Race change token removed

Moonsorrow

So, now since all races are becoming balanced and equal in the Wrathstone update, i suggest Race change token to be removed from the game.

It is obsolete item and not needed anymore, since all races can now be equally good in all mag/stam dps, healer and as tanks. Everyone is getting buffed also. So literally no reason to change race anymore.

It has come time to suggest race change token be deleted from game. I think also the "free" token they plan to give is not needed because of the perfect balance, so they do not need to give that also.

This would make everyone happy and proud of each balanced race they are playing.

I think majority agrees with me so this suggestion should be fast to come in game.

I wish everyone a good weekend!

Edaphon

Moonsorrow

This is an honest suggestion and discussion about it.

Reasoning to remove Race change token is real. Since ZOS and many people here are claiming we now have balance and all are equal in all roles (there are pve dps parses as proof about being equal in all roles).

So why need it anymore?

Also think about it: If there is no race change token, people really want to be sure races ARE equal, since cannot change to the one that was beaten down (nerfed) less than others for your playstyle as an example.

I see only benefits from this suggestion. Also people will save real life money, when cannot even do "token cash crab" as some been saying the race changes now are.

Might seem weird, but think about it for a moment. It would benefit everyone and keep races balanced and worked on with thought.

Banana

As someone who refuses to make alts. I dont think so.

SiAScORCH

They're not going to remove it from the game, nor should they. If you don't want to buy it then don't.

LordGavus

There are still aesthetic reasons for race change.

Moonsorrow

Banana wrote: »

As someone who refuses to make alts. I dont think so.

You mean you only play with 1 character and change race every now and then to have a feeling of a fresh character?

If so, then that would be a legit concern with this suggestion, i admit.

Lord_Wrath

Didnt work before race change token, so no.

Siohwenoeht

Not sure if troll but:
Min/max folks may still want to be able to flip around.

Not everyone uses rc tokens for the same reasons.

No need to get rid of them.

kargen27

If they got rid of everything useless the crown store shelves would be near empty.

ccmedaddy

Tl;dr: OP is unhappy about racial changes, gets triggered by folks saying the new racial passives are balanced, and decides to make this dumb thread to prove his point.

At least it's not another "im quitting because I'm losing 400 magicka" thead, I guess.

Moonsorrow

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Min/max folks may still want to be able to flip around.

But, zos and many people on forum are claiming things are balanced and equal. So if they are, min/maxer does not benefit anything from changing race since they are equal, right?

Or you mean to say racial passives coming at Wrathstone are not equal and totally balanced? Have you seen the pve dps parses as proof?

I watched the pve dps parses and i feel now happy with all races on my tanks and healers and pvp builds to all be equal.

Siohwenoeht

Moonsorrow wrote: »

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Min/max folks may still want to be able to flip around.

But, zos and many people on forum are claiming things are balanced and equal. So if they are, min/maxer does not benefit anything from changing race since they are equal, right?

Or you mean to say racial passives coming at Wrathstone are not equal and totally balanced? Have you seen the pve dps parses as proof?

I watched the pve dps parses and i feel now happy with all races on my tanks and healers and pvp builds to all be equal.

Trying not to feed, but true min/maxers will squeeze every ounce of power/ultilty etc. out of their builds and even though these changes seem to bring more balance there are always going to be slight differences that those players will want to utilize.

Moonsorrow

ccmedaddy wrote: »

Tl;dr: OP is unhappy about racial changes, gets triggered by folks saying the new racial passives are balanced, and decides to make this dumb thread to prove his point.

At least it's not another "im quitting because I'm losing 400 magicka" thead, I guess.

Not quitting.

And you can kind of see the actual logic on what i am saying though right? If can see it from under the mildly humorous imitation of a forum nerf post?

There is logic in if there was no race change available, they would be balanced in a way that no need to change for min/max and there would be real freedom instead.

So race change token (and the whole racial passive changes) would not be content in the game, but actual content would be content.

Sylvermynx

Er.... no.... I don't see any logic at all; you just don't make any sense. Good luck with your crusade.

Moonsorrow

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Moonsorrow wrote: »

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Min/max folks may still want to be able to flip around.

But, zos and many people on forum are claiming things are balanced and equal. So if they are, min/maxer does not benefit anything from changing race since they are equal, right?

Or you mean to say racial passives coming at Wrathstone are not equal and totally balanced? Have you seen the pve dps parses as proof?

