Original Starting Class Overhaul: Sorcerer

Vercingetorix

The starting classes in ESO way back at launch were not designed with balance in mind - classes were largely subject to single combat role and pretty much sucked everywhere outside of that role. ZoS has tried to make minor ability changes to adhere to a more balanced class structure, but I feel that a overhaul is more appropriate. When folks hear about reworking the original starting classes, they often cry about homogenization. This post is not that - I feel that all the classes to be able to do everything, BUT they need to do it in their own way. Following this philosophy I will be starting with the popular Sorcerer class and be using the skill line structure of Warden/Necromancer. Obviously, this will be a big read, but I've formatted the post to make it easier to read through. Keep in mind that any new ability base values are placeholders - they are there for illustrative purposes and subject to change.

NOTE: I felt Sorcerer class passives are fairly good right now where they're currently at and instead chose to focus on the abilities in the skill lines right now.

Storm Calling (DPS Skill Line)

Ultimate: Summon Storm Atronach
Summon a mobile storm atronach to fight alongside you for 30 seconds. Its arrival deals [6147] Shock Damage and stuns enemies for 3 seconds. The atronach zaps the closest enemy, dealing [3072] Shock Damage every 1 second. An ally near the atronach can activate the Charged Lightning​ synergy, granting the ally and the atronach Major Berserk, increasing their damage done by 25% for 8 seconds.
Morph 1: Summon Unstable Storm Atronach - Atronach now explodes for [8000] shock damage in a 8m radius when killed or duration ends.
Morph 2: Summon Air Atronach - Instead deals physical damage. The atronach's slashes bleed any enemy struck for additional [3072] physical damage every second for 5 seconds.

Comment: This gives the Sorcerer both a magicka and a stamina dps option. You are now summoning the very aspect of the storm, wind and lightning! The atronach now also moves with you just like a normal pet but with a limited duration, giving it more combat value. Overload was unbalanced in PvP and because of that it was nerfed into the ground for PvE. ZoS has had 5 years and still not balanced it out. Time to get rid of Overload altogether and make a new ultimate for the tanking skill line!

Mage's Fury: Call down lightning to strike an enemy, dealing [2380] Shock Damage. If the enemy falls to or below 20% Health within 4 seconds of being struck, an explosion deals an additional [8455] Shock Damage to them and [3809] Shock Damage to other enemies nearby.
Morph 1: Mage's Wrath - If any enemy is killed within 5 seconds of being hit with this ability, you restore [4860] Magicka.
Morph 2: Cyclonic Fury - Instead deals physical damage in a 5m cone in front you. (The execute explosion also deals physical damage).

Comment: I combined both Endless Fury and Wrath into a single magicka morph for the Sorcerer and created a stamina morph that executes in an AoE cone. This gives StamSorcs more class identity by freeing them from being forced to run only weapon skills.

Lightning Splash: Create a nexus of storm energy at the target location, dealing [1966] Shock Damage to enemies in the 6m area every 1 second for 12 seconds. An ally standing within the nexus can activate the Conduit synergy, dealing [6147] Shock Damage to enemies around them.
Morph 1: Liquid Lightning - Increases the damage and radius (8m).
Morph 2: Flash Flood - Instead pelts enemies in the area with torrential wind and rain, dealing physical damage. Damage increases by 2% each second, up to 10%.

Comment: Again I combined both the old Liquid Lightning and Lightning Flood morphs into a single morph and gave stamina sorcerers another class ability for their arsenal. Magicka users lose nothing from this change and stamina sorcerers gain more class identity.

Lightning Form: No changes.

Comment: This skill and its morphs IMO do not need to be touched.

Surge: No changes.

Comment: This skill and its morphs IMO do not need to be touched.

Bolt Escape: No changes.

Comment: This skill and its morphs IMO do not need to be touched.

Daedric Fortress (Tanking Skill Line)

Ultimate: Summon Daedroth 250 Ultimate
Summon a Daedroth to besiege enemies in its wake for 30 seconds. The Daedroth can taunt 1 enemy at a time, but will not overwrite any player taunt. The Daedroth's basic attacks deal [4257] Physical Damage and enemies struck are afflicted with Major Maim for 5 seconds. You or any ally near the Daedroth can activate the Infernal Hide synergy, granting Major Protection to all allies near the daedroth for 8 seconds.
Morph 1: Daedroth Juggernaut - Daedroth has increased health and defenses.
Morph 2: Rampaging Daedroth - Daedroth can now taunt up to 2 enemies at a time.

