Has anyone else given up on dungeons?

mann9753b16_ESO

Honestly, lately I am just doing the one daily dungeon do each once for the Skill Point, and other than that, I just dont even bother any more…

I just feel like the Dungeons in this game are really badly designed. There is no real strategy behind them, most of them are just DPS/GearCheck, and they only seem to have 2 Challenge Levels: Laughable easy or full of Trashmobs that one hit kill you if you dont DPS them down right away…

The Boss fights are by far the best part of the experience, a good amount bosses are really well done, but the dungeon around them is just... bland and boring. Most Dungeons I join either have a group melting everything in their way, or a group that cant deal with the insta-Kill mechanics, because the mobs live longer than 1 second.

The Dungeons here really go from "you cant really fail, you dont even need a tank healer" to "If you dont do it 100% correct, dont block that trashmobs instakill that has no warning, you dead!" with nothing in between…

Dont get me wrong, I am just talking about dungeons.

Overworld and the single player content, once you find out how to "nerf" yourself with a casual build, is really well designed and enjoyable, even if I often take a 10 minute break when I see someone else in the same cave as me so I can enjoy it solo, and overall the Storys are great.

Its just that I really get the feeling that ZOS doesnt really know how to design a good dungeon. They know how to design bosses. No negative opinion from me here. But Dungeons as a whole? That doesnt seem to be their field...

Elwendryll

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

I just got my beast personality, had a lot of fun (and failures, especially for the no-death run), and when we got the achievement pop-up I couldn't help but clap and congratulate everyone. I do a lot of dungeons/trials, and yes, it's fun, very challenging, and rewarding. Some dungeons are really easy, but usually I'm talking non-sense in the chat/vocal while doing them so... Yes. This game is great.

idk

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

Your comment seems to be more about confusion.

You say the dungeons are poorly designed and that there is no real strategy behind them, most of them are just DPS/GearCheck. Yet you go on to say a good amount of bosses are really well done.

Those comments are in direct conflict of each other unless you are leaving out some critical information that adds some clarity since both comments have to be about bosses.

Personally, my preference is trials, then dungeons and PvP. Since this is about dungeons I will say I like some better than others. Stories are often good and more of the newer DLC dungeons have good designs that make them more about mechanics than DPS races. Of course someone has to be able to pay attention well to deal with mechanics but that should be the easier than getting mondo DPS.

Edit: personally, after reading the rest of your post I see you go back to Zos not able to design dungeons even though you clearly stated a good amount of the boss fights are really well done. They are such a central part of a dungeon design.

HidesFromSun

They are ok for the Dungeon finder reward, but I wouldnt really do them otherwise...

I dont enjoy the dungeons much tbh. I mostly try to do them for the story/quest, but DLC ones it's all rush rush. So I usually end up recording it, then skipping through the dialogue, then after the dungeon, I'll watch the recording back and pause the video on the dialogue so I can get at least some idea about what the quest was and what happened.

IwakuraLain42

Pretty much describes the dungeons very well. You have either the faceroll easy base game dungeons or the new DLC dungeons that are so overwrought with complex mechanics and fast hard hitting mobs that require a pitch perfect performance of all players to complete (on vet).

They are the most un-fun experiences I had in any MMORPG.

mann9753b16_ESO

Yeah, Dungeons are just badly designed in ESO...

idk wrote: »

Your comment seems to be more about confusion.

You say the dungeons are poorly designed and that there is no real strategy behind them, most of them are just DPS/GearCheck. Yet you go on to say a good amount of bosses are really well done.

Dungeons are more than just the bosses.

The Boss is the end goal, your reward for the dungeon, the final challenge, but the boss is not what the whole dungeon is about.

The dungeon itself has to stand on its own. outside of the bosses. When a Dungeon just feels like a chore you have to finish to get to the "good part" aka bossfight, then the dungeon is not well designed.

oddbasket

Players don't necessarily learn the dungeons nowadays because of how much dps they can put out, and that makes it feel like there's no strategy ot teamwork involved. Most of the time when it feels like a dps check is when the team don't understand the mechanics, granted there are many bosses that you avoid difficulty and skip mechanics with high dps. However, the problem is it's easy to get high enough dps from CP, It's not surprising that you have max level players who never learned mechanics and falter when they come across them.

Just the other day, I queued into vet Fungal Grotto II for a pledge with other 2 max cp dps and a mid cp tank, and we wiped several times on the first boss. Until the team finally noticed the group chat where I was repeating to them the mechanics, especially the part about the tethers killing them.

Then we came to the spider lady with her pet spiders and again I explained the mechanics before the fight, no one read, and the fight became much longer than necessary. After the fight, the dps apologized for not knowing the mechanics because they've always just skipped in FG.

