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Mag Warden Static Rotation (Scalebreaker)

WrathOfInnos
WrathOfInnos
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With all the new Magicka DoTs, I’m working on a Warden DPS rotation that can make the best use of them. It seems that there isn’t really room for a spammable, so Deep Fissure will essentially fill this role. Here is what I have so far for a rotation.

Pre-buff with the Netch, then repeat:
Fissure, Scalding, Swarm
Fissure, Winter, Blockade
Fissure, Degen, Bear
Fissure, Reach, Consuming
Fissure, Scalding, Swarm
Fissure, Winter, Blockade
Fissure, Degen, Netch
Fissure, Reach, Consuming

It’s really the same 12s rotation twice, just alternating between the Bear ultimate and recasting the Netch on step 9 (or 21). This will be performed with the following bars. These are set up in such a way that all passive buffs are on the front bar (4% Mag and Mag Regen from 2 Mage’s Guild skills, and 8% Damage Done from 4 Animal Companion skills). This is done because 16/24 skills are cast from front bar, so it will be the active bar 2/3 of the time. The damage done on front bar will actually be more than 2/3, since every Deep Fissure will hit while on front bar (just before casting the next one) as well as every active bear attack.

Front
1. Deep Fissure
2. Scalding Rune
3. Fetcher Infection
4. Degeneration
5. Blue Betty
U. Eternal Guardian

Back:
1. Blockade of Flame
2. Winter’s Revenge
3. Flame Reach
4. Consuming Trap
5. Dampen Magic
U. Eternal Guardian

The main thing I’m looking to discuss is the possibility of moving skills around to improve the rotation. The order they are cast is somewhat arbitrary. Fissure must be cast every 3s, or there will not be enough skills to fill the entire rotation (and no bar space to add anything else). I’ve kept it to where back bar skills are used in pairs of 2, filling the space between Fissures, so there is minimal bar swapping involved. I’ve also attempted to start with a good burst by beginning with Fissure (3 sec delay), Scalding (2 sec delay) and Swarm (slight delay from travel time), on the first cast of these skills you can skip Light Attacks and not even engage enemies until all of these attacks land together. I put the Bear in the middle of the rotation (instead of opening with it) because I plan to wear Master Architect with this build, and the Major Slayer proc will be more useful if most of my DoTs are already ticking. With a bear every 24s, the 10s buff should have just over 40% uptime on me and 2 allies. The second gear set I’m planning is Z’en’s to go for a full group buff build, and because this rotation keeps 80-100% uptime on 5 single target DoTs (Swarm, Scalding, Degen, Reach, and Consuming).

I want Blockade to be fairly early in the rotation to gain the Maelstrom Light Attack buff as soon as possible (but I put it after Winter’s because I find Blockade it’s easier to bar swap after). I also need to use Blockade morph over Unstable to keep the Maestrom effect the full 12s, despite the fact that Unstable is higher DPS.

I also tried to keep similar skills paired in the rotation, like my 2 AoE DoTs are cast together. I would like to mirror the feel of each attack on the same bar slot on front and back (Fissure and Blockade are both on 1 and are frontal rectangular areas, ideally Scalding and Winter’s should be on the same key since they are both ground-placed circular abilities, and entropy/swarm would be consuming/reach on back bar). I’m struggling a little to make this work, while keeping the rotation as simple as possible (preferring consecutive key presses and similar patterns over something like 1,4,2,1,5,3,1).

The rotation above is currently:
1,2,3,1 swap 2,1 swap
1,4,R,1 swap 3,4 swap
1,2,3,1 swap 2,1 swap
1,4,5,1 swap 3,4 swap

It’s not terrible, but I feel like it can be improved before I spend any time trying to commit it to muscle memory. Please discuss, I’d like to hear any ideas on how to make this build/rotation more effective. Thanks.
Edited by WrathOfInnos on July 12, 2019 3:28PM
  • validifyedneb18_ESO
    validifyedneb18_ESO
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    The supremely dumb state of warden in update 23 lol

    Id wait not only to improve it but also to see if ZOS change things in the next few weeks, some pretty sweeping changes in week 1, going to need equally large amounts of tweaking id bet.
  • WrathOfInnos
    WrathOfInnos
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    The supremely dumb state of warden in update 23 lol

    Id wait not only to improve it but also to see if ZOS change things in the next few weeks, some pretty sweeping changes in week 1, going to need equally large amounts of tweaking id bet.

