Besides stamwhip what offensive stam morph do stamdks need

ochsinator

I know plenty of other stam dks out there want more of an identity. Not that the stam dk can’t be good in both pvp and pve but let’s be real something is missing. Since for some reason the devs are completely against the stamwhip what skill do you think could be a useful offense damage dealing stamina morph skill? I think maybe flames of oblivion would be cool. I still think stone fist would be the best the stamina morph could loose the heal and and do more damage... idk let me know if you guys have any ideas

Silver_Strider

As someone that actually has the mythical unicorn that is a DK healer, I say hell no to turning my main burst heal into a Stamina Skill.

Giving up on Stamwhip is quitter talk. Fight for your toxic whip you spineless worms.

Draxys

Better passives

Ocelot9x

The morph you’re using is cauterize not Foo lol
Also,Im in for a stamina inhale with some cool other effect like putting off balance enemies hit by both first and second hit or damage scaling on enemies around

Onefrkncrzypope

I'm lf a burst skill. Spectral bow, potl, shalks, frags and DK ????

ochsinator

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

I'm lf a burst skill. Spectral bow, potl, shalks, frags and DK ????

Yeah I mean what if stone fist stam morph did increased damage with reduced range with no heal and no stun like 10k damage or so

Jjitsuboy98

Stone fist stam version. Inhale stam version. Whip stam version.

Onefrkncrzypope

ochsinator wrote: »

Onefrkncrzypope wrote: »

I'm lf a burst skill. Spectral bow, potl, shalks, frags and DK ????

Yeah I mean what if stone fist stam morph did increased damage with reduced range with no heal and no stun like 10k damage or so

Then what would be the burst heal for dk healer?

TrinityBreaker

Better passives and turning Stone fist in an Earth spike that shoots up from the ground to impale your enemy. Does 330% more damage to the target when below 25% health.

While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

Sleep724

Make molten armaments give empower to every light attack while active.

Draxys

TrinityBreaker wrote: »

Better passives and turning Stone fist in an Earth spike that shoots up from the ground to impale your enemy. Does 330% more damage to the target when below 25% health.

While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

Seriously, just delete stone fist. It’s literslly been trash for 5 years now.

And some of these passives are just stupid. “Increase the duration of ardent flame abilities by 2 seconds.” What? How about you just make them last that long to begin with, and actually come up with something useful. Zero players in the game skip those passives, so make them actually good.

perogwin_ESO

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

Make "Choking Talon Morph" poison damage and cost stamina

Make "Harden Armor Morph" cost Stamina

Make one of the "Fiery Grip" morphs stamina

Onefrkncrzypope

Draxys wrote: »

TrinityBreaker wrote: »

Better passives and turning Stone fist in an Earth spike that shoots up from the ground to impale your enemy. Does 330% more damage to the target when below 25% health.

While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

Seriously, just delete stone fist. It’s literslly been trash for 5 years now.

And some of these passives are just stupid. “Increase the duration of ardent flame abilities by 2 seconds.” What? How about you just make them last that long to begin with, and actually come up with something useful. Zero players in the game skip those passives, so make them actually good.

The duration means your claw ticks harder. As it gains damage over time. But ye our passives are sad. There is battle roar and that's it. The only exciting passive.

Masel

I know this might be an unpopular opinion, but I dont think stamwhip solve cores issues of a stam dk.

They already have ardent flame abilities (as bad as noxious breath might be, it definitelyneeds improvement), but they need an earthen heart ability to grant themselves and the group minor brutality. Stamwhip wont help with that at all.

So instead of stamwhip, I'd go with a morph of stone fist to change, stone giant.

It is barely used and could be improved onto something that helps stam dk have a little bit of identity.


It would have to have a fairly high base cost due to the stamina return in the passive, and it could make stamina dk focus on poison and the poisoned status effect. So maybe make it deal increased damage against poisoned targets and apply the poisoned status effect to targets that do not have it on yet. Just an idea that could help stamina dk get a little bit more identity as a poison based spec.

