Necro’s OP abilities

Irylia

After playtesting the class in duels, cyro, and test dummies the abilities that I believe to be over-performing are.

1. Blast bones (both morphs)
Either the damage is bugged and not being affected by battle spirit or it’s tt is extremely messed up. With a 13k tt on mag necro using lich shadowrend necro master destro I am hitting 7-10k non crit blast bones without major/Minor vul. A bit off right? It should be sub assaults sister skill essentially. 3 second wind up and then aoe damage.
Sub hits for about half that 4-6k average.

The skills secondary effect, a debuff should be removed or altered for a different effect as constant major defile has been an issue in the past which is why we have seen nerfs to incap, snipe, duroks, befoul, reverb, fasalla.

If the damage could be toned to that amount I believe that would be beneficial to balance especially paired with the next skill that is too strong.

2. Rez ultimate
this ult costs 200 ish ult and either rez’s three allies AND gives 5k of each resource back per res.
Or
Ressurects 3 allies and creates up to 3 blastbones which have this insane damage. So you can essentially send 4 blastbones running in at once each hitting for 7-10 k at the same time.

This ultimate is providing way too many benefits for the cost and should just be a rez to 2 allies for 200 ult (100 per person) no additional benefit)
Or
Ressurect 3 of your corpses and turn them into blastbones (after blast bones gets a damage tweak)
Otherwise this ability will be spammed in pvp and players will continue being instantly revived when the outnumber the other group.

3. Expunge and modify
. (The class purge)
For 1800 hp you can remove 2 debuffs and return 500 Stam and mag per debuff.
Or
For 1800hp you can remove 4 debuffs.

This ability when paired with the healing spirit guardian allows mag necro to perma block in a cycle of
Cleanse debuffs > return resources > spirit heals for 4K 2/s.

I’ll upload clips to enforce my point later today.
Blast bones damage + res ult
Block + debuff spam removal.

rez ult + blast bone dmg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gh2XoyV-pnM

Dark_Shady

100% agree. Blastbones should be comparable to subterranean assault from wardens. That or slow the speed of the zombies, I don’t know why it applies major defile, seems excessive.

Only thing to add, one of the morphs of wraith is a 10% damage reduction, which is crazy, that’s better than minor protection! And this lasts for 16 seconds (or until wraith dies)

frostz417

The resurrection ult cannot go live, this ability will DESTROY solo&small scale as Rez bots are already a big issue and the last thing small scale players need is zerglings all using Rez ult and being unable to wipe

Irylia

That’s the biggest issue I can foresee.
Groups just saving ult for free pick me ups after wiping

Dracane

I agree with everything. And I also believe, that the ress ultimate can never be balanced for pvp. It is way too strong and almost guarantees a win against your opponent. It will be insane in pve, battlegrounds, insane in smallscale and only the divines know what it can do in big battles.

I honestly think this ability should have never been introduced. It should have never even been considered or should be completely disabled in pvp at least. It doesn't even really make sense lore wise. Necromancy can't be used to restore someone like this. Necromancy always results in mindless thralls, because your magicka just fills the corpse and makes it your own.

Just remove this ultimate as long as the chance is still there.
Or give it a long cast time that can always be interrupted, to make it harder to use in pvp.

Urvoth

The res ultimate is broken in cyrodiil, but basically useless in BGs. Blastbones is getting fixed, but necro really won't have a lot of damage after that. The skull/scythe and blastbones are really the only 2 damage skills since the mage and siphon damage ticks are low and less controllable. On top of that, the graveyard only applies breach to people in it, not over a period of time like deep fissure does, and no one is going to stand in it for long since it doesn't snare/stun and has a tiny aoe.

Basically, necro has 2 decent damage skills aside from the ult so I really don't see how they're going to beat any other class in a 1v1. It really needs some form of consistent single target dot damage or something else to weave in with blastbones/skull. A single target CC would be nice too.

OtarTheMad

I agree that the rez ult should only rez two people and also not give them any resources back. In PVP that ult will be huge in determining who will win a keep. We will have to see what week 3 brings us. Maybe Blastbones won't be so bad now that the pet bug is fixed.