    You’re right, things could definitely change, and some skills will almost certainly be tweaked over the next 4 weeks. As for the state of Warden, that’s exactly what makes it fun. Trying to take a class with the reputation of lowest DPS and see if it’s possible to close the gap by playing to its strengths (a powerful “spammable” that can only be used every 3s, a cheap ultimate that is fully ranged, and a bonus to magic damage).
  • rothtwinsdad
    rothtwinsdad
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    Why are you using swarm? On trash fights most targets die around the same time from aoe's thus negating the bonus of this morph.
    PS4/NA
    Ace Ventura: Magsorc pve dps
    Bodacious Brutality: Stamblade pve dps
    Freezer Pops: Magden pvp DC
    Nature Boy: Stamden pvp DC
    Tramp Stampler: Magplar pve dps
    Sargent Slaughterfish: Magblade
    Unbreakable: Stampler pvp DC
    Combustible: DK pve tank
    Romancing The Bone: Stamcro pve dps/tank
  • WrathOfInnos
    WrathOfInnos
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    Why are you using swarm? On trash fights most targets die around the same time from aoe's thus negating the bonus of this morph.

    I call it Swarm for an abbreviation, but definitely going with the Fetcher Infection morph.
  • Joxer61
    Joxer61
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    no soul trap?
  • Lightspeedflashb14_ESO
    Lightspeedflashb14_ESO
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    Joxer61 wrote: »
    no soul trap?

    .4 on back bar, consuming trap. It is the better morph, 20% recourses back is no joke, like 8k mag back on most builds, going to be insane.
  • jypcy
    jypcy
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    Have you tested lightweight/barbed instead of winter’s revenge?
  • WrathOfInnos
    WrathOfInnos
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    jypcy wrote: »
    Have you tested lightweight/barbed instead of winter’s revenge?

    @jypcy I have not. Barbed trap would be too long in duration, since I’m forced to overcast it every 12s, and would force melee range.

    I hadn’t realized Lightweight got a duration increase too, it could work. 10s duration, and fully ranged. The minor force is worth around 4% DPS, so if Winter’s Revenge cannot outperform the Trap damage by at least that much it would be good to swap them. Definitely worth testing, thanks for the idea.
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    Most of the dots being 10s means I'd recommend shortening your rotation and dropping a fissure. I haven't personally tried a 10s rotation with just 2 fissures used either but that starts to make the 12s dots less optimal so I think it'll be a dps loss.

    So it becomes:
    Fissure DOT DOT (3s)
    Fissure DOT Bear/Netch (6s)
    Fissure DOT DOT (9s)
    DOT DOT (11s)
    Repeat

    And yeah I'd definitely recommend dropping a dot for lightweight trap, especially with an 11s rotation its best to drop the weakest 12s dot.
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    Has anybody else had trouble weaving Deep Fissure on the PTS?

    I normally hit 0.89 LA per second on live, even on my Magden. And I can hit similar on the PTS (if I can avoid bar swapping bugs) except on my Magden, and my weaving is only bad when I use Deep Fissure. If I swap Deep Fissure for Cliff Racer I hit my usual 0.89 LA per second.
  • Masel
    Masel
    Class Representative


    I have done something similar on pts on monday, highest I got was 92k.

    Difference is scalding rune, I'm not using it. That's mostly because of the 2 second delay in the rotation: it loses 2 ticks and has a lower tooltip than the single target dots. Having minor force from trap was a sustain boost and dps gain for me. In ranged scenarios that might change though.
    Edited by Masel on July 14, 2019 7:37AM
    PC EU - CP 1200+ All trials + HM

    Intis Ravelen - Stamina Nightblade - Redguard - DD - Flawless Conqueror
    Annisca Micus - Magicka Sorcerer - High Elf - DD - Flawless Conqueror & Voice of Reason
    Shéogórath - Stamina Dragonknight - Imperial - DD - Flawless Conqueror
    Pilar Joranil - Magicka Dragonknight - High Elf - DD - Flawless Conqueror -
    Adeline Du Mont - Magicka Templar - High Elf - Healer & DD - Flawless Conqueror & Voice of Reason + Bringer of Light
    Olivia Thaloran - Magicka Nightblade - Dunmer - DD - Flawless Conqueror & Dro'mathra Destroyer & Voice of Reason
    Pu'jarr Ticklebeard - Stamina Sorcerer - Khajiit - DD - Flawless Conqueror
    Treehugger Joe - Magicka Warden - High Elf - DD - Flawless Conqueror
    Stuga Beluga - Stamina Templar - Orc - DD - Flawless Conqueror & Dro'mathra Destroyer
    Anna Terra - Stamina Warden - Redguard - DD - Flawless Conqueror
    Wamasel - Dragonknight - Argonian - Tank - Flawless Conqueror + Bringer of Light
    Nord Warden - Warden - Nord - Tank - Flawless Conqueror

    Youtube:
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChVEG6ckuAgGs5OyA6VeisA
  • BrokenGameMechanics
    Runefang wrote: »
    Has anybody else had trouble weaving Deep Fissure on the PTS?

