Best Possible Premade BG Group

Iskiab

A post in another thread got me thinking. What do you think would be the nastiest premade BG group after the patch?

I’m thinking:

Stamplar
Magsorc (matriarch pet)
MagDK
* flex Synergy Mag/Stamnecro, another stamplar, maybe a Stamwarden or Magtemplar

Why discuss it? Group synergy is interesting, might learn something. I know some people hate premades but whatever.

chrightt

Would trade in a mag warden for the magsorc 10/10 every time 100% of the time. Don’t think necro is all that good if you’re aiming for death match. It depends a lot on what you bring and what your opponents are as well. In game theory you can have multiple Nash equilibrium so not one single strategy is dominant. That is usually the case with team match ups.

What I can say your team lacks heals and utility. Magsorc pet heals so-so especially cause it costs 4.5k and only scales off Magicka meaning an effective heal from matriarch limits the magsorc to a really classy build. Personally would probably prefer a magplar over a stamplar and toss in a stamden instead.

Finally, it also depends on how well each player plays their role so... I would basically pick from the more OP classes next patch which are DK (especially mag), both types of templar would work, and wardens (stamden for DPS, magden for great support and utility). Last slot would be a filler that can use a class already used. Oh yeah I forgot about nightblades. A good nightblade can really help focus down an enemy to sway the whole battle one way but if the NB can’t pull his weight on DPS and disruption then just use something else with more support for teammates.

Urzigurumash

Are we only talking about Death Match? Obviously StamSorc and StamDK shine in objective modes, but don't seem to be the best for Death Match. Conversely MagSorcs are fairly useless in Flag Games, in my experience.

I would say over the last few patches, MagSorc, MagPlar, StamPlar, and StamDen for Death Match. Of course both types of Blades and MagDK occasionally have the best score in Death Match, but I've only seen a Cro take the top score a few times. I'm not sure I see enough MagDens to comment on them at all.

However, I've seen a StamDK take the top score in Death Match maybe never. That's ok since we are overall the best, or tied with StamSorc, in Crazy King and Relic Runner.

In a way Domination and Chaos Ball are the best test of team play, and so group cohesion is much more important than particular class, I think. Of course StamSorc and StamDK make the best ball runners, and StamDK and MagPlar the best for standing still with the ball. However especially in this last patch, any class advantage in running or holding the ball is easily nullified by good group play.

UrbanMonk

Magden (Heal/Support/Damage)// Stamden// StamDK// Magplar

This would be my dream combo to go to.

Thogard

Four players specced for avoiding fights and only engaging once the other two teams are already fighting:

Pansy
Pansy
Pansy
Pansy

HowlKimchi

Magplar
Magplar
Stamden
Stamden

GhostofDatthaw

A team of perma cloak magnbs, can't kill what ya can't see chump. We may never win, but we, will never lose!

Iskiab

chrightt wrote: »

Would trade in a mag warden for the magsorc 10/10 every time 100% of the time. Don’t think necro is all that good if you’re aiming for death match. It depends a lot on what you bring and what your opponents are as well. In game theory you can have multiple Nash equilibrium so not one single strategy is dominant. That is usually the case with team match ups.

What I can say your team lacks heals and utility. Magsorc pet heals so-so especially cause it costs 4.5k and only scales off Magicka meaning an effective heal from matriarch limits the magsorc to a really classy build. Personally would probably prefer a magplar over a stamplar and toss in a stamden instead.

Finally, it also depends on how well each player plays their role so... I would basically pick from the more OP classes next patch which are DK (especially mag), both types of templar would work, and wardens (stamden for DPS, magden for great support and utility). Last slot would be a filler that can use a class already used. Oh yeah I forgot about nightblades. A good nightblade can really help focus down an enemy to sway the whole battle one way but if the NB can’t pull his weight on DPS and disruption then just use something else with more support for teammates.

Actually magsorc with the pet will have a really good burst heal. Cost was reduced to around 3k from whatever it is now. Matriarch heal scales purely with magicka so with Necropence on PTS in CP I got my matriarch heal up 18k. I’m not sure what that would translate to without CPs, but since it can’t crit no-CPs might make it relatively stronger.

Magcro is because I’ve seen harmony magcros hit me with that self synergy ability for 17k in CP pvp. I never see them in BGs, I’m not sure why. In a premade the same strategy might work.

Biggest change this patch imo is I’d expect cross healing from magdks and pet sorcs, where they traditionally didn’t do much.

EtTuBrutus

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

A team of perma cloak magnbs, can't kill what ya can't see chump. We may never win, but we, will never lose!

Not winning is losing...

Metemsycosis

Brutus never heard of a tie

Metemsycosis

Here is mine

Magplar, for toppling charge alone tbh
Magden
Magdk
Stamden

Skoomah

Magplar
Magplar
Magplar
Magplar

xWarbrain

My Magden

Then I'd clone myself 3 times and all of myselves will play the exact same Magdens.

4 tanky, damage dealing healers.

EtTuBrutus

He specifically said not win. A tie resulting in a win is a win.

But tying is for punk bs

Urzigurumash

Iskiab wrote: »

Magcro is because I’ve seen harmony magcros hit me with that self synergy ability for 17k in CP pvp. I never see them in BGs, I’m not sure why. In a premade the same strategy might work.

It's one of the strongest things going in PvP with Colossus, but maybe it's just too seldom and too risky to be popular. I think the best Cro scores I've seen in Death Match are on a MagCro.

Iskiab

Urzigurumash wrote: »

Iskiab wrote: »

Magcro is because I’ve seen harmony magcros hit me with that self synergy ability for 17k in CP pvp. I never see them in BGs, I’m not sure why. In a premade the same strategy might work.

