Why we don't have a global AH?

Facefister

they want a trading system that makes ESO distinct from other mmorpg

How else you're going to keep a Cornflower stack at 60k gold? An global AH would mean much cheaper prices which also means that crown potions wont be sold so good.

kargen27

Linaleah wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Cpt_Teemo wrote: »

idk wrote: »

OP has not provided the real answer for us to choose from.

The answer is Zos chose to work with a guild trader system. After launch they did a major tweak to it. Since then it has been clear the current system has successfully provided ESO a vibrant and healthy economy which of course is the goal.

It's not even the same light as a "Healthy" economy. Even a centralized auction house has a more vibrant and healthy economy than this failed garbage.

ESO clearly has a very healthy economy. It has served ESO and the community very well which is why it has lasted as long.

One thing for certain, no one has provided a worthy reason for changing it.

people HAVE provided worthy reasons for changing it. you just don't accept them as worthy.

here are a few.

ability for more convenient shopping that doesn't require you run all over the world just to look for that one illusive item.

more stable prices across the board instead of having to severely underprice your goods if you just so happen to be located outside of the few central locations with the most traffic, while prices in those locations are higher - convenience cost.

ability to list and sell your goods without needing to be in a guild just to sell your goods - and as an extension - ability to sell casually instead of having to chose between consistent sales that come with minimum weekly sales and/or extra fees, or ability to sell casually... maybe... at some point .. if someone accidentally comes across your vendor at some point before item expires... or if you list at a low enough price to make it attractive for reseller.


the ONLY real reason to keep this system vs centralized auction house is there are almost no consistent gold sinks in this game outside of trader bids, and its what's keeping inflation manageable. ZoS would have to do a LOT of changing to compensate for gold no longer leaving economy should trader bids no longer be a thing. easier to just keep the system as is. unfortunately.

at this point the best I personaly hope for is that they fix the damn UI so that consoles also have a benefit of search window as well as better more extensive search terms, while PC no longer needs to use an addon for it.

Sure those sound like fine reasons but then reality kicks in and the common items are almost worthless while the rare drops are being monopolized by a few individuals with nothing but time on their hands. All the current system needs is an intuitive search inside the guild trader menu.

That aside taking out the guild trader system now would be akin to deciding to remove all the trials. For a lot of players the part of the game they enjoy most is buying and selling.

shadowwraith666

AnonomissX wrote: »

No, I cannot use an add-on or mod. I am on an Xbox One, NA server. How about you think before you speak.

neither console can use addons and the tamriel trade centre website https://tamrieltradecentre.com/

is primarily pc orientated since the xbox and ps4 sections have virtually no listings at all on both NA and EU.

Linaleah

I have different opinions (please comment)

kargen27 wrote: »

Linaleah wrote: »

idk wrote: »

Cpt_Teemo wrote: »

idk wrote: »

OP has not provided the real answer for us to choose from.

The answer is Zos chose to work with a guild trader system. After launch they did a major tweak to it. Since then it has been clear the current system has successfully provided ESO a vibrant and healthy economy which of course is the goal.

It's not even the same light as a "Healthy" economy. Even a centralized auction house has a more vibrant and healthy economy than this failed garbage.

ESO clearly has a very healthy economy. It has served ESO and the community very well which is why it has lasted as long.

One thing for certain, no one has provided a worthy reason for changing it.

people HAVE provided worthy reasons for changing it. you just don't accept them as worthy.

here are a few.

ability for more convenient shopping that doesn't require you run all over the world just to look for that one illusive item.

more stable prices across the board instead of having to severely underprice your goods if you just so happen to be located outside of the few central locations with the most traffic, while prices in those locations are higher - convenience cost.

ability to list and sell your goods without needing to be in a guild just to sell your goods - and as an extension - ability to sell casually instead of having to chose between consistent sales that come with minimum weekly sales and/or extra fees, or ability to sell casually... maybe... at some point .. if someone accidentally comes across your vendor at some point before item expires... or if you list at a low enough price to make it attractive for reseller.


the ONLY real reason to keep this system vs centralized auction house is there are almost no consistent gold sinks in this game outside of trader bids, and its what's keeping inflation manageable. ZoS would have to do a LOT of changing to compensate for gold no longer leaving economy should trader bids no longer be a thing. easier to just keep the system as is. unfortunately.

at this point the best I personaly hope for is that they fix the damn UI so that consoles also have a benefit of search window as well as better more extensive search terms, while PC no longer needs to use an addon for it.