    I normally hit 0.89 LA per second on live, even on my Magden. And I can hit similar on the PTS (if I can avoid bar swapping bugs) except on my Magden, and my weaving is only bad when I use Deep Fissure. If I swap Deep Fissure for Cliff Racer I hit my usual 0.89 LA per second.

    This ^^^^. Deep Fissure has had so many nerfs (direct as well as indirect) capped off by the recent "is now blockable" that super shortened debuff with the 3 sec lag time makes Deep Fissure a serious consideration to drop from the bar/rotation now in many many contexts. Which is a bit sad as this skill is essentially the hallmark of the Warden.

    e.g. LA weave Birds on a dummy. Try to add Deep Fissure to that simple rotation and watch your DPS drop.

    Weaving your spammable with LAs should never, never do substantially more damage then inclusion of your class'
    signature DPS skill (heck you only have 2 to begin with). <sigh>
    Edited by BrokenGameMechanics on July 14, 2019 8:06PM
  • Masel
    Masel
    Class Representative
    Runefang wrote: »
    Has anybody else had trouble weaving Deep Fissure on the PTS?

    I normally hit 0.89 LA per second on live, even on my Magden. And I can hit similar on the PTS (if I can avoid bar swapping bugs) except on my Magden, and my weaving is only bad when I use Deep Fissure. If I swap Deep Fissure for Cliff Racer I hit my usual 0.89 LA per second.

    This ^^^^. Deep Fissure has had so many nerfs (direct as well as indirect) capped off by the recent "is now blockable" that super shortened debuff with the 3 sec lag time makes Deep Fissure a serious consideration to drop from the bar/rotation now in many many contexts. Which is a bit sad as this skill is essentially the hallmark of the Warden.

    e.g. LA weave Birds on a dummy. Try to add Deep Fissure to that simple rotation and watch your DPS drop.

    Weaving your spammable with LAs should never, never do substantially more damage then inclusion of your class'
    signature DPS skill (heck you only have 2 to begin with). <sigh>

    Well i have a LA ratio that goes beyond 0.91 on the parse i linked with just fissure, no bird, so i cannot confirm what you guys refer to right there...
    PC EU - CP 1200+ All trials + HM

    Intis Ravelen - Stamina Nightblade - Redguard - DD - Flawless Conqueror
    Annisca Micus - Magicka Sorcerer - High Elf - DD - Flawless Conqueror & Voice of Reason
    Shéogórath - Stamina Dragonknight - Imperial - DD - Flawless Conqueror
    Pilar Joranil - Magicka Dragonknight - High Elf - DD - Flawless Conqueror -
    Adeline Du Mont - Magicka Templar - High Elf - Healer & DD - Flawless Conqueror & Voice of Reason + Bringer of Light
    Olivia Thaloran - Magicka Nightblade - Dunmer - DD - Flawless Conqueror & Dro'mathra Destroyer & Voice of Reason
    Pu'jarr Ticklebeard - Stamina Sorcerer - Khajiit - DD - Flawless Conqueror
    Treehugger Joe - Magicka Warden - High Elf - DD - Flawless Conqueror
    Stuga Beluga - Stamina Templar - Orc - DD - Flawless Conqueror & Dro'mathra Destroyer
    Anna Terra - Stamina Warden - Redguard - DD - Flawless Conqueror
    Wamasel - Dragonknight - Argonian - Tank - Flawless Conqueror + Bringer of Light
    Nord Warden - Warden - Nord - Tank - Flawless Conqueror

    Youtube:
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChVEG6ckuAgGs5OyA6VeisA
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    Masel wrote: »
    Runefang wrote: »
    Has anybody else had trouble weaving Deep Fissure on the PTS?

    I normally hit 0.89 LA per second on live, even on my Magden. And I can hit similar on the PTS (if I can avoid bar swapping bugs) except on my Magden, and my weaving is only bad when I use Deep Fissure. If I swap Deep Fissure for Cliff Racer I hit my usual 0.89 LA per second.

    This ^^^^. Deep Fissure has had so many nerfs (direct as well as indirect) capped off by the recent "is now blockable" that super shortened debuff with the 3 sec lag time makes Deep Fissure a serious consideration to drop from the bar/rotation now in many many contexts. Which is a bit sad as this skill is essentially the hallmark of the Warden.

    e.g. LA weave Birds on a dummy. Try to add Deep Fissure to that simple rotation and watch your DPS drop.

    Weaving your spammable with LAs should never, never do substantially more damage then inclusion of your class'
    signature DPS skill (heck you only have 2 to begin with). <sigh>

    Well i have a LA ratio that goes beyond 0.91 on the parse i linked with just fissure, no bird, so i cannot confirm what you guys refer to right there...

