Boundless Storm

ezio45

@ZOS_RobGarrett

I would like zos to strongly reconsider the nerf to boundless major expedition. This was a victim of an obvious blanket nerf to major expedition. Magsorc mobility was already an issues as has been noted by the class reps and this not only doesnt help with that but hurts it for those who were willing to make room for boundless on their bar.

Waffennacht

Casting a Shadow ability grants you Major Resolve and Major Ward for 6 seconds, increasing Physical and Spell Resistance by 5280. This duration is increased by 25% for each piece of Heavy Armor equipped.

Passive...

Manifest yourself as pure lighting, zapping nearby enemies with electricity dealing 84 Shock Damage every 1 second for 20 seconds.
While in this form you also gain Major Resolve and Major Ward, increasing your Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by 5280.
Activating this grants Major Expedition for a brief period, increasing your Movement Speed by 30% for 4 seconds

Active; cost 4k base; slot

I have a hard time slotting boundless

Tannus15

Yeah, I can't see why anyone would ever slot it. It's pretty much rubbish.

ezio45

Tannus15 wrote: »

Yeah, I can't see why anyone would ever slot it. It's pretty much rubbish.

eh the increased resist does help but it is very situational

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO

Waffennacht wrote: »

Casting a Shadow ability grants you Major Resolve and Major Ward for 6 seconds, increasing Physical and Spell Resistance by 5280. This duration is increased by 25% for each piece of Heavy Armor equipped.

Passive...

Manifest yourself as pure lighting, zapping nearby enemies with electricity dealing 84 Shock Damage every 1 second for 20 seconds.
While in this form you also gain Major Resolve and Major Ward, increasing your Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by 5280.
Activating this grants Major Expedition for a brief period, increasing your Movement Speed by 30% for 4 seconds

Active; cost 4k base; slot

I have a hard time slotting boundless

You get 2% spell and weapon damage for having boundless slotted, with a 6% chance to proc implosion every time it hits something under 20% health, "passive...". The major buffs lasts for 23 seconds, with one button press. You are underselling this skill and making a passive that will have a much lower up time for most nightblades look better then it is.

Chilly-McFreeze

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Casting a Shadow ability grants you Major Resolve and Major Ward for 6 seconds, increasing Physical and Spell Resistance by 5280. This duration is increased by 25% for each piece of Heavy Armor equipped.

Passive...

Manifest yourself as pure lighting, zapping nearby enemies with electricity dealing 84 Shock Damage every 1 second for 20 seconds.
While in this form you also gain Major Resolve and Major Ward, increasing your Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by 5280.
Activating this grants Major Expedition for a brief period, increasing your Movement Speed by 30% for 4 seconds

Active; cost 4k base; slot

I have a hard time slotting boundless

You get 2% spell and weapon damage for having boundless slotted, with a 6% chance to proc implosion every time it hits something under 20% health, "passive...". The major buffs lasts for 23 seconds, with one button press. You are underselling this skill and making a passive that will have a much lower up time for most nightblades look better then it is.

It's 15% health and it's usefulness on a mag sorc isn't that big since wrath usually gets the job done before implosion reaches its threshold.

Derra

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Casting a Shadow ability grants you Major Resolve and Major Ward for 6 seconds, increasing Physical and Spell Resistance by 5280. This duration is increased by 25% for each piece of Heavy Armor equipped.

Passive...

Manifest yourself as pure lighting, zapping nearby enemies with electricity dealing 84 Shock Damage every 1 second for 20 seconds.
While in this form you also gain Major Resolve and Major Ward, increasing your Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by 5280.
Activating this grants Major Expedition for a brief period, increasing your Movement Speed by 30% for 4 seconds

Active; cost 4k base; slot

I have a hard time slotting boundless

You get 2% spell and weapon damage for having boundless slotted, with a 6% chance to proc implosion every time it hits something under 20% health, "passive...". The major buffs lasts for 23 seconds, with one button press. You are underselling this skill and making a passive that will have a much lower up time for most nightblades look better then it is.

Implosion is under 15% health. Also boundless storm has a 5m range (only one class is a guaranteed hit in melee all other can completely or partially avoid it) and sorc has an execute that proccs from 20% health.
Implosion is irrelevant as a passive for magsorc.

I´ve made more than 120 million ap on the class. A total of 3% of my killingblows come from implosion. But that´s not telling the whole story - because implosion applies it´s dmg before the actual skill that triggers it. So in most cases a target would have died to fury anyway.

Trying to make it sound that implosion is in any way relevant to boundless storm or magsorcs toolkit just shows that you´re someone who has absolutely no understanding of what they´re talking about or you´re on a personal agenda.

