POLL: Would you like a global AH as in other games?

Arrodisia

tmbrinks wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

THEDKEXPERIENCE wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

THEDKEXPERIENCE wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

wtlonewolf20 wrote: »

With a GAH trading guilds will just change focus and not disappear. Consider this. What do all of the trade guilds do with their resources currently? Their focus is on mostly securing their spot. The gold they spend is then removed from the game. There are guilds that fight for each spot so it is very competitive. So where do those resources, gold and efforts get redirected with a GAH? One to two people may not be able to control the market but a group of 200 could. And it could potentially get to the point where you have to be in a guild to buy certain items

Also what would be the replacement gold sink. We pay listing fees currently and I can say that the amount of gold sunk by traders wont be covered unless you significantly increase the listing fees or have another sink.

The replacement gold sink could be what was mentioned in this thread at some point. Mounts, pets, cosmetics,............ a variety of things that should've already been there, but ended up in the crown store. We should have dozens of mounts available for gold. Sure trade guilds will change focus. Some will try to to stay trade guilds, but will eventually adapt to the new system, and take on another focus. By nature, we adapt as humans. We don't like changes at first, but we do adapt.

Ironic that ESO has a functioning economy that is different than all other MMOs yet you’re trying to argue that changing ESO’s economy to one that is essentially the same as everyone else’s would somehow constitute change.

Sounds to me that it’s probably you that needs to adapt to the world that has changed around you.

I wouldn't say a corrupt, inconvenient economy is truly functioning for everyone. People have been complaining about the trader system since shortly after it began. Someone in the thread mentioned other games have similar economies. For example, (mentioned within this thread)another game which was similar to ESO's trading vendor, but they use supplies instead of gold to fund it. This isn't a completely one of a kind deal. I didn't suggest an AH. I suggested an adjusted AH, a better version of what exists currently in some other games with limits to eliminate the current and many forms of corruption that occur in trading systems. Only a player abusing the current system wouldn't want a system free of corruption.

nice bait. How didn't I adapt?
DO you know me? No.
DO you know what I earn per day? NO right?

So explain how I need to adapt. Proposing a better system doesn't mean I didn't adapt. I've been here since Beta. Hang on I'll go get my popcorn while you try to answer that.Btw, this isn't personal. It's a set of valid questions.

They complained because it was different. People don't like change, so they want to change it to how they imagine it to be in other games. The same can be said of the people who like the system as it currently is, People don't like change. They've adapted to it.

As for the "adjusted AH", I do writs on 36 characters a day... you can be assured that I go out and buy more than 100 stacks of materials at a time, so that I have enough to do them. Daily/Weekly limits would only make it more difficult on me to do what I would like to do. Who is going to determine the "optimal" amount that can be bought for each and every item in the game? That is an unreasonable request, too much time and effort, with no way of determining a reasonable amount. What is good for a person with 1 character is certainly not good for somebody with 36.

People would still be able to get around those artificial limits, whether it's from coordination with guild mates, the creating of alternate accounts that can be used to do the same. There is absolutely no way to "fix" the problem of price fixing by adding in these limits. Under the current system there is a time constraint that limits a person, or group of people from doing this, not saying it can't be done, but it's more difficult with the current arrangement.

Others have brought up the issue of searching all those listings. ESO's "megaserver" is larger than all other MMOs, who split their player base into smaller groupings, so they aren't looking at as many listings. The guild stores already run like crap just looking at one high volume kiosk, multiply that by 50 to account for all of them... sounds terrible.

Yes, ZoS can change their mind, but they have directly stated that they like the current system, they designed the system to not be the same as other games (because ESO is a different MMO than other games). It's worked, the game doesn't have rampant inflation, it doesn't have massive price fixing. Yes, some very, very rare items, where there might be less than 10 for sale in all of Tamriel, have had their markets "cornered", but the staple items in the game, it is very, very difficult to do so, which is why they've remained remarkably stable over the last 5 years.

TTC is atrocious. 90% of the time the item isn't even there anymore. I think people put WAAAAAAAY too much stock in how much TTC affects the economy on PC ESO.

MM is only as good as the guilds that you're in (well... it's worthless right now until ZoS corrects the issues they have there), yet some people treat MM as a bible.

The gold sink has to be there. You honestly believe that ZoS is going to take things OUT of the crown store... lol

I sell a lot of stuff, I'm in 3 large trading guilds. I had to learn what sells in some guilds over the others, it's interesting to see the differences. It's nuanced, it takes a little bit of thinking. I don't do the flip game (unless, while shopping, I see something that is massively underpriced, like the time I got 200 corn flower for 1800 gold ).

