We need 6 man combat gameplay mode ( rewrote idea for clarification)

Tasear

Here's why

* It will allow for new type of gameplay in between Trials and Dungeons
* It will allow for less fake tanks and healers as dps have room for spots
* It will allow for a increased difficulty in mechanics with groups
* It will allow for less kicking of low dps when more dps to hold the burden

How It can be done

* Add on to old maps and increase level of mechanics to account for power creep
* Another option is to 1 of the 2 dlc dungeons dlcs be for 6 man content.

How it will be different from other content

* Add new engagement mechanics for players, such a scouting, pull lever at right time, use the synergy, balance on a beam
* It will for increase difficulty of encounters with possible standard of 4 dps.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

I would support this.

ccfeeling

2 tanks 4 dd

Tasear

ccfeeling wrote: »

2 tanks 4 dd

😝 No no 1 tank, 1 healer and 4 DPS standard. Content will be harder with more ambient damage so it's DPS lost to forget healer.

Skysenzz

Not sure if this could be a good idea, dungeons hardmodes are made about 4players (E.G: SP)
Even though if you raise the monster's damage/health, this is most of the time not the problem in groups, the problem are mostly mechanics, and if you put 4DDs in the same group, that would just be really f-ing easy.
Just thinking about FL For example, you have 2DDs that goes on the crystal, 1 on the Shalks and 1 can support the Crystal or keep damaging the boss. It just sounds ridiculously simple. It will eventually just make the fight a bit longer.

Tasear

Skysenzz wrote: »

Not sure if this could be a good idea, dungeons hardmodes are made about 4players (E.G: SP)
Even though if you raise the monster's damage/health, this is most of the time not the problem in groups, the problem are mostly mechanics, and if you put 4DDs in the same group, that would just be really f-ing easy.
Just thinking about FL For example, you have 2DDs that goes on the crystal, 1 on the Shalks and 1 can support the Crystal or keep damaging the boss. It just sounds ridiculously simple. It will eventually just make the fight a bit longer.

It's about allowing them go for harder mechics. If old content can't me used them just add new type of dungeon where it's designed for 6 man add on old dungeons by stretching them out more.

Right now half community doesn't want harder content hence old can't be changed. Trial community is very inaccessible for most people. There's a group that enjoys more dynamic fights as seen with outrage that @ZOS_Finn chilled down with dungeon difculty nerfs.

It's time to open up a new middle ground between dungeons and trials.

Skysenzz

I dunno, I feel like some dungeons are already tough enough and need many trials to succeed it (thinking of wrathstone ones) then you have all the success that are linked to that dungeon that can be really tough to complete, which kinda trains you to become a better individual player. TBH If everybody did that before trying harder trials such as vMOL/vHOF, they would complete it much easier, because players will have learnt aknowledge of mechanics difficulty and will have much better reflexes.

Qbiken

ccfeeling wrote: »

2 tanks 4 dd

Imagine having 2 tanks when you can have an extra dd

Tasear

Skysenzz wrote: »

I dunno, I feel like some dungeons are already tough enough and need many trials to succeed it (thinking of wrathstone ones) then you have all the success that are linked to that dungeon that can be really tough to complete, which kinda trains you to become a better individual player. TBH If everybody did that before trying harder trials such as vMOL/vHOF, they would complete it much easier, because players will have learnt aknowledge of mechanics difficulty and will have much better reflexes.

Some people would say dungeons don't train you enough though.

VaranisArano

Unless ZOS chose to revamp the base game dungeons, having 3+ DDs would trivialize most of them. One effect that would have is that healers would become even less necessary.

They seem more interested in releasing NEW dungeons than revamping old ones.

Tasear

VaranisArano wrote: »

Unless ZOS chose to revamp the base game dungeons, having 3+ DDs would trivialize most of them. One effect that would have is that healers would become even less necessary.

They seem more interested in releasing NEW dungeons than revamping old ones.

The idea is to add on to existing. So don't have to work from strach.

Ragnaroek93

There's already more than enough content for group PvE players. Literally half of the DLC's are catered exclusively to group PvE players. How about some more love for PvP instead? And maybe a new solo arena and an arena for two people? Making group PvE requiring even more people would just make it even less accessable for most people.

giantpixie

I don’t think we that it’s worth changing current dungeons but maybe add a couple of arenas or even new dungeons built for 6 people rather than trying to squeeze 6 people into a 4 person space

VaranisArano

Tasear wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Unless ZOS chose to revamp the base game dungeons, having 3+ DDs would trivialize most of them. One effect that would have is that healers would become even less necessary.

They seem more interested in releasing NEW dungeons than revamping old ones.

The idea is to add on to existing. So don't have to work from strach.