    Yeah I saw your parse and assumed it was probably just a problem I'm having but was worth asking. I certainly wasn't saying Deep Fissure is a DPS loss, even with a lower LA ratio it out performs the bird for me.
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    I tried out a new rotation this morning which hit 90k for me, which I know somebody better than me could easily beat esp with better than my 250 ping. Also this is the highest parse I've ever done on any character so I'm pretty stoked!

    Fissure > BS
    Unstable Blockade
    Soul Trap > BS
    Fissure
    Degeneration
    Fetcher
    Fissure > BS
    Reach
    Barbed > BS / BS > Rune
    Repeat

    Edit: I use the bear whenever its up and I'm on my front bar. It just doesn't fit nicely into the rotation anyway.

    Bar 1: Degeneration / Fetcher / Fissure / Rune / Inner Light / Bear
    Bar 2: Unstable / Soul Trap / Barber / Reach / Inner Light / Bear

    With parse food I don't need the Netch for sustain and in trials with perfected god's I find I don't need it anyway on live.
    Edited by Runefang on July 24, 2019 1:03AM
  • LeHarrt91
    LeHarrt91
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    I like that Warden is getting high parses but its sad that to get these high parses you need to use less class skills.
    PS4 NA 1100+ CP
    Have played all classes.
    Warden Main
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    LeHarrt91 wrote: »
    I like that Warden is getting high parses but its sad that to get these high parses you need to use less class skills.

    I know, every class is having the same issue though. So can only hope the next big patch addresses class identity via passive and skill update.
    Edited by Runefang on July 24, 2019 1:04AM
  • Lightspeedflashb14_ESO
    Lightspeedflashb14_ESO
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    maybe replace fire rune with mystic orbs?
  • Wolfpaw
    Wolfpaw
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    LeHarrt91 wrote: »
    I like that Warden is getting high parses but its sad that to get these high parses you need to use less class skills.

    I can see why this direction with skill lines being sold.
  • ESO_Nightingale
    ESO_Nightingale
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    Magden is slowly turning into stamsorc. Weapon and guild skill identity.
    Edited by ESO_Nightingale on July 25, 2019 12:51AM
    Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/gnfJXgg

    Let's make frost better for everyone!
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    Magden is slowly turning into stamsorc. Weapon and guild skill identity.

    You can replace Magden with <insert class>.
  • ESO_Nightingale
    ESO_Nightingale
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    Runefang wrote: »
    Magden is slowly turning into stamsorc. Weapon and guild skill identity.

    You can replace Magden with <insert class>.

    Magden always had the least damage skill pressence of any mag class.
    Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/gnfJXgg

    Let's make frost better for everyone!
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    Runefang wrote: »
    Magden is slowly turning into stamsorc. Weapon and guild skill identity.

    You can replace Magden with <insert class>.

    Magden always had the least damage skill pressence of any mag class.

    And now it’s pretty much on par with the rest except Magcro from what I’ve seen thanks to these changes. All other mag classes have also lost their identity bar Magcro who can successfully use 5 of 6 damage skills.
  • ESO_Nightingale
    ESO_Nightingale
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    Runefang wrote: »
    Runefang wrote: »
    Magden is slowly turning into stamsorc. Weapon and guild skill identity.

    You can replace Magden with <insert class>.

    Magden always had the least damage skill pressence of any mag class.

    And now it’s pretty much on par with the rest except Magcro from what I’ve seen thanks to these changes. All other mag classes have also lost their identity bar Magcro who can successfully use 5 of 6 damage skills.

    Lmao i guess you're not wrong. Seeing magdps running fire rune is so bizzarre
    Edited by ESO_Nightingale on July 25, 2019 1:54PM
    Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/gnfJXgg

    Let's make frost better for everyone!
  • Lightspeedflashb14_ESO
    Lightspeedflashb14_ESO
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    Runefang wrote: »
    Runefang wrote: »
    Magden is slowly turning into stamsorc. Weapon and guild skill identity.

    You can replace Magden with <insert class>.

    Magden always had the least damage skill pressence of any mag class.

    And now it’s pretty much on par with the rest except Magcro from what I’ve seen thanks to these changes. All other mag classes have also lost their identity bar Magcro who can successfully use 5 of 6 damage skills.

    Lmao i guess you're not wrong. Seeing magdps running fire rune is so bizzarre

    wait till you see mystic orbs catch on.
  • Runefang
    Runefang
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    Runefang wrote: »
    Runefang wrote: »
    Magden is slowly turning into stamsorc. Weapon and guild skill identity.

    You can replace Magden with <insert class>.

    Magden always had the least damage skill pressence of any mag class.

    And now it’s pretty much on par with the rest except Magcro from what I’ve seen thanks to these changes. All other mag classes have also lost their identity bar Magcro who can successfully use 5 of 6 damage skills.

    Lmao i guess you're not wrong. Seeing magdps running fire rune is so bizzarre

    wait till you see mystic orbs catch on.