Comment: I wanted to create an ultimate that was Oblivion themed but also could function as a tanking ability. Daedroths are behemoths and it seemed like the obvious choice when designing it. The player chooses between having a stronger Daedroth or a Daedroth that can do up to two taunts. I limited the taunt to 2 enemies at a time because any more would be OP.

Summon Clannfear: Command the powers of Oblivion to send a Daedric clannfear to fight at your side. The clannfear's headbutt deals [1171] Physical Damage, while its tail spike hits nearby enemies for [2730] Physical Damage after 1 second. The clannfear can taunt 1 enemy at a time, but will not overwrite any player taunt. Once summoned, you can activate the clannfear's special ability, healing you and the clannfear for [5784]. The clannfear remains until killed or unsummoned.
Morph 1: Summon Unstable Clannfear - Instead deals greatly increased damage with its attacks, but can no longer taunt.
Morph 2: Summon Clannfear Matron - Passively grants you Minor Protection while active.

Comment: I got rid of the wimpy imp because you are a powerful Sorcerer and not a conjurer of cheap tricks. Players can choose between an improved tanking companion or a strictly DPS-oriented companion. Clannfear damage and heal both scale with your highest resource - either lightning damage for magicka or physical damage for stamina.

Daedric Curse: Curse an enemy with a destructive rune, dealing [9000] Magic Damage to the target over 8 seconds. While the curse is active, your pets will prioritize the target and deal an additional 40% damage to the target. You can have only one Daedric Curse active at a time.
Morph 1: Daedric Prey - Targets are also afflicted with Minor Vulnerability. You can have any number of Daedric Prey active at a time.
Morph 2: Haunting Curse - The curse will now also explode twice, dealing [8199] Magic Damage to the target after 4 seconds and explode again when the effect expires. You can have only one Haunting Curse active at a time.

Comment: Since I added a DoT to the base ability while it's active, I slightly extended the delay on the explosions by 0.5 seconds. Daedric Prey becomes a great option for players who wish to have more control over their pets in combat. I also removed the explosion from Prey since the pet bonus with Minor Vulnerability would be too much on a single ability.

Summon Winged Twilight: Call on Azura to send a winged twilight to fight at your side. The winged twilight's zaps deal [2757] Shock Damage and its kicks deal [2416] Shock Damage. Once summoned, you can activate the winged twilight's special ability, causing it to heal you and the winged twilight for [4953] Health. The winged twilight remains until killed or unsummoned.
Morph 1: Twilight Matriarch - Deals 50% less damage, but twilight's special ability now heals you, itself, and one nearby ally.
Morph 2: Twilight Tormentor - Deals 20% more damage, but twilight's special ability heals for 20% less health.

Comment: Adjusted the two morphs so that players can get a heal on either morph but there is a specific focus for each morph: offense or defense.

Conjured Ward: No changes.

Comment: This skill and its morphs IMO do not need to be touched.

Bound Armor: No changes.

Comment: This skill and its morphs IMO do not need to be touched.

Dark Magic (Healing Skill Line)

Ultimate: Negate Magic: No changes.

Comment: This skill and its morphs IMO do not need to be touched.

Crystal Shard: Conjure dark crystals to bombard an enemy, dealing [7367] Magic Damage and healing you for 30% of the damage done. Casting any other Magicka ability has a 35% chance of causing your next Crystal Shard to be instant, deal 20% more damage, and cost 50% less Magicka.
Morph 1: Crystal Fragments - Also heals any allies near the struck enemy.
Morph 2: Crystal Blast - Converts to a stamina ability, dealing Physical damage and also damages enemies near the initial target for [7367] Physical Damage.

Comment: I lowered the initial damage of the ability by 20% and added a heal to the ability. Stam Sorcs get access to a class stam heal and mag sorcs get an AoE heal. Also, I made the base ability and BOTH morphs have the instant-cast proc since it was a vital part of what made Fragments so damn good. No one likes hard-casting Crystal Shard - no one.