Sure those sound like fine reasons but then reality kicks in and the common items are almost worthless while the rare drops are being monopolized by a few individuals with nothing but time on their hands. All the current system needs is an intuitive search inside the guild trader menu.

That aside taking out the guild trader system now would be akin to deciding to remove all the trials. For a lot of players the part of the game they enjoy most is buying and selling.

for the first point - not necessarily. as in... people already monopolize rare items in ESO, while common items are dirt cheap. centralized Ah is not going to do much to change that. all it will do is add convenience.

that said, I do agree that at this point taking trade system out all together will do far more harm then good and like I said in my reply, fixing UI will help at least somewhat with current issues of the existing system. what it will not fix is all the players that are excluded from selling becasue they don't sell consistently enough to be in a trading guild. not to mention.. there are fewer trading guild spots than there are players and a lot of those spots are taken up 5 at a time by a single person.

part of the reason why centralized trading or at least some sort of built in system that allows unguilded traders to participate in trading - will lower prices is becasue right now there is an artificial scarcity created by limited number of players being in trading guilds.

Jhalin

they want a trading system that makes ESO distinct from other mmorpg

Facefister wrote: »

How else you're going to keep a Cornflower stack at 60k gold? An global AH would mean much cheaper prices which also means that crown potions wont be sold so good.

No one with two brain cells to rub together would ever buy Crown store potions

Cornflower is going for 40k if you bother to venture out of hubs, which you should obviously, because out of the way places tend to have better deals, just like restaraunts in the boonies are cheaper than the ones stuck in the middle of a downtown district.


Also which of the GAH hypers are spreading crackpot theories of the “spooky GM monopoly”? Have you ever actually participated in a trade guild? Every time they open their mouths they just prove how absolutely clueless they are about trading in ESO, which leads me to believe they’ve never actually tried to l be a seller in any GAH systems.

As someone who has been a seller in GAH systems, it’s f***ing terrible. If you don’t have enough money to singlehandedly monopolize a rare item, or suck RNGesus D to get one of those rare items the monopolizers cornered for a quick payout via undercutting, then you are never going to be able to make money from the system. Common items go for less than vendor pricing due to over listing. GAH systems can be botted so easily and we still haven’t even seen ZOS mention dealing with the mat farming bots plaguing ESO. Players trying to buy will hit endless streams of “That listing is no longer available” as they struggle to compete with the entire population of NA players + the bots.

The player population gets spread out, a soft gate requiring nothing but bare minimum willingness to participate in the trader system keeps common items from being worth less than dirt, and despite the tinfoil hats theories, it’s not being “monopolized” just because some guild are more competent than yours at the buy-sell-trade game.

IwakuraLain42

Azurya wrote: »

IwakuraLain42 wrote: »

Azurya wrote: »

the only reason we don´t have an GA, is quite simple:
we have about 10 Million players and just 2 MEGASERVERS were they all are around,
if we had just an GA, for these MILLIONS of players, it would take you hours to find the things you are looking for!!!

it is now quite often a pain to find those things you are looking for, and just now we have guildtraders, but the best are already overloaded.

Your numbers are wrong: there are (according to Zenimax) approximately 1 mio regular players and they are evenly spread across 6 servers (2 regions and 3 platforms).

we just had a 10 million players event, remember!
and even then, on a WoW server were never that much players, therefor they had numerous servers and a better performance....

10 Million sold copies are not the same number of active players. If I remember correctly they said something of 1 mio active players.

