ZOS - report a player....

DaveMoeDee

I suppose there would be nothing wrong with some stats about players banned for how they acted in chat, so long as the numbers are presented in a way that didn't single anyone out.

On the other hand, there is no reason why we should know the result of our ticket.

The best reason to report players is so that there is a record of their behavior. If a player continually make gameplay unpleasant for others, it is in ZOS' best interest to remove them.

I don't know why some people try to make this an issue of "you need to be tougher." People play the game to enjoy themselves. I'm not physically or emotionally injured when two people are yelling at each other on the subway, but it is an unpleasant experience. If I am about to enter a car where that is happening, I will go to the next car. ZOS doesn't want people going to the next game. There are TOS for a reason. They want the game to be enjoyable for people. Not wanting to be in environments full of high drama, emotionally immature individuals does not make a person weak.

If someone values the game and finds a toxic individual violating the TOS, it makes sense to report them. ZOS can warn the person and hopefully the toxic person learns to put on the facade of being a decent human being.

DaveMoeDee

Shantu wrote: »

While I agree this type of behavior is abhorrent (and even a bannable offense), I wouldn't invest much time getting upset with ZOS. I used to report this type of nonsense, but it's endless. Personally, I just make a statement that what's happening is unacceptable, block, and immediately leave. I would not have done anything with that group after the very first insult. Let THEM endure the consequences of their behavior.

To say "don't pug and only run with guild members" is getting to be a cliche, but it does solve 99% of the problem.

I'll do quick reports and not care about outcome. Reporting a player is pretty easy. ZOS can decide the merit of the report.

I haven't found it so bad on PC/NA. One of my guilds is one I was invited to after pugging. I've had many very excellent PUG experiences, though they are mostly all pugging random vets or pledges.

I have been leveling characters lately in random normals and groups are pretty much always pleasant.

In general, I'm not going to stick around with anyone unpleasant. I just don't see the value in it during something I do to relax. There is plenty of stress at work and with other obligations.

bzz86

@DaveMoeDee perfectly summarized. Two good posts. Thank you.

VaranisArano

Just a reminder, these are the relevant portions of the TOS and the Code of Conduct we're talking about people breaking.

Code of Conduct: https://account.elderscrollsonline.com/code-of-conduct
Pretty much the entire "Behavior" section, but specifically:

2.5 You may not harass, threaten, embarrass, or cause distress to another customer or guest using ZeniMax sites and Services. This includes but is not limited to verbal attacks, unwanted messaging, personal attacks, stalking or any other undesired behavior used to cause discomfort or disrupt another customer's experience. At all times users will refrain from attacking Age, Race, Disability, Sexual Orientation, National Origin, Pregnancy, Gender or any other protected category under Federal or Maryland State law.


Terms of Service: https://account.elderscrollsonline.com/terms-of-service#_EN_Toc_08
Section 8 Rules of Conduct

Particularly:

You agree not to use any Service to:

• Harass, stalk, threaten, embarrass, spam or do anything else to another user of any Services that is unwanted, such as repeatedly sending unwanted messages or making personal attacks or statements about race, sexual orientation, religion, heritage, etc.;
• Take any action, organize, transmit any Content, effectuate or participate in any activity, group, or guild that is harmful, tortuous, abusive, hateful (including "hate speech"), racially, ethnically, religiously or otherwise offensive, obscene, threatening, bullying, vulgar, sexually explicit, defamatory, libelous, infringing, invasive of personal privacy or publicity rights, encourages conduct that would violate a law or is, in a reasonable person's view, objectionable and/or deemed to be in the sole discretion of ZeniMax inappropriate;

Vonbone

I only have two things to say. Words are only words, a person is the one that gives them meaning and trolls will be trolls.

bzz86

Vonbone wrote: »

I only have two things to say. Words are only words, a person is the one that gives them meaning and trolls will be trolls.

yes. But when you say "I love you", "I miss you" or "I believe in you"... these are only words as well yet you believe when your partner or you kids say them, or mean them when you say it to them.