Encase: Call forth Daedric shards from the earth to immobilize enemies in front of you for 4 seconds. The shards also heal allies in the area for [4100] health.
Morph 1: Restraining Prison - Immobilized enemies are afflicted with Minor Maim for 6 seconds.
Morph 2: Regenerating Shards - You and allies in the area gain Major Vitality for 3 seconds.

Comment: Adjusted this ability to operate as a burst heal that's slightly weaker than Combat Prayer but has Healer and Tank utility morphs.

Rune Prison: Imprison enemy in a constricting sphere of dark magic, after a short duration they are stunned for 3 seconds. This stun cannot be blocked.
Morph 1: Rune Cage - Heals you after the effect expires.
Morph 2: Defensive Rune - No changes.

Comment: Took the damage away from Rune Cage and instead gives a burst heal to the caster when the effect expires. Adds survival and frankly, the Sorc doesn't need any more burst.

Dark Exchange: No changes.

Comment: This skill and its morphs IMO do not need to be touched.

Daedric Mines: Deploy 3 volatile Daedric mines around you, which take 3 seconds to arm and last for 30 seconds. When a mine is triggered it explodes, dealing [4000] Magic Damage and immobilizing the enemy for 2 seconds. Once mines are armed, you can activate this ability again to manually detonate any remaining mines. You heal for [1500] health each time a mine explodes.
Morph 1: Daedric Minefield: Deploys 5 mines and reduces cost.
Morph 2: Daedric Tomb: Mines can be placed up to 28 meters away. Mines also heal any nearby allies when they explode.

Comment: A unique twist on the daedric mine ability. While it loses some initial damage, it gains healing and any armed mines can now be manually detonated for burst damage/heals. Tomb can deal burst damage up to 28 meters away and heal their allies in the process. Minefield allows massive burst damage and a heal for yourself right at your feet - opponents will fear your mines once they're armed even more now.

That's my rework for the Sorcerer class. I know there's a lot of changes and some of your burst or utility got moved or changed, but I feel both magicka and stamina sorcerers would be in a much better spot with this overhaul. Remember, the goal of this overhaul is to allow the Sorcerer to handle ALL roles better, but make sure it does so in its own way. I'd love to hear your feedback and if there's any interest, I can share my rework ideas for adjusting the skill lines for Dragonknight, Templar, and Nightblade so that they can better handle all 3 combat roles in the game.

xeNNNNN

Love the ideas but storm calling looks super broken xD

the scaling of that damage with a fully geared player.... my god xD

Heyodude

i like what you did in the storm class and i like the idea of a deadroth summon but the rest isnt to my taste.

Vercingetorix

xeNNNNN wrote: »

Love the ideas but storm calling looks super broken xD

the scaling of that damage with a fully geared player.... my god xD

Hey, I said that all values were subject to change - it's just there for illustrative purposes. Yeah, Storm Calling is definitely fun AF with my changes. A mobile atronach would make for rather interesting combat in PvP!

Abhaya

I like it. As a stam sorc main and only I am always open to getting some stamina morphs and better utilization of class skills. I personally feel that the active effect for bound armor needs a change.

Vercingetorix

Abhaya wrote: »

I like it. As a stam sorc main and only I am always open to getting some stamina morphs and better utilization of class skills. I personally feel that the active effect for bound armor needs a change.

I ended up not touching the skill because it was designed to be a defensive skill in the tanking skill line. You are getting 8% max stamina for having it slotted so there's combat value in it for stam sorcs, but I understand that you probably don't see much use in the block mitigation effect. The fact is that there are both mag tanks and stam tanks that could use either morph and get value from it. If I changed even one morph, one of those tank specs gets hurt by the change. Since it's the tanking skill line, I decided to leave it alone.

Grandma

I really love this in design. some of the skills are a bit overloaded, such as the pets having like 3 functions before even getting morphed. I don't think both pets should have a heal. I honestly think the matriarch should have the heal, and then the clanfear could have like aoe tail swipe that stuns everything in a small area around it, but the effect can't hit the same target more than once per 5 seconds or something.

xeNNNNN

Vercingetorix wrote: »

xeNNNNN wrote: »

Love the ideas but storm calling looks super broken xD

the scaling of that damage with a fully geared player.... my god xD

Hey, I said that all values were subject to change - it's just there for illustrative purposes. Yeah, Storm Calling is definitely fun AF with my changes. A mobile atronach would make for rather interesting combat in PvP!

