Why is ZOS not allowing in-game trade for giftable crown items?

themaddaedra

Now that exchanging crowns for golds is legit, why do we have to do it in a way where there's a big risk to get scammed? If a crown item is giftable and completely legit for trading with golds, then we should be able to trade them like any other tradable items in game.

Meet a person, offer items/golds then when the offers are legit just submit the trade. That should be the way to do it. Not like sending items/golds beforehand and wait for the other side's good attitude.

That will make the market way more alive and save people a bigload of burden.

Is there a reason to not allow this that i'm missing?

Turelus

Whilst it's not against any rules to do it, it's not a design choice of the gifting feature.

It's likely ZOS only allows it because there is no way they could police it. If you want to trade gold for crowns or vice versa look for a reputable group doing it. If you do get scammed open a support ticket.

themaddaedra

Turelus wrote: »

Whilst it's not against any rules to do it, it's not a design choice of the gifting feature.

It's likely ZOS only allows it because there is no way they could police it. If you want to trade gold for crowns or vice versa look for a reputable group doing it. If you do get scammed open a support ticket.

I got scammed last night and i was recording the whole action in a video. Already submitted a ticket with a link to video.

We all should know that this system is heavily a trading system rather than a gifting system lol. I know about reputable groups and already joined some of them. But when someone in zone chat offers less than half of the reputable group's rate i would like to take that chance.

Otherwise it's restricting the options (or more like eliminating all options except the big group's exchange rate).

Turelus

themaddaedra wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Whilst it's not against any rules to do it, it's not a design choice of the gifting feature.

It's likely ZOS only allows it because there is no way they could police it. If you want to trade gold for crowns or vice versa look for a reputable group doing it. If you do get scammed open a support ticket.

I got scammed last night and i was recording the whole action in a video. Already submitted a ticket with a link to video.

We all should know that this system is heavily a trading system rather than a gifting system lol. I know about reputable groups and already joined some of them. But when someone in zone chat offers less than half of the reputable group's rate i would like to take that chance.

Otherwise it's restricting the options (or more like eliminating all options except the big group's exchange rate).

There is an old saying we've all heard many times and I am sure you have as well. "If it's too good to be true, it probably is"

I hope support can help you out and get you your gold back though. It's a shame we have to deal with scamming in a game like this.

Edit: Another option is to look to find a reputable player to act as a 3rd party to hold your gold until the item is delivered, if it's not delivered you get you gold back, if it is they give it to the seller. This actually become a profession in EVE Online where scamming is legal and common (if not involving real world money).

leepalmer95

It's still a bit strange that you can literally use money to get in game currency and everyone accepts this.

Then say the game isn't p2w at all..

ssorgatem

Giftable crown items should be able to be bought as a runebox.
That'd make them able to be sold through guild traders or by regular trade.

ssorgatem

leepalmer95 wrote: »

It's still a bit strange that you can literally use money to get in game currency and everyone accepts this.

Then say the game isn't p2w at all..

Most BiS sets for most builds cannot be bought in any way.

themaddaedra

Turelus wrote: »

themaddaedra wrote: »

Turelus wrote: »

Whilst it's not against any rules to do it, it's not a design choice of the gifting feature.

It's likely ZOS only allows it because there is no way they could police it. If you want to trade gold for crowns or vice versa look for a reputable group doing it. If you do get scammed open a support ticket.

I got scammed last night and i was recording the whole action in a video. Already submitted a ticket with a link to video.

We all should know that this system is heavily a trading system rather than a gifting system lol. I know about reputable groups and already joined some of them. But when someone in zone chat offers less than half of the reputable group's rate i would like to take that chance.

Otherwise it's restricting the options (or more like eliminating all options except the big group's exchange rate).

There is an old saying we've all heard many times and I am sure you have as well. "If it's too good to be true, it probably is"

I hope support can help you out and get you your gold back though. It's a shame we have to deal with scamming in a game like this.

Edit: Another option is to look to find a reputable player to act as a 3rd party to hold your gold until the item is delivered, if it's not delivered you get you gold back, if it is they give it to the seller. This actually become a profession in EVE Online where scamming is legal and common (if not involving real world money).

Well i bought many items from zone chat before this. I made lots of 200/ea 250/ea deals even tho TCE rate is 400.

I mean it looks like a big win/win for both players and for ZOS to allow in-game trade. I have plans on buying 15k crowns yet i'm not buying any because TCE rate is too big imho. And i'm fairly sure there are loads of players who feel the same.

leepalmer95

ssorgatem wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

It's still a bit strange that you can literally use money to get in game currency and everyone accepts this.

Then say the game isn't p2w at all..

Most BiS sets for most builds cannot be bought in any way.

No but the tempers can.

Most bis sets also require dlc.
Bis skills for endgame pvp and pve require dlc's.
Jewellery crafting is tied to dlc
Trans is tied to dlc.


