Combat Designers Need More Presence in the Forums

WuffyCerulei

It's quite clear that there's a bit of misunderstanding between the combat designers at ZOS and the playerbase, even with the class rep program. The shield cast time isn't what players want. The class rep were completely in the dark about it. Some agree with the change, but the vast majority don't. I think if Wrobel and the gang conversed more with the players here and explain/discuss changes, there would be less miscommunication and bad choices. I see people like the dungeon/gameplay/zone/etc., developers often come on and say their intentions, ideas, processes, and whatnot when the thread is relevant to them. However, I don't see the combat designers partake in discussion. Not in ages. Combat is what makes ESO fun and interesting. It's not slow and calculated like other MMOs. ESO's fast pace combat is what draws people in. Making changes that slow or drastically alter combat and not talk to the community about it does not help the game. So please, Wrobel, Gilliam, and others, please be more vocal and proactive on the forums.


On a side note, other players, please leave Gina and Jessica alone. They may be the faces of the ESO community and are the most active devs here, but they're not responsible for making gameplay and combat decisions.

VaranisArano

I suspect there's also a disconnect between players and the combat team.

Players seem to struggle with the idea that the combat team might implement things that players don't like.

The Great Sustain Nerfs of Morrowind were an example. Most players did not like it, the devs did it anyway. Why?

Because the game needed an overall DPS nerf or else ZOS was going to have to design harder content and the gulf between new players and top tier end game was going to get bigger. End game players found ZOS' hardest content to be easy peasy lemon squeezy and the, wondered why we got a huge DPS nerf.

We're in the same boat now. ZOS recently buffed light attack DPS. We knew we were due for a DPS nerf soon. ZOS just chose to take aim at MA and LA survivability by taking out passive dodge and damage shields.

The Devs on the combat team have different priorities than players. They have to consider how current DPS impacts furture game content and they do make changes to nerf players if the power creep gets too high.

Zoal_AUG

SpiderCultist

This is a snowball rolling down a hill that will hit us all sooner or later (including those that rejoice now) but ESO is made by these devs, let them "adjust" it however they want until most of people realize and leave because it's quite clear they don't listen to the community feedback. There's a BIG gap between what community wants and what devs (combat designers) do.

With the announced changes for Murkmire I've seriously lost faith in ESO, the only thing they do is releasing OP sets every DLC that eventually get nerfed and unasked-for changes. Other people saw this before us and left.

Turelus

We've been pushing for better forums presence since launch but it's sadly never happened.

We've had some moments when it's perked up, Wheeler has been good in the past with a number of PvP threads. I would wonder though how things would go if Wrobel or a member of his team did come on the forums though, look how much abuse people already get and they're not the people who proposed the changes.

We have the class reps program now which is a better connection, but I think if we ever want the dream of full developer/community interaction ZOS needs to give developers the means to go say what they need and we as a community need to learn to be critical without toxicity.

srfrogg23

I'm sure they do read it. There's a lot of threads about "this game is too easy", "not enough build variety", "sorcs are easy mode", "shield stacking is OP", etc.

Well, they are trying to kill all those birds with one stone. And, here's the thing, for all the vitriol coming from sorcs on the forums, you're not the only ones who are going to have to reassess your build strategies.

There are hefty changes being made to a lot of our classes that will shake up the META a lot. Calm down. It's an iterative process. If the changes don't work, Zos will try something else.

Morgul667

The recent changes make it obvious they are nor playing the game nor able to witstand an argument about the changes

Toxicity is no excuse for what they are doing. Sure people have heated discussion but this is because they care about the game and most changes make no sense at all. Witnessing this and being ingored all the time kind of explains people comments

If they were actually communicating or making small changes every week instead of crazy changes every 3 months, things would go a long way.

One can dream

WuffyCerulei

Turelus wrote: »

We've been pushing for better forums presence since launch but it's sadly never happened.

We've had some moments when it's perked up, Wheeler has been good in the past with a number of PvP threads. I would wonder though how things would go if Wrobel or a member of his team did come on the forums though, look how much abuse people already get and they're not the people who proposed the changes.

