PTS 4.3.3: CP modifier is additive with other modifiers

T3hasiangod

I went over a few scenarios and had a few other people try it out as well, and I can confirm that CP is additive with other modifiers, rather than multiplicative.

Here are the conditions used. This is MS + SS + Zaan running Inner Light on the front bar.



These are the expected values we should see for our Max Magicka for both additive and multiplicative CP modifiers.



Here is my Max Magicka with the Mage Mundus



Here is my Max Magicka without the Mage Mundus



As we can see, it appears that CP is interacting with other modifiers on an additive basis, rather than multiplicative. This doesn't mean much for stamina, since your Max Stamina modifiers are usually pretty small. But for magicka DPS, this does mean we're losing ~1k Max Magicka compared to what we initially assumed (multiplicative modification).

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom Can we confirm whether this is intended or no?

Dracane

This is exactly what I have found as well.
And I am wondering, why do some sets still not work with CP ?
Plague Doctor for example. My health is even slightly lower than on live, even though it should be several 100 health higher.

Perhaps you can shed some light on this ? Keep up the good work in any case.

TheYKcid

Nice find! As to why... I'm guessing it was done purely as a quick-and-easy fix.

Additive stat modifiers have always worked with the categories in question—food, Mundus, & procced gear (Necro, Bone Pirate, etc.). ZOS probably refactored the CP bonus into an additive one so that it would apply to those categories (as well as the new racials) without any additional coding work.

This is a pretty crap change. It hits mag specs more, and PvP Magsorcs the most—since the class is ward-dependent, and specs into max magicka more than most specs in order to attain better ward tooltips. Additive scaling is going to result in a significant loss compared to live, compounded on top of the existing loss from the racial changes.

Minno

TheYKcid wrote: »

Nice find! As to why... I'm guessing it was done purely as a quick-and-easy fix.

Additive stat modifiers have always worked with the categories in question—food, Mundus, & procced gear (Necro, Bone Pirate, etc.). ZOS probably refactored the CP bonus into an additive one so that it would apply to those categories (as well as the new racials) without any additional coding work.

This is a pretty crap change. It hits mag specs more, and PvP Magsorcs the most—since the class is ward-dependent, and specs into max magicka more than most specs in order to attain better ward tooltips. Additive scaling is going to result in a significant loss compared to live, compounded on top of the existing loss from the racial changes.

sounds like they did for to cut down on the multiplicative power creep/server load in an effort to control the wrobelization of stats and the performance lag.

Ill take a stat drop if it helps cut down on the above issues.

Olupajmibanan

Okay, but why they didn't announce it? Ninja nerfs are the worst signals to customers.

hakan

is it bad or good? im thinking imperial reduction passive with cp. i guess it makes it better?

Azyle1

Huh. So this will also hurt orcs as well in stam dps since that assumed "running gold food" with the Hp increase will get to 16K HP.

Olupajmibanan

@ZOS_GinaBruno
Is it even a confirmed change? Or a bug resulting from applying cp bonus to food and racials, and is going to be fixed?

Azyle1

hakan wrote: »

is it bad or good? im thinking imperial reduction passive with cp. i guess it makes it better?

This is likely a small nerf I would think. Also, this would hurt Orc stam dps as they were kind of counting on running gold food and hitting 16K hp and that may be not possible anymore.

John_Falstaff

@Azyle1 , actually, when I earlier made a quick-and-dirty estimate of how much HP we'll have with gold food, I assumed additive bonus, not multiplicative (I actually didn't know it might've been multiplicative on live - is it?). Above, on screenshot, khajiit magblade has 17k health with gold food.

Azyle1

John_Falstaff wrote: »

@Azyle1 , actually, when I earlier made a quick-and-dirty estimate of how much HP we'll have with gold food, I assumed additive bonus, not multiplicative (I actually didn't know it might've been multiplicative on live - is it?). Above, on screenshot, khajiit magblade has 17k health with gold food.

Oh? Well then please ignore my comment. I wasn't paying attention.

Good news then for Orc and Khajiits.

T3hasiangod

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

Okay, but why they didn't announce it? Ninja nerfs are the worst signals to customers.

They did announce the CP change. It was announced last week and implemented this week. We just weren't sure how the CP bonus would stack with other modifiers.

hakan wrote: »

is it bad or good? im thinking imperial reduction passive with cp. i guess it makes it better?

The CP change only affects max stats. It does not affect Spell/Weapon Damage, Spell/Weapon Crit, or any other game statistics.

In general, this is a very small nerf to Max Magicka for magicka DPS that do not stack Max Magicka (i.e. everyone except petsorcs) and a small buff to Max Stamina for stamina DPS.

Olupajmibanan

T3hasiangod wrote: »

show previous quotes

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

Okay, but why they didn't announce it? Ninja nerfs are the worst signals to customers.

They did announce the CP change. It was announced last week and implemented this week. We just weren't sure how the CP bonus would stack with other modifiers.

show previous quotes

hakan wrote: »

is it bad or good? im thinking imperial reduction passive with cp. i guess it makes it better?

The CP change only affects max stats. It does not affect Spell/Weapon Damage, Spell/Weapon Crit, or any other game statistics.

In general, this is a very small nerf to Max Magicka for magicka DPS that do not stack Max Magicka (i.e. everyone except petsorcs) and a small buff to Max Stamina for stamina DPS.

CP bonus is currently stacking multiplicatively with other bonuses on live. It is just natural that we expect it to stay so when ZoS didn't announced any change to that. It's clearly a ninja nerf.

Minno

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

show previous quotes

T3hasiangod wrote: »

Olupajmibanan wrote: »

Okay, but why they didn't announce it? Ninja nerfs are the worst signals to customers.

They did announce the CP change. It was announced last week and implemented this week. We just weren't sure how the CP bonus would stack with other modifiers.

hakan wrote: »

is it bad or good? im thinking imperial reduction passive with cp. i guess it makes it better?

The CP change only affects max stats. It does not affect Spell/Weapon Damage, Spell/Weapon Crit, or any other game statistics.

In general, this is a very small nerf to Max Magicka for magicka DPS that do not stack Max Magicka (i.e. everyone except petsorcs) and a small buff to Max Stamina for stamina DPS.

CP bonus is currently stacking multiplicatively with other bonuses on live. It is just natural that we expect it to stay so when ZoS didn't announced any change to that. It's clearly a ninja nerf.

hard to say unless they noted it somewhere if they like it or not. My guess; stealth change back to an intended desire out of CP and how it interacts with bonuses.