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Please, enlighten this Brigadier

  • Lokey0024
    Lokey0024
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    Theignson wrote: »
    Need more context. If it is a small group, eg 4-6 , they are often designed to supplement each other with their builds. They can be extremely hard to kill. They have a huge advantage over pugs, plus they are usually in discord so they call out who to 6v1 focus. As a solo I just avoid those groups since they will just destroy you.

    If it is a solo player, then the maxim, "you can't have everything" holds. Get combat metrics to quantify exactly how hard they are hitting you.

    For example, you can have a stam warden build that is extremely tanky, has good sustain, good helaing, but you lose weapon damage. So how do they kill you? They generate ulti then hit you with their sub/DB/ executioner combo. Just watch for their combo and those tanks should almost never kill you.

    Or you could have a NB whose combo hits extremely hard. But those are not tanky, they are squishy. They cloak away. Or a sorc hitting extremely hard, but they have low hp, they depend on shields and streak.

    In a build you are trying to put together: damage (weapon damage, critical damage and penetration for stam build), defense (resists and hp), sustain (stam recovery) , and healing. Its almost impossible to max all 4. Eg for a stam dk you can have a heavy armor build with seventh/fury, and this can generate high weapon damage under attack, which boosts both damage and healing. But the damage isnt as high as the glass cannons can get, and those stam DK builds usually have bad weapon critical compared, eg to a NB. They also have lower regen that a NB, eg compare 7th to bone pirate, there is no comparison.

    Its easy enough to claim cheating, but I've pvped almost daily for over 18 months, almost never seen anything that I even think is cheating. Only once or twice.

    I've seen 14 dodge rolls stacked, damage that shouldn't be possible thru 30k resists, and movement that is completely unhindered by snares no matter what. I play on ps4, not pc, so I think there might be glitch issues people know about that they don't say a word, kind of like the twin star glitch that went on for a couple years before someone spilled the beans
  • Davadin
    Davadin
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    Sharee wrote: »
    Davadin wrote: »
    Sharee wrote: »
    Well to be fair, ZOS seems to be doing good job of removing the worst offenders next patch. 7th nerfed, fury nerfed, S&B nerfed, corrosive nerfed.
    wait what?

    Corrosive nerfed?????

    It no longer makes DOTs ignore armor.

    i thought that's only Onslaught?
    Praetorian Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Kaalgrontiid
    Scalebreaker 5.1.5 PvP build: 2H/2H The Plague Titan
  • DemonDruaga
    DemonDruaga
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    Davadin wrote: »
    Sharee wrote: »
    Davadin wrote: »
    Sharee wrote: »
    Well to be fair, ZOS seems to be doing good job of removing the worst offenders next patch. 7th nerfed, fury nerfed, S&B nerfed, corrosive nerfed.
    wait what?

    Corrosive nerfed?????

    It no longer makes DOTs ignore armor.

    i thought that's only Onslaught?

    Na.. Corrosive gets the same treatment like Onslaught :'(
    Ardor // Dunkelsicht // Pakt
  • Iskiab
    Iskiab
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    youre arguing for the sake of arguing. Players with high defense, and healing should not be able to take out a group unless that group is full incompetent or new players which is to be expected.

    The flip side of what you say here is that, unless some form of cheating is involved (and that's rarer than most players think), if a single player does successfully fight and defeat a group of players, we can say that the group was new, incompetent, or playing badly.

    Groups that are organized and know how to deal with 1vXers don't lose those fights. They don't let themselves get pulled apart through LOS into a series of 1v1s that lets the 1vXer defeat them in detail. That's when bad 1vXers complain "You zerged me!"

    So I don't really have a lot of sympathy for groups that lose to 1vXers. They need to L2Play when it comes to fighting 1vXers, learn to recognize LOS traps, and stick together to maximise their damage and defense. Nor do I have any sympathy for 1vXers when they lose to groups who don't fall for their tactics.

    Only ass clowns follow "1vXers" playing shuffle monkey around a tree. I have no sympathy for "1vXers" and elitist small group try hards who cry all the time. These players show the massive imbalance in cyrodiil and they all have one thing in common- they think theyre Gods gift to gaming stroking each others egos......
    I laugh when these players get wiped by a group, they start blowing up zone chat and send hate mail.

    Have to agree, oozing with arrogance. Worst part is a lot always claim they’re amazing because of knowledge of the game, then are always trying to get the game to cater to make them more powerful.

    Guess they aren’t that knowledgeable/good if they’re constantly crying to make the game cater to them instead of adapting.

