Reduce Lich cooldown

KhajiitFelix

ZOS, can you reduce cooldown of this set?

(2 items) Adds 129 Magicka Recovery
(3 items) Adds 1096 Maximum Magicka
(4 items) Adds 129 Magicka Recovery
(5 items) When you cast an ability while under 33% Magicka, your Magicka Recovery is increased by 1032 for 20 seconds. This effect can occur once every 1 minute.

This set is nice, but I think making its cooldown 30-40 seconds would make much more viable choice on low sustain classes like MagDK and MagSorc. 1 minute for a pure sustain set with no damage increase is too much imo.

SaintSubwayy

sorry but the Lich set is fine as it is now...its used in PVP on healers, on their backbar, so they can proc it, and swap away

in PVE, where you run a vMA weapon on the back bar, this set isnt really a viable option.
If you have problems sustaining in PVE, make sure to use a absorb glyph on a staff, and run regfood like withcmothers
If that aint enough, take a jelwerypiece with reg enchant

KhajiitFelix

SaintSubwayy wrote: »

sorry but the Lich set is fine as it is now...its used in PVP on healers, on their backbar, so they can proc it, and swap away

in PVE, where you run a vMA weapon on the back bar, this set isnt really a viable option.
If you have problems sustaining in PVE, make sure to use a absorb glyph on a staff, and run regfood like withcmothers
If that aint enough, take a jelwerypiece with reg enchant

Who said that I will run it backbar, and that I have vMA staff?

Trancestor

That would be OP. It's good as it is now.

WrathOfInnos

It averages 344 Magicka recovery. Seems balanced to me, especially since you lose almost nothing running it in a single bar.

I do agree that Mag Sorc and Mag DK need better sustain, but that should be handled through their class skills, not an armor set.

Minalan

Lich is fine, if it's not enough for you then race change to Breton next patch

WrathOfInnos

Minalan wrote: »

Lich is fine, if it's not enough for you then race change to Breton next patch

Or go Breton Sorcerer with Seducer and Alteration for 40% Magicka Cost reduction.

KhajiitFelix

Trancestor wrote: »

That would be OP. It's good as it is now.

So sorc with good sustain is OP? With that logic magnb is OP because magnb has infinite sustain.

Koolio

Considering the easy condition I think it’s fine.

Do a Magic return per minute basis on all recovery sets then check the actual requirements. Most sets are right around each other as far as sustain. Others cant really be used back bar.

Just for rough numbers (depends on actual build)

This is on a per minute basis

Amberplasm
8k Mag and Stam

Bloodthorn
7500 mag and stam(can proc while blocking)

Magicka Furnace
16k Magic per min

Desert Rose
36k Magic per minute

Syrabane Grip
56k Magic per minute

Lich
12-14k Magic per minute

But the conditions for the other sets that give more per minute won’t normally be 100% uptime. Like desert in medium combat situations is probably closer to the 20k mark but you have to take damage. So it doesn’t really fit a Magplar because you cleanse your 5th pc off.

I think they are in a good spot except Lich requires you to spend magic (it didn’t before)

Wuuffyy

Koolio wrote: »

Considering the easy condition I think it’s fine.

Do a Magic return per minute basis on all recovery sets then check the actual requirements. Most sets are right around each other as far as sustain. Others cant really be used back bar.

Just for rough numbers (depends on actual build)

This is on a per minute basis

Amberplasm
8k Mag and Stam

Bloodthorn
7500 mag and stam(can proc while blocking)

Magicka Furnace
16k Magic per min

Desert Rose
36k Magic per minute

Syrabane Grip
56k Magic per minute

Lich
12-14k Magic per minute

But the conditions for the other sets that give more per minute won’t normally be 100% uptime. Like desert in medium combat situations is probably closer to the 20k mark but you have to take damage. So it doesn’t really fit a Magplar because you cleanse your 5th pc off.

I think they are in a good spot except Lich requires you to spend magic (it didn’t before)

Lich op plz nerf

Trancestor

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

That would be OP. It's good as it is now.

So sorc with good sustain is OP? With that logic magnb is OP because magnb has infinite sustain.

How does magnb have infinite sustain?

KhajiitFelix

Trancestor wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

That would be OP. It's good as it is now.

So sorc with good sustain is OP? With that logic magnb is OP because magnb has infinite sustain.

How does magnb have infinite sustain?

Play magnb, you will see.

md3788

How many things are you going to try and fix in one day?

KhajiitFelix

md3788 wrote: »

How many things are you going to try and fix in one day?

Can? Probably none. Want to? Ohh... Like a lot.

Koolio

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

That would be OP. It's good as it is now.

So sorc with good sustain is OP? With that logic magnb is OP because magnb has infinite sustain.

How does magnb have infinite sustain?

Play magnb, you will see.

I’ve got 1 5 star already (no bomb) and working on number 2 now.

In Melee you need a minimum of around 2200 base recovery to even fight a moderate player 1v1. Not ganking.