Suddwrath

"Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me" may sound like like a nice rhyme, but it is false. Words carry significance, meaning, and in some cases power. That is a fact. Simply look at the relationships between bullying/cyberbullying and suicide.

Rather than focusing on telling people to "get over it" and "grow thicker skin" what we need to be focusing on is stopping those who are making those negative comments and dealing with the problem at the source. This whole blaming the victim mentality needs to stop.

Beardimus

Ironic that a thread about player behaviour has players come to it and behave inappropriately enough for moderation.

Honnestly lose faith in people fast these days. Wow.

russelmmendoza

Zos should definitely change their policy on people like this.
If you have proof of their wrong doing and can prove that you didnt started the incident, a 24hr ban should be implemented, and zos should notify you that the offender had been dealth with.
If it was irl done to me, I would be in jail because I broke someone's face already.

Genomic

SaltySudd wrote: »

"Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me" may sound like like a nice rhyme, but it is false. Words carry significance, meaning, and in some cases power. That is a fact. Simply look at the relationships between bullying/cyberbullying and suicide.

Rather than focusing on telling people to "get over it" and "grow thicker skin" what we need to be focusing on is stopping those who are making those negative comments and dealing with the problem at the source. This whole blaming the victim mentality needs to stop.

It seems clear to me that it's not a binary proposition - grow a thicker skin vs trying to reduce bullying - but instead that both of these things are important. Life can be the worst bully of all at times. It can throw cancer, divorce, accidents, etc at you and it cares not a whit. If you have little resilience then life itself will crush you. If you indulge in a victim mentality it will crush you. At the same time, of course we should strive to be kinder, more respectful, better people and efforts should still be made to reduce bullying and other harmful behaviours. The really interesting thing is both bullying and indulging in victimhood fall under the umbrella of harmful behaviours.

VaranisArano

Genomic wrote: »

SaltySudd wrote: »

"Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me" may sound like like a nice rhyme, but it is false. Words carry significance, meaning, and in some cases power. That is a fact. Simply look at the relationships between bullying/cyberbullying and suicide.

Rather than focusing on telling people to "get over it" and "grow thicker skin" what we need to be focusing on is stopping those who are making those negative comments and dealing with the problem at the source. This whole blaming the victim mentality needs to stop.

It seems clear to me that it's not a binary proposition - grow a thicker skin vs trying to reduce bullying - but instead that both of these things are important. Life can be the worst bully of all at times. It can throw cancer, divorce, accidents, etc at you and it cares not a whit. If you have little resilience then life itself will crush you. If you indulge in a victim mentality it will crush you. At the same time, of course we should strive to be kinder, more respectful, better people and efforts should still be made to reduce bullying and other harmful behaviours. The really interesting thing is both bullying and indulging in victimhood fall under the umbrella of harmful behaviours.

Seems to me that it is a binary proposition. One of those behaviors is against the TOS we all signed. The other one isn't.

Aurayna

!

West1389 wrote: »

Back on topic dont be a baby, mean word wont hurt you. Dont run and cry everytime this happens. Zos has more important things to do, like fix the bugs.

Just the attitude NOT needed. ZOS has a duty of care to it's players





You know what would be good .. A displayed list of appropriate actions ZOS will take to punish offenders for whatever offence
.
Then at least players would feel their complaint is being taken seriously

Non-disclosure about players data and what actions have been taken is all very well but what about the player's right when they are subjected to harassment etc. ?

For all we know ZOS might simply discard complaints without any kind of redress

stewhead2ub17_ESO

Everybody grow up.

abzdeman

Nothing happens just give it back to them!!

NordSwordnBoard

In game moderators, however rare or sporadic, would have a positive ripple effect on all this.

The added benefit is if you see a Mod in zone or chat, and then a miscreant is suddenly silenced - you may even witness it or get the confirmation ZOS won't give otherwise about punishment. Word would spread far & wide.