SaintSubwayy

perogwin_ESO wrote: »

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

Make "Choking Talon Morph" poison damage and cost stamina

Make "Harden Armor Morph" cost Stamina

Make one of the "Fiery Grip" morphs stamina

Dragonblood cjhange -> good, seems fair

Choking talons -> No dont get rid of more tankskills, its esential in PVE

Hardened armor -> ok, shiel dis useless anyways

Fiery Grip -> well meh, you can already use one moprh on stam, and get the magicka back if the target is unpullable. and you have silverleash now so you have a chain.

Gona add some things to the list:

Flames of oblivion -> Grants Empower to 3 LAs after the skill fired

Burning embers (Change) -> Heal change to heal for each tick it does, and not when it runs out, when purged heals instantly for 5k health, when it runs its full duration also heals for extra 5k upon last tick.

Engulfing and Nox Breath -> Increase Duration with 2 additional second, supporting sustain of DK's and also making the skills better to use on dps Chars

Combustion -> increase the ammount of resources restored from 500 to 600, increase chance to püroc poisoned statuseffect by 100%
(reason, compared to templar sustain this sustainoption is lacking very much. It requires you to have a target, then theres only a % chance to proc the statuseffect, and flat out dk gets less sustain from the passive then tamplar rune gives (rune 120mag/s) therefore a buff from 500 up to 600 seems fair)

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

. While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

My DK tanks says no. Not just no, but *** no.

@Masel making the most sense here. Keep it a range ablity, doing what you say there, to help bow/bow DK builds.

SaintSubwayy

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

. While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

My DK tanks says no. Not just no, but *** no.

@Masel making the most sense here. Keep it a range ablity, doing what you say there, to help bow/bow DK builds.

you mean for when the Snipenerf hits us hard?

cant w8 for the forums to go up in flames, when all those bow gankers show up here

TrinityBreaker

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

. While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

My DK tanks says no. Not just no, but *** no.

@Masel making the most sense here. Keep it a range ablity, doing what you say there, to help bow/bow DK builds.

Feels bad. My stam DK dd won't be getting anything and will continue be the way he is, f u c k i n g garbage.

Checkmath

SaintSubwayy wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

. While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

My DK tanks says no. Not just no, but *** no.

@Masel making the most sense here. Keep it a range ablity, doing what you say there, to help bow/bow DK builds.

you mean for when the Snipenerf hits us hard?

cant w8 for the forums to go up in flames, when all those bow gankers show up here

[edited to remove naming and shaming]

No stamina dragon blood pls, stamdks already have enough healing.

Talons is a tank skill and should stay as is. Roots on stamina chars in PvP is not a healthy idea.

Hardened armor...well do with it what you want, the shield size is pathetic anyway.

Burning ambers should stay as is and not heal over time. It would take away one of the core fucntions of magdk in PvP to get an emergency-like heal option, if played tactically. The current situation is healthy for skilled gameplay, making the heal over time would dumb down the skill. In PvE such a change would make sense to boost the dks survivability, but will not change the state of magdks not being welcomed in end content. They are not a ranged class and melee spots are better handed over to stam chars. For magicka characters, you got a similar heal over time effect as magicka nb, which makes that class more favored anyway due to the ranged abilities.

juhislihis19

perogwin_ESO wrote: »

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

Make "Choking Talon Morph" poison damage and cost stamina

Make "Harden Armor Morph" cost Stamina

Make one of the "Fiery Grip" morphs stamina

Hear hear!

I find it odd that, when you think of NECROmancer, you would think it's magicka based class. Well they are and they still have at least 5 stamina morphs (not counting ultimates).

And then you have DragonKNIGHT, and you would think they'd have many stamina morphs. And yet, they only have 2!


