Skyshard Prices!?

FlopsyPrince

too expensive

Those don't go far when building crafting on alts. No vital need for that I suppose, but I am doing it. Add in Werewolf or Vampire and you get even more skill point pressure.

It is still inane to have a grind on ever single alt like this. We may have an alternative with a high Crown cost, but that is not good either.

I really do want to do more questing in the game on my alts, but I am pushed to run for skyshards instead.

Justify what you will, it remains an annoyance.

mayasunrising

cheap!

I personally think it's cheaper than I expected. I often have a few hundred crowns laying about, and it would be so easy to just earn gold to by from Tamriel Crown Exchange or some other player/guild selling crowns.

zaria

other

You get the skyshards but not the lore books or the wayshrines.
Pretty pointless as I see it.

Siohwenoeht

other

All the folks that wanted an alternative to actually picking up the skyshards got what they wanted and are now complaining about it, well several people mentioned this was how it would shake out.

I'm glad about the pricing tbh, if no one buys them then hopefully we never see skill lines in the store either.

More than enough skill points without every single shard.

FlopsyPrince

too expensive

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

got what they wanted

I did not like this (and I think I replied against the idea) when it was initially brought up. Charging for what should be free is bad design, though I can see why they did it.

You have likely never done the skill point grind for many alts at the same time. Too much of my play time now is spent running to pick up more skyshards so I can advance their crafting. Annoying and makes me not play the rest of the game (especially question) as much as I would like to.

Siohwenoeht

other

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

got what they wanted

I did not like this (and I think I replied against the idea) when it was initially brought up. Charging for what should be free is bad design, though I can see why they did it.

You have likely never done the skill point grind for many alts at the same time. Too much of my play time now is spent running to pick up more skyshards so I can advance their crafting. Annoying and makes me not play the rest of the game (especially question) as much as I would like to.

Things are only a grind if you make them. I've levelled plenty of toons and picked up more than enough skyshards and lorebooks just by playing the game. Never had too few.

Mik195

El_Borracho wrote: »

Just so I understand, people pay money to buy this game, then pay more money to avoid playing the game, then complain that they are given the option to spend more money to avoid playing the game. ZOS, you guys are geniuses!

I simply don't understand the aversion to gathering skyshards as part of leveling an alternate character. You have to level the new character and the new character's skills by playing the game, why not make running delves and hunting skyshards part of it? Its not hard. Its not much more time consuming than running main quest/zone story quests/guild quests to speed level.

I can see it now, ZOS will next offer "Scrolls of Leveling" in the guild store where you can use crowns to buy experience to level your alternate character. And people will complain that it is again too expensive.

Because paying to get my crafter the points she needs to max out provisioning and alchemy (the only ones she doesn't have since I put trait points toward enchanting) lets me spend my limited time playing characters that I find fun instead of spending days with a weak boring character.

Bouldercleave

other

Iluvrien wrote: »

Shouldn’t be available for sale in the first place.

This ^^^

JadonSky

other

It's a waste of money and won't buy them. You can get them for free, sure it takes a little time but no worse then mages guild, psjiic order skill line, and undaunted .Just another part of the process when leveling an alt. People have just gotten lazy and expect everything handed to them with no effort.

hope0burns

too expensive

El_Borracho wrote: »

Just so I understand, people pay money to buy this game, then pay more money to avoid playing the game

Your understanding is wrong in this case. They play the game, including all the tedious time-consuming bits once then they complain that they have to work to do all the tedious time consuming bits again on every single character. You see, people want to play the game, not work, yet that is what these collectibles are, just time-consuming work that you have to do over and over again.

Yet, the benefits of this tedium are too much to willfully pass up, especially since they actively work in making your character more diverse and just generally stronger. In other MMOs, all you have to do is play the game, quest, group, and dungeon to get more powerful through levels and gear, collectibles are generally just for titles, toys, or other similar things. In this MMO, however, the skyshard collectibles directly affect your character's ability to perform.