Zone chat garbage really doesn't bother me; it boils down to TOS being enforced by the consumer instead of the proprietor and how well that works.

Savos_Saren

To quote from the Dali Lama:

"We often add to our pain and suffering by being overly sensitive, over-reacting to minor things, and sometimes taking things too personally."

Just put the offensive person on ignore and report them. Seeking out a harsher punishment to the offender is a little petty of you.

You are playing a video game... and one of the main goals is to kill things to achieve goals. You're obviously going to run into people who feed off of violence and controversy. Maybe it was a kid that needs to grow up. But part of growing up is getting thicker skin, too...

luizpaulom17

At least most of you are lucky of not being Latin Amrican... I dont mind people being toxic or swearing at me on chat but it really gets to me when they simply tell me to go back to my "*** Hole Country"... Along with other stupid insults, such as "I dont speak takos"... Im brazilian and have a common latin american name, but trolls simply assume Im some sort of iligal mexican imigrant or whatever... I have reported, I have prints, still both times I reported I just received the very same automatic email from Zos... Now I just log off when it happens... I dont really mind when its just regular hate mail, cause Im a 26 years old man, so 14 years old kids swearing at me its just something I laugh about.

bzz86

Could we get something from ZOS regarding topic please ? can anyone tag someone appropriate ?

stewhead2ub17_ESO

bzz86 wrote: »

Could we get something from ZOS regarding topic please ? can anyone tag someone appropriate ?

Let it go. ZOS policy is they don't discuss any disciplinary action taken. What do you want a mod to say to you other than that?

bzz86

stewhead2ub17_ESO wrote: »

bzz86 wrote: »

Could we get something from ZOS regarding topic please ? can anyone tag someone appropriate ?

Let it go. ZOS policy is they don't discuss any disciplinary action taken. What do you want a mod to say to you other than that?

Well if you would read the entire discussion maybe you would understand. What I would like to know is a stand point of ZOS regarding the transparency of what happens with players reported. @DaveMoeDee had a very good two posts about it.

I get that a lot of people cannot care less. But some people do. The behavior in game should not just be let alone like that. Cause while this one person might insult you or me and as grown people we cannot care less, there will always be a poor teenager or a child that will take it to heart. People don't even bother reporting cause they feel like it does nothing or they are like 'I have a thick skin and this does nothing to me'..... I believe that this should not be the case and people that miss-behave should be reported and punished. Everybody has a bad day but a bad year is to much.

stewhead2ub17_ESO

bzz86 wrote: »

stewhead2ub17_ESO wrote: »

bzz86 wrote: »

Could we get something from ZOS regarding topic please ? can anyone tag someone appropriate ?

Let it go. ZOS policy is they don't discuss any disciplinary action taken. What do you want a mod to say to you other than that?

Well if you would read the entire discussion maybe you would understand. What I would like to know is a stand point of ZOS regarding the transparency of what happens with players reported. @DaveMoeDee had a very good two posts about it.

I get that a lot of people cannot care less. But some people do. The behavior in game should not just be let alone like that. Cause while this one person might insult you or me and as grown people we cannot care less, there will always be a poor teenager or a child that will take it to heart. People don't even bother reporting cause they feel like it does nothing or they are like 'I have a thick skin and this does nothing to me'..... I believe that this should not be the case and people that miss-behave should be reported and punished. Everybody has a bad day but a bad year is to much.

I read your post. But again, what more do you want said? It is their policy not to discuss disciplinary issues. That's it. Not sure what more "transparency" you're looking for. And not for nothing, but as per your incident, we are only getting your side of the story, where you did nothing wrong. Insults are often subjective. What you may feel is punishable, others may not. As for teenagers and children, this game is rated "M" for mature, with many adult themes, so as a parent I would be cognizant of my child communicating with anyone in game.

bzz86

stewhead2ub17_ESO wrote: »

bzz86 wrote: »

stewhead2ub17_ESO wrote: »

bzz86 wrote: »

Could we get something from ZOS regarding topic please ? can anyone tag someone appropriate ?