Argonian Stam DK I feel comfortable in my set up with 1k Stam regen

KhajiitFelix

Koolio wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

That would be OP. It's good as it is now.

So sorc with good sustain is OP? With that logic magnb is OP because magnb has infinite sustain.

How does magnb have infinite sustain?

Play magnb, you will see.

I’ve got 1 5 star already (no bomb) and working on number 2 now.

In Melee you need a minimum of around 2200 base recovery to even fight a moderate player 1v1. Not ganking.

Argonian Stam DK I feel comfortable in my set up with 1k Stam regen

Oh so you are a PvPer, that explains everything.

Nerftheforums

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Koolio wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

That would be OP. It's good as it is now.

So sorc with good sustain is OP? With that logic magnb is OP because magnb has infinite sustain.

How does magnb have infinite sustain?

Play magnb, you will see.

I’ve got 1 5 star already (no bomb) and working on number 2 now.

In Melee you need a minimum of around 2200 base recovery to even fight a moderate player 1v1. Not ganking.

Argonian Stam DK I feel comfortable in my set up with 1k Stam regen

Oh so you are a PvPer, that explains everything.

And you would use lich in pve? Oh mother of goats. You need to learn A LOT boi. Like, seriously a lot.

Minalan

I wouldn't nerf lich, since you really have to dig into your Magicka to proc the fifth piece bonus to begin with.

Most of the time you're not benefitting from it (i.e. I mean it's not actively doing anything at all). It's just there when you need it and it helps.

KhajiitFelix

Nerftheforums wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Koolio wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

That would be OP. It's good as it is now.

So sorc with good sustain is OP? With that logic magnb is OP because magnb has infinite sustain.

How does magnb have infinite sustain?

Play magnb, you will see.

I’ve got 1 5 star already (no bomb) and working on number 2 now.

In Melee you need a minimum of around 2200 base recovery to even fight a moderate player 1v1. Not ganking.

Argonian Stam DK I feel comfortable in my set up with 1k Stam regen

Oh so you are a PvPer, that explains everything.

And you would use lich in pve? Oh mother of goats. You need to learn A LOT boi. Like, seriously a lot.

So you are telling me that we should have only 2 viable sets for magicka builds in PvE? [edit]

[edited for baiting]

Checkmath

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Nerftheforums wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Koolio wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Trancestor wrote: »

That would be OP. It's good as it is now.

So sorc with good sustain is OP? With that logic magnb is OP because magnb has infinite sustain.

How does magnb have infinite sustain?

Play magnb, you will see.

I’ve got 1 5 star already (no bomb) and working on number 2 now.

In Melee you need a minimum of around 2200 base recovery to even fight a moderate player 1v1. Not ganking.

Argonian Stam DK I feel comfortable in my set up with 1k Stam regen

Oh so you are a PvPer, that explains everything.

And you would use lich in pve? Oh mother of goats. You need to learn A LOT boi. Like, seriously a lot.

So you are telling me that we should have only 2 viable sets for magicka builds in PvE? This is how you detect a PvPeasant.

Using lich in PvE would be a great damage loss for damage dealers, since you sacrifice too many damage values of others sets like crit, spelldamage or minor slayer. If you can not sustain in PvE, just use witchmother's ptent brew, which is a loss of ca. 1k magicka and you retain all your damage oriented set boni. Another possibility is to run absorb magicka glyph. Going with these two possibilities is the way to go for damage dealers, if they need additional sustain. Lich is just a waste damage wise. You would have more benefits running moondancer in that case for either the sweet recovery or damage and the damage oriented stats.

Similar issues for PvE healer. Right they need good sustain, but are expected to use support sets. Lich will not fit into such a healer build. Also healers can reach immense recovery just through bufffood and recovery glyphs.

So basically: Lich is a PvP sustain set for classes without mistform (since it shuts down your whole recovery). On light armor builds, you will get much more regen than the set actually tells you due to all your regen passives from races (still), class and light armor. So depending on build its more like 1.5k mag regen, which is around 15k magicka per minute.

Juhasow

Koolio wrote: »

Considering the easy condition I think it’s fine.

Do a Magic return per minute basis on all recovery sets then check the actual requirements. Most sets are right around each other as far as sustain. Others cant really be used back bar.

Just for rough numbers (depends on actual build)

This is on a per minute basis

Amberplasm
8k Mag and Stam

Bloodthorn
7500 mag and stam(can proc while blocking)

Magicka Furnace
16k Magic per min

Desert Rose
36k Magic per minute

Syrabane Grip
56k Magic per minute

Lich
12-14k Magic per minute

But the conditions for the other sets that give more per minute won’t normally be 100% uptime. Like desert in medium combat situations is probably closer to the 20k mark but you have to take damage. So it doesn’t really fit a Magplar because you cleanse your 5th pc off.

