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Magden Ice and Immobilize Oh My!
BrokenGameMechanics
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As has been repeatedly pointed out Magden has been getting baffling nerfs on class that is already ranked as worst.
Let's go summarize what the Magden is seeing this patch cycle. If you are an Ice Mage there is a decent chance you are a Magden because of the Frost Damage Passive.
Immobilize and Ice. What might be the only, modestly effective build for a Magden, the Ice Mage has been way, way overally nerfed.
PVE
Doubt there is much belief that Ice Mage is any kind of problem in PVE whatsoever.
PVP
I play a lot of PVP, and almost exclusively as an Ice Mage. As such I am always sensitive to noting on my death log any hint of an opposing Ice Mage. Answer effectively NEVER. Very, very rare to see a Blockade/Wall of Frost, a Frost Clench/Reach, even rarer to see a Winterborn or Icy Conj. I don't think I've seen one single Icy Conj. Just one. And I have not seen a Winterborn in literally months. I might, MIGHT, see one, two or three a Frost Wall/Blockade or Clench/Reach in a long evening of PVP play. One every hour or two.
First major point is if there is almost zero players of an Ice Mage build why is it being nerfed from the game if it is not even a problem? If it was OP, Cyrodiil would be literally overrun with Ice Mages. Well there are none, literally close to zero.
Consider a baseline Magden Frost Mage build, Ysgars and Winterborne, with Frost skills on your bars (are not that many), you are going to do sub 20K on a dummy. So with Battle Spirit that Frost Mage is doing <10K DPS.
A Magden Ice Mage will lose 10 out of 10 1v1s against non-healer builds and you do not have enough DPS to take out a healer. And Immobilize if/when applied is hands down the most innocious, weak CC effect in the game. So ineffective was a soft-CC and not a hard-CC.
In summary, an niche build, poor 1v1, low damage, weak effect, no one running it.
Burdensome To Low Stam Builds.
CCs to low stam builds, like Magden ARE not balanced and should have been fixed long long ago, Fear, Disorient, Stun, Knockback, Dodgeroll, but that is not being fixed or addressed. Why are these not being nerfed, removed, etc. Where and how is ZOS seening Immobilize the poster child for CC imbalance for low stam builds.
Immobilize Is Equivalent To A Hard CC
It's not, really. This is one of those things that you just don't know where to even start. If the combat designers cannot see that Immobilize is NOT even close in equivalence to Fear, Disorient, Stun, Knockback, etc ... I don't know what I can say to convince you otherwise, yet, there you are, reclassifying Immobilize to the same level of treatment as other Hard CCs. What are you seeing that makes this the case?
Immobilize Is Burdensome to Low Stam CC's such as a Magden and as a result we are removing Major Endurance from the Magden's Bird of XXX. Wait, what? Cannot follow the Combat Designer's train of thought here. If Mag vs Stam has a major unbalance point with Resource Pools to the determent of Mag classes how is removing the Magden's Stam recovery capability addressing this?
Frost Wall/Blockade, In Comparison To Fire and Shock, Ice is nerfed 20% ON TOP OF THE ALREADY RECLASSIFICATION NERF OF IMMOBILIZE AS A HARD CC WITH 3 SEC COOLDOWN. Ok, so we've already hit Ice with a 3 second cooldown because the Combat Design believes it on par with Fear, Disorient, Stun, Knockback, Dodgeroll, which all by the way are 100% chance to happen Hard CCs. But wait it's not, it is EVEN STRONGER than a AOE Fear or Stuf or ... so we the Combat Design team are doing a double heavy nerf reducing the probability of affecting by 20%. Of course for Flame and Shock, we are not adjusting that down at all.
Ice Mage As Balance, Exasperating Real Imbalances By Removing Ice Mage From PVP
If an Ice Mage does little to no damage, decidedly loses every 1v1 out there etc, why are there are there a few players playing them in PVP and why does ZOS fear them so that they are being removed as a viable PVP option?
Well I play mine to ADD and CORRECT for long standing REAL game imbalances. An Ice Mage is an modest counter to Streakers, Tanks and High Speed Rock Runners. Yes, there are builds that run and streak around Aless Bridge or some Tower, that are 100% CC and Immobilize free. And CC freedom is offered for free at the skill or trash pot level, yet still Immobilize is a major unbalance threat. And yes, Tanks now can run around PVP with impunity rezing who and where they which, burning any siege, sitting on top of a flag ... but in a many of these cases an Ice Mage did bring some utility. I could slow that Rez/Burn Tank down or slow the Rock Runner Streaker down some ... no more. This double compounded as the Combat Designer's have with removing almost all of the Slows from Skills that all you can do is attempt to get them with a Gap Closer. Gap Closing an unkillable Tank ... what is the point. And you can't Gap Close to a Rock Runner, Tower Circler or Streaker ... These Metas will go continue to go through roof. One of the very, very few semi-counters to these Metas is now gone.
Please just leave Immobilize alone. Very, very few are even using it. It is not directly OP killing anyone. It is one of the very, very few viable alternative play styles that bring nice tactical play into PVP which is now gone. Even assuming that is it a huge problem, the double heavy nerf is way, way overcompensation to a really non-existent problem. Is it really that bad, so destroying of PVP play that 3 Sec Cooldown AND 20% adjustment downward of proc chance not over doing it? Why not adjust ALL Wall/Blockade probs down 20?
