The maintenance is complete and the PTS is now back online. The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test!
The Gold Road Chapter – which includes the Scribing system – and Update 42 is now available to test on the PTS! You can read the latest patch notes here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/656454/
Maintenance for the week of April 15:
• [COMPLETE] ESO Store and Account System for maintenance – April 16, 8:00AM EDT (12:00 UTC) - 6:00PM EDT (22:00 UTC)
• [COMPLETE] ESO Store and Account System for maintenance – April 16, 8:00AM EDT (12:00 UTC) - 6:00PM EDT (22:00 UTC)
Please stop making the same mistake with DPS!
DeathStalker
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Please stop lowering the DPS floor and lower the DPS ceiling instead. If what is on PTS goes live it's the casual player that will be hurt, not the end game elitist. Nerf light attack damage or Trial sets for example of how to lower DPS ceiling and not touch the DPS floor. Also, No sustain equals no fun! Heavy Attacking is slow and boring! All your doing is making it a lot easier to go play other games. I love ESO and I beg you to admit this is the wrong direction and stop hitting sustain and the DPS floor with nerf after nerf.
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BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭DeathStalker wrote: »Please stop lowering the DPS floor and lower the DPS ceiling instead. If what is on PTS goes live it's the casual player that will be hurt, not the end game elitist. Nerf light attack damage or Trial sets for example of how to lower DPS ceiling and not touch the DPS floor. Also, No sustain equals no fun! Heavy Attacking is slow and boring! All your doing is making it a lot easier to go play other games. I love ESO and I beg you to admit this is the wrong direction and stop hitting sustain and the DPS floor with nerf after nerf.
God slayer impossible now outside of the tip top .ooooooooooooooooooooooooo1%
Over exaggeration just like the overnerf dots recieved but still a good pointEdited by BattleAxe on October 15, 2019 8:21PM6 -
Grandma✭✭✭✭✭honestly, getting read of LA weaving would be pretty cool. it's 90% of what makes the gameplay feel artificially fast paced, but if you just used skills off global cooldown without having to weave it would be a lot easier and nice for casual players. I know my mouse doesn't like my light attack ratio being .7 per second. o_o
or, this may be crazy, but imagine a channeled skill being in the game and being useful. besides jesus beam, i guess. like imagine if base crystal shard was a dps increase even if you hard cast it?! that'd be cool honestly, i'd enjoy being able to relax as a sorc once in a while in my rotation.GH / 3/04/2021 / Elemental Catalyst Necromancer22 -
BattleAxe✭✭✭✭✭honestly, getting read of LA weaving would be pretty cool. it's 90% of what makes the gameplay feel artificially fast paced, but if you just used skills off global cooldown without having to weave it would be a lot easier and nice for casual players. I know my mouse doesn't like my light attack ratio being .7 per second. o_o
or, this may be crazy, but imagine a channeled skill being in the game and being useful. besides jesus beam, i guess. like imagine if base crystal shard was a dps increase even if you hard cast it?! that'd be cool honestly, i'd enjoy being able to relax as a sorc once in a while in my rotation.
This is why pet sorcs became so numerous4 -
Zypheran✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Just put a cap on dps.
Think of all the issues it would solveAll my housing builds are available on YouTube
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCf3oJ_cxuu01HmWZJZ6KK6g?view_as=subscriber
I am happy to share the EHT save files for most of my builds.10 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭DeathStalker wrote: »
Because it works but it feels awful for players who can do better.
Prior to One Tamriel, there used to be an effective level cap where you couldn't fight things too far above your level because you would start to artifically miss.
My stam sorc was doing just fine hitting above my level...until I hit the artificial miss penalty that stopped me from progressing until I ground up my level a bit to match where the devs thought I ought to be. It sucked. I was being held back by the devs.
Depending on exactly where you want to cap DPS, you'll have players who can do better if it weren't for the cap. So it feels awful for them.5 -
Wa2p✭✭✭
Hypothetically: Put a soft cap of say 40k, rebalance everything around that number. And anything above 40k gets reduced by x% amount over, so doing 45k? it reads as 42.5k. Doing 60k? It reads something like 44k. The tip top end would be just under 50k, but why push that hard for such punishing diminishing returns. As for why the other damage is absorbed by the aether. The wounds given put the mobs into shock, and they no longer can feel anything over that amount from you.