And if you have too much freetime go read my comparison to other classes skills that also cost a slot and have the same duration mostly in the sorc feedback topic ~ page 39 to understand why boundless storm is underperforming.

I´ll leave it to waffennacht to explain why the nb passive is actually good and the only spec that might have trouble maitaining near 100% uptime would be a 5 1 1 lightarmor ranged nb.

Feanor

It’s not only the nerf on the Major Expedition duration. The cost is simply outrageous. Getting the Armour buffs passively is a big help for sustain - you get the buffs for a cast you’d do anyway. Would any Sorc cast Boundless Storm “anyway”?

TheYKcid

I'm still going to use Boundless after the change, and I'm okay with 4s of speed (since everyone else is losing mobility, too), but the cost is way too high for what it now offers.

4050 magicka base cost, even after a huge cost reduction from 5pc light armor + the Unholy Knowledge passive, is still a whopping 3037 mag that you'll have to be recasting every 4 seconds to maintain uptime. And still results in subpar mobility compared to stam.

Base cost needs to be reduced by a good 20% or so.

Biro123

TheYKcid wrote: »

I'm still going to use Boundless after the change, and I'm okay with 4s of speed (since everyone else is losing mobility, too), but the cost is way too high for what it now offers.

4050 magicka base cost, even after a huge cost reduction from 5pc light armor + the Unholy Knowledge passive, is still a whopping 3037 mag that you'll have to be recasting every 4 seconds to maintain uptime. And still results in subpar mobility compared to stam.

Base cost needs to be reduced by a good 20% or so.

I'm actually considering switching to the stam morph for longer uptime on the mobility buff and bigger damage area for surge procs.. Downside is shorter overall duration

Tasear

Noted some concerns and perspectives here.

Facefister

Yay, another nerf thread

Rikumaru

Feanor wrote: »

It’s not only the nerf on the Major Expedition duration. The cost is simply outrageous. Getting the Armour buffs passively is a big help for sustain - you get the buffs for a cast you’d do anyway. Would any Sorc cast Boundless Storm “anyway”?

Wouldn't boundless storm be slotted post patch due to shields taking into account armor buffs now? Not saying the nerf to major expedition was silly; just like on all the other skills which were nerfed too.

Feanor

@Rikumaru

Yes, but that has nothing to do with the skill being good. What I meant by "anyway" is - a skill that you would slot even if it didn't have the armor buff at all.

Spiked Armor? Gets slotted also because the Burning Heart passive is really good.
Rune Focus? Has sustain or further mitigation attached to it as well.
Frost Cloak? Is either a group buff or has further mitigation on it.
Shadow Barrier? Is a passive that gets activated on NBs main class spammable or escape tools.

And Boundless? Has a 2% Spell Damage increase with a tiny (both in actual damage and radius) AoE damage component along with a now very short Major Expedition. And that for 3k + magicka.

Bergzorn

Biro123 wrote: »

TheYKcid wrote: »

I'm still going to use Boundless after the change, and I'm okay with 4s of speed (since everyone else is losing mobility, too), but the cost is way too high for what it now offers.

4050 magicka base cost, even after a huge cost reduction from 5pc light armor + the Unholy Knowledge passive, is still a whopping 3037 mag that you'll have to be recasting every 4 seconds to maintain uptime. And still results in subpar mobility compared to stam.

Base cost needs to be reduced by a good 20% or so.

I'm actually considering switching to the stam morph for longer uptime on the mobility buff and bigger damage area for surge procs.. Downside is shorter overall duration

Using Hurricane on a mag sorc for surge heals sounds good until you remember that it uses your weapon crit rating. In my case (no CP), that's a whooping 10%.

Sarousse

Feanor wrote: »

And Boundless? Has a 2% Spell Damage increase with a tiny (both in actual damage and radius) AoE damage component along with a now very short Major Expedition. And that for 3k + magicka.

and procs implosion.

TheYKcid

Bergzorn wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

TheYKcid wrote: »

I'm still going to use Boundless after the change, and I'm okay with 4s of speed (since everyone else is losing mobility, too), but the cost is way too high for what it now offers.

4050 magicka base cost, even after a huge cost reduction from 5pc light armor + the Unholy Knowledge passive, is still a whopping 3037 mag that you'll have to be recasting every 4 seconds to maintain uptime. And still results in subpar mobility compared to stam.

Base cost needs to be reduced by a good 20% or so.

I'm actually considering switching to the stam morph for longer uptime on the mobility buff and bigger damage area for surge procs.. Downside is shorter overall duration

Using Hurricane on a mag sorc for surge heals sounds good until you remember that it uses your weapon crit rating. In my case (no CP), that's a whooping 10%.