(These are not just directed at the quoted post, just a summary of what I've read over the past 3 pages catching up)

People complained about the trader system for many reasons. Switching from chat to traders was a small upgrade, but not an efficient or good one. It is inconvenient. It is easily manipulated, and required add ons to be halfway efficient only. It was and is easily recognizable that something better could and should be in place. YOu'd need 2 accounts or 2 separate servers for crafting with 36 chars which is fine. The limit would be per server. It wouldn't effect a second account or server. Still with 2 accounts/servers a person would have double the amount to buy as others. Not many people will bother with 2 full accounts or more. It's a hassle. Worth less than just adapting to the new system. Some might yes but not many. Many people creating alt accounts want mules to hold their personal items and don't even level the chars. They don't want to waste the time on an alt account that they could be spending on the main account. It just isn't the norm for most players. Many still only have 1 or 2 chars they play. Not to mention, most people recognize already crafting writs as a source of money on 36 chars , if they aren't farming any of those mats themselves is very inefficient. That goes doubly so for master writs, which aren't worth quite as much to sell or craft anymore as in the past. So, it's unlikely you aren't farming any of those mats, unless you enjoy losing money, which is also unlikely. As I said unlikely, but not completely impossible.

I don't do the farming, other than the surveys I collect. Will I stop and pick up nodes as I'm doing other activities, yes. I can clear 15 million gold a month, and that's with buying all of the materials from guild traders. Your complete lack of knowledge and false statement here diminishes everything else you've said here. It is most assuredly NOT a losing proposition. If you are this ill-informed about this... I question your "knowledge" in the rest of the things that you say.

Putting an extreme case that is unlikely in the scenario that doesn't fit the majority is no reason for ZOS not to implement a better system. Most off the other things you are saying are unlikely too. It would be too much cost and effort to do that. Trade guilds would pretty much focus on other aspects of the game. It is unlikely you would get that many people together without anything leaking out about it, before they could do anything. Just like all of the things these guilds do now are common knowledge to seasoned players. This certainly isn't the first thread on the guild trader corruption asking for another system and it definitely won't be the last.

So, because my situation doesn't fit within your, juttaa77b16_ESO's system of "acceptability", I am basically told "**** you"

The system doesn't work. It is corrupt in multiple ways. This system has all of those things you said it doesn't. Many examples have been given in the thread by multiple people. I know you want the traders to stay, but staying like this without a massive overhaul or a regulated replacement system is just not good for this game. The only people supporting this current trade system are the people who are spreading the lies and corruption. Those people just keep coming up with scare tactics in these threads to make people, who don't know better, think it will somehow be worse. All of this drama just because they can't control and manipulate prices anymore.

So, you are accusing me of being a liar, of being corrupt, using scare tactics and that I control and manipulate prices?

No one specifically said ZOS should remove things from the crown store. They could put many future items which are similar into the game for gold. People have been complaining about that lack of items for gold for ages too. I actually likely seeing the traders around in the game. SO I wouldn't mind just a complete system overhaul, but the current system behind these traders has to go one way or another. Either overhaul or an adjusted AH.

You honestly believe that ZoS is going to put in a system of getting cosmetics with gold, rather than the crown store? You honestly believe their going to do something that will cut into crown store sales? You're naive.

But but but ... reasons!

No seriously, you are 100% right. I do 1/36th the work you do and generally clear 200-300K a week, and just like you, about 95% of my farming is either when I happen to see something on my way to a quest or when I finally feel like doing my surveys. And even then, much like you, occasionally I’ll still have to buy some materials and somehow still make a profit.

My brain would explode at the monotony of doing that many writs but I respect that you can, and I see nothing wrong with you playing the game how you want to play it. Good for you.

Once I got my system down, it's honestly not that bad. I've gotten all 36 done is just over an hour when load screens are good, and it's all I'm focused on... (and I don't have to defend myself from blatant insults from some forum warriors).

I firmly believe that in an MMO, everybody is going to have to "grind" something to make money in the game. I chose writs. But when I don't want to farm for the monster helm styles in dungeons... I just buy it. I don't want to farm for furnishing patterns/motifs, I just buy them. Some want to farm items to sell, some want to find deals to "flip", and some, like myself, do writs. There's no wrong way to do it!

I didn't see any forum warriors comment on anything you said. I do see though. Your supposed situation is extreme and no one said any of what you put there to you. Fact is no matter how fast your SSD is, if you even have one, the load screens of each character alone will be ca.2 mins in the games current state, which = 72 mins without even taking into consideration yet that you need time to actually craft. add on or not that takes time per char. There is no way you are just over an hour with all chars finished no matter how focused you are. Even so you still would need to have to farm some of those mats, meaning you don't need to buy the entire amount and you would have 2 accounts or servers to do it on. Problem solved. Every single one of my points was valid. Just because you don't like them and they don't fit into your stance doesn't change that.

So, while you are making assumptions... I run 2 instances of the game, so when one is in load screens, the other one I'm doing the writs on!!! I can complete each character in under 2 minutes, I've done a lot of writs. 36 x 2 = 72 minutes!

What I mean by "load screens are good" is that "I don't have to wait for the 2nd character to load in before my 1st account character is done" so for me good load screens means absolutely zero down time.

edit for math error... yikes.

(Hint: you are the forum warrior!)

which makes that even laggier and less believable. I am spot on. nice try at baiting though. You must not have a mirror handy. If you have no further points to add which are on topic, we're done here.

You have proven time and time again, that no matter what anybody says to you, you will take an opposite opposing stance.

I'm honestly not baiting. I legitimately can do them in just over an hour. I don't care if you don't believe me.. I KNOW that it's true. 2 monitors, 2 instances, 2 separate hard drives.