    I tested it but couldn't get it to improve my dps, at least on my Magden. It's definitely going to be run for AoE dps on every mag toon though.
  • Iron_Blurr
    Iron_Blurr
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    With all the new Magicka DoTs, I’m working on a Warden DPS rotation that can make the best use of them. It seems that there isn’t really room for a spammable, so Deep Fissure will essentially fill this role. Here is what I have so far for a rotation.

    Pre-buff with the Netch, then repeat:
    Fissure, Scalding, Swarm
    Fissure, Winter, Blockade
    Fissure, Degen, Bear
    Fissure, Reach, Consuming
    Fissure, Scalding, Swarm
    Fissure, Winter, Blockade
    Fissure, Degen, Netch
    Fissure, Reach, Consuming

    It’s really the same 12s rotation twice, just alternating between the Bear ultimate and recasting the Netch on step 9 (or 21). This will be performed with the following bars. These are set up in such a way that all passive buffs are on the front bar (4% Mag and Mag Regen from 2 Mage’s Guild skills, and 8% Damage Done from 4 Animal Companion skills). This is done because 16/24 skills are cast from front bar, so it will be the active bar 2/3 of the time. The damage done on front bar will actually be more than 2/3, since every Deep Fissure will hit while on front bar (just before casting the next one) as well as every active bear attack.

    Front
    1. Deep Fissure
    2. Scalding Rune
    3. Fetcher Infection
    4. Degeneration
    5. Blue Betty
    U. Eternal Guardian

    Back:
    1. Blockade of Flame
    2. Winter’s Revenge
    3. Flame Reach
    4. Consuming Trap
    5. Dampen Magic
    U. Eternal Guardian

    The main thing I’m looking to discuss is the possibility of moving skills around to improve the rotation. The order they are cast is somewhat arbitrary. Fissure must be cast every 3s, or there will not be enough skills to fill the entire rotation (and no bar space to add anything else). I’ve kept it to where back bar skills are used in pairs of 2, filling the space between Fissures, so there is minimal bar swapping involved. I’ve also attempted to start with a good burst by beginning with Fissure (3 sec delay), Scalding (2 sec delay) and Swarm (slight delay from travel time), on the first cast of these skills you can skip Light Attacks and not even engage enemies until all of these attacks land together. I put the Bear in the middle of the rotation (instead of opening with it) because I plan to wear Master Architect with this build, and the Major Slayer proc will be more useful if most of my DoTs are already ticking. With a bear every 24s, the 10s buff should have just over 40% uptime on me and 2 allies. The second gear set I’m planning is Z’en’s to go for a full group buff build, and because this rotation keeps 80-100% uptime on 5 single target DoTs (Swarm, Scalding, Degen, Reach, and Consuming).

    I want Blockade to be fairly early in the rotation to gain the Maelstrom Light Attack buff as soon as possible (but I put it after Winter’s because I find Blockade it’s easier to bar swap after). I also need to use Blockade morph over Unstable to keep the Maestrom effect the full 12s, despite the fact that Unstable is higher DPS.

    I also tried to keep similar skills paired in the rotation, like my 2 AoE DoTs are cast together. I would like to mirror the feel of each attack on the same bar slot on front and back (Fissure and Blockade are both on 1 and are frontal rectangular areas, ideally Scalding and Winter’s should be on the same key since they are both ground-placed circular abilities, and entropy/swarm would be consuming/reach on back bar). I’m struggling a little to make this work, while keeping the rotation as simple as possible (preferring consecutive key presses and similar patterns over something like 1,4,2,1,5,3,1).

    The rotation above is currently:
    1,2,3,1 swap 2,1 swap
    1,4,R,1 swap 3,4 swap
    1,2,3,1 swap 2,1 swap
    1,4,5,1 swap 3,4 swap

    It’s not terrible, but I feel like it can be improved before I spend any time trying to commit it to muscle memory. Please discuss, I’d like to hear any ideas on how to make this build/rotation more effective. Thanks.

    Try the exact same setup but drop Winters Revenge. Winter tooltip max rank: with 5 pfGod, 5 mothers sorrow and 2 crit Cost=3765 mag. Damage=2044 frost damage every second for 12 seconds.
    With same exact setup. Mystic orbs rank 1: Cost=3138 Damage=1577 damage every HALF second.
    Basically Mystic orbs does more dps by a HUGE margine(50%+) and costs less mag.
  • WrathOfInnos
    WrathOfInnos
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    Iron_Blurr wrote: »
    With all the new Magicka DoTs, I’m working on a Warden DPS rotation that can make the best use of them. It seems that there isn’t really room for a spammable, so Deep Fissure will essentially fill this role. Here is what I have so far for a rotation.