So you want the old dungeons revamped?

Again, ZOS doesn't seem too interested in that, unsurprisingly, since new content makes money,

Tasear

VaranisArano wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Unless ZOS chose to revamp the base game dungeons, having 3+ DDs would trivialize most of them. One effect that would have is that healers would become even less necessary.

They seem more interested in releasing NEW dungeons than revamping old ones.

The idea is to add on to existing. So don't have to work from strach.

So you want the old dungeons revamped?

Again, ZOS doesn't seem too interested in that, unsurprisingly, since new content makes money,

Plan A)

Add on old dungeons

Plan B )

New dungeons designed for 6 people and sell to people.

ccfeeling

Upgrade the dungeons difficulties when 6 man mode is on.

Make dd que time from 30 mins to 15 mins

Tasear

Tasear wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Unless ZOS chose to revamp the base game dungeons, having 3+ DDs would trivialize most of them. One effect that would have is that healers would become even less necessary.

They seem more interested in releasing NEW dungeons than revamping old ones.

The idea is to add on to existing. So don't have to work from strach.

So you want the old dungeons revamped?

Again, ZOS doesn't seem too interested in that, unsurprisingly, since new content makes money,

Plan A)

Add on old dungeons

Plan B )

New dungeons designed for 6 people and sell to people.

Another idea just add a new mode to new dungeons in future.

frostz417

Wait so you want to implement a 6 man dungeon for traditional 4 man dungeons just to make it easier?
Lmfao how about get good and acquire thumbs

Tasear

frostz417 wrote: »

Wait so you want to implement a 6 man dungeon for traditional 4 man dungeons just to make it easier?
Lmfao how about get good and acquire thumbs

Please read, because you did not understand.

SoLooney

Unless incoming damage is absolutely unbearable, good players are probably gonna use 1 tank 5 dps and plow through everything or have a magplar with off heals as they provide shards with their rotation too

Zos already have a hard time queuing 4 ppl for dungeons, they cant handle 6 ppl

Tasear

SoLooney wrote: »

Unless incoming damage is absolutely unbearable, good players are probably gonna use 1 tank 5 dps and plow through everything or have a magplar with off heals as they provide shards with their rotation too

Zos already have a hard time queuing 4 ppl for dungeons, they cant handle 6 ppl

I disagree an increase in dungeons like mechanics will make it a dps lost to do so. Either way the plan is to extend the dps quote so less fake you know healers and tanks. Not to say that people can't remove or won't remove healer or tank role, but idea is to alleviate the imbalance to give people who specialize in that role their spots including dps.

DoonerSeraph

Qbiken wrote: »

ccfeeling wrote: »

2 tanks 4 dd

Imagine having 2 tanks when you can have an extra dd

Imagine having any other role other than DD

tinythinker

Well, somewhere on these forums I posted an idea for new instanced content that could work with 6 players. Or 2-3 depending on how it was made behind the scenes.

Or are you only interested in this for the current "dungeon" system and associated instances?

Cause I don't want to search or retype it if it's just for existing stuffs

Tasear

tinythinker wrote: »

Well, somewhere on these forums I posted an idea for new instanced content that could work with 6 players. Or 2-3 depending on how it was made behind the scenes.

Or are you only interested in this for the current "dungeon" system and associated instances?

Cause I don't want to search or retype it if it's just for existing stuffs

I worded it wrong. I am just interested in 6 mode for content.

tinythinker

Tasear wrote: »

tinythinker wrote: »

Well, somewhere on these forums I posted an idea for new instanced content that could work with 6 players. Or 2-3 depending on how it was made behind the scenes.

Or are you only interested in this for the current "dungeon" system and associated instances?

Cause I don't want to search or retype it if it's just for existing stuffs

I worded it wrong. I am just interested in 6 mode for content.

OK, I just didn't want to hijack your thread with something irrelavent.

*will edit just below here later with idea*

---

OK, so what I was thinking of comes from an old thread.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/374809/mountains-out-of-mole-hills-buffed-battles-with-bosses-only

Basically, it's recycled bosses in a procedurally generated small instance. That's the TL;DR. It could be for 2 people or 6 depending on how it is constructed.

The lore/in-game explanation is that on more than one occasion you've ticked of Vaermina, so she's pulled you into a pocket of her plane, Quagmire, or some space between the Mundus and Quagmire to punish you. She draws upon various quest bosses, world bosses, dungeon bosses, trial bosses, and other things to create a nightmare version of the encounter.