Garack

THEY nerf all classes mostly NB then make Necro OP, and THEN all buy the necro and elswyr and they make Money. zos style.

LiquidPony

Dark_Shady wrote: »

100% agree. Blastbones should be comparable to subterranean assault from wardens. That or slow the speed of the zombies, I don’t know why it applies major defile, seems excessive.

Only thing to add, one of the morphs of wraith is a 10% damage reduction, which is crazy, that’s better than minor protection! And this lasts for 16 seconds (or until wraith dies)

Subterranean Assault is also a giant AoE attack (20m x 8m rectangle IIRC) that does not require a target and applies Major Fracture (or Major Breach for Deep Fissure).

The Blastbones skeleton can also be CC'd or killed. And I believe it's about 10% more expensive as well.

So they do have the same usage on the surface because of delayed activation but IMO it makes sense that the Blastbones has higher damage potential because of differences in design. I wouldn't be mad if the damage was tuned down a little bit but it should hit harder than Subterranean Assault

ccmedaddy

LiquidPony wrote: »

The Blastbones skeleton can also be CC'd or killed. And I believe it's about 10% more expensive as well.

Just curious--how easy is it to kill a skeleton?

Lughlongarm

The spirit heal seems over tuned(both morphs).
The tank heal have crazy ulti regen potencial after players will master rotations. Not that hard to get like 28 ulty every 16 sec without minor/major heroism.

Jagdkommando

Garack wrote: »

THEY nerf all classes mostly NB then make Necro OP, and THEN all buy the necro and elswyr and they make Money. zos style.

And then they nerf Necro...
Cant understand why they are unable to create normal class at once, without nerfing all the game?!

frostz417

Jagdkommando wrote: »

Garack wrote: »

THEY nerf all classes mostly NB then make Necro OP, and THEN all buy the necro and elswyr and they make Money. zos style.

And then they nerf Necro...
Cant understand why they are unable to create normal class at once, without nerfing all the game?!

Y’all realize DK’s and Templars got buffed... right?

katorga

frostz417 wrote: »

Jagdkommando wrote: »

Garack wrote: »

THEY nerf all classes mostly NB then make Necro OP, and THEN all buy the necro and elswyr and they make Money. zos style.

And then they nerf Necro...
Cant understand why they are unable to create normal class at once, without nerfing all the game?!

Y’all realize DK’s and Templars got buffed... right?

Templars got nerfed imo.

Ahlteffour

What if they made the Necro res ultimate indiscriminate. It will res "any" 3 players in PVP randomly, taking away its potential to be abused because you could res one of your enemies in a cluster of bodies.

You would have to be more tactical with it in PVP, and it wouldn't change anything in PVE. With such a large radius, I could see that making it a difficult ability to abuse unless it is only your team getting slaughtered. In that case, what does it matter? If it's one sided, that likely isn't going to change.

Just an idea.

frostz417

katorga wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

Jagdkommando wrote: »

Garack wrote: »

THEY nerf all classes mostly NB then make Necro OP, and THEN all buy the necro and elswyr and they make Money. zos style.

And then they nerf Necro...
Cant understand why they are unable to create normal class at once, without nerfing all the game?!

Y’all realize DK’s and Templars got buffed... right?

Templars got nerfed imo.

Buff to ritual for stamplar
Buff to shards on damage and resource return
Buff to blazing shield
Buff to javelin stun timer
Increase crescent sweep radius by 2 meters

Only nerf was total dark.
Still think templars got nerfed?

Xsorus

There is nothing wrong with the Rez ult.

What is wrong is a Rez penalty doesn’t exist like DAOC had.

kookster

Irylia wrote: »

After playtesting the class in duels, cyro, and test dummies the abilities that I believe to be over-performing are.

1. Blast bones (both morphs)
Either the damage is bugged and not being affected by battle spirit or it’s tt is extremely messed up. With a 13k tt on mag necro using lich shadowrend necro master destro I am hitting 7-10k non crit blast bones without major/Minor vul. A bit off right? It should be sub assaults sister skill essentially. 3 second wind up and then aoe damage.
Sub hits for about half that 4-6k average.