I think they are in a good spot except Lich requires you to spend magic (it didn’t before)

You forgot about percentage bonuses. With them that 1032 can go up to over 1,6k regen. While it have perfectly controlable conditions to proc and gives user possibility to just one bar slot it so seems perfectly balanced.

Checkmath

Juhasow wrote: »

Koolio wrote: »

Considering the easy condition I think it’s fine.

Do a Magic return per minute basis on all recovery sets then check the actual requirements. Most sets are right around each other as far as sustain. Others cant really be used back bar.

Just for rough numbers (depends on actual build)

This is on a per minute basis

Amberplasm
8k Mag and Stam

Bloodthorn
7500 mag and stam(can proc while blocking)

Magicka Furnace
16k Magic per min

Desert Rose
36k Magic per minute

Syrabane Grip
56k Magic per minute

Lich
12-14k Magic per minute

But the conditions for the other sets that give more per minute won’t normally be 100% uptime. Like desert in medium combat situations is probably closer to the 20k mark but you have to take damage. So it doesn’t really fit a Magplar because you cleanse your 5th pc off.

I think they are in a good spot except Lich requires you to spend magic (it didn’t before)

You forgot about percentage bonuses.

Haha I saw that Juhasow :P

Juhasow

Checkmath wrote: »

Juhasow wrote: »

Koolio wrote: »

Considering the easy condition I think it’s fine.

Do a Magic return per minute basis on all recovery sets then check the actual requirements. Most sets are right around each other as far as sustain. Others cant really be used back bar.

Just for rough numbers (depends on actual build)

This is on a per minute basis

Amberplasm
8k Mag and Stam

Bloodthorn
7500 mag and stam(can proc while blocking)

Magicka Furnace
16k Magic per min

Desert Rose
36k Magic per minute

Syrabane Grip
56k Magic per minute

Lich
12-14k Magic per minute

But the conditions for the other sets that give more per minute won’t normally be 100% uptime. Like desert in medium combat situations is probably closer to the 20k mark but you have to take damage. So it doesn’t really fit a Magplar because you cleanse your 5th pc off.

I think they are in a good spot except Lich requires you to spend magic (it didn’t before)

You forgot about percentage bonuses.

Haha I saw that Juhasow :P

Too much drain/s , reg/s testing on PTS

ATomiX96

OP clearly has no clue about neither pve nor pvp so just ignore this thread, nothing constructive to see here.

Datthaw

Lol people saying magsorc needs sustain. You mean the 1 skill that heals and gives resources? If only we had a skill to create distance and then cast another skill to get back to 100% resources.....

Magsorc complaints make me lol

KhajiitFelix

Datthaw wrote: »

Lol people saying magsorc needs sustain. You mean the 1 skill that heals and gives resources? If only we had a skill to create distance and then cast another skill to get back to 100% resources.....

Magsorc complaints make me lol

Nobody got space for an expensive skill with long cast time.

Irylia

SaintSubwayy wrote: »

sorry but the Lich set is fine as it is now...its used in PVP on healers, on their backbar, so they can proc it, and swap away

in PVE, where you run a vMA weapon on the back bar, this set isnt really a viable option.
If you have problems sustaining in PVE, make sure to use a absorb glyph on a staff, and run regfood like withcmothers
If that aint enough, take a jelwerypiece with reg enchant

Healers use lich?

SaintSubwayy

Irylia wrote: »

SaintSubwayy wrote: »

sorry but the Lich set is fine as it is now...its used in PVP on healers, on their backbar, so they can proc it, and swap away

in PVE, where you run a vMA weapon on the back bar, this set isnt really a viable option.
If you have problems sustaining in PVE, make sure to use a absorb glyph on a staff, and run regfood like withcmothers
If that aint enough, take a jelwerypiece with reg enchant

Healers use lich?

I know some who run it in small scale yeah
Balgroups and zergs prob not

Datthaw

KhajiitFelix wrote: »

Datthaw wrote: »

Lol people saying magsorc needs sustain. You mean the 1 skill that heals and gives resources? If only we had a skill to create distance and then cast another skill to get back to 100% resources.....

Magsorc complaints make me lol

Nobody got space for an expensive skill with long cast time.

Funny because almost every single sorc I know uses this skill. Streak > los > conversion/deal.... pretty standard sorc combat move.

NordSwordnBoard

I think for people who don't LA weave, or over spam skills, Lich would be appealing at first for long PvE fights. It may even seem clutch at some points for the recovery burst. That is why its so great in PvP though.

Before target dummies and before I was good enough to get people to help me do a bloodspawn dps test I used Lich in PvE as it seemed logical that since I needed sustain, there's a set providing it, put all dmg on jewelry and I'll be fine. The math in this game isn't like that, as others said you wear two damage sets and tweak the rest for sustain.

I absolutely love Lich in PvP, and wore it for a year or more. Some sets just do best in certain spheres of use, at least its not useless in PvE like Knightslayer's 5th bonus is. Minor slayer is useless in PvP, etc... This is fine the way it is.

ccfeeling

Garbage set in PVE