you in bg's on your magsorc. i understand why you don't want the class nerfed.

Lmao whatever you say mate. My magsorc in BG just uses my spare set and heals half the time now in pug groups. It isn’t even tuned for BG and I certainly can’t tank for *** there. I don’t even run fury 90% of the time cause I know people complain about KSing all day and when there’s a magsorc teammate they always run fury. Yet, I still consistently score top of the chart with highest damage/heals/score if I manage to actually get into a damn game at the start these days which is a challenge of its own (or breaking the buggy af vamp drain). No idea who you, probably some halfwit premade salty that you can’t beat down a pug group you thought was another premade. Ah no wait I see you salty cause you die to sorcs once too many times.

mursie wrote: »

you are an embarrassment

Much useful comment. You can try running a magsorc yourself in no CP and see how it goes. Probably one of those sorcs shielding away while on take a dump on you. Anyways this thread is a royal waste of time at this point so peace out.

GhostofDatthaw

chrightt wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

I don't see your point, and the fact you seem so angry is comical. I'm not sure how me saying I have all mag toons geared out that I played, or that I quit this patch because I'm tired of the inconsistency in thier skill audits, somehow makes me inconsistent?

Classic "no u"

And you're also throwing straw man arguments there, I never suggested I want skills to be flat numbers and homogenized. You clearly missed my point in your hurry to be offended.

No point talking to someone who doesn’t even have a clue what he is talking about. Also, btw I’m usually laughing my ass off at how dumb comments like yours are rather than being angry. They’re just so damn amusing I feel exasperated as I type.

mursie wrote: »

chrightt wrote: »

[....

i've seen you in bg's on your magsorc. i understand why you don't want the class nerfed.

Lmao whatever you say mate. My magsorc in BG just uses my spare set and heals half the time now in pug groups. It isn’t even tuned for BG and I certainly can’t tank for *** there. I don’t even run fury 90% of the time cause I know people complain about KSing all day and when there’s a magsorc teammate they always run fury. Yet, I still consistently score top of the chart with highest damage/heals/score if I manage to actually get into a damn game at the start these days which is a challenge of its own (or breaking the buggy af vamp drain). No idea who you, probably some halfwit premade salty that you can’t beat down a pug group you thought was another premade. Ah no wait I see you salty cause you die to sorcs once too many times.

mursie wrote: »

you are an embarrassment

Much useful comment. You can try running a magsorc yourself in no CP and see how it goes. Probably one of those sorcs shielding away while on take a dump on you. Anyways this thread is a royal waste of time at this point so peace out.

What exactly is dumb about my comment? Because all you have given me is "no u". I'm still waiting for your point about how I'm dumb for saying zos is inconsistent in thier skill audits. It really funny how people like you try to belittle people who may not share the same thoughts as you on a subject. You obviously love the stun on sorc streak and feel the need to attack the people who felt it was either foolish, or like me a change for change sake.

And that rambling you're doing at mursie, just lol. You say sorc is not strong is one comment, then you have like 500 words on how your magsorc runs backup gear and is not tuned for bgs at all and still scores in the top of everything.... So what is it? Is sorc just that strong? Is sorc a crap tier and you're just an eso God? As you said to me, I love to come laugh at people on the forums.

itscompton

Sorc is pretty well balanced right now in my opinion. Before the nerfs to shields taking on a Sorc with my Magplar was just asking to get whupped. Last patch flipped that around to where Sorcs were free AP because any two ST dots applied together took down a shield every 3-4 seconds; with this patch I'm finding myself getting into nice even fights in which I have the ability to stun/burst the Sorc but have to be careful not to overspend resources lining it up or else I'm the one that gets burst down.
The only thing I think is cheesy about the class is when their pets tank damage by getting in the LOS. Pets, including those spawned by sets, should either be non-targetable in PvP or should forward a portion of damage received to their owner.

Mayrael

I dare to disagree. Till this day Ive met 2 magsorcs that I wasn't able to kill and get them below 50%, but they couldn't do this to me either. While all the rest sorcs are totally killable...

Vanzen

Anyone honnest with an experience playing most of the classes will aknowledge that sorcs (at least in BG) are a pure scandal since day one.

Whan I want to feeel good I play my sorc. Its a walk in the park compared to any other class, maybe on par with NB, but even NB takes a bit of skill to achieve something, Sorcs have just to stay carefully away and hit fury once in a while.

katorga

People been killing sorcs since day one; BEFORE the streak, shield, healing ward, crystal frags, crit surge, velocious curse, implosion, overload, 3rd bar, and pet nerfs. Yep. Almost every single ability has been soundly nerfed, some multiple times, since release.

If you can't beat them now. Don't know what to say.

PhoenixGrey

chrightt wrote: »

Lmao whatever you say mate. My magsorc in BG just uses my spare set and heals half the time now in pug groups. It isn’t even tuned for BG and I certainly can’t tank for *** there. I don’t even run fury 90% of the time cause I know people complain about KSing all day and when there’s a magsorc teammate they always run fury. Yet, I still consistently score top of the chart with highest damage/heals/score if I manage to actually get into a damn game at the start these days which is a challenge of its own (or breaking the buggy af vamp drain). No idea who you, probably some halfwit premade salty that you can’t beat down a pug group you thought was another premade. Ah no wait I see you salty cause you die to sorcs once too many times.

mursie wrote: »

you are an embarrassment

Much useful comment. You can try running a magsorc yourself in no CP and see how it goes. Probably one of those sorcs shielding away while on take a dump on you. Anyways this thread is a royal waste of time at this point so peace out.

OP, mursie does run mag sorc in no CP along with other classes and I would say he is equally skilled in all of them

GhostofDatthaw

katorga wrote: »

People been killing sorcs since day one; BEFORE the streak, shield, healing ward, crystal frags, crit surge, velocious curse, implosion, overload, 3rd bar, and pet nerfs. Yep. Almost every single ability has been soundly nerfed, some multiple times, since release.

If you can't beat them now. Don't know what to say.

You can say that about any class at this point dude. Look at my magnb, incap nerfed, cloak, swallow soul, cripple, siphon strikes, refreshing path, shadow image, agony is gone, fear, mark... Should I go on? And I'm sure the same can be said for every class. Stop the pity party please, sorcs are still a good class

Bubosh

Make sorc great again we want @Fasold666 back

Sarousse

The core mechanic of magicka stacking sorcs that allow to have great defense while keeping great offense has always been the reason why this class is so strong and that will never change, get used to it.