Let it go. ZOS policy is they don't discuss any disciplinary action taken. What do you want a mod to say to you other than that?

Well if you would read the entire discussion maybe you would understand. What I would like to know is a stand point of ZOS regarding the transparency of what happens with players reported. @DaveMoeDee had a very good two posts about it.

I get that a lot of people cannot care less. But some people do. The behavior in game should not just be let alone like that. Cause while this one person might insult you or me and as grown people we cannot care less, there will always be a poor teenager or a child that will take it to heart. People don't even bother reporting cause they feel like it does nothing or they are like 'I have a thick skin and this does nothing to me'..... I believe that this should not be the case and people that miss-behave should be reported and punished. Everybody has a bad day but a bad year is to much.

I read your post. But again, what more do you want said? It is their policy not to discuss disciplinary issues. That's it. Not sure what more "transparency" you're looking for. And not for nothing, but as per your incident, we are only getting your side of the story, where you did nothing wrong. Insults are often subjective. What you may feel is punishable, others may not. As for teenagers and children, this game is rated "M" for mature, with many adult themes, so as a parent I would be cognizant of my child communicating with anyone in game.

Ah, and you believe that kids do not play it? When you have been younger did the little box at the bottom that said 'I am at least 18' ever stopped you ? You would have read the entire conversation you would understand that I am not asking about detailed punishment to one single person but how does ZOS handle it. What are the generic statistics? Do people actually get punished or does 'report a player' serve as a button to shut people up.

My story is just one of many. I am sure you had situations where you have been insulted by someone with no apparent reason. Everybody that playes this game significant amount of time did get that at least once. What I do not want is for people to stop reporting "cause they have thick skin"..... People that play this game to move their aggressive or abusive behavior onto another player should be held responsible and at least banned.

jainiadral

bzz86 wrote: »

West1389 wrote: »

Ahhh looks like they deleted comments now cant reply back to some.

Verbal assult is when I say it gonna hurt or do something to you. Come on people use your head. You sound dumb when you talk and try to make things up. I can say what I want as long as not a threat to hurt you, or fire in building stuff like that. You try to get that gotcha moment when you look dumb.

This is sad looking at. Feels a little like the education system has failed you. You are still off-topic and don't even do any research to support your replies. Posts were removed due to the course you have taken the discussion in.

Random American insert: Political education isn't exactly a priority here. My high school government teacher was our football coach

It's not surprising that most of us don't know the difference between public space and private communities. You'd think we'd start to get it once we begin interacting with, well, anything. Including private gaming communtities hosted and run by American companies.

Anyway, after reading a lot of the more egregious instances here, ignoring doesn't seem to work. I'm starting to think reporting early and reporting often might be the best tactic. Maybe ZOS will have to step up its game.

stewhead2ub17_ESO

*shakes his head and waves goodbye to this thread*

bzz86

jainiadral wrote: »

bzz86 wrote: »

West1389 wrote: »

Ahhh looks like they deleted comments now cant reply back to some.

Verbal assult is when I say it gonna hurt or do something to you. Come on people use your head. You sound dumb when you talk and try to make things up. I can say what I want as long as not a threat to hurt you, or fire in building stuff like that. You try to get that gotcha moment when you look dumb.

This is sad looking at. Feels a little like the education system has failed you. You are still off-topic and don't even do any research to support your replies. Posts were removed due to the course you have taken the discussion in.

Random American insert: Political education isn't exactly a priority here. My high school government teacher was our football coach

It's not surprising that most of us don't know the difference between public space and private communities. You'd think we'd start to get it once we begin interacting with, well, anything. Including private gaming communtities hosted and run by American companies.

Anyway, after reading a lot of the more egregious instances here, ignoring doesn't seem to work. I'm starting to think reporting early and reporting often might be the best tactic. Maybe ZOS will have to step up its game.