Collectibles are often seen as one of those "one time and done" things by players, assuming they do them at all. Most just want to play the game instead of wasting time to go around collecting things. So to tie character performance into collectibles, especially in a MMO, only encourages a lot of complaining due to the massive waste of time and work required to go and get them all each and every time. This happens because people want to play the game, not work in the game.

Of course, being able to buy them wouldn't be as bad as it is if it wasn't transaction-per-character and was, instead, a transaction-per-account. There'd still be people complaining, yet it'd be much more reasonable, especially at 50 crowns per shard. So, yeah. People complain because they want to play. They want to do dungeons, group with friends, do quests, not run around mindlessly collecting shinies like we're part of the Duke's court.

One common problem in understanding this is that some mistakenly think that every single little thing that's in the game is still "play," yet that couldn't be further from the truth. There are many things put in that are just designed to make the player work, to be tedious, to be "its own reward." These sorts of things may inspire someone's curiosity to make them do it once, yet if the reward isn't great enough and/or the adventure not grand enough then that one time working on it will generally be it- the player will only do it just the once, wanting, instead, to have fun with the aspects of the game designed toward play instead of work as playing, not working, is what people want games for in the first place.

laksikus

just right!

El_Borracho wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

Just so I understand, people pay money to buy this game, then pay more money to avoid playing the game, then complain that they are given the option to spend more money to avoid playing the game. ZOS, you guys are geniuses!

I simply don't understand the aversion to gathering skyshards as part of leveling an alternate character. You have to level the new character and the new character's skills by playing the game, why not make running delves and hunting skyshards part of it? Its not hard. Its not much more time consuming than running main quest/zone story quests/guild quests to speed level.

I can see it now, ZOS will next offer "Scrolls of Leveling" in the guild store where you can use crowns to buy experience to level your alternate character. And people will complain that it is again too expensive.

Running around needed items like skyshards is grindy, not "playing the game". Technically anything is, but the game could have something that required you to daily run (not ride) between Alinoir and Shimmerine, for example. That would technically be "playing the game" but would add no value. The same is true of collecting skyshards on multiple characters. That grind keeps me from playing much of the game I would rather play.

You get over 50 skill points just by leveling to level 50. You get at least 5 more through the basic main quest. You get anywhere from 3-6 more skill points by doing a zone story quest. It takes about 2-3 zones to level up to 50, so conservatively, that is 10 more skill points for a total of 65, and that is without counting the bonus skill points you get at level 25 or 30 or whatever.

With 10 skills and 2 ultimates, that's 24 skill points. Racial passives are another 9. Throw in 2 for persuasion and intimidation and we are up to 33. Which leaves over 30 points for passives to fill. And this is all without grabbing a single skyshard. In fact, this would likely entail actively avoiding grabbing skyshards on quests you are doing for leveling.

Exactly how many skill points do you need from skyshards on your alternate? Are you trying to make every character a master crafter? If so, great, its your game. But that is an unnecessary luxury. Just as buying skyshards is an unnecessary luxury. Therefore, you should be prepared to pay unnecessary prices for it.

Its really no different than paying gold to teleport in the game instead of riding another 10 seconds to a wayshrine with your mount. Except you are using real money to gather something that would take, what, 30-45 minutes to run through a zone? A zone you are likely grinding exp on to level that new character anyway...

lets see what my nb needs on skillpoints other than crafting skills and for 1 pvp and 1 pve build only:

22 skills+morphs: 44 skill points
12x2 class passives: 24 skill points
11x2 Weapon passives: 24 skill points
Armor passives: 21 skill points
Guild passives: 21 skill points
alliance war passives: 12 skill points
racials: 9 skill points
Medicinal Use: 3 skill points

thats on total 158 skill points

Vandril

other

• It should have been account-wide, for free. Possibly with a gold cost per zone for account-wide unlock.
• They charge a set price per zone based on how many Skyshards are in the zone, not how many you have left to collect. If you have all but one Skyshard in a zone, the cost will be the same as though you had none of them. That's unreasonable.
• Aside from the two caveats above, 50 Crowns/Skyshard is a fairly reasonable price. I sub whenever I play (for the crafting bag, mainly), so that means I pretty much get around 11 Skill Points/month for free.