1) There's no stamina based AOE skill
2) There's no stamina based spam skill
3) No passives to benefit slotting class skills (health recovery is a joke)
4) There's no stamina heal (this isn't my number 1 concern though)
5) The sustain is based on using expensive magicka skills and improbable proc passives and ultimates. Ie:

Warden - flat 12% stamina recovery for slotted skill + Major Endurance from Falcon + free stamina Netch
Nightblade - flat 15% stamina recovery, Minor Endurance from Relentless Focus + stamina restore from Siphoning
Sorcerer - flat 20% stam rec from slotted skill + little stamina skill cost reduction
Templar - stamina skill cost reduction, Minor Endurance from Radiant Aura + stamina restore

DK - stamina restore when status effect procs + casting magicka Earthen Heart skills + when using ultimates. Also Major Endurance from GDB, but it is a terrible for PVP and nobody uses it there.

110 ultimate Leap will restore 2530 stamina and magicka. To gather that amount will take about, 15-20 seconds? This would then equal to 168-125 stam per second.

I would either remove Major Endurance from GDB and place it in to more meaningful skill. Or add ie. Minor Endurance to Volatile Armor and make it a stamina morph. Or make GDB a stamina based heal and buff it a little bit so maybe someone would actually use it.

World in Ruin passive also needs rework. Just remove the AOE cap.

SaintSubwayy

Checkmath wrote: »

SaintSubwayy wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

. While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

My DK tanks says no. Not just no, but *** no.

@Masel making the most sense here. Keep it a range ablity, doing what you say there, to help bow/bow DK builds.

you mean for when the Snipenerf hits us hard?

cant w8 for the forums to go up in flames, when all those bow gankers show up here

[edited]

No stamina dragon blood pls, stamdks already have enough healing.

Talons is a tank skill and should stay as is. Roots on stamina chars in PvP is not a healthy idea.

Hardened armor...well do with it what you want, the shield size is pathetic anyway.

Burning ambers should stay as is and not heal over time. It would take away one of the core fucntions of magdk in PvP to get an emergency-like heal option, if played tactically. The current situation is healthy for skilled gameplay, making the heal over time would dumb down the skill. In PvE such a change would make sense to boost the dks survivability, but will not change the state of magdks not being welcomed in end content. They are not a ranged class and melee spots are better handed over to stam chars. For magicka characters, you got a similar heal over time effect as magicka nb, which makes that class more favored anyway due to the ranged abilities.

the problem about DK beeing welcome or not is a whole other problem, which ofc needs to be adressed, especially since the dunmer gutting of the synergy to magDK. We lost even more towards stamNB or other stamchars in meelespots

About the Embers Idea I proposed, you would still have the Emergency heal in PVP, but with the constant healing from the Ticks you wont need it as much, since you are already countering the inc dmg, and those 5k can OFC be adjusted to a healthy lvl on PVP. It would still require some skill to be able to keep it up and proc it when needed, but it would also add to PVEs magDK survivability

To make a completly ridic example (with real numbers)...I healed in vCR+2 with Emberproc 98k health in 1 Cast...98 frkin K, where should I go with all this healin , its 400-500% OVERHEAL, even with the strong healdebuff from the Boss in execute you can heal up with 1 Skill if you time it correctly, thats jsut completly bonkers sorry.

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

TrinityBreaker wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

. While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

My DK tanks says no. Not just no, but *** no.

@Masel making the most sense here. Keep it a range ablity, doing what you say there, to help bow/bow DK builds.

Feels bad. My stam DK dd won't be getting anything and will continue be the way he is, f u c k i n g garbage.

You can't take the second best percentage based heal in the game away from tanks. You would get a spammable that gives you Stam back and procs minor brutality if masels suggestion is taken seriously.

psychotic13

I play stamDK and stamsorc, and stamsorc is definitely in need of a buff before DK, DK isnt bad to be honest.