This skill I confirmed with Carno is hitting for 10-27% harder than it should based off the tooltip. The tooltip is flat out wrong. When you have 2 characters with no gear, cp, passives, etc it hits for 27% harder than it should. When we had our normal gear and cp it was hitting for 10% harder than it should of based off our CP/resistances etc. The skill is legit bugged.

I also agree that a skill that hits this hard should not have major defile, or really any debuff with how hard it actually hits. The tooltip is almost as much as a ultimate. You can by no means justify a skill hitting that hard and have any kind of a debuff when you can cast it every 3-5 seconds.

Burtan

PREACH

Vapirko

It won’t be nerfed for a while for sure. Will almost definitely go live very strong.

Dracane

Vapirko wrote: »

It won’t be nerfed for a while for sure. Will almost definitely go live very strong.

That would be a disaster.
It is an AoE resurrection. It should have a 3-4 seconds channel time like normal resurrections do, which can always be interrupted, even when CC immune. In my opinion, this is the only way this ultimate wouldn't be utterly overpowered. Reducing targets or increasing costs would only delay the problem a bit.

MLGProPlayer

There are some OP passives too.

1. Last Gasp: +2000 healh

That's crazy. They just nerfed gold/purple food, but here is a class that gets almost as much health for free. Coupled with orc, stamcros will be getting +3000 health for free. It means they can get away with using parse food in actual content, which means they don't need to build for any additional sustain like other classes, which is broken as ***. They need to attach the health to using Bone Tyrant abilities. Giving it away for free so DPS can use it is game-breaking.

2. Death Knell: 100% crit chance during execute phase

This sounds unbelievably broken on paper. Is the test dummy fixed so it can be tested? The only way to balance it is to make their skills incredibly weak.

Anti_Virus

Make Rez ult do this:
Rezzed allies have their max hp capped at 60% and 45% magicka and stamina for 5 secs after being rezzed, then stats go back to normal. For added fun a zombie skin could be applies for the debuff duration.

This reinforces Necromancers not being able to perfectly bring the dead back to life

OtarTheMad

frostz417 wrote: »

Jagdkommando wrote: »

Garack wrote: »

THEY nerf all classes mostly NB then make Necro OP, and THEN all buy the necro and elswyr and they make Money. zos style.

And then they nerf Necro...
Cant understand why they are unable to create normal class at once, without nerfing all the game?!

Y’all realize DK’s and Templars got buffed... right?

Some will always wear the tin foil hat

Strider__Roshin

There's so many abilities and passives that are OP about this class that I lack the patience to write a dissertation about it. It's clear from this class that they're no longer interested in balance.

mb10

That ult needs to be disabled for PVP in all honesty

Going to absolutely ruin cyrodiil

ecru

The 4 ability purge is definitely too good IMO. The amount of damage that can be mitigated--possibly up to 40k damage worth of dots at a cost of 2k health is ridiculous. Mitigating that much damage should cost more than a few ticks of health recovery. This will completely neuter anyone or anything that relies on dots (hello stamdk) or debuffs for damage. Purges in general are pretty broken IMO in terms of opportunity cost and purging off a dot should come with a damage penalty against the person removing it, but that's another discussion altogether.

Irylia

It really is for the cost. Should have to spend more health to make it an actual trade off.
Do you really need them removed or do you need the hp

Olupajmibanan

Major Defile on Blastbones should be removed. It does disease damage so it can proc Diseased status effect a.k.a. Major Defile anyways.

czar

I made a magicka necromancer on the PTS. I'm not used to playing mag classes (I have tried a few on the PTS in the past, but I don't really enjoy them and grow bored after half an hour), and I knew absolutely nothing about the skills. I literally just clicked random skills in no proper order just to see what they did, and I practically melted everything around me. I did just as much, if not more, damage than on my stamblade, which I've played for an embarrasing amount of hours since launch (and yes, my stamblade is doing noticeably worse on the PTS than on live, thanks zos). Admittedly I had some trouble staying alive (probably because I had no idea what kind of skills I was throwing around, lmao), but damage-wise, necro seems stupid OP atm.

ATomiX96

no worries its gonna get adjusted after they sold enough elsweyr copies