Character Creation needs to be changed - stop confusing newbies, ZOS

bluebird

This is an improvement suggestion thread for the Character Creation screen, so that it's less confusing and more informative.

1) Remove 'Novice Gear' and 'Champion Gear' previews entirely, or change them.
Currently when you're creating a character it changes the equipped armor type based on its class. That's really misleading for ESO, since a character's armor isn't determined by the class but by the role and build. Many new players in guilds, zone chats, and here on the forums too expressed the misbelief that their armor type would somehow be linked to their class. While they may have brought these misconceptions from other games, ESO's own character creator not only doesn't dispel this false information but in fact contributes to it with its armor preview.

- One possible solution would be to remove the 'Novice Gear' and 'Champion Gear' previews entirely, and only leaving the 'No Gear' character creation. There is no reason for these armor previews to exist, really. Experienced players will of course know that their class doesn't determine their armor type, and they don't need a preview to show them what armor looks like, they already know those looks from ingame and from the Outfit system, so they lose nothing. And new players who aren't aware of how armors work in ESO will gain from it, since they won't be misguided to believe that they need to make a Dragonknight or a Templar if they want a heavy armor wearing character.

- Another option would be to change it into 'Light Armor' 'Medium Armor' 'Heavy Armor' and 'No Armor'. Currently the char creator previews Anequina/Pellitine armor as 'Novice Gear', and Sunspire armor as 'Champion Gear' ... but none of these are particularly relevant or informative choices. If devs want to keep some manner of armor preview in there, it would be far better if they previewed armor type options instead. That way, classes wouldn't have a pre-assigned armor type as they do now (Heavy- DK, Templar; Medium - NB, Warden; Light - Sorc, Necro). Instead, players could pick any armor type on any class; much like they can ingame.

2) Change Class Descriptions to be more informative.
Class Descriptions should give new players a decent overview of what they can expect from that class, but currently they fall short. Some Class Descriptions mention only a very niche role of that class: the Necro is described as being able to 'harm and heal' which is good, yet the Sorc Warden and NB are described as a pure dps class. Some have oddly specific lore: the Templar is defined as a 'traveling knight' (which is another distraction from the fact that class doesn't determine role). And some have vague or misleading information : DKs 'phyiscally alter the world around them' and a Warden's 'nature tales become magical reality'... What is that even supposed to add to a player's understanding of that class? I'm sure all of that would fit in a lorebook, but is this really the most relevant information we want new players to see on an MMO character creation?

- The crucial first step would be to make people aware of class/role flexibility. Wardens have an entire skill line dedicated to healing yet there is no mention of healing in their class desrciption for example. There is a lot of unused space under the Class Descriptions (they added the Criminal Act warning under the Necromancer, and there is still plenty of space left). This space should be used to desrcibe the role-agnostic nature of classes in ESO which differs from many other MMOs and can therefore be an issue for new players. The paragraph could be something like 'Even though some classes can have a greater affinity for certain roles, all classes are capable of dealing damage, healing, and tanking', which would already be enough of a disclaimer to not mislead new players as much as the menu does now.

- If we want to go even further, we could update the Class Descriptions too.

1. Dragonknight: 'These skillful masters-at-arms use the ancient Akaviri martial arts tradition of battle-spirit, and wield fearsome magic that pounds, shatters and physically alters the world around them.' Less emphasis on martial expertise, reference stamina and healing options, change the misleading 'alters the world around them' bit. 'Dragonknights use the ancient Akaviri tradition of battle-spirit to wield poisons and fire spells against their enemies, and invoke the elemental forces of the earth to protect or mend their allies.'
2. Sorcerer: 'Sorcerers can use conjuration and destruction spells to hurl lightning bolts and create shock fields, wield dark magic to snare and stun, and summon Daedric combat followers from Oblivion to assist them.' Put less emphasis on spells, add reference to stamina options. 'Sorcerers can harness the power of the storms to cast lightning spells or improve their combat prowess, wield dark magic to keep their enemies at bay, and summon Daedric followers from Oblivion to assist them and their allies.'
3. Nightblade: 'Nightblades are adventurers and opportunists with a gift of getting in and out of trouble. Relying variously on stealth, blades, and speed, Nightblades thrive on conflict and misfortune, trusting to their luck and cunning to survive.' Remove the misleading swashbuckling rogue bits, add reference magicka and healing options. 'Thriving on conflict, Nightblades can rely on shadows, blood magic or skillful weapon strikes to dispatch enemies, to restore allies, and to hold their own against their attackers.'
4. Templar: 'These traveling knights call upon the powers of light and the burning sun to deal massive damage to their enemies while restoring health, magicka and stamina to their allies.' Remove the knight reference, remove 'massive', and add reference to spears, and to stamplars and tankplars. 'Templars call upon spears of light and the power of the burning sun to deal damage to their enemies, to heal and empower their allies, or to stand as a protector against those who would do them harm.'
5. Warden: 'Wardens are defenders of the Green, master storytellers whose nature tales become magical reality. They wield frost spells against their enemies and summon animals to aid them.' Remove that whole storytelling bit, add references to healing and tanking. 'Wardens are defenders of the Green, calling upon nature to rejuvenate their allies, summoning animals to aid them in combat, and wielding frost magic to damage enemies and bolster their own defenses.'
6. Necromancer: 'Masters of death, Necromancers can call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls and weave ghastly spells to both harm and heal.' This is pretty good by default, maybe add some info about stamcros and tankcros. 'Masters of death, Necromancers can call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls and weave ghastly spells and diseases to harm, heal, or enhance their own survivability.'