2 monitors 2 instances, 2 HDD's and same connection. Two devices pulling from the same connection will not leave both devices running at max speed. They will both be at a reduced speed. If you can link proof that your connection and systems function better than anyone else's would, with both systems up and running in ESO at the same time, I'll be happy to drop the topic. Otherwise it's just your say so, and nothing more. I'm not playing opposites for the sake of playing opposites as you're suggesting. I'm just being realistic, and considering the entire population, instead of just one or two extreme players. I don't take these things personally, like some people do. You're situation, whether true or false is extreme, which is what I said earlier, and no system in a game should be based on one or two extreme cases. It's as simple as that.

Trying to paint me as the monster under the bed here won't help your cause. I neither support nor am against the traditional AH idea. I proposed 2 things, leaving the current system, but overhauling it completely to rid of the massive amount of corruption, or replacing it with a different type of AH, not the traditional type, to safeguard against the typical problem it could bring. Sometimes it pays to beat the dead horse, especially if it ends with the removal of the current corruption.

Disturbed_One

Global AH seems like a bad idea.

The economy in the game has been stable for years, and going to a single place to buy and sell would allow the ultra wealthy in the game to corner the market significantly easier, especially for necessary items.

Yeah, it sometimes sucks travelling from town to town to try and find that one thing you need, but I'll gladly take this over a system that can be easily monopolized.

I apologize if this has been said... I didn't read all 14 pages

idk

The thing with threads on this subject is they will fall on deaf ears. The guild trader design is a design ESO chose and likes. It has shown to work which Zos can see clearly. The logical course of action would be to suggest change within the system since suggesting the idea in the OP is just a waste of effort.

Aurie

Jayman1000 wrote: »

Guilds are, by definition, elitist. If you want elitism gone, you want guilds gone too. Or do you think some elitism is ok, while other is not?

Why are guilds elitist?

A few may be, simply due to their membership requirements. But the vast majority are not.

Isn't that rather generalising?

Ildun

Actually I do not want AH, AH is bad. What I want is just a way to browse everything at once and purchase on the spot.

Arrodisia

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS. We may possibly come into a lot more positive and critical thinking in a thread of that nature.

Disturbed_One

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

Arrodisia

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

Kidgangster101

GarnetFire17 wrote: »

Jayman1000 wrote: »

GarnetFire17 wrote: »

It's funny that this pointless thread is still going on. Bump it all you want, the guild traders aren't going anywhere. They should move this thread a "vent thread" section.

The thread is going strong because a lot of people find the subject interesting and feel strongly about it. It's a testament to the success that the game has in making it's players feel involved with the game. But I agree, I dont think guild traders are going away, thankfully.

People act like they have strong feelings about anything they don't like because they think if they complain hard enough it's going to help them get their way.

No text chat for consoles- we got text chat
Skyshards account bound- we can now buy them (Soon to be lorebooks and psijic order)
Moves-people complain and they get nerfed all the time
Monster sets- people complain we got golden vendor
Styles- people complained about a terrible system where items were locked into certain looks for gear and we got outfit station
Content is too hard-working it gets nerfed so more people can complete it.

That's just to name stuff off the top of my head. Something a lot of those things all have in common with this subject, all the polls that would come out always said they would never happen. Guess what? They all happened so yeah never say never 😉

Disturbed_One

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

khajiitNPC

Why not have both?

Kidgangster101

Disturbed_One wrote: »

Global AH seems like a bad idea.

The economy in the game has been stable for years, and going to a single place to buy and sell would allow the ultra wealthy in the game to corner the market significantly easier, especially for necessary items.

Yeah, it sometimes sucks travelling from town to town to try and find that one thing you need, but I'll gladly take this over a system that can be easily monopolized.

I apologize if this has been said... I didn't read all 14 pages

Sorry the ecomeny on console at least is not stable lol. If it was stable then all items would be equal value as long as they are the same.

But that is not the case, I can go to glenumbra and buy a plague doctor lightning staff for 5-10k then go to grahtwood and it is 70-100k

So that is by far not equal and that is just one example showing it is unstable. There are hundreds of items like this and it allows people to have a trader in the higher spot and buy from all the lower people and net huge profits. If it is more stable you could find one undercut and make maybe 5k profit rather than a 7 times plus profit on your investment

Disturbed_One

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

Global AH seems like a bad idea.

The economy in the game has been stable for years, and going to a single place to buy and sell would allow the ultra wealthy in the game to corner the market significantly easier, especially for necessary items.

Yeah, it sometimes sucks travelling from town to town to try and find that one thing you need, but I'll gladly take this over a system that can be easily monopolized.

I apologize if this has been said... I didn't read all 14 pages

Sorry the ecomeny on console at least is not stable lol. If it was stable then all items would be equal value as long as they are the same.

But that is not the case, I can go to glenumbra and buy a plague doctor lightning staff for 5-10k then go to grahtwood and it is 70-100k

So that is by far not equal and that is just one example showing it is unstable. There are hundreds of items like this and it allows people to have a trader in the higher spot and buy from all the lower people and net huge profits. If it is more stable you could find one undercut and make maybe 5k profit rather than a 7 times plus profit on your investment

I guess I fail to understand. isn't that similar to how the real world works? Different stores have different prices?