    A lot are cool just trying to have fun, but some of them give them a bad reputation. Especially the ones who constantly give bad advice they’d never follow to keep new players easily farmable.
    Edited by Iskiab on August 3, 2019 2:30PM
    Looking for any guildies I used to play with:
    Havoc Warhammer - Alair
    LoC EQ2 - Mayi and Iskiab
    Condemned and Tabula Rasa - Rift - Iskiab
    Or anyone else I used to play games with in guilds I’ve forgotten
  • NuarBlack
    NuarBlack
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    Iskiab wrote: »
    youre arguing for the sake of arguing. Players with high defense, and healing should not be able to take out a group unless that group is full incompetent or new players which is to be expected.

    The flip side of what you say here is that, unless some form of cheating is involved (and that's rarer than most players think), if a single player does successfully fight and defeat a group of players, we can say that the group was new, incompetent, or playing badly.

    Groups that are organized and know how to deal with 1vXers don't lose those fights. They don't let themselves get pulled apart through LOS into a series of 1v1s that lets the 1vXer defeat them in detail. That's when bad 1vXers complain "You zerged me!"

    So I don't really have a lot of sympathy for groups that lose to 1vXers. They need to L2Play when it comes to fighting 1vXers, learn to recognize LOS traps, and stick together to maximise their damage and defense. Nor do I have any sympathy for 1vXers when they lose to groups who don't fall for their tactics.

    Only ass clowns follow "1vXers" playing shuffle monkey around a tree. I have no sympathy for "1vXers" and elitist small group try hards who cry all the time. These players show the massive imbalance in cyrodiil and they all have one thing in common- they think theyre Gods gift to gaming stroking each others egos......
    I laugh when these players get wiped by a group, they start blowing up zone chat and send hate mail.

    Have to agree, oozing with arrogance. Worst part is a lot always claim they’re amazing because of knowledge of the game, then are always trying to get the game to cater to make them more powerful.

    Guess they aren’t that knowledgeable/good if they’re constantly crying to make the game cater to them instead of adapting.

    A lot are cool just trying to have fun, but some of them give them a bad reputation. Especially the ones who constantly give bad advice they’d never follow to keep new players easily farmable.

    They were the primary push for the snipe and bow nerf that nerfed bow into the ground to where it is now worthless. I pushed several of them on here till they admitted they aren't looking for fair fights. That many of them know each other and will just wave and leave each other alone in cyro because they don't want fair fights. They just want to farm potatoes and to make heavily edited and curated(leave out the 9 of 10 times they get stomped to post the 1 video they were able to farm potatoes) videos to post to boost their epeen.

    They basically are always pushing for nerfs or buffs that favor the LoS and ult dump. They think all combat should occur within Dbos range and anything else isn't valid which is just ridiculous and means they can't l2p against a larger variety of tactic. And 9 of 10 are cp Crutchers and bash on no Cp and BGs cause their tactics don't work in those modes.
  • InvictusApollo
    InvictusApollo
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    youre arguing for the sake of arguing. Players with high defense, and healing should not be able to take out a group unless that group is full incompetent or new players which is to be expected.

    The flip side of what you say here is that, unless some form of cheating is involved (and that's rarer than most players think), if a single player does successfully fight and defeat a group of players, we can say that the group was new, incompetent, or playing badly.

    Groups that are organized and know how to deal with 1vXers don't lose those fights. They don't let themselves get pulled apart through LOS into a series of 1v1s that lets the 1vXer defeat them in detail. That's when bad 1vXers complain "You zerged me!"

    So I don't really have a lot of sympathy for groups that lose to 1vXers. They need to L2Play when it comes to fighting 1vXers, learn to recognize LOS traps, and stick together to maximise their damage and defense. Nor do I have any sympathy for 1vXers when they lose to groups who don't fall for their tactics.

    I still remember one of my first raids in Cyrodill with a guild. We literally had only one person who knew how to pvp. At once point I saw an enemy player and started running towards him. Our raid leader asked me:
    RL: Do you know who that is?
    Me: No.
    RL: Thats a 1vXer. Are you in pvp build?
    Me: No.
    RL: Then don't engage him.
    Me: Ok.
    Years later I've been hunting 1vXers while facepalming at zerglings who chase them around a rock.
  • VaranisArano
    VaranisArano
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    youre arguing for the sake of arguing. Players with high defense, and healing should not be able to take out a group unless that group is full incompetent or new players which is to be expected.

    The flip side of what you say here is that, unless some form of cheating is involved (and that's rarer than most players think), if a single player does successfully fight and defeat a group of players, we can say that the group was new, incompetent, or playing badly.

    Groups that are organized and know how to deal with 1vXers don't lose those fights. They don't let themselves get pulled apart through LOS into a series of 1v1s that lets the 1vXer defeat them in detail. That's when bad 1vXers complain "You zerged me!"