Yeah that assumes they fix the hit box issues and telegraph issues we have at the moment xD

otherwise it will be a weird mobile immobile atro

RogueShark

As a sorc healer, just going to comment on your dark magic reworks...
They wouldn'tbe practical for serious raid healing. The two AoE heals apply a CC, which makes the tank's job miserable. There's no reason to have immobilize on them: if it's a line dedicated to healing, dedicate it to healing. As well as it being very redundant to have the same CC on both AoE heals. Crystal shard heal looks gimmicky and would be very unreliable for an AoE heal, needing people to be near the target (which is not always possible). I do kind of like the dynamic and idea of it, just uncertain about practicality.

But!
I do love the effort put into these ideas and I would like ZoS to take the warden/necro approach to all classes and give them all healing, tanking, and dpsing trees. Very thoughtful post and I am in full agreement that sorc needs some reworks. Not just for healing, but for stam (who get zero use out of so many class passives).

Vercingetorix

RogueShark wrote: »

As a sorc healer, just going to comment on your dark magic reworks...
They wouldn'tbe practical for serious raid healing. The two AoE heals apply a CC, which makes the tank's job miserable. There's no reason to have immobilize on them: if it's a line dedicated to healing, dedicate it to healing. As well as it being very redundant to have the same CC on both AoE heals. Crystal shard heal looks gimmicky and would be very unreliable for an AoE heal, needing people to be near the target (which is not always possible). I do kind of like the dynamic and idea of it, just uncertain about practicality.

But!
I do love the effort put into these ideas and I would like ZoS to take the warden/necro approach to all classes and give them all healing, tanking, and dpsing trees. Very thoughtful post and I am in full agreement that sorc needs some reworks. Not just for healing, but for stam (who get zero use out of so many class passives).

Thank you for your feedback! Yes, you make a great point about Encase needing one of its morphs being dedicated to healing - perhaps drop the heal for one morph and keep the CC with the other morph being the heal without any CC?

The Crystal Shard heal was an attempt to give it some extra utility. The healing skill line can have damage abilities but I wanted the emphasis to be on utility. The AoE heal would likely help melee dps against a boss when the healer fires off their frag, but yeah other than that it may not be practical. Thanks for your insight - I think the Storm Calling skill line rework I posted has the most promise because stam sorcs suffer so much from class identity because they get so little from their own class.

Abhaya

Also another thought is that the 3 lines don’t have to be forced into a designated role. I like the ideas behind it but as someone else pointed out skills like crystal shards were designed to be damage skills and it’s weird trying to force them into a (insert role here.)

Soundinfinite

No

While there are some good ideas here, and I'm not saying the Sorc couldn't use a refresh, this isn't what I would like to see the sorc become.

1) It is very Stamina biased. While there are many arguments that a Stam Sorc needs more, that more shouldn't come at the expense of it's magicka counterpart.

A) No changes to Negate, no addition of Silencing Stam Skills while at the same time arguing that Stam should have skills that work like magicka. This is already contentious with the new Classes and how much Stamina is now basically green magicka. With your proposed changes, the Sorc (As by definition in Merrian Webster A Sorcerer means magic person) will have a large choice of stam skills that they can't silence while still silencing other magicka sorcs.

B ) Crystal Shards being nerfed. Why? this is a bread and butter skill of the Sorc that keeps being changed, nerfed, buffed, nerfed again and now with this rework is NERFED on the magicka side and made weaker. The Stamina morph ends up the stronger of the 2 morphs outputting more damage. Stamina Bias showing, Especially on a skill line called Dark MAGIC. A heal on this skill isn't needed. This skill line passively heals for 10% of your max health every .05 sec when you hit an enemy with a Dark Magic Skill.

C)Lightning Splash is an AOE DOT which are historically Magicka advantageous skills. No other classes AOE DOT has a Stamina morph including the Warden/Necromancer. This is to give Magicka as a whole an identity that Stamina doesn't possess. In the future this may be changed, but a Stamina morph of this skill shouldn't be given until classes wide make this change. Stam Sorcs already have an AOE DOT advantage with Hurricane and makes them the leader of Stamina in this role already, and matches excellently with dual wield skills. Also Stamina is mobile so a static AOE DOT doesn't mesh with the playstyle like Hurricane already does. Additionally, this skill has just reached a balance where depending on your build, each morph is viable on a magicka character meaning it no longer has an unusable morph.