We have the class reps program now which is a better connection, but I think if we ever want the dream of full developer/community interaction ZOS needs to give developers the means to go say what they need and we as a community need to learn to be critical without toxicity.

I do agree that we all have to learn to communicate with the devs better than cocaine-fueled screeching monkeys throwing our feces everywhere. I can understand why they would hestitate to talk if people only harrass them instead of being civil. They are humans, and people tend to forget that.

Gnozo

Like @Morgul667 already mentioned. Community is toxic cause we get ignored all the time. Somehow only special member can talk to the devs (class reps) and even they get ignored when it comes to real changes in the game.

This just feels like we, as the community, are only good enough for throwing money at them while they do what they want this the game and ignoring our concerns and wishes for the game.

This is frustrating for players that love this game. And from frustration and ignorence comes hate and toxic comments/discussions.

So i would say its their own fault.

Turelus

Gnozo wrote: »

Like Morgul667 already mentioned. Community is toxic cause we get ignored all the time. Somehow only special member can talk to the devs (class reps) and even they get ignored when it comes to real changes in the game.

This just feels like we, as the community, are only good enough for throwing money at them while they do what they want this the game and ignoring our concerns and wishes for the game.

This is frustrating for players that love this game. And from frustration and ignorence comes hate and toxic comments/discussions.

So i would say its their own fault.

It's on ZOS to try and show we're important and listened to, however no matter how little communication you get from a dev team toxic replies and attacks should never be just.
They have in the last year made a much better effort via different means and we see more information now than we did a year ago, people shouldn't forget the progress we've gained.
I fully understand peoples frustrations, we've all been there and been slapped in the face with changes in this game, however it's better to try and be calm, rational and debate why an idea is bad rather than just drum up more hatred and anger by posting things which encourage it.

Jameliel

Most design in this game is rancid ass. (the mule type creature; making this clear so I don't get weird messages from mods, though since everyone has freewill, you're free to envision any type of image you choose)

The mechanics all consist of colored circles, and mini messages popping up on the screen(dungeon design team are colored circle geniuses). The skills are all clunky, even more so if you live outside "Murica", and have to play with ping between 300-500. Loads of useless or near useless sets. A nearly useless skill line involving soul stones...

Cyrodiil and sieging is great as a concept. At times it can be fun, but it's mostly the same exact builds, running the same exact skills. All the lag and other bugs ruin it. I think more people play because their friends/guildies play, than for any other reason these days.

Anyone who has ever played DDO, EQ, Sony's VG, Age of Conan or even Runescape can attest that ESO has sloppy design. There are always a few exceptions, but most people singing praises to this game have never really played another MMO for any length of time. MMO's are mostly utter crap these days, and ESO glaringly carries the crap torch.

It's just one of those "coulda/woulda/shoulda been" games. Massive amount of content, but watered down and with sloppy design.

Morgul667

Turelus wrote: »

Gnozo wrote: »

Like Morgul667 already mentioned. Community is toxic cause we get ignored all the time. Somehow only special member can talk to the devs (class reps) and even they get ignored when it comes to real changes in the game.

This just feels like we, as the community, are only good enough for throwing money at them while they do what they want this the game and ignoring our concerns and wishes for the game.

This is frustrating for players that love this game. And from frustration and ignorence comes hate and toxic comments/discussions.

So i would say its their own fault.

It's on ZOS to try and show we're important and listened to, however no matter how little communication you get from a dev team toxic replies and attacks should never be just.
They have in the last year made a much better effort via different means and we see more information now than we did a year ago, people shouldn't forget the progress we've gained.
I fully understand peoples frustrations, we've all been there and been slapped in the face with changes in this game, however it's better to try and be calm, rational and debate why an idea is bad rather than just drum up more hatred and anger by posting things which encourage it.

I agree it is not right to be harsh with them

But ignoring people about bugs major issues and major balance issues is zos way of working and they cannot blame others for their own failure

They have to take a few hits and try to communicate more... even if it not pleasant at first. I thought they were trying.... they even have a class rep system. I liked the job done by the team but ZOS still managed to mess it up

Bevik

Turelus wrote: »

We've been pushing for better forums presence since launch but it's sadly never happened.