By no means do I claim to know the perfect way to capture the essence of a class, I'm in fact looking forward to reading your comments and ideas on how to summarize classes the best, these are just some suggestions. Whatever the exact wording, the Class Descriptions should be changed to give an overall view that is neither too vague nor too pigeon-holed.

tl;dr: Char Creation has some features and descriptions which don't particulalry help new players, and even mislead them.
Are you an experienced player? How would you revamp the char creation screen to be more useful for new players?
Are you a new player? What information do you wish the character creator had told you when you were starting out?

Taleof2Cities

As a new player, I wished a lot of things that didn’t have anything to do with the displayed gear on the character creation screen.

Back in 2014, I was trying to improve my build first ... the aesthetic display was far in the rear view mirror.

After I figured out builds and combat, then I could sit back and change outfit styles.

In other words, I don’t think this issue is paramount for new players. Just my opinion though.

bluebird

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

As a new player, I wished a lot of things that didn’t have anything to do with the displayed gear on the character creation screen.

Back in 2014, I was trying to improve my build first ... the aesthetic display was far in the rear view mirror.

Perhaps I didn't word my post specifically, I'm referring to the fact that the gear display on the character creation (which is just purely aesthethic and thus indeed irrelevant, especially with the Outfit system) misleads players to think it matters. It thus affects their class and build choices, far from being in the rear view mirror (where it belongs).

This post was inspired by another thread, where a new player was asking what class he should make if he wants to make heavy armor. So clearly the game isn't doing a good job of informing players of how it works; we can see that in a lot of 'newbie' questions about class/roles or class/armors, etc.

jainiadral

Armor is seriously confusing as a n00b anyway. I remember getting drops in different styles and thinking I'd lose stats if I put Argonian pieces on my Breton

I've never understood the armor thing on the creation screen. I always turn it off since you can't see your toon's body dmensions anyway. Might as well remove it-- and the confusion that it comes with.

Araneae6537

All very good points and many are things that confused me when I started last month. The class descriptions could definitely be more informative (at least the skills advisor helps make up for this) and since every other RPG I know of either restricts armor by class or applies penalties to heavier armor to actions like stealth and spell-casting, the fact that ESO doesn’t could be made more apparent and the “novice” and “champion” gear do only reinforce a false impression.

SydneyGrey

Those novice gear and champion gear previews are absolutely pointless. The first time I ever made a character and played as a newbie, I thought the previews meant you'd start with that gear in the game. Nope. Learned very quickly that wasn't the case. Ha ha. It's not a big deal, though. Just slightly confusing for Day 1 newbs.

Lord_Eomer

They should add small description about each race Lore.

What nords are, came from etc.

idk

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

As a new player, I wished a lot of things that didn’t have anything to do with the displayed gear on the character creation screen.

Back in 2014, I was trying to improve my build first ... the aesthetic display was far in the rear view mirror.

After I figured out builds and combat, then I could sit back and change outfit styles.

In other words, I don’t think this issue is paramount for new players. Just my opinion though.

I have to +1 on this.

Edit: adding to this. I do not recall fretting about this when I was a new player. It seems to be a good idea to provide some sort of idea what the character looks like with armor and providing an appearance without armor so new players can get a sense of things. It is not to complicated and does not overload a new player.

red_emu

There should be a lore description AND a list of all passives. As a vet player, I still find myself doing a Google search to check what passives each race has when I create a new char.

The armour previews are misleading too. I remember when I created my first character (An altmer Stamblade) I was so disappointed, when I got into the game and my character was wearing rags. Also had no idea, that NB could be mag as well and deleted the char at level 14 to create a magSorc, since I thought it's the only caster class.

I totally approve of OPs idea.

Berserkerkitten

As a new player, I understood those armor previews as what they were - something my character may roughly look like at higher levels. I was gonna say you're probably overthinking this, but then I saw some of the replies here. Oh well.

eklhaftb16_ESO

There should be lighting options: outdoors day, outdoors night, indoors and flat light.

And voice selection could use some work, too. I once had to reroll a perfectly good character because of the sound he'd make when prodding a horse...