Sure, Walmart may have the cheapest milk in town, and the another grocery store has beef on sale. Sometimes it's worth it to go to both, sometimes it's not worth the hassle. I guess it's up to the individual and how much they could save.

Wouldn't a global AH, just allow one person to buy up everything cheap and just overprice it. Isn't that what Walmart does once it's driven out the local competition?

Arrodisia

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

I can understand lack of time, but I also lack time like most people here who work. You really can't expect everyone else to do it for you. It has been summarized at least a couple times. Having to write it over and over again for each person, who doesn't bother to read the thread, and others who misread the thread is tedious as well, and I already did it a couple times today. So, I'm out of extra time as well.

jkerlandsenrwb17_ESO

Trust me. You dont want a global AH. You're never going to find any gold mats for at least twice their current price and good luck ever finding a corn flower.

Sincerely,
an evil dirty flipper since PC launch

THEDKEXPERIENCE

Disturbed_One wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

Global AH seems like a bad idea.

The economy in the game has been stable for years, and going to a single place to buy and sell would allow the ultra wealthy in the game to corner the market significantly easier, especially for necessary items.

Yeah, it sometimes sucks travelling from town to town to try and find that one thing you need, but I'll gladly take this over a system that can be easily monopolized.

I apologize if this has been said... I didn't read all 14 pages

Sorry the ecomeny on console at least is not stable lol. If it was stable then all items would be equal value as long as they are the same.

But that is not the case, I can go to glenumbra and buy a plague doctor lightning staff for 5-10k then go to grahtwood and it is 70-100k

So that is by far not equal and that is just one example showing it is unstable. There are hundreds of items like this and it allows people to have a trader in the higher spot and buy from all the lower people and net huge profits. If it is more stable you could find one undercut and make maybe 5k profit rather than a 7 times plus profit on your investment

I guess I fail to understand. isn't that similar to how the real world works? Different stores have different prices?

Sure, Walmart may have the cheapest milk in town, and the another grocery store has beef on sale. Sometimes it's worth it to go to both, sometimes it's not worth the hassle. I guess it's up to the individual and how much they could save.

Wouldn't a global AH, just allow one person to buy up everything cheap and just overprice it. Isn't that what Walmart does once it's driven out the local competition?

Yes.

jkerlandsenrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Trust me. You dont want a global AH. You're never going to find any gold mats for at least twice their current price and good luck ever finding a corn flower.

Sincerely,
an evil dirty flipper since PC launch

Exactly.

Arrodisia

jkerlandsenrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Trust me. You dont want a global AH. You're never going to find any gold mats for at least twice their current price and good luck ever finding a corn flower.

Sincerely,
an evil dirty flipper since PC launch

With an AH which is modified by ZOS with safeguards to prevent such things, that would never happen. I'm not for or against the AH, but even I see a way to get it done, which means the devs(with more xp than me ) probably have more ways than that to do it properly.

Arrodisia

Disturbed_One wrote: »

Kidgangster101 wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

Global AH seems like a bad idea.

The economy in the game has been stable for years, and going to a single place to buy and sell would allow the ultra wealthy in the game to corner the market significantly easier, especially for necessary items.

Yeah, it sometimes sucks travelling from town to town to try and find that one thing you need, but I'll gladly take this over a system that can be easily monopolized.

I apologize if this has been said... I didn't read all 14 pages

Sorry the ecomeny on console at least is not stable lol. If it was stable then all items would be equal value as long as they are the same.

But that is not the case, I can go to glenumbra and buy a plague doctor lightning staff for 5-10k then go to grahtwood and it is 70-100k

So that is by far not equal and that is just one example showing it is unstable. There are hundreds of items like this and it allows people to have a trader in the higher spot and buy from all the lower people and net huge profits. If it is more stable you could find one undercut and make maybe 5k profit rather than a 7 times plus profit on your investment

I guess I fail to understand. isn't that similar to how the real world works? Different stores have different prices?

Sure, Walmart may have the cheapest milk in town, and the another grocery store has beef on sale. Sometimes it's worth it to go to both, sometimes it's not worth the hassle. I guess it's up to the individual and how much they could save.

Wouldn't a global AH, just allow one person to buy up everything cheap and just overprice it. Isn't that what Walmart does once it's driven out the local competition?

Not if ZOS modified an AH with some minor safeguards to prevent things like that. I'm not for or against it, but it's doable in the right hands.

Disturbed_One

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

I can understand lack of time, but I also lack time like most people here who work. You really can't expect everyone else to do it for you. It has been summarized at least a couple times. Having to write it over and over again for each person, who doesn't bother to read the thread, and others who misreads the thread is tedious as well, and I already did it a couple times today. So, I'm out of extra time as well.

well, I perused the thread (didn't read it all) saw things like cartels controlling the entire market? people who are sniping sales to make a profit, etc...

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

As far as sniping sales, people do that at auctions/garage sales/etc... it's part of the fun of the system!

I have to pay dues (or sell enough in my trader) each week... It's 5k a week. We're not in a prime spot, but I don't think Vivec City is that bad, as it's a good crafting spot, but I've been able to sell pretty much anything I want there, and usually clear way more than that.. usually in the 100-200k/week range, just selling the things I don't need.