I don't honestly know. The above is the only vague way I could see it not being a huge huge huge issue.Though I know it has issues. But really, I would rather have a cap at this point.4 -
SirDopey✭✭✭✭✭
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Scaling Miss Chance. The more damage you are doing the higher your miss chance becomes (think of it as accuracy goes out the window the more enraged you become) to the point at a certain DPS ceiling you have 100% miss chance.
Fixes soooooo many problems and will allow people to place the classes, races and sets as they please instead of being pigion holed into having to be this race and wear these sets for this class...NA PC | AD
xx Doc Holliday xx2 -
ZeroXFF✭✭✭✭✭
✭I don't agree on a lot with @VaranisArano , but I agree that damage caps should be the last resort. It would basically be an admission of ZOS' failure and a resignation.
So before that happens:
1. Remove LA weaving. That's going to do the bulk of damage equalization, but individually people will still have the opportunity to do more complex things to improve their damage output, for example by improving uptimes of skills with different durations (juggling 6s purifying light, 8s solar barrage, 12s entropy and 10s wall of elements while managing bar swaps is not trivial if you want to avoid both overcasting and clipping). So people would still be rewarded for better skills unlike with a damage cap.
2. Make the game teach people the mechanics before they reach vet DLC dungeons, so that the floor gets naturally higher, and the gap between the floor and the ceiling smaller, without just severely punishing those who are doing well as would be the case with a cap.7 -
ThePedge✭✭✭✭✭Lower the floor and raise the ceiling.
I'd you're a casual you won't care about DPS anyway, but actually have good mechanics like Light Attack Weaving which reward more skilled and hardcore players.
Don't cap the better players because "casuals" are jealous.4 -
ThePedge✭✭✭✭✭I don't agree on a lot with @VaranisArano , but I agree that damage caps should be the last resort. It would basically be an admission of ZOS' failure and a resignation.
So before that happens:
1. Remove LA weaving. That's going to do the bulk of damage equalization, but individually people will still have the opportunity to do more complex things to improve their damage output, for example by improving uptimes of skills with different durations (juggling 6s purifying light, 8s solar barrage, 12s entropy and 10s wall of elements while managing bar swaps is not trivial if you want to avoid both overcasting and clipping). So people would still be rewarded for better skills unlike with a damage cap.
People already do that this patch on magicka toons, while LA Weaving.Edited by ThePedge on October 15, 2019 11:11PM2 -
VaranisArano✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I don't agree on a lot with @VaranisArano , but I agree that damage caps should be the last resort. It would basically be an admission of ZOS' failure and a resignation.
So before that happens:
1. Remove LA weaving. That's going to do the bulk of damage equalization, but individually people will still have the opportunity to do more complex things to improve their damage output, for example by improving uptimes of skills with different durations (juggling 6s purifying light, 8s solar barrage, 12s entropy and 10s wall of elements while managing bar swaps is not trivial if you want to avoid both overcasting and clipping). So people would still be rewarded for better skills unlike with a damage cap.
2. Make the game teach people the mechanics before they reach vet DLC dungeons, so that the floor gets naturally higher, and the gap between the floor and the ceiling smaller, without just severely punishing those who are doing well as would be the case with a cap.
Just your number 2 alone would be amazing! The fact that players must use outside sources to learn about damage rotations - a basic staple of end game DPS - is a huge factor in the floor to ceiling gap that already existed prior to the Morrowind patch that made light attacks weaving a focus for damage and the Summerset patch that buffed it.
(Honestly, I'd be fine with reverting Summerset's buffs to light attacks as well. I don't mind weaving per se, but its the sort of mechanic that benefits the ceiling a lot more than the floor, so I'm not sure it really needed the buff it got.)6 -
ZeroXFF✭✭✭✭✭
✭I don't agree on a lot with VaranisArano , but I agree that damage caps should be the last resort. It would basically be an admission of ZOS' failure and a resignation.