D0PAMINE

bluebird wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

As a new player, I wished a lot of things that didn’t have anything to do with the displayed gear on the character creation screen.

Back in 2014, I was trying to improve my build first ... the aesthetic display was far in the rear view mirror.

Perhaps I didn't word my post specifically, I'm referring to the fact that the gear display on the character creation (which is just purely aesthethic and thus indeed irrelevant, especially with the Outfit system) misleads players to think it matters. It thus affects their class and build choices, far from being in the rear view mirror (where it belongs).

This post was inspired by another thread, where a new player was asking what class he should make if he wants to make heavy armor. So clearly the game isn't doing a good job of informing players of how it works; we can see that in a lot of 'newbie' questions about class/roles or class/armors, etc.

Great thread OP. You make some interesting points.

jircris11

bluebird wrote: »

This is an improvement suggestion thread for the Character Creation screen, so that it's less confusing and more informative.

1) Remove 'Novice Gear' and 'Champion Gear' previews entirely, or change them.
Currently when you're creating a character it changes the equipped armor type based on its class. That's really misleading for ESO, since a character's armor isn't determined by the class but by the role and build. Many new players in guilds, zone chats, and here on the forums too expressed the misbelief that their armor type would somehow be linked to their class. While they may have brought these misconceptions from other games, ESO's own character creator not only doesn't dispel this false information but in fact contributes to it with its armor preview.

- One possible solution would be to remove the 'Novice Gear' and 'Champion Gear' previews entirely, and only leaving the 'No Gear' character creation. There is no reason for these armor previews to exist, really. Experienced players will of course know that their class doesn't determine their armor type, and they don't need a preview to show them what armor looks like, they already know those looks from ingame and from the Outfit system, so they lose nothing. And new players who aren't aware of how armors work in ESO will gain from it, since they won't be misguided to believe that they need to make a Dragonknight or a Templar if they want a heavy armor wearing character.

- Another option would be to change it into 'Light Armor' 'Medium Armor' 'Heavy Armor' and 'No Armor'. Currently the char creator previews Anequina/Pellitine armor as 'Novice Gear', and Sunspire armor as 'Champion Gear' ... but none of these are particularly relevant or informative choices. If devs want to keep some manner of armor preview in there, it would be far better if they previewed armor type options instead. That way, classes wouldn't have a pre-assigned armor type as they do now (Heavy- DK, Templar; Medium - NB, Warden; Light - Sorc, Necro). Instead, players could pick any armor preview on any class; much like they can ingame.

2) Change Class Descriptions to be more informative.
Class Descriptions should give new players a decent overview of what they can expect from that class, but currently they fall short. Some Class Descriptions mention only a very niche role of that class: the Necro is described as being able to 'harm and heal' which is good, yet the Sorc Warden and NB are described as a pure dps class. Some have oddly specific lore: the Templar is defined as a 'traveling knight' (which is another distraction from the fact that class doesn't determine role). And some have vague or misleading information : DKs 'phyiscally alter the world around them' and a Warden's 'nature tales become magical reality'... What is that even supposed to add to a player's understanding of that class? I'm sure all of that would fit nicely in a lorebook, but is this really the most relevant information we want a new player to see on an MMO character creation?

- The crucial first step would be to make people aware of class/role flexibility. Wardens have an entire skill line dedicated to healing yet there is no mention of healing in their class desrciption for example. There is a lot of unused space under the Class Descriptions (they added the Criminal Act warning under the Necromancer, and there is still plenty of space left). This space should be used to desrcibe the role-agnostic nature of classes in ESO which differs from many other MMOs and can therefore be an issue for new players. The paragraph could be something like 'Even though some classes can have a greater affinity for certain roles, all classes are capable of dealing damage, healing, and tanking', which would already be enough of a disclaimer to not mislead new players as much as the menu does now.

- If we want to go even further, we could update the Class Descriptions too.