NordSwordnBoard

just right!

Craglorn and the opposite alliances are worth it to me time consumption wise. I've been sitting on crowns for months to use for this.

Collecting skyshards as you go about exploring and questing is fun, collecting them just because you need skill points is tedious maintenance to me. Somewhere around my 5th or 8th character I got tired of the repetition involved, and this shortcut is saving my patience.

When I look at my wardens, I get some remorse about the time spent on preparing them just to end up failing my expectations. I turned cosmetics/dlc currency into more quality game time for myself. Win-Win.

Darkenarlol

other

i don't care

but for those who are just imagine

(with EU prices at lowest 300g/crown

and up to 400 from from abusive guild alliance mafia)

you *get* 15k gold per shard for not buying it

45-60k gold for one skill point? lol thanks but no

El_Borracho

other

@FloppyTouch I'm not disagreeing that the price is laughably high. I also agree that skyshard hunting can be a grind. But

laksikus wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

Just so I understand, people pay money to buy this game, then pay more money to avoid playing the game, then complain that they are given the option to spend more money to avoid playing the game. ZOS, you guys are geniuses!

I simply don't understand the aversion to gathering skyshards as part of leveling an alternate character. You have to level the new character and the new character's skills by playing the game, why not make running delves and hunting skyshards part of it? Its not hard. Its not much more time consuming than running main quest/zone story quests/guild quests to speed level.

I can see it now, ZOS will next offer "Scrolls of Leveling" in the guild store where you can use crowns to buy experience to level your alternate character. And people will complain that it is again too expensive.

Running around needed items like skyshards is grindy, not "playing the game". Technically anything is, but the game could have something that required you to daily run (not ride) between Alinoir and Shimmerine, for example. That would technically be "playing the game" but would add no value. The same is true of collecting skyshards on multiple characters. That grind keeps me from playing much of the game I would rather play.

You get over 50 skill points just by leveling to level 50. You get at least 5 more through the basic main quest. You get anywhere from 3-6 more skill points by doing a zone story quest. It takes about 2-3 zones to level up to 50, so conservatively, that is 10 more skill points for a total of 65, and that is without counting the bonus skill points you get at level 25 or 30 or whatever.

With 10 skills and 2 ultimates, that's 24 skill points. Racial passives are another 9. Throw in 2 for persuasion and intimidation and we are up to 33. Which leaves over 30 points for passives to fill. And this is all without grabbing a single skyshard. In fact, this would likely entail actively avoiding grabbing skyshards on quests you are doing for leveling.

Exactly how many skill points do you need from skyshards on your alternate? Are you trying to make every character a master crafter? If so, great, its your game. But that is an unnecessary luxury. Just as buying skyshards is an unnecessary luxury. Therefore, you should be prepared to pay unnecessary prices for it.

Its really no different than paying gold to teleport in the game instead of riding another 10 seconds to a wayshrine with your mount. Except you are using real money to gather something that would take, what, 30-45 minutes to run through a zone? A zone you are likely grinding exp on to level that new character anyway...

lets see what my nb needs on skillpoints other than crafting skills and for 1 pvp and 1 pve build only:

22 skills+morphs: 44 skill points
12x2 class passives: 24 skill points
11x2 Weapon passives: 24 skill points
Armor passives: 21 skill points
Guild passives: 21 skill points
alliance war passives: 12 skill points
racials: 9 skill points
Medicinal Use: 3 skill points

thats on total 158 skill points

So, again, you are talking about a luxury. Only this time it is enough skill points to be able to transition one character between PVE and PVP without having to respec. One that can go from DW/Bow to 2H with a whole new set of skills and fully stacked in all armor passives. Which is about as necessary as it would be to have multiple master crafters.