D) Mage's Fury, this makes a redundant morph. Currently the ONLY Stamina Execute given to Class's is on a NightBlade and it is underused because of the strength of weapon skill line executes. To have an option just to have it, isn't an argument for it to exist. In single target damage, Executioner will out DPS it, and in AOE damage Whirlwind will out DPS it, lastly if you are wanting to go Bow build it doesn't have the range to be usable. Thus you are making an unneeded skill at the expense of a Magicka Skill which hasn't any other options but to use 1 of the 2 morphs of this skill. Whirlwind also, already pairs/compliments the design of a StamSorc excellently with the use of the Hurricane Skill.

E) All your changes do nothing for the Magicka Sorc at all, leaving it functioning worse than currently live. In short you are simply creating options for a Stam Sorc and options that are stronger than the Magicka counterpart. The magicka skills either remain untouched for DPS or nerfed. Meaning it isn't a true rework/refresh of the Sorc class as a whole, but is just adding Stamina skills.

2) Ultimates do not meet what is needed. You have created 2 Ultimates that do the same job.

A) You already have Conjured Ultimate in the form of the Storm Atro. To move it and then create a SECOND Conjured Ultimate makes build uniqueness fly away. It also makes the two redundant to each other. Add in, that Maw of the Infernal monster helm and you already have a conjured Daedroth a Sorc can use further making the new Ultimate redundant. Lastly they have made specific strides to make conjured pets NOT pull or taunt enemies. They used to, and they consciously went in and removed this function. While you are arguing that this is the tank skill, you are negating the role of the tank and its job by making the pets fill the role for the player. It also makes all of these skills completely unusable outside of tanking. The act of not overriding someone else's taunt creates too much work on the game especially if you are in a trial with many Sorcs using these skills. Also, Negate is already a decent Tanking Ultimate if you choose NOT to use the Warhorn/Shield Wall/ Pisijic Undo Ultimates which are hard to beat for a tank. Negate when Morphed to Absorption will stun all enemies, remove AOEs and heal all under the dome. This is a pure Utility Ultimate that can be equally used by Sorc Tanks and Sorc Healers if again not choosing the already very strong world ultimates and weapon skill ultimates available.

B ) Conjured Ultimates are expensive and the point of Lightning Lord is to give the Sorc its single cheap Ultimate, as all classes have access to, save the Necromancer. However, the Necro has an active skill that builds ultimate, plus a passive skill attached to its main offensive skills that builds ultimate. In short the Necro builds ultimate faster than any other class making its high Ultimate costs not taxing on players. While Lightning Lord needs a rework, in all respects it needs to be redone, hands down, no question, deleting it from the game and moving an expensive conjured Ultimate in its place is not even close to an an answer. It also lessons the Elemental/Mage/Wizard quality that the sorc can possess and creates just MORE pets to deal with.

C)For a Tanking Ultimate the New Daedroth does very little to help a tank. It simply taunts and enemy and then deals damage. If you are trying to create a tanking ultimate it needs to create OVERALL SURVIVABILITY. Shield Wall blocks for you negating 50% of all damage for free for its duration, Magma Armor, reduces all damage to 3% of your health grants damage shield, and Goliath adds 30k health and makes light and heavy attacks heal you. Granted you give major protection for melee ranged characters, however, this is only 8 seconds of a 30 second ultimate and un-stacakable with many other sources already giving this, including now a potion. Thus if it simply reduced incoming damage for lets say 20% while active it would be much stronger. However, considering the Meta of Warhorn on tanks, this makes a Sorc lose a viable Damage ultimate for a low usage Tanking one.

3) While the Sorc doesn't have clear cut Healing/Tanking/Dps skill lines, the Sorc already has somewhat of a division. Dark Magic is closer to Tanking, Daedric Summoning is as close as the Sorc gets to Healing, and Storm Calling is the DPS line. Meaning I feel its an odd choice of which lines you have chosen to align and change.

A) Daedric Summoning is the only line to have active on demand heals in both the Matriarch and the Clannifer. Yet, you have chosen to force heals on a multitude of skills of Dark Magic forcing them to lose their potency in damage to have this. None of the Dark Magic skills, even with your changes, are pure healing. Instead everything is just given secondary healing effects which will do little to help a dedicated healer and does not fill the role with what is needed. You haven't given viable alternatives to what other classes and their healing lines offer. It would be much easier to change the Summoning line into a healing line than the one you chose.