1. Dragonknight: 'These skillful masters-at-arms use the ancient Akaviri martial arts tradition of battle-spirit, and wield fearsome magic that pounds, shatters and physically alters the world around them.' Less emphasis on martial expertise, reference stamina and healing options, change the misleading 'alters the world around them' bit. 'Dragonknights use the ancient Akaviri tradition of battle-spirit to wield poisons and fire spells against their enemies, and invoke the elemental forces of the earth to protect or mend their allies.'
2. Sorcerer: 'Sorcerers can use conjuration and destruction spells to hurl lightning bolts and create shock fields, wield dark magic to snare and stun, and summon Daedric combat followers from Oblivion to assist them.' Put less emphasis on spells, add reference to stamina options. 'Sorcerers can harness the power of the storms to cast lightning spells or improve their combat prowess, wield dark magic to keep their enemies at bay, and summon Daedric followers from Oblivion to assist them and their allies.'
3. Nightblade: 'Nightblades are adventurers and opportunists with a gift of getting in and out of trouble. Relying variously on stealth, blades, and speed, Nightblades thrive on conflict and misfortune, trusting to their luck and cunning to survive.' Remove the misleading swashbuckling rogue bits, add reference magicka and healing options. 'Thriving on conflict, Nightblades can rely on shadows, blood magic or skillful weapon strikes to dispatch enemies, to restore allies, and to hold their own against their attackers.'
4. Templar: 'These traveling knights call upon the powers of light and the burning sun to deal massive damage to their enemies while restoring health, magicka and stamina to their allies.' Remove the knight reference, remove 'massive', and add reference to spears, and to stamplars and tankplars. 'Templars call upon spears of light and the power of the burning sun to deal damage to their enemies, to heal and empower their allies, or to stand as a protector against those who would do them harm.'
5. Warden: 'Wardens are defenders of the Green, master storytellers whose nature tales become magical reality. They wield frost spells against their enemies and summon animals to aid them.' Remove that whole storytelling bit, add references to healing and tanking. 'Wardens are defenders of the Green, calling upon nature to rejuvenate their allies, summoning animals to aid them in combat, and wielding frost magic to damage enemies and bolster their own defenses.'
6. Necromancer: 'Masters of death, Necromancers can call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls and weave ghastly spells to both harm and heal.' This is pretty good by default, maybe add some info about stamcros and tankcros. 'Masters of death, Necromancers can call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls and weave ghastly spells and diseases to harm, heal, or enhance their own survivability.'

By no means do I claim to know the perfect way to capture the essence of a class, I'm in fact looking forward to reading your comments and ideas on how to summarize classes the best, these are just some suggestions. Whatever the exact wording, the Class Descriptions should be changed to give an overall view that is neither too vague nor too pigeon-holed.

tl;dr: Char Creation has some features and descriptions which don't particulalry help new players, and even mislead them.
Are you an experienced player? How would you revamp the char creation screen to be more useful for new players?
Are you a new player? What information do you wish the character creator had told you when you were starting out?

Or ppl can do some research. I help new ppl when I can but let's be honest not many read the info at char creation.

WeerW3ir

bluebird wrote: »

This is an improvement suggestion thread for the Character Creation screen, so that it's less confusing and more informative.

1) Remove 'Novice Gear' and 'Champion Gear' previews entirely, or change them.
Currently when you're creating a character it changes the equipped armor type based on its class. That's really misleading for ESO, since a character's armor isn't determined by the class but by the role and build. Many new players in guilds, zone chats, and here on the forums too expressed the misbelief that their armor type would somehow be linked to their class. While they may have brought these misconceptions from other games, ESO's own character creator not only doesn't dispel this false information but in fact contributes to it with its armor preview.

This part is not really true. Armors in character editor was for preview always. Always your race armor was in light, medium, heavy. But now. since Elsweyr its the new style for everybody and its so washed out.

bluebird

idk wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

As a new player, I wished a lot of things that didn’t have anything to do with the displayed gear on the character creation screen.

Back in 2014, I was trying to improve my build first ... the aesthetic display was far in the rear view mirror.

After I figured out builds and combat, then I could sit back and change outfit styles.

In other words, I don’t think this issue is paramount for new players. Just my opinion though.

Edit: adding to this. I do not recall fretting about this when I was a new player. It seems to be a good idea to provide some sort of idea what the character looks like with armor and providing an appearance without armor so new players can get a sense of things. It is not to complicated and does not overload a new player.

What's the 'good idea' in making that armor preview change based on your class? How does that help new players get a 'sort of idea' about the game? If anything, it gives the totally wrong sort of idea. That's the point my point I was making. I already said that if devs do want to keep armor previews in there, they can keep them there, but they shouldn't make it change based on the class.

If they kept the same armor Type on all classes (let's say Medium or just basic Clothing as they did in Summerset), you would still get a 'sort of idea' of what armor looks like on your character. And if they added the option to preview all classes in all three armor types (Light, Medium, Heavy instead of Novice and Champion), you would get even more sort of an idea.

WeerW3ir wrote: »

bluebird wrote: »

This is an improvement suggestion thread for the Character Creation screen, so that it's less confusing and more informative.

1) Remove 'Novice Gear' and 'Champion Gear' previews entirely, or change them.
Currently when you're creating a character it changes the equipped armor type based on its class. That's really misleading for ESO, since a character's armor isn't determined by the class but by the role and build. Many new players in guilds, zone chats, and here on the forums too expressed the misbelief that their armor type would somehow be linked to their class. While they may have brought these misconceptions from other games, ESO's own character creator not only doesn't dispel this false information but in fact contributes to it with its armor preview.

This part is not really true. Armors in character editor was for preview always. Always your race armor was in light, medium, heavy. But now. since Elsweyr its the new style for everybody and its so washed out.

Not sure what you mean that it isn't true, it's absolutely true. Armor type previews do change (and always have changed) based on your class (which they shouldn't do because that's not how classes work.)