Also, a good tank who knows a dungeon will quickly grab elites who can one shot sparing everyone from the mechanic while an inexperienced one can make even fighting mobs with such elites hard.

idk

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

mann9753b16_ESO wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Your comment seems to be more about confusion.

You say the dungeons are poorly designed and that there is no real strategy behind them, most of them are just DPS/GearCheck. Yet you go on to say a good amount of bosses are really well done.

Dungeons are more than just the bosses.

The Boss is the end goal, your reward for the dungeon, the final challenge, but the boss is not what the whole dungeon is about.

The dungeon itself has to stand on its own. outside of the bosses. When a Dungeon just feels like a chore you have to finish to get to the "good part" aka bossfight, then the dungeon is not well designed.

I am very aware there is more to a dungeon than the bosses. There is a story which is really the main point of the dungeon, lay out and more.

However, what you included in the quote of my previous comment is clearly about bosses. So my comment that they are in direct conflict is extremely accurate.

I guess it could be you are suggesting the trash mobs between the bosses are dps/gear checks but I doubt anyone having that much trouble with trash is seeing any bosses.

Edit: also as a MMORPG matures the new instanced content does improve in design and mechanics. That has been the case with ESO in both their dungeons and trials for the most part. The mini-trial format of AS and CR are fairly boring and lazy designs but dungeons overall have improved.

This is why DLC dungeons do not unlock as early as the non dlc dungeons in normal and pretty sure vet as well.

Brodda

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

You need to keep in mind, that base game dungeons were designed around different ... I guess game-play would be the word? I still remember how challenging they were on veteran levels (Fungal grotto vet progression runs, anyone?). Nowadays, with good high CP players, you can pretty much ignore the mechanics in those dungeons.

Game has evolved and I believe devs adapted the base game dungeons as much as they could, without allocating massive resources for the project.

That said, I think the new DLC dungeons are absolutely marvelous and I love that they are heavy on mechanics. No more brain-dead automated DPS burn, but a fight that actually forces you to think and pay attention.

NWOMark

If you wish to get all from dungeon you pick up guild that do dungeons walkthrough where you do quest, read books and explore for fun and not just for run through for loot and accomplishment.
This days is LFG and rush rush and this is not good way to have fun in MMO but gamers dont have time (work, family, more games to play in a day... ).

ruff

they are ok, but the pug system with broken lfg built certain mentality, like - "I've waited for so long in the queue so i don't give a shite about others needs". Long story short - it's fun making them solo, or with a friend.

BoraxFlux

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

Enjoy them for the teamwork and/or gear. But it has been awhile since PvP (and leveling Necromancer).

akl77

Where’s the other option

Yuffie91

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

I love the dungeons and would do more but saving it til cp 810 as i want to lvl through quests

mistermacintosh

I've taken breaks from the game, so right now I'm catching up on other stuff before I get back into dungeons and trials.

I like the dungeons in eso ok, but only enjoy them if I'm in a powerful group that communicates... but I usually pug them, so I rarely enjoy the experience. The DLC dungeons are no good for pug groups, not on vet anyway and certainly not hard-mode.

I'm not sure how they could improve them, though. Add/subtract trash, obstacles, dialogue, difficulty, etc, and you'll get complaints on either side. Dungeons are probably about as good as they can be for what they are. You can tweak them and make a certain group of people happy, but will just end up ticking off another group.

phaneub17_ESO

They are ok for the Dungeon finder reward, but I wouldnt really do them otherwise...

So... I generally run most of the normal non-DLC dungeons solo, with my tank and magicka characters for the quests or farming loot; my stamina characters just ignore them entirely. I've mostly given up on groups even though I do have tanks and healers, the frustration of other (stupid) people can be daunting where solo is easier and less hassle. People standing in red, ignoring mechanics, don't bother to interrupt, or get one-shot killed by something they can easily block or avoid.

redlink1979

Yesterday I tried to use the dungeon finder tool (PS4) because I'm trying to level my necro, I didn't get a single group even after more than 1 hour queuing... Please don't wait until U24 to fix the finder tool.....

GoldenLight

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

I still enjoy the dungeons and think the stories are well done much of the time. My groups try to make sure everyone has a chance to enjoy and follow the story if it is their first time. We never really care about the rush, rush, kill approach.

With that being said: I do think the dungeons were more of a challence and balanced back when we were still using Veteran Ranks and not Champion points.Champion points were a good idea but they have started to cause the game to outbalance. If they didnt count your new characters and was independant like in the old Veteran Ranks, it would probably work better. That is another conversation though.

In summary... they are fun if you enjoy the story and like to take first time players in to do their quests at their pace.Some of the comments from players we have had were awesome.

rumple9

Rewards are too poor - there's no incentive to do dungeons, everyone has the monster helms. I don't want to run fungal grotto, elden root, white gold tower for the thousandth time.