B ) Dark Magic is already closer to Tanking. The Ultimate is pure Utility, Daedric Mines and Encase are AOE crowd controls with encase being an equivalent of Dk Claws, and Dark Exchange can only be viably used in PVE on a tank due to its cast time. While it isn't meta nor amazingly strong, a Tank is the most viable to use it. Thus, this would be the easiest line to change into a pure tanking line for a build. Granted Crystal Shards is found here, but likewise, Necro has Scythe, and Warden has Impaling shards so having one damage skill is perfectly viable to a tank line.

C) When it comes to DPS you kept with Storm Calling as the main focus, which is very easy since it basically already is this on live. However, you haven't altered any of these skills in any serious way of improvement besides making Stamina morphs. Outside of this line, skills that could be used as damage have been seriously nerphed for other means, and you deleted the Unstable Familiar which is currently the strongest DPS of the pets, and the least complained about because of its small size, not creating the problems the larger pets cause around the world. I've already touched on the destruction of Crystal Shards for Magicka builds and you haven't created any other viable way to build a Mag Sorc for DPS than is already in play. While you have given Stam Sorcs more morphs, the skills chosen don't align with the build of Stam Sorcs or Stam characters in general and thus will likely not change their builds as it is not what they need. Lastly, there is still no class spammable for Stam or Mag.

D) Overall, you also haven't changed niche skills or skills of little use, nor have you changed redundant skills. For example, Daedric Mines vs Encase. Neither are widely used, Encase isn't as strong as a DK's Claws as it doesn't carry a synergy nor does is surround the player, only working on enemies in front of them, yet it is a must for a Sorc Tank. Daedric Mines surrounds the player but has a load time, and a limited amount of enemies it can affect, though you trade instant arm for more enemies depending on morphs. Mines is mainly only used in PVP and even there with limited function, also sky high cost. Long and short, both skills serve the same function, to immobilize and damage multiple players and provide crowd control. Why are there 2 skills with niche uses that basically do the same thing at their core? It would be great, in my opinion to combine them, blending damage, cost and utlitly into a sinlge skill with morphs that increase the effectiveness of ultilty vs damage. I'd say keep encase with these changes. Daedric Mines can then be a completely new skill that has a magicka and stamina morph. Possibly something along the line of a bomb you place on yourself and is a time released AOE explosion in the vein of Solar Barrage that moves with you. Just thinking here.

The main change I can get behind out of all of these, is the morphs to the Strom Atro. While I don't agree with it being moved to Storm Calling, having a lightning Stone Atro for MAgicka and an Air Atro for Stamina is a good strong idea. However, you have greatly nerphed the damage (I know you say this can be changed, but I feel it is better to use base damage that is unscaled when offering changes) Currently my Atro hits for much more damage than yours here and if that nerf is for mobility I don't want it. Maybe the magicka version can take on a Dk's Moving Standard type of morph. Where you can call it 2 or 3 times in different locations during its time span and each time giving the AOE damage and stun. Also, it needs to keep the AOE damage that is available to the Charged Atro so it isn't just a single target Ultimate. The Air Atro can be an always AOE damage skill that moves with the caster at all times, so it fits very strongly with a Stam Sorc playstyle.

Otherwise, most changes I don't get behind and think can be better designed.

IBreathlesSI

I don't have much experience with sorcerer class but everyone can talk on internet, right. I tryed to play a pet sorc only to regret and change it to nonpet. I still look at pets after each patch. I believe biggest problem with sorcerer class is their pets. I am on night shift right now so plenty of free time and read your skills multiple times and here are my thoughts. Mostly about pets and half the critics goes to ZoS for making them.

Vercingetorix wrote: »

Ultimate: Summon Storm Atronach
Summon a mobile storm atronach to fight alongside you for 30 seconds. Its arrival deals [6147] Shock Damage and stuns enemies for 3 seconds. The atronach zaps the closest enemy, dealing [3072] Shock Damage every 1 second. An ally near the atronach can activate the Charged Lightning​ synergy, granting the ally and the atronach Major Berserk, increasing their damage done by 25% for 8 seconds.

very good idea but where will it go? Leaving the actual the battle and running around with mobs or attacking other players in cyrodiil. It is not like eye of the storm hitting the area of your base. My pets usually go around. If pets doesn't promise us to read our minds to attack to target we want, I say remove them.