Currently 'Novice Gear' on a Templar of any Race will be Heavy Anequina, on a Necro with any Race will be Light Pellitine. 'Champion Gear' will be Heavy Sunspire on the Templar, and Light Sunspire on the Necro. Why exactly?

(Earlier in the game an Orc Templar wore Heavy Orc 1 as 'Novice Gear' and Heavy Orc 4 as 'Champion Gear', while an Orc Sorc wore Light Orc 1, and Light Orc 4. Then later with Morrowind 'Novice Gear' was Heavy Soul Shriven for any Race Templars, and Light Soul Shriven for any Race Sorcs; while 'Champion Gear' was Heavy Racial 4 for the Templar, and Light Racial 4 for the Sorc. In Summerset the 'Novice Gear of every Class and every Race was basic clothing, and the 'Champion Gear' was still Heavy Racial 4 for the Templar and Light Racial 4 for the Sorc.)

So while armor previews didn't always change style based on the race, they always changed type based on the class. And that's the problem. Why is it more helpful to show 'You can preview your Templar in Heavy Anequina and Heavy Sunspire' instead of 'You can preview your Templar in some clothing' or 'You can preview your Templar in Light, Medium and Heavy Anequina' (or any style, it doesn't matter). It would help a lot more since classes wouldn't be locked into specific armor types on the character creation, the same way they aren't locked into specific armor types in the game.

Roketta

This is so true, my first character was Templar, because I thought since it looks like heavy armor I will be melee dps. I later find out its healer.....its realy misleading

MajBludd

If anything show racial passives instead of the description they have.

Idinuse

bluebird wrote: »

This is an improvement suggestion thread for the Character Creation screen, so that it's less confusing and more informative.

:st

ar: 1) Remove 'Novice Gear' and 'Champion Gear' previews entirely, or change them.
Currently when you're creating a character it changes the equipped armor type based on its class. That's really misleading for ESO, since a character's armor isn't determined by the class but by the role and build. Many new players in guilds, zone chats, and here on the forums too expressed the misbelief that their armor type would somehow be linked to their class. While they may have brought these misconceptions from other games, ESO's own character creator not only doesn't dispel this false information but in fact contributes to it with its armor preview.

- One possible solution would be to remove the 'Novice Gear' and 'Champion Gear' previews entirely, and only leaving the 'No Gear' character creation. There is no reason for these armor previews to exist, really. Experienced players will of course know that their class doesn't determine their armor type, and they don't need a preview to show them what armor looks like, they already know those looks from ingame and from the Outfit system, so they lose nothing. And new players who aren't aware of how armors work in ESO will gain from it, since they won't be misguided to believe that they need to make a Dragonknight or a Templar if they want a heavy armor wearing character.

- Another option would be to change it into 'Light Armor' 'Medium Armor' 'Heavy Armor' and 'No Armor'. Currently the char creator previews Anequina/Pellitine armor as 'Novice Gear', and Sunspire armor as 'Champion Gear' ... but none of these are particularly relevant or informative choices. If devs want to keep some manner of armor preview in there, it would be far better if they previewed armor type options instead. That way, classes wouldn't have a pre-assigned armor type as they do now (Heavy- DK, Templar; Medium - NB, Warden; Light - Sorc, Necro). Instead, players could pick any armor type on any class; much like they can ingame.

2) Change Class Descriptions to be more informative.
Class Descriptions should give new players a decent overview of what they can expect from that class, but currently they fall short. Some Class Descriptions mention only a very niche role of that class: the Necro is described as being able to 'harm and heal' which is good, yet the Sorc Warden and NB are described as a pure dps class. Some have oddly specific lore: the Templar is defined as a 'traveling knight' (which is another distraction from the fact that class doesn't determine role). And some have vague or misleading information : DKs 'phyiscally alter the world around them' and a Warden's 'nature tales become magical reality'... What is that even supposed to add to a player's understanding of that class? I'm sure all of that would fit in a lorebook, but is this really the most relevant information we want new players to see on an MMO character creation?

- The crucial first step would be to make people aware of class/role flexibility. Wardens have an entire skill line dedicated to healing yet there is no mention of healing in their class desrciption for example. There is a lot of unused space under the Class Descriptions (they added the Criminal Act warning under the Necromancer, and there is still plenty of space left). This space should be used to desrcibe the role-agnostic nature of classes in ESO which differs from many other MMOs and can therefore be an issue for new players. The paragraph could be something like 'Even though some classes can have a greater affinity for certain roles, all classes are capable of dealing damage, healing, and tanking', which would already be enough of a disclaimer to not mislead new players as much as the menu does now.

- If we want to go even further, we could update the Class Descriptions too.