    Pre-buff with the Netch, then repeat:
    Fissure, Scalding, Swarm
    Fissure, Winter, Blockade
    Fissure, Degen, Bear
    Fissure, Reach, Consuming
    Fissure, Scalding, Swarm
    Fissure, Winter, Blockade
    Fissure, Degen, Netch
    Fissure, Reach, Consuming

    It’s really the same 12s rotation twice, just alternating between the Bear ultimate and recasting the Netch on step 9 (or 21). This will be performed with the following bars. These are set up in such a way that all passive buffs are on the front bar (4% Mag and Mag Regen from 2 Mage’s Guild skills, and 8% Damage Done from 4 Animal Companion skills). This is done because 16/24 skills are cast from front bar, so it will be the active bar 2/3 of the time. The damage done on front bar will actually be more than 2/3, since every Deep Fissure will hit while on front bar (just before casting the next one) as well as every active bear attack.

    Front
    1. Deep Fissure
    2. Scalding Rune
    3. Fetcher Infection
    4. Degeneration
    5. Blue Betty
    U. Eternal Guardian

    Back:
    1. Blockade of Flame
    2. Winter’s Revenge
    3. Flame Reach
    4. Consuming Trap
    5. Dampen Magic
    U. Eternal Guardian

    The main thing I’m looking to discuss is the possibility of moving skills around to improve the rotation. The order they are cast is somewhat arbitrary. Fissure must be cast every 3s, or there will not be enough skills to fill the entire rotation (and no bar space to add anything else). I’ve kept it to where back bar skills are used in pairs of 2, filling the space between Fissures, so there is minimal bar swapping involved. I’ve also attempted to start with a good burst by beginning with Fissure (3 sec delay), Scalding (2 sec delay) and Swarm (slight delay from travel time), on the first cast of these skills you can skip Light Attacks and not even engage enemies until all of these attacks land together. I put the Bear in the middle of the rotation (instead of opening with it) because I plan to wear Master Architect with this build, and the Major Slayer proc will be more useful if most of my DoTs are already ticking. With a bear every 24s, the 10s buff should have just over 40% uptime on me and 2 allies. The second gear set I’m planning is Z’en’s to go for a full group buff build, and because this rotation keeps 80-100% uptime on 5 single target DoTs (Swarm, Scalding, Degen, Reach, and Consuming).

    I want Blockade to be fairly early in the rotation to gain the Maelstrom Light Attack buff as soon as possible (but I put it after Winter’s because I find Blockade it’s easier to bar swap after). I also need to use Blockade morph over Unstable to keep the Maestrom effect the full 12s, despite the fact that Unstable is higher DPS.

    I also tried to keep similar skills paired in the rotation, like my 2 AoE DoTs are cast together. I would like to mirror the feel of each attack on the same bar slot on front and back (Fissure and Blockade are both on 1 and are frontal rectangular areas, ideally Scalding and Winter’s should be on the same key since they are both ground-placed circular abilities, and entropy/swarm would be consuming/reach on back bar). I’m struggling a little to make this work, while keeping the rotation as simple as possible (preferring consecutive key presses and similar patterns over something like 1,4,2,1,5,3,1).

    The rotation above is currently:
    1,2,3,1 swap 2,1 swap
    1,4,R,1 swap 3,4 swap
    1,2,3,1 swap 2,1 swap
    1,4,5,1 swap 3,4 swap

    It’s not terrible, but I feel like it can be improved before I spend any time trying to commit it to muscle memory. Please discuss, I’d like to hear any ideas on how to make this build/rotation more effective. Thanks.

    Try the exact same setup but drop Winters Revenge. Winter tooltip max rank: with 5 pfGod, 5 mothers sorrow and 2 crit Cost=3765 mag. Damage=2044 frost damage every second for 12 seconds.
    With same exact setup. Mystic orbs rank 1: Cost=3138 Damage=1577 damage every HALF second.
    Basically Mystic orbs does more dps by a HUGE margine(50%+) and costs less mag.

    Yes, I’ve come to the same conclusion about Winter’s Revenge. At least on Sorc or Necro there’s still a trade off for using Graveyard or Lightning Flood vs Mystic Orb, since they give a unique synergy to teammates. Even Blazing Spear is has some benefits with good passives and Burning Light procs. There’s no redeeming quality on Winter’s Revenge though. Bad damage, bad passives, high cost, relatively small size, weak status effect, and no group utility. It made my list here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/491186/3-underperforming-skills-that-should-be-addressed-in-update-24#latest
    Edited by WrathOfInnos on September 10, 2019 11:09PM
  • ESO_Nightingale
    ESO_Nightingale
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Iron_Blurr wrote: »
    With all the new Magicka DoTs, I’m working on a Warden DPS rotation that can make the best use of them. It seems that there isn’t really room for a spammable, so Deep Fissure will essentially fill this role. Here is what I have so far for a rotation.