    So I don't really have a lot of sympathy for groups that lose to 1vXers. They need to L2Play when it comes to fighting 1vXers, learn to recognize LOS traps, and stick together to maximise their damage and defense. Nor do I have any sympathy for 1vXers when they lose to groups who don't fall for their tactics.

    I still remember one of my first raids in Cyrodill with a guild. We literally had only one person who knew how to pvp. At once point I saw an enemy player and started running towards him. Our raid leader asked me:
    RL: Do you know who that is?
    Me: No.
    RL: Thats a 1vXer. Are you in pvp build?
    Me: No.
    RL: Then don't engage him.
    Me: Ok.
    Years later I've been hunting 1vXers while facepalming at zerglings who chase them around a rock.

    Awesome. That's an experience every new player could stand to learn!
  • montiferus
    montiferus
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    ArchMikem wrote: »
    Ive PvP'd for a couple years now. I've picked up on things, defeated thousands. But i absolutely cannot fathom how so many people never run out of resources, always break free, mitigate the hell out of attacks, constantly self heal, never get snared, AND turn around to lay waste to their attackers, all in the same build, acting like its the easiest thing to pull off.

    Just how.

    Is it like some kind of PvP fight club? First rule is you dont talk about Build Club?

    Good builds, teamwork and experience.

    I've seen you in Cyro and if you want to get better you should try and connect with the good solo/smallscale EP players.
  • Waffennacht
    Waffennacht
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    CP builds.

    In No CP BGs you can do a lot; just not everything.

    Think of the resources available via CP. I mean you have reductions to every mechanic, additional Regen, additional return on heavies, that's just Regen alone.

    Anyone that has tried a block heavy or a dodge heavy build can instantly tell the difference between CP and no CP
    Gamer tag: ShenronNacht NA Xbox One
    1100+ CP
    Battleground PvP'er
    Shepherd of Rot - Stamina Necromancer
  • RighteousBacon
    RighteousBacon
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    ArchMikem wrote: »
    Ive PvP'd for a couple years now. I've picked up on things, defeated thousands. But i absolutely cannot fathom how so many people never run out of resources, always break free, mitigate the hell out of attacks, constantly self heal, never get snared, AND turn around to lay waste to their attackers, all in the same build, acting like its the easiest thing to pull off.

    Just how.

    Is it like some kind of PvP fight club? First rule is you dont talk about Build Club?

    Too many players running around trying to be a proto fake me out tank that can deal too much damage. If youre building high resistances take your ass to a trial.

    Too many players running around with high resistance and high damage, certain sets and certain class abilities that are ridiculous, this is why eso can never be balanced.

    Pvp builds should be either a healer, a tank or, a dps - not all of the above. This game enables such horendous and unbalanced gameplay. U23 will make cyrodiil worse.

    I cant blame the players i blame the developers for allowing such shlt game play.



    Sets,CP allocation,potions and food.

    I disagree

    You can disagree all you want, it doesnt change the fact that there is an ever increasing imbalance in pvp excluding server performance. One more thing to add, reduce population in the 30 day, force players to spread out to other campaigns.

    PvP builds should not just be a healer, tank, or dps. There’s such thing as solo pvp, and it’s what many of us love. If that’s taken away many players will leave.
  • BaiterOfZergs
    BaiterOfZergs
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    CP builds.

    In No CP BGs you can do a lot; just not everything.

    Think of the resources available via CP. I mean you have reductions to every mechanic, additional Regen, additional return on heavies, that's just Regen alone.

    Anyone that has tried a block heavy or a dodge heavy build can instantly tell the difference between CP and no CP

    Depends on the player really, on paper it can look like it doesn’t do everything but the skill level of the player can change that. No cp builds usually either lack mitigation or sustain. Although, if a player is accustomed to low sustain builds sustain becomes irrelevant and they can cover “every” area.

    Think the biggest factors in no cp bgs is actually who you’re grouped with, up against and your ability to be a team player. The most generic builds can work in there if you learn to manage your resources.

    Zerg of House Smallscale, First of his name, wielder of Volendrung, battleground hero, Cyrodiil butcher, the swifft footed, OG of the Templars and first pvpers, defender of scrolls and baiter of zergs.
  • montiferus
    montiferus
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    CP builds.

    CP has very little to do with what the OP is talking about. If that were true every max CP pug in Cyro would exhibit the behavior he is talking about. I can assure you that is NOT the case.