1. Dragonknight: 'These skillful masters-at-arms use the ancient Akaviri martial arts tradition of battle-spirit, and wield fearsome magic that pounds, shatters and physically alters the world around them.' Less emphasis on martial expertise, reference stamina and healing options, change the misleading 'alters the world around them' bit. 'Dragonknights use the ancient Akaviri tradition of battle-spirit to wield poisons and fire spells against their enemies, and invoke the elemental forces of the earth to protect or mend their allies.'
2. Sorcerer: 'Sorcerers can use conjuration and destruction spells to hurl lightning bolts and create shock fields, wield dark magic to snare and stun, and summon Daedric combat followers from Oblivion to assist them.' Put less emphasis on spells, add reference to stamina options. 'Sorcerers can harness the power of the storms to cast lightning spells or improve their combat prowess, wield dark magic to keep their enemies at bay, and summon Daedric followers from Oblivion to assist them and their allies.'
3. Nightblade: 'Nightblades are adventurers and opportunists with a gift of getting in and out of trouble. Relying variously on stealth, blades, and speed, Nightblades thrive on conflict and misfortune, trusting to their luck and cunning to survive.' Remove the misleading swashbuckling rogue bits, add reference magicka and healing options. 'Thriving on conflict, Nightblades can rely on shadows, blood magic or skillful weapon strikes to dispatch enemies, to restore allies, and to hold their own against their attackers.'
4. Templar: 'These traveling knights call upon the powers of light and the burning sun to deal massive damage to their enemies while restoring health, magicka and stamina to their allies.' Remove the knight reference, remove 'massive', and add reference to spears, and to stamplars and tankplars. 'Templars call upon spears of light and the power of the burning sun to deal damage to their enemies, to heal and empower their allies, or to stand as a protector against those who would do them harm.'
5. Warden: 'Wardens are defenders of the Green, master storytellers whose nature tales become magical reality. They wield frost spells against their enemies and summon animals to aid them.' Remove that whole storytelling bit, add references to healing and tanking. 'Wardens are defenders of the Green, calling upon nature to rejuvenate their allies, summoning animals to aid them in combat, and wielding frost magic to damage enemies and bolster their own defenses.'
6. Necromancer: 'Masters of death, Necromancers can call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls and weave ghastly spells to both harm and heal.' This is pretty good by default, maybe add some info about stamcros and tankcros. 'Masters of death, Necromancers can call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls and weave ghastly spells and diseases to harm, heal, or enhance their own survivability.'

By no means do I claim to know the perfect way to capture the essence of a class, I'm in fact looking forward to reading your comments and ideas on how to summarize classes the best, these are just some suggestions. Whatever the exact wording, the Class Descriptions should be changed to give an overall view that is neither too vague nor too pigeon-holed.

tl;dr: Char Creation has some features and descriptions which don't particulalry help new players, and even mislead them.
Are you an experienced player? How would you revamp the char creation screen to be more useful for new players?
Are you a new player? What information do you wish the character creator had told you when you were starting out?

Yes. I would just add that the preview of the character in character creation should actually reflect exactly how the character will look in game. ATM it doesn't really.

Nestor

Some changes need to be made to Chargen, however these are my suggestions.

1. Allow character to be tweaked during the tutorial, what we see in the game does look different than in Chargen. Or, at least fix the dang Camera Focal Length so we see the same weight in game. You can make a character skinny in chargen, and they are pudgy in game. Same with Lighting, it is not the same as the game, like anywhere in the game. If you have to limit this change to once during the tutorial at the end, so be it, but give us a chance to tweak the character.
2. Give us a generic tutorial, or a new one I don't care, but let us pick where we start the game. The new Chapters/DLC discount the main game's content, and can cause some story discontinuity. Perhaps we have an extended Tutorial for those who need or want it, and a basic tutorial so peeps can see their character before starting the game in earnest.

Sylvermynx

Great points @bluebird - now, I'm a long time TES and other MMO player, so I did what I always do before starting a character: I read both wikis and spent days reading around on the forums. But a lot of people don't do that....

I found - and still find - the gear displays silly. That's just me probably, maybe a lot of others think they're great.

Sengra

Nestor wrote: »

1. Allow character to be tweaked during the tutorial, what we see in the game does look different than in Chargen. Or, at least fix the dang Camera Focal Length so we see the same weight in game. You can make a character skinny in chargen, and they are pudgy in game. Same with Lighting, it is not the same as the game, like anywhere in the game. If you have to limit this change to once during the tutorial at the end, so be it, but give us a chance to tweak the character.

Oh yes. I wasted one of my free race changes because my char came out of char creation with hamster cheeks and a weird sickly skin tone. At least they should make the lighting representative of ingame daylight because the skin tones look totally different in candle light and the shadows make a round face seem much thinner.

VocalThought

They definitely need to change how the do Character Creation. Totally agree with the OP. Adding Lighting options, phrases to voice check, a history panel for races, and list the build names with each class in the class description to help players have a sense of what type of character they can create.