We've had some moments when it's perked up, Wheeler has been good in the past with a number of PvP threads. I would wonder though how things would go if Wrobel or a member of his team did come on the forums though, look how much abuse people already get and they're not the people who proposed the changes.

We have the class reps program now which is a better connection, but I think if we ever want the dream of full developer/community interaction ZOS needs to give developers the means to go say what they need and we as a community need to learn to be critical without toxicity.

Love when someone from a Dev team explains things to everyone on the forum. That really should happen as Wheeler did and the tech guy about graphics, can't remember his name sorry. But was really nice to see and read something from a Dev who can really working on these things.

The big problem is they probably don't have much time to write on forums and the other thing is there are too many crybabies on the forum. Nerf this, nerf that, I don't like this, I don't like that etc.

ScardyFox

Gnozo wrote: »

Like @Morgul667 already mentioned. Community is toxic cause we get ignored all the time. Somehow only special member can talk to the devs (class reps) and even they get ignored when it comes to real changes in the game.

This just feels like we, as the community, are only good enough for throwing money at them while they do what they want this the game and ignoring our concerns and wishes for the game.

This is frustrating for players that love this game. And from frustration and ignorence comes hate and toxic comments/discussions.

So i would say its their own fault.

This is true. I've been here since the beginning basically. I remember one time I counted the number of days in post that the werewolf thread was ignored, when we were just asking for basic things to be addressed. All we wanted to do was just be acknowledged in the most simple way akin to someone saying we know something is wrong.

Finally someone from the dev team did respond by telling me to stop posting. Granted, I was being obnoxious (I would post Day: 10 still no one has responded) but I wanted to illustrate a point. This was years ago now, so I don't remember what number I got to. Anyway, as aforementioned, when someone did respond I was told to zip it and not a single thing was acknowledged other then me pointing out how many times no one responded to us.

At that time, it was basically the reason me and 40 members of our old guild left ESO and went to FF14. We simply had enough of being ignored. Now, I come and go until I get sick of the bugs in the game. That said, this has been the case since day one of the game (when I started) and I doubt it will ever change.

xxthir13enxx

“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”

Niemöller

Emma_Overload

I don't think the "combat team" or any other ZOS developers are behind these horrific nerfs, it's merely their job to implement them.

I suspect that the mandate for these nerfs and also the dumb Xv1 gear sets like Sload's and Anguish comes from higher up. I think that ZOS executives, whose names we don't know because we never see them, are behind all of this crap.

When you look at all the nerfs and other crazy decisions put together, it's clear that ZOS hates skilled players, 1vXers and "potato mashers". It's equally clear that ZOS loves newbies, potatoes and zergs.

This is why Sorcerers are getting nerfed. NOT because we are overpowered (we certainly are not), but because we are good at killing newbies and bad players (if not much else). Why is this a problem? I suspect that some bean counters at ZOS HQ have determined, rightly or wrongly, that crappy players and n00bs are more PROFITABLE. Maybe they buy more stuff in the Crown Store... who knows?

Unfortunately, there could be a perception among the powers-that-be that newbies get frustrated and quit ESO altogether when they get 1vXed by a skilled player. This is really bad news for Sorcs because we have a bad reputation for this due to all the 1vX videos on YouTube.

What do you guys think? Are Sorcs getting nerfed to death because we mashed too many potatoes?

jcm2606

VaranisArano wrote: »

I suspect there's also a disconnect between players and the combat team.

Players seem to struggle with the idea that the combat team might implement things that players don't like.

The Great Sustain Nerfs of Morrowind were an example. Most players did not like it, the devs did it anyway. Why?

Because the game needed an overall DPS nerf or else ZOS was going to have to design harder content and the gulf between new players and top tier end game was going to get bigger. End game players found ZOS' hardest content to be easy peasy lemon squeezy and the, wondered why we got a huge DPS nerf.