Thanks for making me peruse it.. I have a better idea, and am now more assuredly against the Auction House, particularly enlightening was the fact somebody said that ZoS actually wanted the system to be different from other MMOs. I like that. I like it's different and that it still works.

edit: typos

Arrodisia

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

I can understand lack of time, but I also lack time like most people here who work. You really can't expect everyone else to do it for you. It has been summarized at least a couple times. Having to write it over and over again for each person, who doesn't bother to read the thread, and others who misreads the thread is tedious as well, and I already did it a couple times today. So, I'm out of extra time as well.

well, I perused the thread (didn't read it all) saw things like cartels controlling the entire market? people who are sniping sales to make a profit, etc...

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

As far as sniping sales, people do that at auctions/garage sales/etc... it's part of the fun of the system!

I have to pay dues (or sell enough in my trader) each week... It's 5k a week. We're not in a prime spot, but I don't think Vivec City is that bad, as it's a good crafting spot, but I've been able to sell pretty much anything I want there, and usually clear way more than that.. usually in the 100-200k/week range, just selling the things I don't need.

Thanks for making me peruse it.. I have a better idea, and am not more assuredly against the Auction House, particularly enlightening was the fact somebody said that ZoS actually wanted the system to be different from other MMOs. I like that. I like it's different and that it still works.

The system doesn't work when people use exploits to get around it, and the other forms of corruption are just icing on the cake. The system is similar to other games which was also mentioned in other comments in this thread. There is no reason to keep the current system at all, unless it gets a complete overhaul. I like seeing the vendors in the game. However, since I was able to peek behind the curtain, I don't like what they stand for currently. So you see. I don't care about AH or no AH. I just care that the corruption is removed.

tmbrinks

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

I can understand lack of time, but I also lack time like most people here who work. You really can't expect everyone else to do it for you. It has been summarized at least a couple times. Having to write it over and over again for each person, who doesn't bother to read the thread, and others who misreads the thread is tedious as well, and I already did it a couple times today. So, I'm out of extra time as well.

well, I perused the thread (didn't read it all) saw things like cartels controlling the entire market? people who are sniping sales to make a profit, etc...

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

As far as sniping sales, people do that at auctions/garage sales/etc... it's part of the fun of the system!

I have to pay dues (or sell enough in my trader) each week... It's 5k a week. We're not in a prime spot, but I don't think Vivec City is that bad, as it's a good crafting spot, but I've been able to sell pretty much anything I want there, and usually clear way more than that.. usually in the 100-200k/week range, just selling the things I don't need.

Thanks for making me peruse it.. I have a better idea, and am now more assuredly against the Auction House, particularly enlightening was the fact somebody said that ZoS actually wanted the system to be different from other MMOs. I like that. I like it's different and that it still works.

edit: typos

Be careful... if you sell your Corn Flower for under MM price.. the "evil cartel" is gonna send their goons and crack your kneecaps! /s

You're right on the boogeyman arguments. There's nothing nefarious going on, but a few here will try and convince you otherwise. Why? I don't know, perhaps they are the ones sitting on millions and want a global AH so they can control the market on something, but they know they can't do it on the current system, so they come up with a whole bunch of "reasons" for change.

Disturbed_One

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

I can understand lack of time, but I also lack time like most people here who work. You really can't expect everyone else to do it for you. It has been summarized at least a couple times. Having to write it over and over again for each person, who doesn't bother to read the thread, and others who misreads the thread is tedious as well, and I already did it a couple times today. So, I'm out of extra time as well.

well, I perused the thread (didn't read it all) saw things like cartels controlling the entire market? people who are sniping sales to make a profit, etc...

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

As far as sniping sales, people do that at auctions/garage sales/etc... it's part of the fun of the system!

I have to pay dues (or sell enough in my trader) each week... It's 5k a week. We're not in a prime spot, but I don't think Vivec City is that bad, as it's a good crafting spot, but I've been able to sell pretty much anything I want there, and usually clear way more than that.. usually in the 100-200k/week range, just selling the things I don't need.

Thanks for making me peruse it.. I have a better idea, and am not more assuredly against the Auction House, particularly enlightening was the fact somebody said that ZoS actually wanted the system to be different from other MMOs. I like that. I like it's different and that it still works.

The system doesn't work when people use exploits to get around it, and the other forms of corruption are just icing on the cake. The system is similar to other games which was also mentioned in other comments in this thread. There is no reason to keep the current system at all, unless it gets a complete overhaul. I like seeing the vendors in the game. However, since I was able to peek behind the curtain, I don't like what they stand for currently. So you see. I don't care about AH or no AH. I just care that the corruption is removed.

I saw you said "exploits", "corruption" on lots of your comments, but I didn't see where you went into any detail about it.

What do you mean "peak behind the curtain"? What do they "stand for currently"? You're saying lots of nebulous things, using scary terms, but there's no substance to it.

My trade guild is great. They have guild hall with the crafting stations, low limits, lots of friendly members who have helped me out with vamp bites, ports to wayshrines, etc... Even ran a normal trial with them the other day, never thought I'd get into those.