So before that happens:
1. Remove LA weaving. That's going to do the bulk of damage equalization, but individually people will still have the opportunity to do more complex things to improve their damage output, for example by improving uptimes of skills with different durations (juggling 6s purifying light, 8s solar barrage, 12s entropy and 10s wall of elements while managing bar swaps is not trivial if you want to avoid both overcasting and clipping). So people would still be rewarded for better skills unlike with a damage cap.
People already do that this patch on magicka toons, while LA Weaving.
But LA weaving is widening the gap. Juggling those would not get easier, and you can still squeeze out your extra 5k DPS on the trial dummy if you do it perfectly, but it will no longer be on top of the other 20k you get over someone who can't properly weave, it would be just those 5k. So the most difficult part of a rotation will remain for people who want something to strive for while not making others feel useless.5 -
DeathStalker✭✭✭✭✭What about a cooldown on light attacks? Maybe 1-3 second cooldown. Which wouldn't destroy light attack weaving but would reduce its effectiveness and lower the ceiling DPS?Edited by DeathStalker on October 15, 2019 11:25PM0
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b95fister✭✭✭Lmao at dps cap. If causal players only do like 5,10,20k capping dps won’t help them. That is some backwards ass thinking there.
Capping dps will help the dps poor. Wow think about that........5 -
Darkenarlol✭✭✭✭✭
✭dps cap is even more stupid than
old idea of dps check dummy
with 40k requirement to be able
to que for DLC dungeons...
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p00tx✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I don't agree on a lot with VaranisArano , but I agree that damage caps should be the last resort. It would basically be an admission of ZOS' failure and a resignation.
So before that happens:
1. Remove LA weaving. That's going to do the bulk of damage equalization, but individually people will still have the opportunity to do more complex things to improve their damage output, for example by improving uptimes of skills with different durations (juggling 6s purifying light, 8s solar barrage, 12s entropy and 10s wall of elements while managing bar swaps is not trivial if you want to avoid both overcasting and clipping). So people would still be rewarded for better skills unlike with a damage cap.
People already do that this patch on magicka toons, while LA Weaving.
But LA weaving is widening the gap. Juggling those would not get easier, and you can still squeeze out your extra 5k DPS on the trial dummy if you do it perfectly, but it will no longer be on top of the other 20k you get over someone who can't properly weave, it would be just those 5k. So the most difficult part of a rotation will remain for people who want something to strive for while not making others feel useless.
No dude. You don't restrict someone's ability to play well because some people refuse to learn how to do so themselves. If someone genuinely can't because of a physical limitation, that's a bit different and I cast no aspersions on their character or worth, but that still does not merit limiting the top end. You don't force everyone to use a wheelchair to get from point A to point B just because some people can only get there using wheelchairs and others are too lazy to walk there themselves. If you're capable and just don't want to, then don't, but sit back, be quiet, and enjoy your low dps.Edited by p00tx on October 16, 2019 10:20PMPC/Xbox NA Mindmender|Swashbuckler Supreme|Planes Breaker|Dawnbringer|Godslayer|Immortal Redeemer|Gryphon Heart|Tick-tock Tormentor|Dro-m'Athra Destroyer|Stormproof|Grand Overlord|Grand Mastercrafter|Master Grappler|Tamriel Hero8 -
vesselwiththepestle✭✭✭✭✭
✭I've seen some parses of really low dps (10k group buffed kind) and a LOT of their damage is from light attacks. Like, light attacks being no 1 damage. If you nerf light attack damage, you hit really hard those players who are unable to do any kind of rotation, having less than 50% uptime on dots and are mostly spamming their mouse button and kinda randomly using skills in between.1000+ CP
PC/EU Ravenwatch Daggerfall Covenant
Give me my wings back!1 -
Weisstag✭✭✭easy fix: add one more content difficulty setting (let's call it nightmare for example) and optimize it for min-max playstyle, it wouldn't grant better items (as better set bonuses) but rather gold quality gear,so the logically it would go:
normal-superior (blue), vet-epic(purple), nightmare-legendary (gold)
So in the end everyone would be happy bc minmaxers would get to challenge themselves and casuals wouldn't be missing out content, ppl with high skill get to measure pp with each other and casual players get to play all content.Iam an EU player...so Iam pretty used to suffering1 -
Nordic__Knights✭✭✭✭✭
✭If they would fix the first bug of the game call animation canceling there wouldn't be a gap but since the exploit is now seen as a skill there will always be one and for the ones who say Well learn how to do it I do why because it's part of the game not that I liked it or not that I feel it's good for but still it is part of the game now but it's still a bugEdited by Nordic__Knights on October 17, 2019 9:23AM2 -
ZeroXFF✭✭✭✭✭
✭I don't agree on a lot with VaranisArano , but I agree that damage caps should be the last resort. It would basically be an admission of ZOS' failure and a resignation.