Good point. I also wouldn't be comfortable taking that chunk out of my limited stam pool.

Personally I'd still rather have the short but big burst of speed from Boundless, it makes all the difference sometimes when trying to round a corner to get LOS and drop pressure.

Either way, the fact that people are seriously considering Hurricane is pretty indicative of the sorry state Boundless is in...

Sparr0w

Plz I can't do without major expedition in PvE, literally have it on every class

Feanor

Sarousse wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

And Boundless? Has a 2% Spell Damage increase with a tiny (both in actual damage and radius) AoE damage component along with a now very short Major Expedition. And that for 3k + magicka.

and procs implosion.

Under 15% HP. Anything would kill you then.

BrightOblivion

Sarousse wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

And Boundless? Has a 2% Spell Damage increase with a tiny (both in actual damage and radius) AoE damage component along with a now very short Major Expedition. And that for 3k + magicka.

and procs implosion.

I really wish that people would stop using that passive as an excuse for no improvements to sorc. In point of fact, I wish that that passive would be replaced by something actually useful that isn't rendered pointless by the execute already in the sorc's toolkit, the 6% chance on enemies under 15% health, and the fact that (in those instances where implosion does kill you) the next ability would have done the job anyway. Maybe then we could have a reasonable discourse without "YoU hAvE a PaSsIvE tHaT kIlLs PeOpLE!!!!1!" (Gosh that was painful to write.)

I mean, probably not, but a guy can hope, right?

Things to add to the eventual theoretical sorc offensive rework!

Biro123

Bergzorn wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

TheYKcid wrote: »

I'm still going to use Boundless after the change, and I'm okay with 4s of speed (since everyone else is losing mobility, too), but the cost is way too high for what it now offers.

4050 magicka base cost, even after a huge cost reduction from 5pc light armor + the Unholy Knowledge passive, is still a whopping 3037 mag that you'll have to be recasting every 4 seconds to maintain uptime. And still results in subpar mobility compared to stam.

Base cost needs to be reduced by a good 20% or so.

I'm actually considering switching to the stam morph for longer uptime on the mobility buff and bigger damage area for surge procs.. Downside is shorter overall duration

Using Hurricane on a mag sorc for surge heals sounds good until you remember that it uses your weapon crit rating. In my case (no CP), that's a whooping 10%.

Aahh.. good point.. :-(

Biro123

BrightOblivion wrote: »

Sarousse wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

And Boundless? Has a 2% Spell Damage increase with a tiny (both in actual damage and radius) AoE damage component along with a now very short Major Expedition. And that for 3k + magicka.

and procs implosion.

I really wish that people would stop using that passive as an excuse for no improvements to sorc. In point of fact, I wish that that passive would be replaced by something actually useful that isn't rendered pointless by the execute already in the sorc's toolkit, the 6% chance on enemies under 15% health, and the fact that (in those instances where implosion does kill you) the next ability would have done the job anyway. Maybe then we could have a reasonable discourse without "YoU hAvE a PaSsIvE tHaT kIlLs PeOpLE!!!!1!" (Gosh that was painful to write.)

I mean, probably not, but a guy can hope, right?

Things to add to the eventual theoretical sorc offensive rework!

/Agree. I'm honestly starting to think that the only way forward with the class now is to remove every single thing that people whine about, then start adding new stuff..
Only then may we have reasonable balance.

Chilly-McFreeze

Biro123 wrote: »

BrightOblivion wrote: »

Sarousse wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

And Boundless? Has a 2% Spell Damage increase with a tiny (both in actual damage and radius) AoE damage component along with a now very short Major Expedition. And that for 3k + magicka.

and procs implosion.

I really wish that people would stop using that passive as an excuse for no improvements to sorc. In point of fact, I wish that that passive would be replaced by something actually useful that isn't rendered pointless by the execute already in the sorc's toolkit, the 6% chance on enemies under 15% health, and the fact that (in those instances where implosion does kill you) the next ability would have done the job anyway. Maybe then we could have a reasonable discourse without "YoU hAvE a PaSsIvE tHaT kIlLs PeOpLE!!!!1!" (Gosh that was painful to write.)

I mean, probably not, but a guy can hope, right?

Things to add to the eventual theoretical sorc offensive rework!

/Agree. I'm honestly starting to think that the only way forward with the class now is to remove every single thing that people whine about, then start adding new stuff..
Only then may we have reasonable balance.

But is a sorc without curse, fury, streak, shields, pets, implosion, dark deal, hurricane and overload still a sorc?

Biro123

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

BrightOblivion wrote: »

Sarousse wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

And Boundless? Has a 2% Spell Damage increase with a tiny (both in actual damage and radius) AoE damage component along with a now very short Major Expedition. And that for 3k + magicka.

and procs implosion.