    Pre-buff with the Netch, then repeat:
    Fissure, Scalding, Swarm
    Fissure, Winter, Blockade
    Fissure, Degen, Bear
    Fissure, Reach, Consuming
    Fissure, Scalding, Swarm
    Fissure, Winter, Blockade
    Fissure, Degen, Netch
    Fissure, Reach, Consuming

    It’s really the same 12s rotation twice, just alternating between the Bear ultimate and recasting the Netch on step 9 (or 21). This will be performed with the following bars. These are set up in such a way that all passive buffs are on the front bar (4% Mag and Mag Regen from 2 Mage’s Guild skills, and 8% Damage Done from 4 Animal Companion skills). This is done because 16/24 skills are cast from front bar, so it will be the active bar 2/3 of the time. The damage done on front bar will actually be more than 2/3, since every Deep Fissure will hit while on front bar (just before casting the next one) as well as every active bear attack.

    Front
    1. Deep Fissure
    2. Scalding Rune
    3. Fetcher Infection
    4. Degeneration
    5. Blue Betty
    U. Eternal Guardian

    Back:
    1. Blockade of Flame
    2. Winter’s Revenge
    3. Flame Reach
    4. Consuming Trap
    5. Dampen Magic
    U. Eternal Guardian

    The main thing I’m looking to discuss is the possibility of moving skills around to improve the rotation. The order they are cast is somewhat arbitrary. Fissure must be cast every 3s, or there will not be enough skills to fill the entire rotation (and no bar space to add anything else). I’ve kept it to where back bar skills are used in pairs of 2, filling the space between Fissures, so there is minimal bar swapping involved. I’ve also attempted to start with a good burst by beginning with Fissure (3 sec delay), Scalding (2 sec delay) and Swarm (slight delay from travel time), on the first cast of these skills you can skip Light Attacks and not even engage enemies until all of these attacks land together. I put the Bear in the middle of the rotation (instead of opening with it) because I plan to wear Master Architect with this build, and the Major Slayer proc will be more useful if most of my DoTs are already ticking. With a bear every 24s, the 10s buff should have just over 40% uptime on me and 2 allies. The second gear set I’m planning is Z’en’s to go for a full group buff build, and because this rotation keeps 80-100% uptime on 5 single target DoTs (Swarm, Scalding, Degen, Reach, and Consuming).

    I want Blockade to be fairly early in the rotation to gain the Maelstrom Light Attack buff as soon as possible (but I put it after Winter’s because I find Blockade it’s easier to bar swap after). I also need to use Blockade morph over Unstable to keep the Maestrom effect the full 12s, despite the fact that Unstable is higher DPS.

    I also tried to keep similar skills paired in the rotation, like my 2 AoE DoTs are cast together. I would like to mirror the feel of each attack on the same bar slot on front and back (Fissure and Blockade are both on 1 and are frontal rectangular areas, ideally Scalding and Winter’s should be on the same key since they are both ground-placed circular abilities, and entropy/swarm would be consuming/reach on back bar). I’m struggling a little to make this work, while keeping the rotation as simple as possible (preferring consecutive key presses and similar patterns over something like 1,4,2,1,5,3,1).

    The rotation above is currently:
    1,2,3,1 swap 2,1 swap
    1,4,R,1 swap 3,4 swap
    1,2,3,1 swap 2,1 swap
    1,4,5,1 swap 3,4 swap

    It’s not terrible, but I feel like it can be improved before I spend any time trying to commit it to muscle memory. Please discuss, I’d like to hear any ideas on how to make this build/rotation more effective. Thanks.

    Try the exact same setup but drop Winters Revenge. Winter tooltip max rank: with 5 pfGod, 5 mothers sorrow and 2 crit Cost=3765 mag. Damage=2044 frost damage every second for 12 seconds.
    With same exact setup. Mystic orbs rank 1: Cost=3138 Damage=1577 damage every HALF second.
    Basically Mystic orbs does more dps by a HUGE margine(50%+) and costs less mag.

    Yes, I’ve come to the same conclusion about Winter’s Revenge. At least on Sorc or Necro there’s still a trade off for using Graveyard or Lightning Flood vs Mystic Orb, since they give a unique synergy to teammates. Even Blazing Spear is has some benefits with good passives and Burning Light procs. There’s no redeeming quality on Winter’s Revenge though. Bad damage, bad passives, high cost, relatively small size, weak status effect, and no group utility. It made my list here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/491186/3-underperforming-skills-that-should-be-addressed-in-update-24#latest

    Weeps in frost
    Come Join the ESO Frost Discord to discuss everything frost!: https://discord.gg/gnfJXgg

    Let's make frost better for everyone!
  • MooseKnuckles88
    MooseKnuckles88
    ✭✭✭✭
    Iron_Blurr wrote: »
    With all the new Magicka DoTs, I’m working on a Warden DPS rotation that can make the best use of them. It seems that there isn’t really room for a spammable, so Deep Fissure will essentially fill this role. Here is what I have so far for a rotation.