Someone with the base game is at a very noticeable disadvantage vs someone with all the dlc's.

silvermistktralasub17_ESO

Actually, there's a very simple explanation to why they're handling the gifting the way it is now. If you stop to think about it, you'll understand. There has always been a problem with people hacking into other people's accounts and taking their items, as well as items from guild banks, etc, and giving them to their own (or friends') accounts. As I recall, the gifting is actually limited per day, and it is easily tracked in their system who the gifts go to, even if it isn't. They have a very easy record of when the sales were made, who they were gifted, to, etc. And it doesn't change hands again. This makes it much easier to determine what needs to be replaced when the hack is uncovered and repaired. It would be far harder, and require much looking through logs, to determine who received the 'stolen goods' if it were done through trades, or any other non-controlled environment. Especially if something could be traded multiple times. So, yes, the current gifting rules are here for *our* protection, as well as Zos'.

@Alassirana
SneakyBo, ExSO_Gold, Demure Dragon Dealings

Streega

Because there is no money for ZOS in it? Also, what silvermistktralasub17_ESO said above.

idk

Zos permitted gifting and is allowing trading for gold because there is really no way to police the gifting. That seems pretty clear by the design.

As Turelus stated, if it seems to good of a deal it probably is. It is also likely seller beware as those giving up the crowns have much more to lose than someone giving up some gold.

redspecter23

Tamriel Crown Exchange is a very safe and relatively easy way to get gifts for gold. If you're aware of this and still go to zone to hunt a deal, then there is obviously a much higher chance of being scammed.

At some point, hopefully ZOS will fully integrate a trade system to make it safer for all, but for now, there is a great community providing this service and it's a very good alternative to risking zone trades.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/430760/discord-tamriel-crown-exchange-crown-store-items-for-gold-over-1-mil-crowns-traded

themaddaedra

redspecter23 wrote: »

Tamriel Crown Exchange is a very safe and relatively easy way to get gifts for gold. If you're aware of this and still go to zone to hunt a deal, then there is obviously a much higher chance of being scammed.

At some point, hopefully ZOS will fully integrate a trade system to make it safer for all, but for now, there is a great community providing this service and it's a very good alternative to risking zone trades.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/430760/discord-tamriel-crown-exchange-crown-store-items-for-gold-over-1-mil-crowns-traded

I know what TCE is ^^

redspecter23

themaddaedra wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

Tamriel Crown Exchange is a very safe and relatively easy way to get gifts for gold. If you're aware of this and still go to zone to hunt a deal, then there is obviously a much higher chance of being scammed.

At some point, hopefully ZOS will fully integrate a trade system to make it safer for all, but for now, there is a great community providing this service and it's a very good alternative to risking zone trades.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/430760/discord-tamriel-crown-exchange-crown-store-items-for-gold-over-1-mil-crowns-traded

I know what TCE is ^^

I figured as much, but more links to these awesome guys can never hurt. Anyone reading this looking for the safest way to avoid getting scammed should check it out. I've turned my gold into about 20,000 crowns worth of items so far through them and not a single issue.

Tandor

It beats me why people don't just play the game, instead of doing all this fancy gifting and trading with funny handshakes and goodness knows what else !

Sheezabeast

leepalmer95 wrote: »

ssorgatem wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

It's still a bit strange that you can literally use money to get in game currency and everyone accepts this.

Then say the game isn't p2w at all..

Most BiS sets for most builds cannot be bought in any way.

No but the tempers can.

Most bis sets also require dlc.
Bis skills for endgame pvp and pve require dlc's.
Jewellery crafting is tied to dlc
Trans is tied to dlc.


Someone with the base game is at a very noticeable disadvantage vs someone with all the dlc's.

Actually, anyone with a crafter can get crafting writs to buy the transmutation station from the vendor in Mournhold, or buy one from a guild trader. And anyone can acquire transmutation crystals.

themaddaedra

Tandor wrote: »

It beats me why people don't just play the game, instead of doing all this fancy gifting and trading with funny handshakes and goodness knows what else !

What makes you think that i don't play the game? Strange assumption lol.

themaddaedra

redspecter23 wrote: »

themaddaedra wrote: »

redspecter23 wrote: »

Tamriel Crown Exchange is a very safe and relatively easy way to get gifts for gold. If you're aware of this and still go to zone to hunt a deal, then there is obviously a much higher chance of being scammed.

At some point, hopefully ZOS will fully integrate a trade system to make it safer for all, but for now, there is a great community providing this service and it's a very good alternative to risking zone trades.

https://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/430760/discord-tamriel-crown-exchange-crown-store-items-for-gold-over-1-mil-crowns-traded

I know what TCE is ^^

I figured as much, but more links to these awesome guys can never hurt. Anyone reading this looking for the safest way to avoid getting scammed should check it out. I've turned my gold into about 20,000 crowns worth of items so far through them and not a single issue.