Dragonknights: Use the ancient Akaviri tradition of bsttle-spirit, wielding poisons, fire spells and dragon abilities against their enemies, and invoke the elemental forces of the earth and flame to protect or mend their allies. Pyromancer, Dragon Warrior, Geomancer

Sorcerers: Harness the power of the storms to cast lightning spells or improve their combat prowess, wield dark magic to keep their enemies at bay, and summon Daedric followers from Oblivion to assist them and their allies. Warlock, Conjurer, Shaman

Nightblade: Manipulators of shadow and the life force of others, they're highly train to land a skillful strikes to dispatch enemies, debilitated their foes, and to restore allies to hold their own against their attackers.' Strider, Shadowbinder, Siphoner

Templar: Call upon spears of light and the power of the burning sun to deal damage to their enemies, to heal and empower their allies, or to stand as a protector against those who would do them harm.' Priest, Crusader, Light Mage

Warden: Defenders of the Green, calling upon nature to rejuvenate their allies, summoning animals to aid them in combat, and wielding frost magic to damage enemies and bolster their own defenses.' Druids, Beastmasters, Ice Mages

Necromancer: Call upon corpses to serve as undead thralls and weave ghastly spells and diseases to harm, heal, or enhance their own survivability, mastering death. Occultist, Deathslayer, Medium

Ratzkifal

@VocalThought I think the "build names" you list are very confusing. When people hear druids, a lot of players are going to think about "transforming into beasts". And Warlock might invoke the right image of a demon summoning mage, but a Warlock usually has a patron granting them their powers, which is not true for the Sorcerer.

Generally I think that a lot of the ingame descriptions are pretty bad or misleading, but the more straightforward approach feels a bit soulless. Just look at the new racial descriptions. Just bland.
I'd rather be mislead and inspired than bored out of my mind just from the nonfantastical but accurate descriptions.

StormeReigns

VocalThought wrote: »

Templar: Call upon spears of light and the power of the burning sun to deal damage to their enemies, to heal and empower their allies, or to stand as a protector against those who would do them harm.' Priest, Crusader, Light Mage

I would have used Inquisitor

SirAxen

Lord_Eomer wrote: »

They should add small description about each race Lore.

What nords are, came from etc.

That would be a nice flavor thing for sure. I'd love that.

kaisernick

bluebird wrote: »

- Another option would be to change it into 'Light Armor' 'Medium Armor' 'Heavy Armor' and 'No Armor'. Currently the char creator previews Anequina/Pellitine armor as 'Novice Gear', and Sunspire armor as 'Champion Gear' ... but none of these are particularly relevant or informative choices. If devs want to keep some manner of armor preview in there, it would be far better if they previewed armor type options instead. That way, classes wouldn't have a pre-assigned armor type as they do now (Heavy- DK, Templar; Medium - NB, Warden; Light - Sorc, Necro). Instead, players could pick any armor type on any class; much like they can ingame.

This is actually a bad idea, while i agree that gear doesnt define your character having nothing would mean you dont know if you made your ass or chest or arm so big they look daft when wearing armor.
i would say some default armor maybe like it was in vanilla wehere you wore class armor makes the mose sense, or better yet have it so you can see each class in each armor type.

Eifleber

Two things:

1. Emphasize racial bonusses more so you know beforehand what combinations aren' t that fitting;

2. Please use different lighting so our characters don' t look a lot worse in game than in the creation screen.

relentless_turnip

idk wrote: »

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

As a new player, I wished a lot of things that didn’t have anything to do with the displayed gear on the character creation screen.

Back in 2014, I was trying to improve my build first ... the aesthetic display was far in the rear view mirror.

After I figured out builds and combat, then I could sit back and change outfit styles.

In other words, I don’t think this issue is paramount for new players. Just my opinion though.

I have to +1 on this.

Edit: adding to this. I do not recall fretting about this when I was a new player. It seems to be a good idea to provide some sort of idea what the character looks like with armor and providing an appearance without armor so new players can get a sense of things. It is not to complicated and does not overload a new player.

yeah I would like to +2

I never saw this as a problem as a new player. I'm not sure I even noticed and just created my character in the default novice gear. There are plenty of ways ZOS should be helping new players, like understanding core mechanics.
I remember having to google and watch video's on how to weave and animation cancel. I had to research how the crafting systems work. I had to make a lot of terrible builds before i understood the benefit of armor types, skill lines, enchants and traits etc...

There are many ways the developer could help new players understand the game so it doesn't have to be out sourced or people feel cheated when they finally learn weaving (as an example) is a thing.

It is just my opinion and my experience, but I don't feel viewing your character in various gear is a problem. Nor do I think it is confusing or misleading.