So before that happens:
1. Remove LA weaving. That's going to do the bulk of damage equalization, but individually people will still have the opportunity to do more complex things to improve their damage output, for example by improving uptimes of skills with different durations (juggling 6s purifying light, 8s solar barrage, 12s entropy and 10s wall of elements while managing bar swaps is not trivial if you want to avoid both overcasting and clipping). So people would still be rewarded for better skills unlike with a damage cap.
People already do that this patch on magicka toons, while LA Weaving.
But LA weaving is widening the gap. Juggling those would not get easier, and you can still squeeze out your extra 5k DPS on the trial dummy if you do it perfectly, but it will no longer be on top of the other 20k you get over someone who can't properly weave, it would be just those 5k. So the most difficult part of a rotation will remain for people who want something to strive for while not making others feel useless.
No dude. You don't restrict someone's ability to play well because some people refuse to learn how to do so themselves. If someone genuinely can't because of a physical limitation, that's a bit different and I cast no aspersions on their character or worth, but that still does not merit limiting the top end. You don't force everyone to use a wheelchair to get from point A to point B just because some people can only get there using wheelchairs and others are too lazy to walk there themselves. If you're capable and just don't want to, then don't, but sit back, be quiet, and enjoy your low dps.
And I'm not restricting anyone's ability to play well, because the hardest part of a perfect rotation still remains. That's the whole point.2 -
ZeroXFF✭✭✭✭✭
✭vesselwiththepestle wrote: »I've seen some parses of really low dps (10k group buffed kind) and a LOT of their damage is from light attacks. Like, light attacks being no 1 damage. If you nerf light attack damage, you hit really hard those players who are unable to do any kind of rotation, having less than 50% uptime on dots and are mostly spamming their mouse button and kinda randomly using skills in between.
Those people aren't weaving light attacks though, they are using them as spammables, because that's the intuitive thing to do. My proposal is not to nerf LA damage, but turn LAs into spammables by putting them on the same global cooldown as skills. That way these people you're talking about will not be affected at all, but the top will come down by about 20k.4 -
ShadowKyuubi✭✭✭✭Another nerf the elite players thread...again...how original.
Instead of trying to demean all the hard work these players have done, why don't you use the time it takes you to write these post to practice your dps? I am not considered an "elite" player, but I am pretty damn good. Do you know why? Because there was a point in my ESO career that all I was concerned about was raising my pitiful dps. For half a year, I practiced. I practiced every day for a couple hours. I forced myself to learn how to light attack weave, to animation cancel, and memorized all the skill orders. Was it easy? No, that is why it took so long to learn. Some people are more gifted at it than me, so it takes less time for them to learn. Some aren't, so they practice more. We aren't some of the top dps in the world because ZoS decided we were the special ones. We are the best because we practiced. So sit down, force yourself to learn, and don't make the rest of the dps suffer because you feel left out. Make no mistake, it isn't easy.
We earned this dps, who are you to take it away.Edited by ShadowKyuubi on October 21, 2019 8:27PM1 -
Chilly-McFreeze✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Puh, some strange stuff going on here. Makes we wonder that nobody brought up soft caps on stats again, along with a nerf to meta sets.0 -
Emma_Overload✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Why are people so dead set on removing light attack weaving?