You will say just heavy attack the target or put a curse on it but it doesn't solve the problem If they are not there to attack it at the first place. I wanted to try it in a dungeon. The stupid monkey did not even follow the boss when he moved and that boss was the only thing there to attack. lol

Vercingetorix wrote: »

]Summon a Daedroth to besiege enemies in its wake for 30 seconds. The Daedroth can taunt 1 enemy at a time, but will not overwrite any player taunt. The Daedroth's basic attacks deal [4257] Physical Damage and enemies struck are afflicted with Major Maim for 5 seconds. You or any ally near the Daedroth can activate the Infernal Hide synergy, granting Major Protection to all allies near the daedroth for 8 seconds.

again a very good idea but who will it taunt? A mob instead of boss. If it overrides on other players taunt, it will cause overtaunting and bye bye to raid. If not overrides ,like you proposed, what use will it do. Tank is already taunting the boss. Why do you fell an urge to taunt a mob. If you are the tank are you saying boss will turn to Daedroth or clannfear you have active making your tanking job extremelly easy.

Vercingetorix wrote: »

Morph 1: Daedric Prey - Targets are also afflicted with Minor Vulnerability. You can have any number of Daedric Prey active at a time.

This morph will allow player to put it on multiple targets but which one the pets attack?

Vercingetorix wrote: »

Morph 1: Crystal Fragments - Also heals any allies near the struck enemy.

A heal skill with a procc chance seems hard to use. The target is not always near players and a healer should be ready to heal at all situations.

MojaveHeld

Soundinfinite wrote: »

No

...
Otherwise, most changes I don't get behind and think can be better designed.

Do you by chance main a magsorc? Because most of your criticisms honestly come off less as "I understand class balance and have experience with a wide range of this sort of thing" and more as "This makes my favorite something I don't like." Honestly, as someone who has a ton of characters from all classes and in all roles, I see a lot more merit and valid points in OP's suggested changes than I do in your criticisms of them, most of which honestly boil down to "It's not fair to give stam something cool and not mag!" So take a step back from your clear favoritism of magsorc and look at this with a more reasonable view. I don't agree with all of OP's suggested changes, but I do see the merit in them, whereas your criticisms of them are severely lacking.

mzprx

Vercingetorix wrote: »

...I got rid of the wimpy imp because you are a powerful Sorcerer and not a conjurer of cheap tricks...

but... but... I am a mag. Sorcerer and I use the "wimpy imp" and I AM Conjuror of Cheap Tricks..

Soundinfinite

MojaveHeld wrote: »

Soundinfinite wrote: »

No

...
Otherwise, most changes I don't get behind and think can be better designed.

Do you by chance main a magsorc? Because most of your criticisms honestly come off less as "I understand class balance and have experience with a wide range of this sort of thing" and more as "This makes my favorite something I don't like." Honestly, as someone who has a ton of characters from all classes and in all roles, I see a lot more merit and valid points in OP's suggested changes than I do in your criticisms of them, most of which honestly boil down to "It's not fair to give stam something cool and not mag!" So take a step back from your clear favoritism of magsorc and look at this with a more reasonable view. I don't agree with all of OP's suggested changes, but I do see the merit in them, whereas your criticisms of them are severely lacking.

No, I have 13 Characters 6 Stam, 7 Mag (1 dedicated healer). I have a stam and mag version of every class. All fully leveled. I play them equally and currently my favorite is my Magicka Dragon Knight.

Ironically I felt the OP was more on the side of "This is what I want" without a head to balance and actual game play. What a class needs and is lacking compared to what one just wants a class to have, for their own design and fun. Also, only my first point 1) Biased towards Stamina, focuses on the magicka vs stamina debate. Points 2 and 3 and their subsections deal with overall skill lines and choices made with Ultimate.

I also pointed out that a Sorc could use a revision, that Stam Sorc's have an argument of being underserved on a Sorc build and brought up skills that I thought were completely needing a ground up design and even gave a stam morph to an off the cuff skill creation.