I watched the pve dps parses and i feel now happy with all races on my tanks and healers and pvp builds to all be equal.

Trying not to feed, but true min/maxers will squeeze every ounce of power/ultilty etc. out of their builds and even though these changes seem to bring more balance there are always going to be slight differences that those players will want to utilize.

So you are saying there are "ounces" to squeeze in from changing a race after next update? Hmm, that does not sound balanced then.. hmmm, sounds almost like it was done on purpose. I guess some were lucky since race change tokens went on sale just when these changes were announced. Hmmm.. *Master Yoda face*

So how about my Imperial healer.. you saying it is not now as equal as other races? But i saw the pve dps parses saying all are now really balanced.

Hmmm..

generalmyrick

Id l Iike my free race change token...

Siohwenoeht

Moonsorrow wrote: »

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Moonsorrow wrote: »

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Min/max folks may still want to be able to flip around.

But, zos and many people on forum are claiming things are balanced and equal. So if they are, min/maxer does not benefit anything from changing race since they are equal, right?

Or you mean to say racial passives coming at Wrathstone are not equal and totally balanced? Have you seen the pve dps parses as proof?

I watched the pve dps parses and i feel now happy with all races on my tanks and healers and pvp builds to all be equal.

Trying not to feed, but true min/maxers will squeeze every ounce of power/ultilty etc. out of their builds and even though these changes seem to bring more balance there are always going to be slight differences that those players will want to utilize.

So you are saying there are "ounces" to squeeze in from changing a race after next update? Hmm, that does not sound balanced then.. hmmm, sounds almost like it was done on purpose. I guess some were lucky since race change tokens went on sale just when these changes were announced. Hmmm.. *Master Yoda face*

So how about my Imperial healer.. you saying it is not now as equal as other races? But i saw the pve dps parses saying all are now really balanced.

Hmmm..

It's not that I don't see what you're doing....

Regardless of any change, outside of removing racial bonuses completely, there will ALWAYS be slight differences in performance. That's my only point. Every mmo that has racial bonuses has things that one will do better than another. It will ALWAYS be like this.

Moonsorrow

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Moonsorrow wrote: »

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Moonsorrow wrote: »

Siohwenoeht wrote: »

Min/max folks may still want to be able to flip around.

But, zos and many people on forum are claiming things are balanced and equal. So if they are, min/maxer does not benefit anything from changing race since they are equal, right?

Or you mean to say racial passives coming at Wrathstone are not equal and totally balanced? Have you seen the pve dps parses as proof?

I watched the pve dps parses and i feel now happy with all races on my tanks and healers and pvp builds to all be equal.

Trying not to feed, but true min/maxers will squeeze every ounce of power/ultilty etc. out of their builds and even though these changes seem to bring more balance there are always going to be slight differences that those players will want to utilize.

So you are saying there are "ounces" to squeeze in from changing a race after next update? Hmm, that does not sound balanced then.. hmmm, sounds almost like it was done on purpose. I guess some were lucky since race change tokens went on sale just when these changes were announced. Hmmm.. *Master Yoda face*

So how about my Imperial healer.. you saying it is not now as equal as other races? But i saw the pve dps parses saying all are now really balanced.

Hmmm..

It's not that I don't see what you're doing....

Regardless of any change, outside of removing racial bonuses completely, there will ALWAYS be slight differences in performance. That's my only point. Every mmo that has racial bonuses has things that one will do better than another. It will ALWAYS be like this.

why does it have to be always like that? What if ESO was the 1st ever to be actually balanced in races and only reason to change race was cosmetic and/or feeling of a playing a fresh character without making an alt as someone said they do? That would make ESO greater than any other mmo in fact.

Taleof2Cities

As someone who probably won't need the free race change token, I still disagree with you @Moonsorrow.

Remember that "balance" for you and me is different ... and different than each and every one of the millions of players that play ESO.

Sylvermynx

Bottom line here: only those who've played TES SPMR games are going to get the "racial difference" setup. And ESO has finally decided to not go there because of....

....whining.

Yes, I do understand that an MMO is far FAR different than a SPMR game. However, I still want ESO to "feel" like the previous TES games.

That's a dead horse now.

goatlyonesub17_ESO

I don't race change, but I don't care if you do.

Somebody might want to change to argonian to win the swimming events in the Tamriel Olympics.