From a content design perspective, it allows @ZOS_Finn and crew to creatively re-imagine various fights. By being in a *relatively* small space and recycling character models and basic mechanic-codes for those bosses, there are many possible combinations. Basically:

- X number of boss options/models
- X number of boss mechanics from the bosses above and some new mechanics; they all go into a pool and can be randomly assigned
- X number of effect changes; some boss mechanics may be tied to a particular boss but there could be changes like from lightning to fire, fire to poison, etc.
- X number of arena types, which would have different layouts such as placed to hide, things to activate, etc.
- X number of arena mechanics, some fixed for particular arenas but others randomly assigned; these could include waves of adds (which again could be randomly assigned) or waves of cold that freeze or snare, etc., etc., lots of room for creativity here

Your group has to overcome whichever version of whichever boss they get to "free themselves" from Vaermina's trap, but she vows she will try again after you complete the activity. It would come with normal and vet and an optional hard-mode where you mock Vaermina to tick her off.


Here was a previous attempt to describe the original concept:

Imagine Balreth fighting like you imagine he would versus the Covenant invaders, with a huge AoE rain of fire that is forcing your healer to rapid burn their magicka to keep you alive. The DPS have to set sigils or crystals or totems up to summon the water rain magic to stun Balreth and increase the damage he takes (for the hard mode the rain to make him vulnerable to any damage). The scamps in the fight come to steal the totems which starts the fire rain again until the scamps are caught, killed, and the totems set up again but the scamps are fast and teleport. But Balreth summons skellies that go after whoever has the totems and their attacks interrupt the set-up process.

So that is a partial example of an enhanced Balreth fight, and you can add randomized elements to it like having Balreth use ice magic instead of fire to snare and immobilize players, or perhaps poison/disease damage to keep DoTS on players and make healing a bigger pain, etc. The sequence of certain attacks and phases could be changed. You could replace the scamps with trolls.

Tasear wrote: »

* Add new engagement mechanics for players, such a scouting, pull lever at right time, use the synergy, balance on a beam

Yeah, something like that could be part of the arena/arena mechanics.

It's something that could start with something like 8 bosses, 2 arenas then grow if people liked it to include more and more variations/options.

MashmalloMan

I'm all for this, especially since the game will have 6 different classes. Would love to see an optimized group with 1 of each providing as much class synergy as possible.

They honestly need to stop releasing more 4 man dungeons and invest time in to solo, duo or 6man at this point to mix the game up with proper group finder support.

karekiz

Don't see much of a point really. Seems like a lot of work and even more ques for no reason. You can't have Normal/vet 4/ Normal/vet 6 team ques and expect it to work out. You can maybe get away with seperate DLC que, but then it would end up being 4 separate ques.

Newer players will be immediately confused. Where do I get good healer gear? Go que for vault of madness? Which Vault of madness? Vet will net you purple rings. Which vet should I que for 4 or 6?

frostz417

Tasear wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

Wait so you want to implement a 6 man dungeon for traditional 4 man dungeons just to make it easier?
Lmfao how about get good and acquire thumbs

Please read, because you did not understand.

Guarantee it’s going to end up as high end pve’ers doing a 1 tank 5 dd comp and absolutely melt everything.
3dd’s pulling around 50-60k already melts dungeons quickly I can’t imagone 5 dd’s in one. Sheeesh

Tasear

frostz417 wrote: »

Tasear wrote: »

frostz417 wrote: »

Wait so you want to implement a 6 man dungeon for traditional 4 man dungeons just to make it easier?
Lmfao how about get good and acquire thumbs

Please read, because you did not understand.

Guarantee it’s going to end up as high end pve’ers doing a 1 tank 5 dd comp and absolutely melt everything.
3dd’s pulling around 50-60k already melts dungeons quickly I can’t imagone 5 dd’s in one. Sheeesh

Sure that will be one way to do it but enough ambient damage it won't be worth it

Wyrd88

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

And maybe a new solo arena

No, thanks. We had enough of this Maelstrom garbage.

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

an arena for two people?

Yes, please. This would be awesome, actually.

MashmalloMan

Wyrd88 wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

And maybe a new solo arena

No, thanks. We had enough of this Maelstrom garbage.

Says you, in the past 4+ years thats the only solo, semi-challenging (now anyway) yet fun, rewarding content in the game and I'd love to see another one. There is nothing quite like that first clear.

I remember everyday being excited to try again at 300 cp and each time got easier and easier until I finally got a couple VMA bows in the right trait, before you could just transmute them.

Wyrd88 wrote: »

Ragnaroek93 wrote: »

an arena for two people?

Yes, please. This would be awesome, actually.

I'd take this over a new solo arena simply because we already have VMA, but nothing DUO related as of yet and they have a finite amount of resources for DLC. Stop releasing Dungeon DLC and focus on new arenas or 6 man mini trials/dungeons.