PvP Magicka DKs: How is your sustain now?

ThatNeonZebraAgain

I've been using Crafty Alfiq and BSW combo since Elsweyr came out, and sustain has solid in CP-enabled instances. I'd occasionally have to throw in some heavy attacks if the fighting was particularly chaotic or lasting longer than a couple minutes. However, been running around IC last hour or so and have noticed that my sustain has taken a big hit this patch. There were several times I died because I was totally out of resources where that never used to happen. Removing the cooldown from Combustion doesn't seem to have had any effect on sustain, and I'm even wearing BSW whose 5pc proc applies Burning status effect. With all the cost increases to DoTs, spamming Flames of Oblivion now makes for a better way to charge up the big hit of Molten Whip. Considering switching out BSW for Bright-throat's boast to help with this sustain, but then I'd lose a significant chunk of my damage.

What has been your experience so far?\

EDIT: This is also with Breton racial passives and 1500 magicka regen. I also swap in Elemental Drain into a flex spot on my bar when it seems appropriate for the encounter.

Somewhere

I was only able to get a few BG matches in this morning, however I didnt find it too bad. I will say I was using heavies far more since entropy has less damage I was trying out molten armaments. Just used a lot of heavies from a distance and closed in with full resources.

ZarkingFrued

Somewhere wrote: »

I was only able to get a few BG matches in this morning, however I didnt find it too bad. I will say I was using heavies far more since entropy has less damage I was trying out molten armaments. Just used a lot of heavies from a distance and closed in with full resources.

Doesnt help for the majority of builds not spamming resource returning attack..

ZarkingFrued

Its horrible. What can we expect when they raise costs on an already struggling class, and try to tie sustain to proccing a status effect that honestly doesn't proc that often? The changes only hurt pvp per usual for Mdk.

Stridig

Mine seems ok. I'm just over 1600 regen and using the new "New Moon" set. I just changed 1 jewel trait and it seems fine.

LinearParadox

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

-Snip- With all the cost increases to DoTs, spamming Flames of Oblivion now makes for a better way to charge up the big hit of Molten Whip.

Brilliant game design there, spamming a 15-second duration skill is more cost and damage efficient than one that's meant to be used often.

Anyron

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

I've been using Crafty Alfiq and BSW combo since Elsweyr came out, and sustain has solid in CP-enabled instances. I'd occasionally have to throw in some heavy attacks if the fighting was particularly chaotic or lasting longer than a couple minutes. However, been running around IC last hour or so and have noticed that my sustain has taken a big hit this patch. There were several times I died because I was totally out of resources where that never used to happen. Removing the cooldown from Combustion doesn't seem to have had any effect on sustain, and I'm even wearing BSW whose 5pc proc applies Burning status effect. With all the cost increases to DoTs, spamming Flames of Oblivion now makes for a better way to charge up the big hit of Molten Whip. Considering switching out BSW for Bright-throat's boast to help with this sustain, but then I'd lose a significant chunk of my damage.

What has been your experience so far?

You are using alfiq and burning spellweave and you wonder you have bad sustain?

I wish i could use that on my magsorc. But because we have costly skills i have to use alfiq + some resource set, like Bright-throat's or warlock

Tolino

Magdks PvP: Our Sustain is bad
Also Magdks: Use builds with 800 - 1400 Magreg

Other classes use 1800-2200 Magreg (+Sustain Skill)

I don't get it.

robpr

It's bad as ever, but when I switched back to Crushing Shock spam with Asylum Inferno, with Flame Enchant front Combustion can proc 2-4 times giving nice boost to magicka. Rng reliant if flame enchant proc the burning, but it's not that bad overall in the end. We are used to starve with resources.

juhislihis19

Tolino wrote: »

Magdks PvP: Our Sustain is bad
Also Magdks: Use builds with 800 - 1400 Magreg

Other classes use 1800-2200 Magreg (+Sustain Skill)

I don't get it.

This seems odd as well. On all of my stamina characters my stam rec has always been 1500-2400, except maybe with Warden can be little less with Netch.

Haquor

Tolino wrote: »

Magdks PvP: Our Sustain is bad
Also Magdks: Use builds with 800 - 1400 Magreg

Other classes use 1800-2200 Magreg (+Sustain Skill)

I don't get it.

Magedk sustain is traditionally not just from that number though.

zParallaxz

Tolino wrote: »

Magdks PvP: Our Sustain is bad
Also Magdks: Use builds with 800 - 1400 Magreg

Other classes use 1800-2200 Magreg (+Sustain Skill)

I don't get it.

Keep in mind dks have no passive that gives stam or mag recovery.

Iskiab

robpr wrote: »

It's bad as ever, but when I switched back to Crushing Shock spam with Asylum Inferno, with Flame Enchant front Combustion can proc 2-4 times giving nice boost to magicka. Rng reliant if flame enchant proc the burning, but it's not that bad overall in the end. We are used to starve with resources.

That’s pretty clever. I’m thinking jorvlund + willpower + BRP DW + Asylum fame, think this would work well?