Moonsorrow

Taleof2Cities wrote: »

As someone who probably won't need the free race change token, I still disagree with you @Moonsorrow.

Remember that "balance" for you and me is different ... and different than each and every one of the millions of players that play ESO.

This is what i am trying to demonstrate here.

But one have to provoke some thoughts, since there are a lot of people saying all races are now balanced because of some pve dps parses.

Like everyone plays their characters only as pve dps and there is no pvp, no tanks and no healers, no fun builds, no sneaky bosmer thiefs at bank of Mournhold missing their old Stealthy passive, no stamsOrcs missing their old pvp hp regen builds.. #WeAreAllPveDPS.

Jameliel

Watch how many of the anti-snipe, run around the tower, axe bleed x dawnbreaker types roll wood elves.

Moonsorrow

There are a few nice changes in them, but most are not necessary and many are totally out of common sense type of changes.

So all in all, it`s like someone saying they will give you a candy, then they drop it inside a bag that is full of poop and hands over the bag to you. Is it now a bag full of candy or just a bag full of poop?

It just a bag of poop and 1 candy inside and picking that up from there and eating is just nasty.

Sadly many people will pick up the candy and eat the rest of it too.

I think people are tired to try even defend their own playstyles anymore when feel they do not get listened to and because of the "this is fine.." crowd who ridicules everyone who tries to say that balancing is possible without destroying many fun things as collateral damage.

lokulin

I race change so I can continue playing on my main and collecting achievements. I'd pay for class and alliance change tokens for the same reason. Only thing that would stop me is account wide achievements as then I'd probably play alts more.

dovakiin5574

I'm the kind of person who would rather re-roll than use a race change token but I support the right of other players to use them so no... I do not support the removal of race change tokens

CleymenZero

SiAScORCH wrote: »

They're not going to remove it from the game, nor should they. If you don't want to buy it then don't.

You're ok with them making changes that would make you pay? Based on results taht came out recently, I have to switch 6-7 races to be optimized.

I love the changes, I hate that THEY made changes that is going to require ME to pay. Buying chapters, DLC, Crown Crates and subbing wasn't enough?

mxxo

Moonsorrow wrote: »

So, now since all races are becoming balanced and equal in the Wrathstone update, i suggest Race change token to be removed from the game.

It is obsolete item and not needed anymore, since all races can now be equally good in all mag/stam dps, healer and as tanks. Everyone is getting buffed also. So literally no reason to change race anymore.

It has come time to suggest race change token be deleted from game. I think also the "free" token they plan to give is not needed because of the perfect balance, so they do not need to give that also.

This would make everyone happy and proud of each balanced race they are playing.

I think majority agrees with me so this suggestion should be fast to come in game.

I wish everyone a good weekend!

What?

Nairinhe

CleymenZero wrote: »

SiAScORCH wrote: »

They're not going to remove it from the game, nor should they. If you don't want to buy it then don't.

You're ok with them making changes that would make you pay? Based on results taht came out recently, I have to switch 6-7 races to be optimized.

I love the changes, I hate that THEY made changes that is going to require ME to pay. Buying chapters, DLC, Crown Crates and subbing wasn't enough?

Maybe it would be easier to swap builds between characters instead of changing races?

apri

With the balance change to races, the tokens should not be removed but free instead. All the balance updates the game has so far, can be countered with in-game items. Gold to reset CP, gold to reset attribute and skill points. The racial changes are the first major balance change we need to adjust to with real money. That's a very, very worrying step. I don't put "pay to win" out lightly but racial balances and the tokens only available in the crown store go into this very direction.

Don't forget this may not be the last racial update we see for a while. It might be a core element of each update, who knows. It could end in a real money cash sink, in particular for people with multiple toons they wanna min-max.

The one free race change token ZOS plans to add does not compensate this worry for everyone having more than one toon. There is three fair solutions ZOS could add for those who desire a race change, caused by adjustments to the game later than the toon creation took place (and thus were not foreseeable):

1. Give each character slot a free race change token.
2. Make race change tokens in the crown store free.
3. Take the race change tokens out of the crown store and make them available in-game for gold.

And indeed those who consider race changes despite of balance updates and role playing concerns obsolete, can straight ignore that offer. No harm done. But those who feel the need, should have fair options to do adjust to the game whenever it changes. Core game changes should be adapted to by playing and with items obtained by doing so and not with the wallet.