We're in the same boat now. ZOS recently buffed light attack DPS. We knew we were due for a DPS nerf soon. ZOS just chose to take aim at MA and LA survivability by taking out passive dodge and damage shields.

The Devs on the combat team have different priorities than players. They have to consider how current DPS impacts furture game content and they do make changes to nerf players if the power creep gets too high.

You just highlighted how backwards Zenimax's logic can be, though. DPS is getting out of hand, so we're going to nerf... sustain and survivability? If DPS is getting out of hand, you bring DPS back in line, you don't nerf things entirely unrelated, especially in the way that Zenimax nerfs things.

Rak_am

Emma_Overload wrote: »

I don't think the "combat team" or any other ZOS developers are behind these horrific nerfs, it's merely their job to implement them.

I suspect that the mandate for these nerfs and also the dumb Xv1 gear sets like Sload's and Anguish comes from higher up. I think that ZOS executives, whose names we don't know because we never see them, are behind all of this crap.

When you look at all the nerfs and other crazy decisions put together, it's clear that ZOS hates skilled players, 1vXers and "potato mashers". It's equally clear that ZOS loves newbies, potatoes and zergs.

This is why Sorcerers are getting nerfed. NOT because we are overpowered (we certainly are not), but because we are good at killing newbies and bad players (if not much else). Why is this a problem? I suspect that some bean counters at ZOS HQ have determined, rightly or wrongly, that crappy players and n00bs are more PROFITABLE. Maybe they buy more stuff in the Crown Store... who knows?

Unfortunately, there could be a perception among the powers-that-be that newbies get frustrated and quit ESO altogether when they get 1vXed by a skilled player. This is really bad news for Sorcs because we have a bad reputation for this due to all the 1vX videos on YouTube.

What do you guys think? Are Sorcs getting nerfed to death because we mashed too many potatoes?

+1000 (the fault of operational marketing ..)

Gnozo

Emma_Overload wrote: »

I don't think the "combat team" or any other ZOS developers are behind these horrific nerfs, it's merely their job to implement them.

I suspect that the mandate for these nerfs and also the dumb Xv1 gear sets like Sload's and Anguish comes from higher up. I think that ZOS executives, whose names we don't know because we never see them, are behind all of this crap.

When you look at all the nerfs and other crazy decisions put together, it's clear that ZOS hates skilled players, 1vXers and "potato mashers". It's equally clear that ZOS loves newbies, potatoes and zergs.

This is why Sorcerers are getting nerfed. NOT because we are overpowered (we certainly are not), but because we are good at killing newbies and bad players (if not much else). Why is this a problem? I suspect that some bean counters at ZOS HQ have determined, rightly or wrongly, that crappy players and n00bs are more PROFITABLE. Maybe they buy more stuff in the Crown Store... who knows?

Unfortunately, there could be a perception among the powers-that-be that newbies get frustrated and quit ESO altogether when they get 1vXed by a skilled player. This is really bad news for Sorcs because we have a bad reputation for this due to all the 1vX videos on YouTube.

What do you guys think? Are Sorcs getting nerfed to death because we mashed too many potatoes?

Ye, thats what i also think. Sorc are mediocore in pvp. Except bursting pugs. And then they come to forums and complain about Sorc being OP and they can´t touch their HP due to shields and huuuuuuge burst.

Ofc your light attack spam with a Bow wont cut through shields. And the Armor you can buy from NPC´s will not help you in this case. But you cant help them, they will get 1vXed and will cry about it cause they dont understand the game. They play casual and players who put time and effort in this game will kill them. No matter what.

Bad thing is, that ZOS only cares about these players. Not the skilled ones, who btw also spend a lot money on crown store.

Darkenarlol

just imagine that you are a combat dev...you are planning to implement some big changes to the game

mechanics which gonna totally shake current meta.


you woke up in the morning in great mood after long working week, grabbed your coffee and it's time to check

some forums...what do you see there? hundreds of people calls you names and demands your retirement instead of

appreciating the results of your hard long job which you are proud of. where is your good mood now? after being

called %$^*&*& three hundred times?


do you have any willing to talk to them after that?

to people who don't ask about why you want this changes -

they just call you names...so you remain silent


maybe i'm wrong but just imagine it for a second

Liofa

From what I understand, they want to do things their own way. They specifically mentioned to us that suggestions are not what they are looking for. They basically wanted us to point the biggest problems so they can prioterize them.