Arrodisia

tmbrinks wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

I can understand lack of time, but I also lack time like most people here who work. You really can't expect everyone else to do it for you. It has been summarized at least a couple times. Having to write it over and over again for each person, who doesn't bother to read the thread, and others who misreads the thread is tedious as well, and I already did it a couple times today. So, I'm out of extra time as well.

well, I perused the thread (didn't read it all) saw things like cartels controlling the entire market? people who are sniping sales to make a profit, etc...

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

As far as sniping sales, people do that at auctions/garage sales/etc... it's part of the fun of the system!

I have to pay dues (or sell enough in my trader) each week... It's 5k a week. We're not in a prime spot, but I don't think Vivec City is that bad, as it's a good crafting spot, but I've been able to sell pretty much anything I want there, and usually clear way more than that.. usually in the 100-200k/week range, just selling the things I don't need.

Thanks for making me peruse it.. I have a better idea, and am now more assuredly against the Auction House, particularly enlightening was the fact somebody said that ZoS actually wanted the system to be different from other MMOs. I like that. I like it's different and that it still works.

edit: typos

Be careful... if you sell your Corn Flower for under MM price.. the "evil cartel" is gonna send their goons and crack your kneecaps! /s

You're right on the boogeyman arguments. There's nothing nefarious going on, but a few here will try and convince you otherwise. Why? I don't know, perhaps they are the ones sitting on millions and want a global AH so they can control the market on something, but they know they can't do it on the current system, so they come up with a whole bunch of "reasons" for change.

Nothing nefarious? ok.This is just off the top of my head. So creating sister guilds every week and buying up all the spots, selling them to guilds who didn't win and g quiting to give it to them after you got paid isn't nefarious? The only boogeyman comments are coming from people who don't want the system to change because they profit most from the abuse of it.

Alchemical

The fact that, according to the poll, 64% of the game like the decentralized auction house should speak for itself. There shouldn't be on going months of debates 5 years after launch. Zenimax isn't going to change it now or ever, and the majority are content with that. It's not a flawless system, but it's a system that is heavily warded against the flaws of other systems.

When's the last time you heard of ESO's economy crashing? And I don't mean a temporary downswing in motif prices whenever an event happens, I mean "gold tempers have gone up 500% because Seylam Hlaalu sits at the auction house 20 hours a day sniping and relisting anyone who tries to under cut him." Or even better "I can't buy gold tempers because someone wiped them all out. All of them. Someone bought every single last one. Now the price of gold gear begins inflating exponentially because you can only get it from a small population of people". Oh oh and it also comes in the flavor of "Someone literally listed 100,000 tempers, in stacks of 1, at 60% of their going rate, flooding the market and causing them to become totally worthless". This is all stuff I've seen and done in other games where all I had to do was sit in one place, refreshing a window every few minutes, in order to make effortless cash.

Arrodisia

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

I can understand lack of time, but I also lack time like most people here who work. You really can't expect everyone else to do it for you. It has been summarized at least a couple times. Having to write it over and over again for each person, who doesn't bother to read the thread, and others who misreads the thread is tedious as well, and I already did it a couple times today. So, I'm out of extra time as well.

well, I perused the thread (didn't read it all) saw things like cartels controlling the entire market? people who are sniping sales to make a profit, etc...

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

As far as sniping sales, people do that at auctions/garage sales/etc... it's part of the fun of the system!

I have to pay dues (or sell enough in my trader) each week... It's 5k a week. We're not in a prime spot, but I don't think Vivec City is that bad, as it's a good crafting spot, but I've been able to sell pretty much anything I want there, and usually clear way more than that.. usually in the 100-200k/week range, just selling the things I don't need.

Thanks for making me peruse it.. I have a better idea, and am not more assuredly against the Auction House, particularly enlightening was the fact somebody said that ZoS actually wanted the system to be different from other MMOs. I like that. I like it's different and that it still works.

The system doesn't work when people use exploits to get around it, and the other forms of corruption are just icing on the cake. The system is similar to other games which was also mentioned in other comments in this thread. There is no reason to keep the current system at all, unless it gets a complete overhaul. I like seeing the vendors in the game. However, since I was able to peek behind the curtain, I don't like what they stand for currently. So you see. I don't care about AH or no AH. I just care that the corruption is removed.

I saw you said "exploits", "corruption" on lots of your comments, but I didn't see where you went into any detail about it.

What do you mean "peak behind the curtain"? What do they "stand for currently"? You're saying lots of nebulous things, using scary terms, but there's no substance to it.

My trade guild is great. They have guild hall with the crafting stations, low limits, lots of friendly members who have helped me out with vamp bites, ports to wayshrines, etc... Even ran a normal trial with them the other day, never thought I'd get into those.

Then you didn't really read the thread. It's all within the thread.

tmbrinks

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

I can understand lack of time, but I also lack time like most people here who work. You really can't expect everyone else to do it for you. It has been summarized at least a couple times. Having to write it over and over again for each person, who doesn't bother to read the thread, and others who misreads the thread is tedious as well, and I already did it a couple times today. So, I'm out of extra time as well.

well, I perused the thread (didn't read it all) saw things like cartels controlling the entire market? people who are sniping sales to make a profit, etc...