Knowing that this is not an advertisment thread wouldn’t also hurt

JKorr

leepalmer95 wrote: »

It's still a bit strange that you can literally use money to get in game currency and everyone accepts this.

Then say the game isn't p2w at all..

You know, I have yet to get a good explanation of how having shedloads of gold is "winning" anything.

Although I guess, if you find an emperor who is willing to allow you to kill him if you pay him off, it could be "winning". The bis weapons, armor, shoulders and helms are bound to player, so they can't be sold. Being able to acquire every motif in the game doesn't do anything for "winning". Even being able to buy all the perfect roe for ambrosia means nothing. There is no uber rare almost unobtainable craftable set that is super uber overpowered totally invincible that some crafter could charge millions of gold for. Nothing that can be bought in the crown store or in the game for gold will instantly win you trials, pledges, or put you at the top of the leaderboards.

There are players who have multiple tens/hundreds of millions of gold. Afaik that gives them bragging rights, and allows the purchase of some of the houses in the game. Whether that is p2w or not though is questionable.

Tandor

themaddaedra wrote: »

Tandor wrote: »

It beats me why people don't just play the game, instead of doing all this fancy gifting and trading with funny handshakes and goodness knows what else !

What makes you think that i don't play the game? Strange assumption lol.

I never suggested otherwise, hence my using the word "just".

HidesFromSun

Wait, so crowns for gold exchange is legit? I've contact customer support about this and they told me it was a violation of their Terms of Service?

The exact quote was:
'The collection of gold to sell to other players for real world money, however, is a violation of our Terms of Service.'

Have I missed something?

themaddaedra

Derlfak wrote: »

Wait, so crowns for gold exchange is legit? I've contact customer support about this and they told me it was a violation of their Terms of Service?

The exact quote was:
'The collection of gold to sell to other players for real world money, however, is a violation of our Terms of Service.'

Have I missed something?

The whole answer said trading in-game items for in-game items is legit -and it also said crown items are in-game items.

But trading them for real money is a violation.

themaddaedra

Streega wrote: »

Because there is no money for ZOS in it? Also, what silvermistktralasub17_ESO said above.

There's way too much money for ZOS in it lol.

ictopbasli

Unfortunately there is no actual trading system in this game. You can't sell most of item. Too bad for this game and players.

LordSarevok

Don't worry. It probably won't last long anyway. Gambling commissions are cracking down on loot box's and real life money for virtual item trading. Pretty soon Crown Crates and the gift able option may very well be illegal.

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2018-04-25-three-industry-leading-publishers-found-in-breach-of-belgian-gambling-laws

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-43906306

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGJx_QwN4S8

https://metro.co.uk/2018/09/17/15-countries-including-uk-join-forces-to-tackle-loot-boxes-7952253/

redspecter23

Tandor wrote: »

It beats me why people don't just play the game, instead of doing all this fancy gifting and trading with funny handshakes and goodness knows what else !

The issue comes when you define how you play the game. PvP'ers play differently than PvE'ers who play differently than roleplayers who play differently than those that choose to buy and sell in game a lot. There are many different ways to play the game and often these playstyles overlap. If someone chooses to play the game with "fancy gifting" and "funny handshakes" they are still playing the game though it may not be exactly the way you choose to play the game. They are still having fun.

HidesFromSun

themaddaedra wrote: »

Derlfak wrote: »

Wait, so crowns for gold exchange is legit? I've contact customer support about this and they told me it was a violation of their Terms of Service?

The exact quote was:
'The collection of gold to sell to other players for real world money, however, is a violation of our Terms of Service.'

Have I missed something?

The whole answer said trading in-game items for in-game items is legit -and it also said crown items are in-game items.

But trading them for real money is a violation.

Ahhh ok that makes sense, thank you

themaddaedra

LordSarevok wrote: »

Don't worry. It probably won't last long anyway. Gambling commissions are cracking down on loot box's and real life money for virtual item trading. Pretty soon Crown Crates and the gift able option may very well be illegal.

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2018-04-25-three-industry-leading-publishers-found-in-breach-of-belgian-gambling-laws

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-43906306

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGJx_QwN4S8

https://metro.co.uk/2018/09/17/15-countries-including-uk-join-forces-to-tackle-loot-boxes-7952253/

Yes i've seen this coming as well. Curious if it will hit ESO too.

idk

LordSarevok wrote: »

Don't worry. It probably won't last long anyway. Gambling commissions are cracking down on loot box's and real life money for virtual item trading. Pretty soon Crown Crates and the gift able option may very well be illegal.

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2018-04-25-three-industry-leading-publishers-found-in-breach-of-belgian-gambling-laws

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-43906306

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGJx_QwN4S8

https://metro.co.uk/2018/09/17/15-countries-including-uk-join-forces-to-tackle-loot-boxes-7952253/

@LordSarevok

Pretty sure the cash shop or gifting isn’t going away. You might want to read what you actually linked. My guess is you just wanted to plug that there is a possibility crates will be legislated in a widespread manner. Might.