Let's go summarize what the Magden is seeing this patch cycle. If you are an Ice Mage there is a decent chance you are a Magden because of the Frost Damage Passive.
Immobilize and Ice. What might be the only, modestly effective build for a Magden, the Ice Mage has been way, way overally nerfed.
PVE
Doubt there is much belief that Ice Mage is any kind of problem in PVE whatsoever.
PVP
I play a lot of PVP, and almost exclusively as an Ice Mage. As such I am always sensitive to noting on my death log any hint of an opposing Ice Mage. Answer effectively NEVER. Very, very rare to see a Blockade/Wall of Frost, a Frost Clench/Reach, even rarer to see a Winterborn or Icy Conj. I don't think I've seen one single Icy Conj. Just one. And I have not seen a Winterborn in literally months. I might, MIGHT, see one, two or three a Frost Wall/Blockade or Clench/Reach in a long evening of PVP play. One every hour or two.
First major point is if there is almost zero players of an Ice Mage build why is it being nerfed from the game if it is not even a problem? If it was OP, Cyrodiil would be literally overrun with Ice Mages. Well there are none, literally close to zero.
Consider a baseline Magden Frost Mage build, Ysgars and Winterborne, with Frost skills on your bars (are not that many), you are going to do sub 20K on a dummy. So with Battle Spirit that Frost Mage is doing <10K DPS.
A Magden Ice Mage will lose 10 out of 10 1v1s against non-healer builds and you do not have enough DPS to take out a healer. And Immobilize if/when applied is hands down the most innocious, weak CC effect in the game. So ineffective was a soft-CC and not a hard-CC.
In summary, an niche build, poor 1v1, low damage, weak effect, no one running it.
Burdensome To Low Stam Builds.
CCs to low stam builds, like Magden ARE not balanced and should have been fixed long long ago, Fear, Disorient, Stun, Knockback, Dodgeroll, but that is not being fixed or addressed. Why are these not being nerfed, removed, etc. Where and how is ZOS seening Immobilize the poster child for CC imbalance for low stam builds.
Immobilize Is Equivalent To A Hard CC
It's not, really. This is one of those things that you just don't know where to even start. If the combat designers cannot see that Immobilize is NOT even close in equivalence to Fear, Disorient, Stun, Knockback, etc ... I don't know what I can say to convince you otherwise, yet, there you are, reclassifying Immobilize to the same level of treatment as other Hard CCs. What are you seeing that makes this the case?
Immobilize Is Burdensome to Low Stam CC's such as a Magden and as a result we are removing Major Endurance from the Magden's Bird of XXX. Wait, what? Cannot follow the Combat Designer's train of thought here. If Mag vs Stam has a major unbalance point with Resource Pools to the determent of Mag classes how is removing the Magden's Stam recovery capability addressing this?
Frost Wall/Blockade, In Comparison To Fire and Shock, Ice is nerfed 20% ON TOP OF THE ALREADY RECLASSIFICATION NERF OF IMMOBILIZE AS A HARD CC WITH 3 SEC COOLDOWN. Ok, so we've already hit Ice with a 3 second cooldown because the Combat Design believes it on par with Fear, Disorient, Stun, Knockback, Dodgeroll, which all by the way are 100% chance to happen Hard CCs. But wait it's not, it is EVEN STRONGER than a AOE Fear or Stuf or ... so we the Combat Design team are doing a double heavy nerf reducing the probability of affecting by 20%. Of course for Flame and Shock, we are not adjusting that down at all.
Ice Mage As Balance, Exasperating Real Imbalances By Removing Ice Mage From PVP
If an Ice Mage does little to no damage, decidedly loses every 1v1 out there etc, why are there are there a few players playing them in PVP and why does ZOS fear them so that they are being removed as a viable PVP option?
Well I play mine to ADD and CORRECT for long standing REAL game imbalances. An Ice Mage is an modest counter to Streakers, Tanks and High Speed Rock Runners. Yes, there are builds that run and streak around Aless Bridge or some Tower, that are 100% CC and Immobilize free. And CC freedom is offered for free at the skill or trash pot level, yet still Immobilize is a major unbalance threat. And yes, Tanks now can run around PVP with impunity rezing who and where they which, burning any siege, sitting on top of a flag ... but in a many of these cases an Ice Mage did bring some utility. I could slow that Rez/Burn Tank down or slow the Rock Runner Streaker down some ... no more. This double compounded as the Combat Designer's have with removing almost all of the Slows from Skills that all you can do is attempt to get them with a Gap Closer. Gap Closing an unkillable Tank ... what is the point. And you can't Gap Close to a Rock Runner, Tower Circler or Streaker ... These Metas will go continue to go through roof. One of the very, very few semi-counters to these Metas is now gone.
Please just leave Immobilize alone. Very, very few are even using it. It is not directly OP killing anyone. It is one of the very, very few viable alternative play styles that bring nice tactical play into PVP which is now gone. Even assuming that is it a huge problem, the double heavy nerf is way, way overcompensation to a really non-existent problem. Is it really that bad, so destroying of PVP play that 3 Sec Cooldown AND 20% adjustment downward of proc chance not over doing it? Why not adjust ALL Wall/Blockade probs down 20?
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