    Does CP help? Of course but it isn't the reason why some players consistently survive against and kill numbers greater than their own.
    Edited by montiferus on August 5, 2019 10:59PM
  • Vapirko
    Vapirko
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    Play solo or in very small groups and keep at it until you stop dying all the time. I don’t think there’s any other way. It’s trial by fire, frustration and tears. I used to think there was some trick to it that no one was telling me. Now I can 1/2vX in medium with no protective traits on a stamina templar and there are classes much better suited to such things. The thing is I always went for the solo or very small scale play even when I was a salty noob blaming my losses on cheats and meta builds. Then one day I realized I was the guy people were calling a cheater and coming back to Xv1 and bag after getting beat. After that it’s like riding a bike and you never really forget how. A lot of it is patience and avoiding tunnel vision on getting a kill. Play the long game but watch for your burst windows. And as you get better always be straddling that build line between maximum damage and sustain/survivability. If I can do it so can you, I’m far from the top level of player.
    Edited by Vapirko on August 5, 2019 11:11PM
  • ArchMikem
    ArchMikem
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    Vapirko wrote: »
    Play solo or in very small groups and keep at it until you stop dying all the time. I don’t think there’s any other way. It’s trial by fire, frustration and tears. I used to think there was some trick to it that no one was telling me. Now I can 1/2vX in medium with no protective traits on a stamina templar and there are classes much better suited to such things. The thing is I always went for the solo or very small scale play even when I was a salty noob blaming my losses on cheats and meta builds. Then one day I realized I was the guy people were calling a cheater and coming back to Xv1 and bag after getting beat. After that it’s like riding a bike and you never really forget how. A lot of it is patience and avoiding tunnel vision on getting a kill. Play the long game but watch for your burst windows. And as you get better always be straddling that build line between maximum damage and sustain/survivability. If I can do it so can you, I’m far from the top level of player.

    I've to a point, gotten there with my StamBlade. Replacing Hulking Draugr with Leviathan to get a 71% Crit has helped tremendously with damage output, maybe not with true PvP builds with super crit resist but those who don't have any and Guards are slightly easier fights now. And of course being a Nightblade the main Ult is Incap and that is just super finicky. A lot of the time it's dodged and many hits are mitigated or blocked. I've managed to get a few moments of a good burst, just need to work on that more. I know how to do a burst but most people just immediately ani cancel a break free and roll dodge out of my rotation.
    CP1,100+ Master Explorer - AvA Brigadier - Console Peasant

    The constant state of Cyrodiil PvP:
    https://i.imgur.com/CHyI36F.png
  • Hexquisite
    Hexquisite
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    Its synergy between many things...Sets/passives/cp/skills/monster set/poisons/debuffs...and also there are some awesome lingering health potions out there--expenisve to make, but often worth it. Or once someone set you up to lose your resources they might use which ever dps potion works best for them and then combo you.
    Edited by Hexquisite on August 13, 2019 10:42PM
    PC NA
    ~Ethereal Traders Union~
    ~Spicy Economics~


  • chris25602
    chris25602
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    so just my two cents I found the amount of critical resistance you have to be super important. I played around with different setups and found 2k crit resist to be right for me. at 1.5k I can play but I have to be super kitey while anything over 2k I have to sacrifice another stat I don't want to loose.
  • Davadin
    Davadin
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    Vapirko wrote: »
    Play solo or in very small groups and keep at it until you stop dying all the time. I don’t think there’s any other way. It’s trial by fire, frustration and tears. I used to think there was some trick to it that no one was telling me. Now I can 1/2vX in medium with no protective traits on a stamina templar and there are classes much better suited to such things. The thing is I always went for the solo or very small scale play even when I was a salty noob blaming my losses on cheats and meta builds. Then one day I realized I was the guy people were calling a cheater and coming back to Xv1 and bag after getting beat. After that it’s like riding a bike and you never really forget how. A lot of it is patience and avoiding tunnel vision on getting a kill. Play the long game but watch for your burst windows. And as you get better always be straddling that build line between maximum damage and sustain/survivability. If I can do it so can you, I’m far from the top level of player.

    this post is epic. well said.
    Praetorian Davadin Bloodstrake - Nord Dragon Knight - PC NA - Kaalgrontiid
    Scalebreaker 5.1.5 PvP build: 2H/2H The Plague Titan
  • KillsAllElves
    KillsAllElves
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    I disagree[/quote]

    You can disagree all you want, it doesnt change the fact that there is an ever increasing imbalance in pvp excluding server performance. One more thing to add, reduce population in the 30 day, force players to spread out to other campaigns.[/quote]

    PvP builds should not just be a healer, tank, or dps. There’s such thing as solo pvp, and it’s what many of us love. If that’s taken away many players will leave.[/quote]

    No they wont leave, theyll learn to adapt and solo players are least of ZO$'s worries.

    Players keep telling eachother theyre going to leave if muh build gets nerfed, theyre still playing eso.
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