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

As far as sniping sales, people do that at auctions/garage sales/etc... it's part of the fun of the system!

I have to pay dues (or sell enough in my trader) each week... It's 5k a week. We're not in a prime spot, but I don't think Vivec City is that bad, as it's a good crafting spot, but I've been able to sell pretty much anything I want there, and usually clear way more than that.. usually in the 100-200k/week range, just selling the things I don't need.

Thanks for making me peruse it.. I have a better idea, and am now more assuredly against the Auction House, particularly enlightening was the fact somebody said that ZoS actually wanted the system to be different from other MMOs. I like that. I like it's different and that it still works.

edit: typos

Be careful... if you sell your Corn Flower for under MM price.. the "evil cartel" is gonna send their goons and crack your kneecaps! /s

You're right on the boogeyman arguments. There's nothing nefarious going on, but a few here will try and convince you otherwise. Why? I don't know, perhaps they are the ones sitting on millions and want a global AH so they can control the market on something, but they know they can't do it on the current system, so they come up with a whole bunch of "reasons" for change.

Nothing nefarious? ok.This is just off the top of my head. So creating sister guilds every week and buying up all the spots, selling them to guilds who didn't win and g quiting to give it to them after you got paid isn't nefarious? The only boogeyman comments are coming from people who don't want the system to change because they profit most from the abuse of it.

Make sure you check your closet before going to sleep tonight... don't want that scary monster getting you while you sleep. I don't envy that you see evil, manipulation, deceit, treachery in everything.

You keep spouting the exact same dribble, the exact same thing over and over. Just because you say it over and over and over doesn't make it any more true.

Arrodisia

tmbrinks wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

tmbrinks wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

I can understand lack of time, but I also lack time like most people here who work. You really can't expect everyone else to do it for you. It has been summarized at least a couple times. Having to write it over and over again for each person, who doesn't bother to read the thread, and others who misreads the thread is tedious as well, and I already did it a couple times today. So, I'm out of extra time as well.

well, I perused the thread (didn't read it all) saw things like cartels controlling the entire market? people who are sniping sales to make a profit, etc...

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

As far as sniping sales, people do that at auctions/garage sales/etc... it's part of the fun of the system!

I have to pay dues (or sell enough in my trader) each week... It's 5k a week. We're not in a prime spot, but I don't think Vivec City is that bad, as it's a good crafting spot, but I've been able to sell pretty much anything I want there, and usually clear way more than that.. usually in the 100-200k/week range, just selling the things I don't need.

Thanks for making me peruse it.. I have a better idea, and am now more assuredly against the Auction House, particularly enlightening was the fact somebody said that ZoS actually wanted the system to be different from other MMOs. I like that. I like it's different and that it still works.

edit: typos

Be careful... if you sell your Corn Flower for under MM price.. the "evil cartel" is gonna send their goons and crack your kneecaps! /s

You're right on the boogeyman arguments. There's nothing nefarious going on, but a few here will try and convince you otherwise. Why? I don't know, perhaps they are the ones sitting on millions and want a global AH so they can control the market on something, but they know they can't do it on the current system, so they come up with a whole bunch of "reasons" for change.

Nothing nefarious? ok.This is just off the top of my head. So creating sister guilds every week and buying up all the spots, selling them to guilds who didn't win and g quiting to give it to them after you got paid isn't nefarious? The only boogeyman comments are coming from people who don't want the system to change because they profit most from the abuse of it.

Make sure you check your closet before going to sleep tonight... don't want that scary monster getting you while you sleep. I don't envy that you see evil, manipulation, deceit, treachery in everything.

You keep spouting the exact same dribble, the exact same thing over and over. Just because you say it over and over and over doesn't make it any more true.

You meant to say that too yourself. You repeat like a broken record. At least similar too my statements were also made by others.

jkerlandsenrwb17_ESO

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

jkerlandsenrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Trust me. You dont want a global AH. You're never going to find any gold mats for at least twice their current price and good luck ever finding a corn flower.

Sincerely,
an evil dirty flipper since PC launch

With an AH which is modified by ZOS with safeguards to prevent such things, that would never happen. I'm not for or against the AH, but even I see a way to get it done, which means the devs(with more xp than me ) probably have more ways than that to do it properly.

Just how would they have safeguards to prevent it? Limit amount of listings you can buy? There's more than enough flippers to make it happen anyway any flipper from the smol boi who sells for 100k to the big boi that sells for up to 50 mil per guild will do it. Put a fixed upper pricing for items? ALL useful items will end up only being sold at their max listings.

As long as there's a margin on an easy sellable item a flipper is gonna flip if they find it. I dont care if I only make 1g from reselling a wax, as said flippers gonna flip.

I honestly think anyone that advocates an AH is either a flipper in disguise or someone that dont quite understand how much gold we actually have or how many flippers there actually are and how low morals we actually have. Yes, I'm not ashamed to admit I'm a *** when it comes to trading, seeing an extra digit on my total gold would be like completely smashing all raid high scores.

A global AH will lead to either free items, meaningless gold and all traders being furious because ZOS put a stupid low price cap and thus ruined a part of their gameplay or prices will raise astronomical.

Disturbed_One wrote: »

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

There's no evil cartel, securing guild traders is a spanish soap drama. It's a warzone.