I fail to understand your outrage. Should this be free? Because you also fail to suggest a reasonable price in order to avoid the horror of having to gather enough skyshards so you can run a character that can do everything in every part of the game. All while defending paying real-world money to avoid respecing your character so you can avoid spending in-game gold to do so. Which is the most confounding part of this debate.

But the best part? The zones from which they are offering to sell skyshards are the smallest and easiest to gather them from. Its not Cyrodiil, its Stros M'Kai and Bleakrock

Tasear

other

SirAxen wrote: »

When things start popping up on the Crown store for super cheap you will know the game is dying.

Nah people wanted it. They begged for years for it.

disintegr8

cheap!

I don't think they should be for sale at all, so at double the prices they would still be too cheap.

FlopsyPrince

too expensive

El_Borracho wrote: »

@FloppyTouch I'm not disagreeing that the price is laughably high. I also agree that skyshard hunting can be a grind. But

laksikus wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

El_Borracho wrote: »

Just so I understand, people pay money to buy this game, then pay more money to avoid playing the game, then complain that they are given the option to spend more money to avoid playing the game. ZOS, you guys are geniuses!

I simply don't understand the aversion to gathering skyshards as part of leveling an alternate character. You have to level the new character and the new character's skills by playing the game, why not make running delves and hunting skyshards part of it? Its not hard. Its not much more time consuming than running main quest/zone story quests/guild quests to speed level.

I can see it now, ZOS will next offer "Scrolls of Leveling" in the guild store where you can use crowns to buy experience to level your alternate character. And people will complain that it is again too expensive.

Running around needed items like skyshards is grindy, not "playing the game". Technically anything is, but the game could have something that required you to daily run (not ride) between Alinoir and Shimmerine, for example. That would technically be "playing the game" but would add no value. The same is true of collecting skyshards on multiple characters. That grind keeps me from playing much of the game I would rather play.

You get over 50 skill points just by leveling to level 50. You get at least 5 more through the basic main quest. You get anywhere from 3-6 more skill points by doing a zone story quest. It takes about 2-3 zones to level up to 50, so conservatively, that is 10 more skill points for a total of 65, and that is without counting the bonus skill points you get at level 25 or 30 or whatever.

With 10 skills and 2 ultimates, that's 24 skill points. Racial passives are another 9. Throw in 2 for persuasion and intimidation and we are up to 33. Which leaves over 30 points for passives to fill. And this is all without grabbing a single skyshard. In fact, this would likely entail actively avoiding grabbing skyshards on quests you are doing for leveling.

Exactly how many skill points do you need from skyshards on your alternate? Are you trying to make every character a master crafter? If so, great, its your game. But that is an unnecessary luxury. Just as buying skyshards is an unnecessary luxury. Therefore, you should be prepared to pay unnecessary prices for it.

Its really no different than paying gold to teleport in the game instead of riding another 10 seconds to a wayshrine with your mount. Except you are using real money to gather something that would take, what, 30-45 minutes to run through a zone? A zone you are likely grinding exp on to level that new character anyway...

lets see what my nb needs on skillpoints other than crafting skills and for 1 pvp and 1 pve build only:

22 skills+morphs: 44 skill points
12x2 class passives: 24 skill points
11x2 Weapon passives: 24 skill points
Armor passives: 21 skill points
Guild passives: 21 skill points
alliance war passives: 12 skill points
racials: 9 skill points
Medicinal Use: 3 skill points

thats on total 158 skill points

So, again, you are talking about a luxury. Only this time it is enough skill points to be able to transition one character between PVE and PVP without having to respec. One that can go from DW/Bow to 2H with a whole new set of skills and fully stacked in all armor passives. Which is about as necessary as it would be to have multiple master crafters.

I fail to understand your outrage. Should this be free? Because you also fail to suggest a reasonable price in order to avoid the horror of having to gather enough skyshards so you can run a character that can do everything in every part of the game. All while defending paying real-world money to avoid respecing your character so you can avoid spending in-game gold to do so. Which is the most confounding part of this debate.