I really wish that people would stop using that passive as an excuse for no improvements to sorc. In point of fact, I wish that that passive would be replaced by something actually useful that isn't rendered pointless by the execute already in the sorc's toolkit, the 6% chance on enemies under 15% health, and the fact that (in those instances where implosion does kill you) the next ability would have done the job anyway. Maybe then we could have a reasonable discourse without "YoU hAvE a PaSsIvE tHaT kIlLs PeOpLE!!!!1!" (Gosh that was painful to write.)

I mean, probably not, but a guy can hope, right?

Things to add to the eventual theoretical sorc offensive rework!

/Agree. I'm honestly starting to think that the only way forward with the class now is to remove every single thing that people whine about, then start adding new stuff..
Only then may we have reasonable balance.

But is a sorc without curse, fury, streak, shields, pets, implosion, dark deal, hurricane and overload still a sorc?

Ooh, now.. I wonder if I can come up with a working build that doesn't use a single sorc' skill..

Mintaka5

Agreed. Totally dissatisfied with this nerf. Sorcs have been getting pounded by the nerf bombs lately, and it's making already bad experience worse. I use both Streak and Boundless Storm to escape a fight, and everytime I get killed. It sucks as it is. I really don't understand how the developers can look at this and say that it has an OP advantage over other builds that have meta stam build outs. Is it me or do we really need to make magsorcs less appealing to the player community?

Beardimus

Waffennacht wrote: »

Casting a Shadow ability grants you Major Resolve and Major Ward for 6 seconds, increasing Physical and Spell Resistance by 5280. This duration is increased by 25% for each piece of Heavy Armor equipped.

Passive...

Manifest yourself as pure lighting, zapping nearby enemies with electricity dealing 84 Shock Damage every 1 second for 20 seconds.
While in this form you also gain Major Resolve and Major Ward, increasing your Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by 5280.
Activating this grants Major Expedition for a brief period, increasing your Movement Speed by 30% for 4 seconds

Active; cost 4k base; slot

I have a hard time slotting boundless

Spot on.

Especially with no 3rd bar now.

Also its boundful not boundless, remove snares etc or Cc needed

ezio45

Lightspeedflashb14_ESO wrote: »

Waffennacht wrote: »

Casting a Shadow ability grants you Major Resolve and Major Ward for 6 seconds, increasing Physical and Spell Resistance by 5280. This duration is increased by 25% for each piece of Heavy Armor equipped.

Passive...

Manifest yourself as pure lighting, zapping nearby enemies with electricity dealing 84 Shock Damage every 1 second for 20 seconds.
While in this form you also gain Major Resolve and Major Ward, increasing your Physical Resistance and Spell Resistance by 5280.
Activating this grants Major Expedition for a brief period, increasing your Movement Speed by 30% for 4 seconds

Active; cost 4k base; slot

I have a hard time slotting boundless

You get 2% spell and weapon damage for having boundless slotted, with a 6% chance to proc implosion every time it hits something under 20% health, "passive...". The major buffs lasts for 23 seconds, with one button press. You are underselling this skill and making a passive that will have a much lower up time for most nightblades look better then it is.

you get the 2% for any sorc skill and most buffs for major ward/ resolve last that long

Chilly-McFreeze

Biro123 wrote: »

Chilly-McFreeze wrote: »

Biro123 wrote: »

BrightOblivion wrote: »

Sarousse wrote: »

Feanor wrote: »

And Boundless? Has a 2% Spell Damage increase with a tiny (both in actual damage and radius) AoE damage component along with a now very short Major Expedition. And that for 3k + magicka.

and procs implosion.

I really wish that people would stop using that passive as an excuse for no improvements to sorc. In point of fact, I wish that that passive would be replaced by something actually useful that isn't rendered pointless by the execute already in the sorc's toolkit, the 6% chance on enemies under 15% health, and the fact that (in those instances where implosion does kill you) the next ability would have done the job anyway. Maybe then we could have a reasonable discourse without "YoU hAvE a PaSsIvE tHaT kIlLs PeOpLE!!!!1!" (Gosh that was painful to write.)

I mean, probably not, but a guy can hope, right?

Things to add to the eventual theoretical sorc offensive rework!

/Agree. I'm honestly starting to think that the only way forward with the class now is to remove every single thing that people whine about, then start adding new stuff..
Only then may we have reasonable balance.

But is a sorc without curse, fury, streak, shields, pets, implosion, dark deal, hurricane and overload still a sorc?

Ooh, now.. I wonder if I can come up with a working build that doesn't use a single sorc' skill..

Of course you can. But then you'd have to call it a stam sorc.