Disturbed_One

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

Disturbed_One wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

I think the thread poll is too limited in it's choices at the very least. With a poll of this nature most people answer one of the two, and in this case both choices are corruptible without safeguards. Maybe instead, we should first be asking if the people want changes to remove the corruption from the system, while asking them how they think it should be best removed by ZOS.

What corruption is there in the current system? People can list whatever they want at any price.

because that's what I think of corruption, as in somebody tells me I have to sell this item for this price, I've never seen or heard of that happening in my 3 years of playing

I haven't read the entire thread, so I apologize (again) if this has been said elsewhere

There are multiple admitted examples within this thread and in other threads. It's there. We all have busy lives. So I understand. Please feel free to read the thread, and catch up when you have time.

can anybody point me to the comments, or an idea of a page, or maybe summarize, if you have read them all... I really don't want to read 14 pages for a few examples that were given... that sounds too much like homework

I can understand lack of time, but I also lack time like most people here who work. You really can't expect everyone else to do it for you. It has been summarized at least a couple times. Having to write it over and over again for each person, who doesn't bother to read the thread, and others who misreads the thread is tedious as well, and I already did it a couple times today. So, I'm out of extra time as well.

well, I perused the thread (didn't read it all) saw things like cartels controlling the entire market? people who are sniping sales to make a profit, etc...

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

As far as sniping sales, people do that at auctions/garage sales/etc... it's part of the fun of the system!

I have to pay dues (or sell enough in my trader) each week... It's 5k a week. We're not in a prime spot, but I don't think Vivec City is that bad, as it's a good crafting spot, but I've been able to sell pretty much anything I want there, and usually clear way more than that.. usually in the 100-200k/week range, just selling the things I don't need.

Thanks for making me peruse it.. I have a better idea, and am not more assuredly against the Auction House, particularly enlightening was the fact somebody said that ZoS actually wanted the system to be different from other MMOs. I like that. I like it's different and that it still works.

The system doesn't work when people use exploits to get around it, and the other forms of corruption are just icing on the cake. The system is similar to other games which was also mentioned in other comments in this thread. There is no reason to keep the current system at all, unless it gets a complete overhaul. I like seeing the vendors in the game. However, since I was able to peek behind the curtain, I don't like what they stand for currently. So you see. I don't care about AH or no AH. I just care that the corruption is removed.

I saw you said "exploits", "corruption" on lots of your comments, but I didn't see where you went into any detail about it.

What do you mean "peak behind the curtain"? What do they "stand for currently"? You're saying lots of nebulous things, using scary terms, but there's no substance to it.

My trade guild is great. They have guild hall with the crafting stations, low limits, lots of friendly members who have helped me out with vamp bites, ports to wayshrines, etc... Even ran a normal trial with them the other day, never thought I'd get into those.

Then you didn't really read the thread. It's all within the thread.

I admitted as much that I just perused it... I did see a lot of posts from you.. most of them attacking people who disagreed with any part of your position, which is now very clear.

I'm sorry I engaged with you... If I'd have known before, I wouldn't have. I'd rather deal with people who are reasonable, and don't resort to personal attacks, fear-mongering, etc... you remind me of the US President when somebody slights him.

I guess I'll just stay away from the forums, since they seem to be where there worst in people come out.

Arrodisia

jkerlandsenrwb17_ESO wrote: »

juttaa77b16_ESO wrote: »

jkerlandsenrwb17_ESO wrote: »

Trust me. You dont want a global AH. You're never going to find any gold mats for at least twice their current price and good luck ever finding a corn flower.

Sincerely,
an evil dirty flipper since PC launch

With an AH which is modified by ZOS with safeguards to prevent such things, that would never happen. I'm not for or against the AH, but even I see a way to get it done, which means the devs(with more xp than me ) probably have more ways than that to do it properly.

Just how would they have safeguards to prevent it? Limit amount of listings you can buy? There's more than enough flippers to make it happen anyway any flipper from the smol boi who sells for 100k to the big boi that sells for up to 50 mil per guild will do it. Put a fixed upper pricing for items? ALL useful items will end up only being sold at their max listings.

As long as there's a margin on an easy sellable item a flipper is gonna flip if they find it. I dont care if I only make 1g from reselling a wax, as said flippers gonna flip.

I honestly think anyone that advocates an AH is either a flipper in disguise or someone that dont quite understand how much gold we actually have or how many flippers there actually are and how low morals we actually have. Yes, I'm not ashamed to admit I'm a *** when it comes to trading, seeing an extra digit on my total gold would be like completely smashing all raid high scores.

A global AH will lead to either free items, meaningless gold and all traders being furious because ZOS put a stupid low price cap and thus ruined a part of their gameplay or prices will raise astronomical.

Disturbed_One wrote: »

The idea that there's a cartel seems implausible to me... is it suspicious that the same guilds have the same traders all the time, perhaps, but many are there because they offer a lot of goods, and sell a lot. The idea there's a "evil cartel" manipulating everything seems like a boogeyman argument to me. I don't buy it.

There's no evil cartel, securing guild traders is a spanish soap drama. It's a warzone.

Those aren't my decisions to make. Zos would make those.