Alucardo

Silver_Strider wrote: »

Giving up on Stamwhip is quitter talk. Fight for your toxic whip you spineless worms.

I remember ZOS saying this will never be on the table. Having said that, this was when Wrobel was in charge of combat design, so who knows. But still, I wouldn't count on it. Flame Lash is obviously the go-to morph for PvP, and Molten Whip for PvE. You can't add a stam whip without upsetting mdks, so it's really not an option.

TrinityBreaker

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

TrinityBreaker wrote: »

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

. While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

My DK tanks says no. Not just no, but *** no.

@Masel making the most sense here. Keep it a range ablity, doing what you say there, to help bow/bow DK builds.

Feels bad. My stam DK dd won't be getting anything and will continue be the way he is, f u c k i n g garbage.

You can't take the second best percentage based heal in the game away from tanks. You would get a spammable that gives you Stam back and procs minor brutality if masels suggestion is taken seriously.

I see what you mean, I really do. I also want you to understand that I truly love Stamnina DragonKnight. I'm just tired of the fact that as a class, its trash and an absolute pain in the ass to play. Been playing this since it released on console and just want to see this variation of DK be fun to play and not a dizzying swing Dawnie/Take Flight spammer.

BoiledEgg

- give inhale a stam morph ( it synergizes really good with take flight and reverse slice )

- make stone giant a stam morph and make it either a melee or ranged cc ( kinda like binding javelin ) since no one uses this
morph ( destructive reach/clench is better )

- make wrecking blow an instant cast and reduce the dmg so we have a nice spammable (this also helps stamsorc and brings
more variety to other classes and maybe helps 2h in pve aswell )

JinMori

For flames of oblivion and standard of might they can just change the scaling based on your resources, if you have more stamina, poison damage, if you have more mag, keep it fire, no need to remove abilities from healers.

JinMori

Alucardo wrote: »

Silver_Strider wrote: »

Giving up on Stamwhip is quitter talk. Fight for your toxic whip you spineless worms.

I remember ZOS saying this will never be on the table. Having said that, this was when Wrobel was in charge of combat design, so who knows. But still, I wouldn't count on it. Flame Lash is obviously the go-to morph for PvP, and Molten Whip for PvE. You can't add a stam whip without upsetting mdks, so it's really not an option.

Again, make it so molten whip scales from your highest resources, they are changing it anyway next patch.

The best thing to do would be to make a third morph option shared between the first 2 morphs, this would basically remove any problems with stamina abilities, and add new things this is a general statement, not talking specifically about whip only.

Browiseth

why is stamwhip needed?

there's already a few weapon abilities that fill the role of a stam spammable. Flurry, hidden blade, snipe, uppercut...

Why not work on making those abilities more viable instead?

John_Falstaff

Browiseth wrote: »

why is stamwhip needed?

there's already a few weapon abilities that fill the role of a stam spammable. Flurry, hidden blade, snipe, uppercut...

Why not work on making those abilities more viable instead?

Those skills do have own problems; and while yes, they can be buffed, it doesn't make sDK any better - it's about having (or not having) a feel of playing unique class. sDK is a bland, generic brawler with one and a half stamina abilities (one in practice - when Fracture is provided, Noxious can be safely unslotted), without any special twist to damage dealing (no special proc effects that make rotation engaging, no spammable, burst, execute...). I don't think that stamina spammable would address the overly bad class design, but have to start somewhere.

Toc de Malsvi

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Turn "Green Dragon Blood Morph" into a Stamina Version of "Coagulate Blood Morph"

. While we're at it, make GDB scale off max stam and weapon damage too.

My DK tanks says no. Not just no, but *** no.

@Masel making the most sense here. Keep it a range ablity, doing what you say there, to help bow/bow DK builds.

Good looking out bro.

But seriously Bow builds aside, DK's need more ranged support in general not less. They do not need to further invest into melee only skills as they are already strong in melee. Further melee boost only makes their package more specialized and less adaptable.