But the best part? The zones from which they are offering to sell skyshards are the smallest and easiest to gather them from. Its not Cyrodiil, its Stros M'Kai and Bleakrock

You are leaving out crafting.

Yeah, it is not required for each character, but it is a allowed for all characters, so I am playing the game that way and it takes a lot of skill points to max those.

FlopsyPrince

too expensive

Tasear wrote: »

SirAxen wrote: »

When things start popping up on the Crown store for super cheap you will know the game is dying.

Nah people wanted it. They begged for years for it.

What we got was not what most of us asked for.

Siohwenoeht

other

Darkenarlol wrote: »

i don't care

but for those who are just imagine

(with EU prices at lowest 300g/crown

and up to 400 from from abusive guild alliance mafia)

you *get* 15k gold per shard for not buying it

45-60k gold for one skill point? lol thanks but no

FYI: The packs aren't giftable so you can't pay gold for them at all, regardless of amorphous "mafias" lol

Casterial

just right!

Iluvrien wrote: »

Shouldn’t be available for sale in the first place.

As a pvper I wish they even sold max level 50 or max weapon lines lol..

Enokariel

other

I do not think that P2W solution is a good idea. Unlock system will be much better.

bmnoble

too expensive

If it had been an account wide unlock I would have considered buying some of them. Since its per character I won't bother.

Uryel

too expensive

hope0burns wrote: »

Of course, being able to buy them wouldn't be as bad as it is if it wasn't transaction-per-character and was, instead, a transaction-per-account. There'd still be people complaining, yet it'd be much more reasonable, especially at 50 crowns per shard.

And that is true for many things. I'll add my pet peeve, the outfit slots. 1500 crowns per slot per character is armed robbery. 1000, as it is currently discounted, is still armed robbery.

1500 crowns for one more slot for every character ? I'll buy 3, thank you. 1000 crowns for one more slot for one character ? I'll buy none, thank you.

As a comparison, Champions Online, which is a a superhero game, thus one where appearance is a major aspect of your character, sells per character outfit slots, but the price is roughly 20 times lower. No, this is not a type. TWENTY TIMES LOWER. As you can guess, my characters there have a large variety of appearances.

1500 crowns per outfit slot should be account wide.

Uryel

too expensive

Casterial wrote: »

As a pvper I wish they even sold max level 50 or max weapon lines lol..

And as a PvEer I wish they would remove PvP entirely so the outcries for "nerf <insert class whiners complain most at the current time, race that is percieved as OP or pretty much anything, really>" would never be a problem and we who don't care about PvP at all wouldn't see our gameplay ruined by sore losers.

To each their own, I guess.

Zedrian

other

Shouldn't be for sale.

IndorilArwynLlethran

other

They are free and no one forces anyone to buy them. The price for being lazy is absolutely ok.

Iluvrien

other

Casterial wrote: »

Iluvrien wrote: »

Shouldn’t be available for sale in the first place.

As a pvper I wish they even sold max level 50 or max weapon lines lol..

Then what you are looking for is a fantasy FPS not an MMORPG.

Iluvrien

other

FlopsyPrince wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

SirAxen wrote: »

When things start popping up on the Crown store for super cheap you will know the game is dying.

Nah people wanted it. They begged for years for it.

What we got was not what most of us asked for.

And yet it is what more than one person predicted in, and based on, the request threads.

Daedric_NB_187

just right!

I think the prices are fair. I bought all the ones I unlocked on my new stamcro, which came out to be about 48 skill points. Not too bad. TBH, I thought they were going to be way more expensive than it already is.

Do I wish they would have made them account wide? Yeah. But they didn't. This is the route they chose. I had the crowns to spend, so I did. It's a convenience thing. And I appreciate not having run all over Tamriel for the hundredth time to get them. If you don't agree with it, don't buy it. Nothing is forcing you to.