Either that or trying the maurader set or Desert Rose.

chrightt

Sustain is not that good, but comparatively I’d say as a magDK we have strong CC, strong burst, strong DoTs. Honestly, I see good magDKs really popping off this patch in BGs and even Cyrodiil. Probably one of the strongest specs to play on if you know how. (For my setup only claws and breath got a bit more expensive but the passive buff actually returns me more Magicka as well so all works well.

Seriously though, it’s amazing how MagDKs think they should be able to “sustain” on 2 5 piece DPS sets. Somehow all the players of the 5 other classes seems just a tad bit smarter in general.

ThatNeonZebraAgain

Anyron wrote: »

You are using alfiq and burning spellweave and you wonder you have bad sustain?

I wish i could use that on my magsorc. But because we have costly skills i have to use alfiq + some resource set, like Bright-throat's or warlock

chrightt wrote: »

Seriously though, it’s amazing how MagDKs think they should be able to “sustain” on 2 5 piece DPS sets. Somehow all the players of the 5 other classes seems just a tad bit smarter in general.

So I forgot to mention, my experience was with Breton racial passives and 1500 magicka regen. Additionally, Harness Magicka is a mainstay on my bar, but I also swap in Elemental Drain into a flex spot when it seems appropriate for the encounter. And as a class DKs can typically get away with lower regen because of the Battle Roar passive, which returns resources when you use an ultimate; so my sustain capabilities are actually on the high side for DKs in general. Yet despite all this, the removal of the cooldown on the Combustion passive seems to have zero effect on my sustain so far, which was why I made this post. Regardless of the DoT damage last patch, sustain in CP-enabled settings was much more manageable.

chrightt

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

So I forgot to mention, my experience was with Breton racial passives and 1500 magicka regen. Additionally, Harness Magicka is a mainstay on my bar, but I also swap in Elemental Drain into a flex spot when it seems appropriate for the encounter. And as a class DKs can typically get away with lower regen because of the Battle Roar passive, which returns resources when you use an ultimate; so my sustain capabilities are actually on the high side for DKs in general. Yet despite all this, the removal of the cooldown on the Combustion passive seems to have zero effect on my sustain so far, which was why I made this post. Regardless of the DoT damage last patch, sustain in CP-enabled settings was much more manageable.

I see where you’re coming from now. However, a few things to point out: harness Magicka is now trash. It costs a ton of Magicka and your shield pops in one or two hits; thus, you’ll see better overall sustain if you stop relying on this skill or swap morphs. 1.5k is not a lot of mag regen. My magDK without CP has over 1.5k mag regen because I run a sustain set. (Also Magicka return from 2 piece heavy while getting hit). Elemental drain is a good option but you need to remember to apply it. If you watched some of Dottzgaming’s video in his magDK he almost always forgets to apply it despite having a sufficient time gap to do so very often. Yet, he can still sustain for some duration. Finally, I suggest trying out charged weapon trait to feel the load of sustain from combustion. Infused is also a decent trait with flame enchant that does more damage than charged for less sustain.

ThatNeonZebraAgain

chrightt wrote: »

I see where you’re coming from now. However, a few things to point out: harness Magicka is now trash. It costs a ton of Magicka and your shield pops in one or two hits; thus, you’ll see better overall sustain if you stop relying on this skill or swap morphs. 1.5k is not a lot of mag regen. My magDK without CP has over 1.5k mag regen because I run a sustain set. (Also Magicka return from 2 piece heavy while getting hit). Elemental drain is a good option but you need to remember to apply it. If you watched some of Dottzgaming’s video in his magDK he almost always forgets to apply it despite having a sufficient time gap to do so very often. Yet, he can still sustain for some duration. Finally, I suggest trying out charged weapon trait to feel the load of sustain from combustion. Infused is also a decent trait with flame enchant that does more damage than charged for less sustain.

Thanks for those tips! Going to swap trait and enchant on my backbar staff to charged/flame, and experiment with doing animation cancelling light/heavy attacks with Crushing shock. Since I'm dropping Harness and DoTs in general, I'm thinking of also changing back to Flame Lash and swapping Fiery Breath for Choking Talons to pick up more healing and mitigation.

Anyron

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

Anyron wrote: »

You are using alfiq and burning spellweave and you wonder you have bad sustain?

I wish i could use that on my magsorc. But because we have costly skills i have to use alfiq + some resource set, like Bright-throat's or warlock

chrightt wrote: »

Seriously though, it’s amazing how MagDKs think they should be able to “sustain” on 2 5 piece DPS sets. Somehow all the players of the 5 other classes seems just a tad bit smarter in general.