For example, we said PvE sustain balance is absolutely terrible, nightblades should be the beacon of gameplay and other classes should be more in line with nightblades by buffing. What ZOS did was nerfing everything but especially nightblades to put classes in line. We've shown them what top PvE players think. They want sustain, not damage. Some classes can't sustain a light attack rotation without using Equilibrium. I think that says more than enough. But they buffed damage again by a huge amount. I mean, a 15 minutes Speed Run is being cleared in 7 minutes due to absurd amount of damage and they keep buffing damage. I don't see the logic.

Some of the buffs don't even make sense to me. For example, pet buffs are absolutely out of time. This is not Homestead anymore. Pets cannot even be used in trials due to stun mechanics and they die all the time. Sorcerer sustain is so disgustingly bad on live server, you can't even shoot a procced Crystal Fragment in a two minute fight. Funny enough, their spammable got a 10% cost increase. If these changes go live, Sorcerers are dead for not only PvP but also PvE.

I can say a lot more but I don't want to keep this long. Sadly, we don't know more than you do. I wish we did so we could have some discussions with them before they pushed these not very thoughtful changes.

OutLaw_Nynx

I don’t blame them for not wanting to post here. People are toxic and incredibly hostile on here at times. I wouldn’t want to deal with it.

LadyNalcarya

Emma_Overload wrote: »

I don't think the "combat team" or any other ZOS developers are behind these horrific nerfs, it's merely their job to implement them.

I suspect that the mandate for these nerfs and also the dumb Xv1 gear sets like Sload's and Anguish comes from higher up. I think that ZOS executives, whose names we don't know because we never see them, are behind all of this crap.

When you look at all the nerfs and other crazy decisions put together, it's clear that ZOS hates skilled players, 1vXers and "potato mashers". It's equally clear that ZOS loves newbies, potatoes and zergs.

This is why Sorcerers are getting nerfed. NOT because we are overpowered (we certainly are not), but because we are good at killing newbies and bad players (if not much else). Why is this a problem? I suspect that some bean counters at ZOS HQ have determined, rightly or wrongly, that crappy players and n00bs are more PROFITABLE. Maybe they buy more stuff in the Crown Store... who knows?

Unfortunately, there could be a perception among the powers-that-be that newbies get frustrated and quit ESO altogether when they get 1vXed by a skilled player. This is really bad news for Sorcs because we have a bad reputation for this due to all the 1vX videos on YouTube.

What do you guys think? Are Sorcs getting nerfed to death because we mashed too many potatoes?

Maybe that's true, but stuff like Sload's or Soldier is also something premade groups use against newbs. No way a newb can survive when there's a few sloads on them and they cant heal.
Sorc might be a good newb killer class, but it's also one of the best starter classes because it has shields and pets, it's very easy to play on an average level.
So even if these ideas come from higher-ups, they should be implemented in a way that doesnt destroy casual players. Devs must remember that heavy handed nerfs harm casual players more than anyone because they have less means to adapt and less motivation to do so, unlike more dedicated players.

VaranisArano

jcm2606 wrote: »

VaranisArano wrote: »

I suspect there's also a disconnect between players and the combat team.

Players seem to struggle with the idea that the combat team might implement things that players don't like.

The Great Sustain Nerfs of Morrowind were an example. Most players did not like it, the devs did it anyway. Why?

Because the game needed an overall DPS nerf or else ZOS was going to have to design harder content and the gulf between new players and top tier end game was going to get bigger. End game players found ZOS' hardest content to be easy peasy lemon squeezy and the, wondered why we got a huge DPS nerf.

We're in the same boat now. ZOS recently buffed light attack DPS. We knew we were due for a DPS nerf soon. ZOS just chose to take aim at MA and LA survivability by taking out passive dodge and damage shields.