You should have seen the rest of comments that were removed by moderator.

Kalante

Ill never understand these easily offended types. Ive played video games for almost the past 13 years since the psp and no matter were I went whether it was need for speed most wanted, resistance fall of man, MAG, Dust 514, cod4, cod mw2, cod mw3, cod bo1, ESO. There was always someone or a group people that talks massive ****t and you know what I did? I talked **** back and then I ignored them, forget about it next ten minutes or so and the next day I wouldn't even remember what happened that day. That is when you become a seasoned gamer.

Banana

Dont do anymore group activities solved it for me

Lloydmp

Don’t aggro the boss, let them die and t-bag them until you die. Repeat until you are kicked or they leave.

It’s funny, relives stress and those kinds of people normally can’t stand it.

Genomic

VaranisArano wrote: »

Genomic wrote: »

SaltySudd wrote: »

"Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me" may sound like like a nice rhyme, but it is false. Words carry significance, meaning, and in some cases power. That is a fact. Simply look at the relationships between bullying/cyberbullying and suicide.

Rather than focusing on telling people to "get over it" and "grow thicker skin" what we need to be focusing on is stopping those who are making those negative comments and dealing with the problem at the source. This whole blaming the victim mentality needs to stop.

It seems clear to me that it's not a binary proposition - grow a thicker skin vs trying to reduce bullying - but instead that both of these things are important. Life can be the worst bully of all at times. It can throw cancer, divorce, accidents, etc at you and it cares not a whit. If you have little resilience then life itself will crush you. If you indulge in a victim mentality it will crush you. At the same time, of course we should strive to be kinder, more respectful, better people and efforts should still be made to reduce bullying and other harmful behaviours. The really interesting thing is both bullying and indulging in victimhood fall under the umbrella of harmful behaviours.

Seems to me that it is a binary proposition. One of those behaviors is against the TOS we all signed. The other one isn't.

Which makes zero difference if the TOS is not enforced. Without ZOS enforcing it, the TOS is just empty words on a page.

VaranisArano

Genomic wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

Genomic wrote: »

SaltySudd wrote: »

"Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me" may sound like like a nice rhyme, but it is false. Words carry significance, meaning, and in some cases power. That is a fact. Simply look at the relationships between bullying/cyberbullying and suicide.

Rather than focusing on telling people to "get over it" and "grow thicker skin" what we need to be focusing on is stopping those who are making those negative comments and dealing with the problem at the source. This whole blaming the victim mentality needs to stop.

It seems clear to me that it's not a binary proposition - grow a thicker skin vs trying to reduce bullying - but instead that both of these things are important. Life can be the worst bully of all at times. It can throw cancer, divorce, accidents, etc at you and it cares not a whit. If you have little resilience then life itself will crush you. If you indulge in a victim mentality it will crush you. At the same time, of course we should strive to be kinder, more respectful, better people and efforts should still be made to reduce bullying and other harmful behaviours. The really interesting thing is both bullying and indulging in victimhood fall under the umbrella of harmful behaviours.

Seems to me that it is a binary proposition. One of those behaviors is against the TOS we all signed. The other one isn't.

Which makes zero difference if the TOS is not enforced. Without ZOS enforcing it, the TOS is just empty words on a page.

And given ZOS' stance on privacy, how are you ever going to know if its enforced?

You won't. That's as much protection for you as it is the other player. ZOS isnt going to change that.

So we report when people break the TOS and hope ZOS holds them accountable for breaking the rules.

Or we don't, and no one holds them accountable for breaking the rules, guaranteed.

See, I'm not interested in dicussing bullying vs victimhood or whether people should have a thicker skin. Those are red herrings when discussing whether or not to report behavior.

My thought is more straightforward: Is this behavior against the TOS? Yes/No

If yes, I'll report it with whatever evidence I have and let ZOS sort it out. If they do nothing with the report, not my problem. Unless I see the behavior again, in which case there will be another report, with the original report referenced.