Kiyakotari

Sengra wrote: »

Nestor wrote: »

1. Allow character to be tweaked during the tutorial, what we see in the game does look different than in Chargen. Or, at least fix the dang Camera Focal Length so we see the same weight in game. You can make a character skinny in chargen, and they are pudgy in game. Same with Lighting, it is not the same as the game, like anywhere in the game. If you have to limit this change to once during the tutorial at the end, so be it, but give us a chance to tweak the character.

Oh yes. I wasted one of my free race changes because my char came out of char creation with hamster cheeks and a weird sickly skin tone. At least they should make the lighting representative of ingame daylight because the skin tones look totally different in candle light and the shadows make a round face seem much thinner.

Idinuse wrote: »

Yes. I would just add that the preview of the character in character creation should actually reflect exactly how the character will look in game. ATM it doesn't really.

AGREED. I was so angry when the red-toned feather color I'd picked came out brown on my Argonian. But I paid the fee to change it, and I went in and picked the reddest color option available.

NOPE.

Her feathers are white in game, with a very, very slight pink tint in some lighting.

In the character editor, they were a burgundy red, and the square to select that color was also red. It's ridiculous. The lighting should be the same in game and in the editor.

FierceSam

I agree the character creation process could be improved.

I believe you are wrong about the Champion/Novice gear previews. I think it’s really valuable for new players. First, it varies depending on which class you choose, which helps players with no knowledge of the game/lore distinguish between them. Second, the Champion Gear plays into the ‘power fantasy’ of each class, showing what a badass Sorc, Templar, Warden etc might look like. And, third, it clearly shows that there is some visual benefit to levelling up and that a character’s appearance is in some ways tied to experience and level.

In terms of educating the new player, I think this is a real challenge. Most new players want to get through the character creation and get playing as fast as possible. And given the game is also asking them to make some permanent choices at this point, you don’t want to bury them in information that, no matter how important, isn’t absolutely vital to the immediate task in hand.

I thought OP’s class descriptions like 'Dragonknights use the ancient Akaviri tradition of battle-spirit to wield poisons and fire spells against their enemies, and invoke the elemental forces of the earth to protect or mend their allies.' made sense. They are short and informative and better reflect the classes’ individual identities now.

Looking at existing text information in the process is something that can be done relatively easily and could be beneficial to new players.

TheShadowScout

bluebird wrote: »

- Another option would be to change it into 'Light Armor' 'Medium Armor' 'Heavy Armor' and 'No Armor'.

That would be my wish.

Sylvermynx wrote: »

I found - and still find - the gear displays silly. That's just me probably, maybe a lot of others think they're great.

Its not just you, I found them silly back when I made my first character in summer 2014...

And personally, I dislike the chargen entirely in how little it gave as info on what the classes actually mean. Now, me being me, I went with making all of them back in the day, then figuring out what they did (yeah, it was a dark time, before wikis and guildes one could read) tho I already knew from the little info on the ESO site back then which flavors I wanted for my mains, so there is that.

But...
...I often wish the whole chargen experience had been done a bit differently.
Like...
First, let people make their character in chargen, appearance only... tweak the body, get their desired looks, etc. Picka name and then jump into adventuring...
And -then- let them play the "escape from coldharbour" part, letting them pick their class IN the tutorial... like, have a scene where they can free one single "tortured soul" who will then bestow some power unto the character... free the tormeted fallen priest of the divines, get your aedric blessing and become a holy light slinging, aedric spear summoning templar, free the soulbound dragon priest, get a touch of draconic power and become a fire-breathing, wings-flapping DK, free the renegade daedra, make a pact with it and become a daedra summoning, dark magic wielding sorceror, free the vampire, learn a bit of blood magic and become a lifedraining, bloodspilling murderhappy nightblade etc. Later adding a druid for getting in touch with nature to become a tree-hugging, animal.friendly warden and a lich to get the bit of death magic tutoring to become a skull-tossing, spirint-calling necromancer as well.

Possibly even make it a two part selection, splitting all the classes into "power source" - Aedric, Draconic, Daedric, Blood and later Nature, and Necromancy; and a second "make your choice" setup for picking "elemental affinity" - Fire (DPS/DoT), Storm (DPS/Splash), Ice (DPS/Slow), Earth (DPS/Tanky), Light (healing), Darkness (stealth), and let people mix and match as they please...

And at the end of the coldharbour escape, THEN let them pick where to come out after jumping into the vortex. Without extras, automatically in the chosen races "home alliance", as imperial or with "Any Race, Any Alliance", you get to pick... and with the expansions, you get more options to pick from added!

And if you pick the mainstory... you drop into the starter isles, and if you want to skip the mainstory for that character and jump ahead to some expansion... you drop into that expansions tutorial map where you get the "expansion storyline intro", but not the "figure out how to play" part (since you already did that in coldharbour).
Or have everyone go to the starter isles, and only add a "manual" shortcut for those who want to go to some expansion, making the "expansion tutorial" more of an intro that -everyone- gets when they first travel there...

Would have been sooo nifty... alas, paths not taken!