The Devs on the combat team have different priorities than players. They have to consider how current DPS impacts furture game content and they do make changes to nerf players if the power creep gets too high.

You just highlighted how backwards Zenimax's logic can be, though. DPS is getting out of hand, so we're going to nerf... sustain and survivability? If DPS is getting out of hand, you bring DPS back in line, you don't nerf things entirely unrelated, especially in the way that Zenimax nerfs things.

Its not unrelated. Just not obviously related.

DPS dropped after Morrowind, as ZOS intended. That was directly due to the sustain changes. What good is a high damage rotation if you can't sustain it through the whole fight?

That's had some extra effects, btw, like the end game dominance of Redguard and Altmer for stam and mag classes, thanks to that extra sustain, or Argonian for the passive.

In the same way, having to dodge roll or take a cast time in order to shield is a DPS loss compared to passive dodge and instant shields, in addition to the extra proactive healing players will need since they can't just shield.

This lets ZOS nerf DPS without saying "Your skills do less damage." Morrowind was more "you need to do a sustainable amount of damage" and this patch is currently "You need to spend more time surviving and less time doing damage."

Avnr

maybe devs can make build and gameplay movie?
I will pay to see them pvp with no shields

Turelus

Avnr wrote: »

maybe devs can make build and gameplay movie?
I will pay to see them pvp with no shields

So they just have to make some Stamina PvP characters and you'll pay them for it?

albesca

Emma_Overload wrote: »

I don't think the "combat team" or any other ZOS developers are behind these horrific nerfs, it's merely their job to implement them.

I suspect that the mandate for these nerfs and also the dumb Xv1 gear sets like Sload's and Anguish comes from higher up. I think that ZOS executives, whose names we don't know because we never see them, are behind all of this crap.

When you look at all the nerfs and other crazy decisions put together, it's clear that ZOS hates skilled players, 1vXers and "potato mashers". It's equally clear that ZOS loves newbies, potatoes and zergs.

This is why Sorcerers are getting nerfed. NOT because we are overpowered (we certainly are not), but because we are good at killing newbies and bad players (if not much else). Why is this a problem? I suspect that some bean counters at ZOS HQ have determined, rightly or wrongly, that crappy players and n00bs are more PROFITABLE. Maybe they buy more stuff in the Crown Store... who knows?

Unfortunately, there could be a perception among the powers-that-be that newbies get frustrated and quit ESO altogether when they get 1vXed by a skilled player. This is really bad news for Sorcs because we have a bad reputation for this due to all the 1vX videos on YouTube.

What do you guys think? Are Sorcs getting nerfed to death because we mashed too many potatoes?

If there's 1 masher for any 10 potatoes (totally made up figures, I don't have any kind of statistic at hand) it makes sense to try and please the latter, I'd think.

We forum dwellers are a minority (a small one, I think) of the player base; a minority of this, the skilled forum dweller, thinks of themselves as the "community" that combat developers should listen to when making any change to the system; only, this community is really two different and opposing groups (endgame PVErs and PVPrs) within which there's a wide variety of opinions.

I'm not saying that developers should steer clear of the forum, but really, every one of us, however informed, competent and committed to the game, should put his own opinion in perspective.

aeowulf

VaranisArano wrote: »

I suspect there's also a disconnect between players and the combat team.

Players seem to struggle with the idea that the combat team might implement things that players don't like.

The Great Sustain Nerfs of Morrowind were an example. Most players did not like it, the devs did it anyway. Why?

Because the game needed an overall DPS nerf or else ZOS was going to have to design harder content and the gulf between new players and top tier end game was going to get bigger. End game players found ZOS' hardest content to be easy peasy lemon squeezy and the, wondered why we got a huge DPS nerf.

We're in the same boat now. ZOS recently buffed light attack DPS. We knew we were due for a DPS nerf soon. ZOS just chose to take aim at MA and LA survivability by taking out passive dodge and damage shields.

The Devs on the combat team have different priorities than players. They have to consider how current DPS impacts furture game content and they do make changes to nerf players if the power creep gets too high.