So I forgot to mention, my experience was with Breton racial passives and 1500 magicka regen. Additionally, Harness Magicka is a mainstay on my bar, but I also swap in Elemental Drain into a flex spot when it seems appropriate for the encounter. And as a class DKs can typically get away with lower regen because of the Battle Roar passive, which returns resources when you use an ultimate; so my sustain capabilities are actually on the high side for DKs in general. Yet despite all this, the removal of the cooldown on the Combustion passive seems to have zero effect on my sustain so far, which was why I made this post. Regardless of the DoT damage last patch, sustain in CP-enabled settings was much more manageable.

i got it. all i was wanted to do is to point where i think your problem is. using two damage sets isnt working anymore in pvp,
even with alfiq + Bright-throat's i have really bad sustain . but thats because i play no-cp pvp

it may work in cp. try to swap one of your sets for sustain set. it can help a lot

Haquor

Ive been running bs, clever achemist, bsw, destro/restro, 5 light, apprentice mundus, trifood and my sustain is ok. Using drain. Believe it or not.

SipofMaim

It's fine. I had to adjust some things though. If I'd stayed with what I was running last patch, I'd be suffering.

We've been here before. Lucky us with our inherently weak sustain in the first place.

MyPrist

Skills do not work correct !!! What sustain are you talking about ?

Who need it if skills are buged?

0% add from moltan armaments on restro heavy fully charged attacks.

< 20% on destro lightning.

I see a lot of topicks with bugs.

Who cares about sustain ?

I am happy that light attack and bash works.

New future meta will be:

Nothing works, light attack+ bash them to death ?

lucky_Sage

Tolino wrote: »

Magdks PvP: Our Sustain is bad
Also Magdks: Use builds with 800 - 1400 Magreg

Other classes use 1800-2200 Magreg (+Sustain Skill)

I don't get it.

well dks sustain is tied to ulti. and for dks to get dmg to match other classes we have to spec more dmg

lucky_Sage

Anyron wrote: »

ThatNeonZebraAgain wrote: »

I've been using Crafty Alfiq and BSW combo since Elsweyr came out, and sustain has solid in CP-enabled instances. I'd occasionally have to throw in some heavy attacks if the fighting was particularly chaotic or lasting longer than a couple minutes. However, been running around IC last hour or so and have noticed that my sustain has taken a big hit this patch. There were several times I died because I was totally out of resources where that never used to happen. Removing the cooldown from Combustion doesn't seem to have had any effect on sustain, and I'm even wearing BSW whose 5pc proc applies Burning status effect. With all the cost increases to DoTs, spamming Flames of Oblivion now makes for a better way to charge up the big hit of Molten Whip. Considering switching out BSW for Bright-throat's boast to help with this sustain, but then I'd lose a significant chunk of my damage.

What has been your experience so far?

You are using alfiq and burning spellweave and you wonder you have bad sustain?

I wish i could use that on my magsorc. But because we have costly skills i have to use alfiq + some resource set, like Bright-throat's or warlock

@Anyron
dks sustain is bassed of ulting so we can get slightly lower because we get back from ulting but its a bad thing because we need a ult to land kills

kalunte

Too many dk here are forgetting/denying the existence of the combustion passive... and the inner cooldown removal...

They should start studying first.

Anyway the first tic of burning dmg occurring at second 0, using the charged trait, any destro staff for mag, infused flame enchants, any possible way to proc burning or poisoned will be both a little dmg boost and a sustain tool.

AS for if it's enough or not, I can't tell, I'm no dk at all..

NBrookus

Combustion doesn't provide any sustain at all versus Dunmer.

Mag sustain on my DK doesn't really feel much different this patch. Now stam sustain... the sprint cost reduction is

Tolino

zParallaxz wrote: »

[

Keep in mind dks have no passive that gives stam or mag recovery.

Yes. The other classes have all Passive which give them 600 Magreg .....


Dk Sustain is OP compared to other classes.
The problem of dks are missing dmg passives

JumpmanLane

I played at times with 688 recovery last patch. (Get those heavies in). Sustain hasn’t been an issue this patch...except for when I tried New Moon. 5% across the board is noticeable, DOABLE, but noticeable.

There’s no reason to have to work so hard. The new set is trash.

lucky_Sage

Sustain of a proc change is not good dks. I even switched to charged triat and can’t tell that the passive is helping

deepseamk20b14_ESO

So far manageable. I only have 1200 regen, then I have elemental drain, maelstrom resto staff back bar, and bloodthorn. I also went with nord so I kind of figure my ult into my regen and as nord with bloodspawn my ult gain is fairly nice, thus getting resource return a bit more often.

Lokey0024

MyPrist wrote: »

Skills do not work correct !!! What sustain are you talking about ?

Who need it if skills are buged?

0% add from moltan armaments on restro heavy fully charged attacks.

< 20% on destro lightning.

I see a lot of topicks with bugs.

Who cares about sustain ?

I am happy that light attack and bash works.

New future meta will be:

Nothing works, light attack+ bash them to death ?

This kinda bothers me. I was using off balance heavies with molten to supplement sustain with decent/high damage heavy attack hits. I prepped many sets with lightning staffs just for This, taking the 8% dmg from inferno staves bonus. This was rewarding but risky. Now it's not working? Lame.

Gorrest

I went with Charged+Flame glyph and I do just fine with 750 regen