They need to put better rewards in

srfrogg23

They are ok for the Dungeon finder reward, but I wouldnt really do them otherwise...

I'm not a fan of one-shot mechanics. Never have been. Needless to say, I don't bother with Vet dungeons anymore. I just do normal mode for the more relaxed experience.

Darkenarlol

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

l2p

P.S. new dung DLC i'm waiting 4 u

MartiniDaniels

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

Dungeons are best part of the game (PVE) in all aspects. They are beautifully designed, voiced, have interesting stories and allow different builds and approach for optimal results in case of harder ones.

mobicera

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

I love dungeons in this game, they are quite simply the best part of this game.
If you are having problems consider adjusting your build.

rotaugen454

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

I bet the OP is not getting the results they expected.

mann9753b16_ESO

Yeah, Dungeons are just badly designed in ESO...

rotaugen454 wrote: »

I bet the OP is not getting the results they expected.

OH, dont get me wrong, I love to see that so many people are satisfied with these dungeons.

That means it makes more people happy than unhappy, and I like that.

I will just wait for Classic WoW, where healers actually have to heal and tanks have to tank, and enjoy the rest of the content till now.



Just had the best example, I was kicked out of a Vet Dungeon for queing healer as a healer, because they prefered another DPS so they could be faster...

BigBragg

Yeah, Dungeons are just badly designed in ESO...

To me the persistent use of one shot mechanics just seem like an unimaginative and lazy way to artificially increase dificulty. If it was a once in a while tool used, sure no problem. But to me, it just doesn't hold any excitement. I don't get thrilled for dungeon DLC, and only to dailies when I need to farm Undaunted levels or gear. They don't speak to me. Which is fine. In ESO I have become more of a world explorer and PvPer.

idk

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

mann9753b16_ESO wrote: »

rotaugen454 wrote: »

I bet the OP is not getting the results they expected.

Just had the best example, I was kicked out of a Vet Dungeon for queing healer as a healer, because they prefered another DPS so they could be faster...

This puts it all into context. Enjoy WoW. I did not last the full month that came with my purchase. To simplistic. But I do understand why some from WoW do not like the mechanics in this game. Very different and requires a more active defense for all roles.

mann9753b16_ESO

Yeah, Dungeons are just badly designed in ESO...

idk wrote: »

mann9753b16_ESO wrote: »

rotaugen454 wrote: »

I bet the OP is not getting the results they expected.

Just had the best example, I was kicked out of a Vet Dungeon for queing healer as a healer, because they prefered another DPS so they could be faster...

This puts it all into context. Enjoy WoW. I did not last the full month that came with my purchase. To simplistic. But I do understand why some from WoW do not like the mechanics in this game. Very different and requires a more active defense for all roles.

Honestly, I didnt really play WoW since Cata either, because they dumbed it down too much. Gave BFA a try lately, couldnt even get through the free weekend without getting bored.

Dungeons are literally as unchallenging as Vet Dungeons in ESO, but BFA lacks anything to make up for it. in ESO, you have an awesome and alive overworld, with tons of good quests, a more interesting combat system, etc. There is a reason I am still playing even though I really dislike the Dungeons.

But at some point an MMORPG lover wants some group content that is actually group content, and I am even willing to accept a broing tab target system for that after I fell in love with ESOs dynamic combat^^

Colecovision

I love Dungeons and think they are well done!

They're mostly stupid if you take a max level character and head into a base game dungeon with 4 people. They're awesome if you pick the right format for your level and ability.

The standard healer/tank/ 2 dps is what gets so stale imo. If you like it, awesome, but if not, be sure and try the content in other arrangements. Solo and Duo are better for this game because you do so much more.

When a healer says to stand still, I always think it would be more fun to uninstall the game and install a game where my video game character moves. If a tank holds the boss, healer has you in one spot and heals through incoming damage, then the dps job is to be as good of a macro as you can. Boring level one million.

Tdlr: The content is great, you need to choose the right format.

yodased

I think the disconnect is in what you are experiencing from the group finder.

When doing a daily dungeon for the pledge or for a skill point, you are obligated to be in that dungeon, so already you are looking at it as something you have to do vs something you get to do. That will color your judgement.

Take that and add into it once you hit 100k group dps any sort of challenge you would have seen melts as fast as said trash mobs.

On the other side of the coin, if you have 20k group DPS, you can't clear Darkshade Caverns II because you can't clear the netch adds fast enough and they will overwhelm the tank.

The "middle ground" you are looking for doesn't come from the dungeon finder, you have to find a group of people that are in your wheelhouse of skill and gear and that will change things.

Anything obligitory is going to be less fun even if you like it, so try to get into a dungeon group or guild and do some for shiggles and see if that changes your opinion of them.

Dysturbed

where is the option for I don't do dungeons.