I've been in the game for almost 3 years and will admit that the first character I created was Mag Sorc, cause the person who got me to play the game was showing it to me while playing a Mag Sorc. To put it easily it looked "cool". However, once in the game I became dismayed with the Sorc Playstyle and its drive to use Pets. I found Pets boring and the fighting too passive, and was disappointed that it didin't feel like a Wizard/Mage/Sorc in the end but a Necromancer/Conjurer. This is what drove me away from the class and explore the other classes of the game. To this day my MagSorc is a non-pet build which is one of the weakest DPS of the game. But I simply find it more fun to play. However, I spend more time on other chracter's than my Sorc.

Point is, for Stam morphs to work, they need to be needed, they need to fill voids in builds, and they need to have purpose. They also do not need to destroy the magicka counterpart, and I still hold true to my point that if you are wanting an ENTIRE CLASS refresh and rebuild skill lines it has to take into affect both the Magicka and Stamina side as well as the point to each skill line. Calling a refresh just adding Stam morphs with no care to the Magicka counterpart is not a balanced redesign. And think of what you honestly feel a stam sorc is in need of, and what type of skills would make the current Stam Sorc stronger.

When looking at the current trajectory of the game, there is a problem emerging in the class balance system of Mag vs Stam. While Stam is winning in DPS in PVE and PVP on all classes, the NEW classes of Warden and Necromancer have a severely wide birth of seperation between the Magicka and Stamina versions. The initial 4 classes, though still dis-proportioned, are closer in DPS between their Magicka and Stamina versions and thus are MORE BALANCED in game design. This new direction is a problem. And if you go back and redesign the original 4, I don't want this great divide to be placed in them as well.

FoulSnowpaw

Overall I agree that Sorcerer Class really needs more stamina morphs and a majority of its abilities to be more usable rather than a select few meta ones.

Crystal Shard current suggestion would be too over powered.
It benefits from the class's damage passives as it is and is a ranged ability unlike templar and dragonknight. Sure DK also has stonefist but the cost and damage does not compare sorc shard.
Since this is a tank tree I agree crystal shards should have heal capabilities but perhaps as a morph that group heals in a small radius(because crystal explodes anyhow), but NOT benefiting both damage(proc bonus) and heal perks simultaneously.
But such would make the ability too similar to other abilities, so maybe have it give x amount of damage shield after hitting an opponent(of course still aware that passive heals health on hit but compared to necromancer scythe or templar javelin?)

Storm Calling
Lightning Splash morph should not increase in damage and radius simultaneously since it would just blot out the incentive for the stamina morph, which also increases just damage but a lot slower... Duration is pretty powered since it overall controls resource management unlike radius. Perhaps stamina morph should have a longer duration.
Lightning Form and morphs probably does need changes. It's pretty powerful considering it's a mobile aoe dot ability that can easily execute weak targets in key turning points.

I disagree with an overpowered ultimate moving storm atronoch bullying everyone and stunning/melting everything in it's path... I agree that power overload is messy and needs to be reworked. I feel like storm atronoch doesn't fit here since it's mostly a utility ability in a damage tree. The user should no doubt benefit some form of major buff just like all the other classes, and should not merely be a synergy.

Daedric Fortress (great rename!)
Definitely need that Daedroth but are people willing to trade off storm atronoch? Morphs should be unique anyhow.
Daedric prey shouldn't have a morph that give minor vulnerability to target since it already increases pet damage by a whooping 40%. IMO daedric prey duration is so short and pretty messy to time in with other abilities in the heat of battle.

Browiseth

i'll be honest i don't like this idea that necro brought to the table in that "each skill tree is specific to a dps/tank/healer role"

i like the design of the old classes where you can mix and match skills from each tree and gain the benefits of passives from all of them, and would much rather necro and warden were made to be less linear in their design rather than make the old classes more linear.

MojaveHeld

Browiseth wrote: »

i'll be honest i don't like this idea that necro brought to the table in that "each skill tree is specific to a dps/tank/healer role"

i like the design of the old classes where you can mix and match skills from each tree and gain the benefits of passives from all of them, and would much rather necro and warden were made to be less linear in their design rather than make the old classes more linear.

That predates necro by quite a bit, it started with wardens. Although even with both of those, you still draw from each of the skill lines for most roles, just one skill line more than the others, depending on role.