It's one of the strongest things going in PvP with Colossus, but maybe it's just too seldom and too risky to be popular. I think the best Cro scores I've seen in Death Match are on a MagCro.

Yea, if you’re running lots of harmony traits you’re really reliant on your group for synergies. DK has a good damage one, templar and NB have good ultimates. In a premade it’d probably be good.

Hard to say without playing one. That’s when you figure out the spec’s limitations.

GhostofDatthaw

EtTuBrutus wrote: »

GhostofDatthaw wrote: »

A team of perma cloak magnbs, can't kill what ya can't see chump. We may never win, but we, will never lose!

Not winning is losing...

Tell that to my wall of participation trophies

Calboy

Magplar - dps/heals - epic damage and group heals with utility
Magdk - dps - absolute monster with a healer and offers good cc
Stamden/ stamdk - dps - stamina burst and executes
Magden - heals - insane group healer to allow magdk and stam dps to go full beast mode

Iskiab

Calboy wrote: »

Magplar - dps/heals - epic damage and group heals with utility
Magdk - dps - absolute monster with a healer and offers good cc
Stamden/ stamdk - dps - stamina burst and executes
Magden - heals - insane group healer to allow magdk and stam dps to go full beast mode

Great group for winning a head to head fight, but he who gets the last hit gets credit. Magplar execute’s okay and stam will be able to contribute, but you might lose to killstealing Sorcs and Magblades.

Qbiken

Thogard wrote: »

Four players specced for avoiding fights and only engaging once the other two teams are already fighting:

Pansy
Pansy
Pansy
Pansy

So far I think Thogard is the only one that got the right answer.

Maulkin

People are picking compositions for a sludge match. But in a 3-way battle where 2 of the teams are brawling, an untouchable team of 4 x MagSorcs will steal nearly all the kills while kiting with burst.

If you want to pick sludge-match teams, there's many combinations of them that work; primarily built around these 3 classes:
- DK
- Warden
- Templar
..whether stam or magicka. But you can also fit a Magblade healer or a decent MagNecro in there.

The only thing that really matters is to pick a team that is consistent in its purpose. It's either a team of bursty kiters or a team of melee brawlers with a lot of cross-healing. There's no point in having a tanky, slow healer if 2 of your teammates are a stamblade and a sorc (mag or stam) that will turn and run the second your team is pushed leaving the healer alone to get focused and die. The team needs to be relatively close to each other, because body-blocking damage is the best way to help teammates in trouble.

That said in my experience, 3 premades are the most boring matches you could ever play. Everyone tentatively poking and moving, without committing into a fight, for fear of getting dog-piled by the 3 team. Just boring af. The best games are those composed by highly competent solo and duo players who know to support their teammates but don't all move in lockstep like a premade on voice comms. You need a little bit of YOLO spirit and uncoordination to make the games fun.

ketsparrowhawk

For deathmatch? Magplar healer with mist form + 3 mag sorcs is pretty brutal.

kylewwefan

Under 50. 3 werewolves, 1 Sorc (me)

The WW shred opponents to within inches of their lives and I secure the kills with Mages wrath. All of the kills. They’re all mine!

It’s the I win button for battlegrounds. Under 50 anyways.

BNOC

Thogard wrote: »

Four players specced for avoiding fights and only engaging once the other two teams are already fighting:

Pansy
Pansy
Pansy
Pansy

@ Mad Max if you're on here, he's talking about you.

I agree though, the most effective premade is one that avoids all combat and just plays objective like they're capping Cyrodil resources or empty IC districts.

universal_wrath

Templar BIS premade

AAbrigo

4 werewolfs would probably destroy everything if build right..

Qbiken

AAbrigo wrote: »

4 werewolfs would probably destroy everything if build right..

Lmao, ww is trash in high mmr games maybe for sub 50 but below 50 bg are irrelevant imo

Iskiab

I prefer groups with a healer myself. Rush all the teams that try and play hide and seek and just roll them.

Someone said 4 sorcs too, I’ve never seen a 4 sorc team do well. In one game it was me and 3 sorcs and we only had 2 deaths on our team but still lost.

I think it’s a preference issue. Personally I find the hide and seek games boring, I like to brawl it out. I also find a lot of sorcs are too worried about their KvD and not enough about winning. Those who’re too timid to push, or lack sustain to keep pushing, are mostly dead weight. They might have good final stats but usually end up on the losing team. Looking good while losing seems pointless to me.

That’s why I’ve never thought sorcs were OP. If they were you could play 4 Sorcs and do well, but it’s a terrible group combo from my experience.

Decimus

Magplar
Magplar
Magplar/Stamplar
mSorc (y'know, to steal all the kills from other teams while hiding behind those healbots)

sabresandiego_ESO

Honestly almost any combo of healer and 3dps is ideal, based on player builds and skill more than class. Healing is mandatory though and affects the game more than anything.

xeha_arwen11

When it comes to a broken system that puts pugs up against premades, the best possible premade is NO premade.

ZOS needs to get premades and pugs a different queue. The whole MMR system and premade fighting pug system is broken and terrible, ruining bgs. Premades are cheating when you're against pugs. Pure and simple. Anyone who does premades against pugs is just showing that they have no skill. They suck all fun out of the game for casuals, pugs, and serious players who don't want to cheat.

Premades against premades isn't cheating. That would be fine. Pugs against pugs is fine. Not talking about that. I stopped bgs a long time ago because of toxicity, other types of cheating and exploiting, and because the top was just premades farming pugs. I was 1st place in spite of the fact that I refused to be a part of a premade and was always thrown up against premades, but it's not fun in the slightest. 99 percent of people in-game who have talked to me about bgs have had nothing but complaints against premades farming pugs. Just get separate queues. Then bgs would actually be fun for almost everyone.