Might sound like a silly question, but if the game needed a DPS nerf, why didn't they nerf DPS?

Nerfing sustain in an attempt to nerf DPS is counter-intuitive and highly ineffective, as shown by the results of those changes. The DPS of some classes was barely touched if the correct race was chosen, and the viability of some (mostly non DPS) roles were removed from some classes. If I remember correctly, the DPS of Stamina NB actually went up with Morrowind due to some of the other changes or sets brought in. (as in the DPS of 'the best of the best' players)

Those changes actually widened the gap between a new or inexperienced players and one that has perfected his rotation & gear.

Urvoth

Morgul667 wrote: »

The recent changes make it obvious they are nor playing the game nor able to witstand an argument about the changes

Toxicity is no excuse for what they are doing. Sure people have heated discussion but this is because they care about the game and most changes make no sense at all. Witnessing this and being ingored all the time kind of explains people comments

If they were actually communicating or making small changes every week instead of crazy changes every 3 months, things would go a long way.

One can dream

Yeah, small gradual changes are the way to go. They're easier to test out and go back on than massive quarterly nukes. That's why many PvP-centric games do weekly or biweekly updates, with many of the updates doing nothing but slightly changing changing damage numbers, etc.

LadyNalcarya

albesca wrote: »

Emma_Overload wrote: »

I don't think the "combat team" or any other ZOS developers are behind these horrific nerfs, it's merely their job to implement them.

I suspect that the mandate for these nerfs and also the dumb Xv1 gear sets like Sload's and Anguish comes from higher up. I think that ZOS executives, whose names we don't know because we never see them, are behind all of this crap.

When you look at all the nerfs and other crazy decisions put together, it's clear that ZOS hates skilled players, 1vXers and "potato mashers". It's equally clear that ZOS loves newbies, potatoes and zergs.

This is why Sorcerers are getting nerfed. NOT because we are overpowered (we certainly are not), but because we are good at killing newbies and bad players (if not much else). Why is this a problem? I suspect that some bean counters at ZOS HQ have determined, rightly or wrongly, that crappy players and n00bs are more PROFITABLE. Maybe they buy more stuff in the Crown Store... who knows?

Unfortunately, there could be a perception among the powers-that-be that newbies get frustrated and quit ESO altogether when they get 1vXed by a skilled player. This is really bad news for Sorcs because we have a bad reputation for this due to all the 1vX videos on YouTube.

What do you guys think? Are Sorcs getting nerfed to death because we mashed too many potatoes?

If there's 1 masher for any 10 potatoes (totally made up figures, I don't have any kind of statistic at hand) it makes sense to try and please the latter, I'd think.

We forum dwellers are a minority (a small one, I think) of the player base; a minority of this, the skilled forum dweller, thinks of themselves as the "community" that combat developers should listen to when making any change to the system; only, this community is really two different and opposing groups (endgame PVErs and PVPrs) within which there's a wide variety of opinions.

I'm not saying that developers should steer clear of the forum, but really, every one of us, however informed, competent and committed to the game, should put his own opinion in perspective.

Thats true, but sorc class is popular amongst those "potatoes" and they also die to sloads and such.
The thing is, less dedicated players have less motivation to "adapt" than "potato mashers". Those mashers are more invested in the game and are more affected by sunk cost fallacy. Casuals, on the other hand, will just quit the game if their class is destroyed, they have no time to level up and learn another class.

JD2013

If you absolutely need to blame someone, you can blame the Champion Point system.

Since the beginning, the whole system was a bad idea.

We keep getting artificial increases every major update. That adds 120 points a year. Take into account that overland content is a mostly static 160 CP difficulty. They tweak difficulty up on trials etc but with this (even trivial) increase every year, they have to do things to compensate for the fact that anyone at around 300-400 CP is overpowered. At cap you’re vastly overpowered. This is without sets etc.

This is why, in my opinion, they have to make such sweeping changes.

CP was a bad idea at inception and it’s likely going to be like this forever.

Scrapping the CP system would certainly help the combat team.