Is it really so hard to click LA + SKILL, LA + SKILL, LA + SKILL, etc?#CAREBEARMASTERRACE7 -
Ksariyu✭✭✭✭Personally, I don't agree that just hard-nerfing damage for elite players is a good idea. It removes the incentive to get better if there you're being specifically punished for doing so. That said, I 100% agree on removing LA weaving.Emma_Overload wrote: »Why are people so dead set on removing light attack weaving?
Is it really so hard to click LA + SKILL, LA + SKILL, LA + SKILL, etc?
Here's why: It feels clunky having to rapidly press two buttons for essentially one action. It's connection-dependent; the game can barely keep up with the skills itself, never mind a quick LA thrown in between each one. It over-buffs Relequen to the point where it's untouchable, because instead of providing an option for LA dependent builds (Which don't exist because of weaving), it now becomes a requirement to make the most out of all those LAs. It's also a necessity for pretty much everyone, not just DPS, and forces players to focus more on their rotation than mechanics, which is the exact opposite of what you should be doing in a trial. And finally, it looks absolutely stupid to have your character spasm before every skill.
Instead, I would really like to see them add more complexity to the skills themselves, perhaps by adding things like combos. Even better, add combo mechanics to light attacks themselves to encourage using them as an independent damage source, and perhaps integrate that with heavy attacks so people can finally stop whining about those too.
Quite frankly, there's an overwhelmingly large list of changes that can and arguably should be made to make the game feel better for all levels of play, but given the difficulty in implementing them, we're likely gonna be stuck with just random buffs and nerfs till the end of time. Feelsbadman.12 -
Daddysadface✭✭✭Plenty of videos on how to light attack weave. They go back 5 Years! Why not just lower the damage of LA/HA, this would make the vMA Staves of more value to have, it would lower the dps over all but across the board for everyone. Would make LA weaving more "Optional" and would close the gap between skilled and "less skilled" players, and it might give you a little more survivability in pvp vs the people who run snipe build that can perfectly time their HA with Snipe and a LA almost 1 shotting anyone that is not wearing impen.
LA weaving raised the bar for dps, the only way to combat it is to take some of the dps out of it, or negate it totally from wanting or needing to have it as part of a rotation.
(Personally, I like weaving. I think it's fun, but I see the downsides of it also.).1 -
usmcjdking✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭DPS caps in a game that is trying to reinvent itself into an Action RPG instead of a text-based RPG is such an insufferably bad idea that the game should be scrapped from existence before DPS caps come into play.
In an action RPG, you don't cap DPS. You put plateau soft caps on things like Crit, Crit Hit Damage, Weapon Damage OR Stamina. There needs to be something that has no cap (in this case it would be raw damage/max stat) to serve as a dump stat for those who want to squeeze every ounce of damage out that's possible at a huge opportunity cost.Edited by usmcjdking on October 21, 2019 2:44AM0331
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Sebar80✭✭✭I have even better idea! Lets put cap on top dmg lets say 45k dps and than simmilar cap to bottom dps lets say 40k.
If you care to press a random key on your keybord or mouse by default you are assigned 44k dps and if you only care to breath in front of your computer you get 40k. If you actualy manage to do one key stroke per second for 5 seconds, combo!!! You have 45k dps for 5 seconds.
I realy detest participation trophy generation.
We can make it a step further! Random 100 players will get assigned god slayer every week only if they bother to port in to sunspire, these days it is unheard that you actually have to make an effort to get an achivment!
This idea would solve so many issues. There will be no need for end game comunity every one would be end game. Devs could nerf and buff skills at random with no impact on game play, races classes and skills used would be for visuals only. The compositio of raid groups would not matter at all, you could rp your god slayer with wood elf mag sorc tank wielding two hander and a bow if you only wished it. It would open up youtube content creation and twich streaming for everyone. I can alreade see a flod of content! "Do it better the Lico, how i managed to press 5 buttons, my road to top dps"
Irony out!
PC EU
PVE
Tanks all classes4