    Pre-buff with the Netch, then repeat:
    Fissure, Scalding, Swarm
    Fissure, Winter, Blockade
    Fissure, Degen, Bear
    Fissure, Reach, Consuming
    Fissure, Scalding, Swarm
    Fissure, Winter, Blockade
    Fissure, Degen, Netch
    Fissure, Reach, Consuming

    It’s really the same 12s rotation twice, just alternating between the Bear ultimate and recasting the Netch on step 9 (or 21). This will be performed with the following bars. These are set up in such a way that all passive buffs are on the front bar (4% Mag and Mag Regen from 2 Mage’s Guild skills, and 8% Damage Done from 4 Animal Companion skills). This is done because 16/24 skills are cast from front bar, so it will be the active bar 2/3 of the time. The damage done on front bar will actually be more than 2/3, since every Deep Fissure will hit while on front bar (just before casting the next one) as well as every active bear attack.

    Front
    1. Deep Fissure
    2. Scalding Rune
    3. Fetcher Infection
    4. Degeneration
    5. Blue Betty
    U. Eternal Guardian

    Back:
    1. Blockade of Flame
    2. Winter’s Revenge
    3. Flame Reach
    4. Consuming Trap
    5. Dampen Magic
    U. Eternal Guardian

    The main thing I’m looking to discuss is the possibility of moving skills around to improve the rotation. The order they are cast is somewhat arbitrary. Fissure must be cast every 3s, or there will not be enough skills to fill the entire rotation (and no bar space to add anything else). I’ve kept it to where back bar skills are used in pairs of 2, filling the space between Fissures, so there is minimal bar swapping involved. I’ve also attempted to start with a good burst by beginning with Fissure (3 sec delay), Scalding (2 sec delay) and Swarm (slight delay from travel time), on the first cast of these skills you can skip Light Attacks and not even engage enemies until all of these attacks land together. I put the Bear in the middle of the rotation (instead of opening with it) because I plan to wear Master Architect with this build, and the Major Slayer proc will be more useful if most of my DoTs are already ticking. With a bear every 24s, the 10s buff should have just over 40% uptime on me and 2 allies. The second gear set I’m planning is Z’en’s to go for a full group buff build, and because this rotation keeps 80-100% uptime on 5 single target DoTs (Swarm, Scalding, Degen, Reach, and Consuming).

    I want Blockade to be fairly early in the rotation to gain the Maelstrom Light Attack buff as soon as possible (but I put it after Winter’s because I find Blockade it’s easier to bar swap after). I also need to use Blockade morph over Unstable to keep the Maestrom effect the full 12s, despite the fact that Unstable is higher DPS.

    I also tried to keep similar skills paired in the rotation, like my 2 AoE DoTs are cast together. I would like to mirror the feel of each attack on the same bar slot on front and back (Fissure and Blockade are both on 1 and are frontal rectangular areas, ideally Scalding and Winter’s should be on the same key since they are both ground-placed circular abilities, and entropy/swarm would be consuming/reach on back bar). I’m struggling a little to make this work, while keeping the rotation as simple as possible (preferring consecutive key presses and similar patterns over something like 1,4,2,1,5,3,1).

    The rotation above is currently:
    1,2,3,1 swap 2,1 swap
    1,4,R,1 swap 3,4 swap
    1,2,3,1 swap 2,1 swap
    1,4,5,1 swap 3,4 swap

    It’s not terrible, but I feel like it can be improved before I spend any time trying to commit it to muscle memory. Please discuss, I’d like to hear any ideas on how to make this build/rotation more effective. Thanks.

    Try the exact same setup but drop Winters Revenge. Winter tooltip max rank: with 5 pfGod, 5 mothers sorrow and 2 crit Cost=3765 mag. Damage=2044 frost damage every second for 12 seconds.
    With same exact setup. Mystic orbs rank 1: Cost=3138 Damage=1577 damage every HALF second.
    Basically Mystic orbs does more dps by a HUGE margine(50%+) and costs less mag.

    Yes, I’ve come to the same conclusion about Winter’s Revenge. At least on Sorc or Necro there’s still a trade off for using Graveyard or Lightning Flood vs Mystic Orb, since they give a unique synergy to teammates. Even Blazing Spear is has some benefits with good passives and Burning Light procs. There’s no redeeming quality on Winter’s Revenge though. Bad damage, bad passives, high cost, relatively small size, weak status effect, and no group utility. It made my list here: https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/491186/3-underperforming-skills-that-should-be-addressed-in-update-24#latest

    What kind of dps were you able to pull on your magden? Race and gear?
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