Rackdaniels

How about few ”flea market” spots on major cities where casual player can atleast try to sell some valuable stuff and try earn few extra coins without making trading bigger deal.Limit selling spots maybe 1-3 would be sufficient to make little more coins now and then compared vendoring that is pretty much only money making option for us who don’t feel like joining guilds.

With my limited playing time no guild will take me in their ranks even if my bank stuff value is 300k-500k,and to be honest I have zero interest to spend my time explaining myself anyone trying to control my gaming time.I just would like to drop some items for new players or for people more interesred of full profit instead decoing or vendoring,and earn few coins.

Any one claiming this would destroy economy,think again.Vendoring gives many players just enoug gold to fix their gear and buy cheap items from guild traders.If I could earn 20k more for casual sells it would most certainly return in the pockets of guild traders,with current systems I just can dream of buying anything more than 5k worth from the guilds.

Avalon

technical issues

idk wrote: »

You have not demonstrated it is not healthy. Considering it has done so well and the economy is vibrant and robust there healthy is a good word to describe it.

You have not demonstrated that there IS a healthy economy, or that a centralized AH system leads to an unhealthy one. And, no, you don't get to rest back on laurels of "The system is what it is, until you can demonstrate otherwise..." because, like I said before on other posts, that is a no-win situation, and is the VERY reason things need changed quite often. Imagine some of the horrific things that have happened in the real world, that needed changed. If your attitude was the one everyone used and listened to, then those things would not have changed, because it is asking for an impossible thing: providing proof before it can be provided, or proof that is impossible to gain. You cannot prove that ESO has a healthy economy, because that is purely subjective, so, instead of living up to your own requirements for an argument, you instead fall back on, "It's this way, it will always be this way, deal with it". So, your arguments should be completely ignored, and not even counted. They add nothing constructive, they don't even have logic.

Actually, the fact that so many consistently ask for some form of change, the fact that there are add-ons to make the system work on PC, etc? Is proof that something needs fixed, changed. So, how about this, sit back and chill unless you can actually point to some demonstrable evidence of what you are saying.

idk wrote: »

Not necessarily and not something we will see in this game.

Granted, it is ok that you favor such a system, but I suggest getting used to the guild trader system in ESO since that is what we have and it will not be changing.

Perfect example of what I just said. When you cannot provide any form of proof for your argument, and cannot back up what you say, you resort to that form of reply, "I suggest getting used to the guild trader system in ESO since that is what we have and it will not be changing", which is not constructive, does absolutely no one any good. [snip]

[Edit to remove bait]

Abelon

I have different opinions (please comment)

All of the above to some extent.

They came up with what they believed to be an interesting trading system during game development. They could use that system to advertise the game as unique.

"If it ain't broke, don't fix it" Why waste valuable time and resources (that could be spent on crown crates) to remake or improve something a big chunk of the playerbase is okay with?

Sure, sure. Everything must be realistic. As long as we aren't talking about apex mounts that would absolutely burn or freeze your immersive butt off.

A centralized system is simpler in many ways. It is easier for a casual player to engage in. As such it is easier for the casual player to get what they want. Maybe they want to sell more crown store items keep their system more "engaging" and complex.

If they came up with the guild trader idea in the first place, why would they want to change it to some filthy global auction that has worked perfectly for every mmo ever and has never created any polls on the forums?

In the end, changing such a big part of the game is simply too risky of a move.

Cpt_Teemo

IwakuraLain42 wrote: »

Azurya wrote: »

IwakuraLain42 wrote: »

Azurya wrote: »

the only reason we don´t have an GA, is quite simple:
we have about 10 Million players and just 2 MEGASERVERS were they all are around,
if we had just an GA, for these MILLIONS of players, it would take you hours to find the things you are looking for!!!

it is now quite often a pain to find those things you are looking for, and just now we have guildtraders, but the best are already overloaded.

Your numbers are wrong: there are (according to Zenimax) approximately 1 mio regular players and they are evenly spread across 6 servers (2 regions and 3 platforms).

we just had a 10 million players event, remember!
and even then, on a WoW server were never that much players, therefor they had numerous servers and a better performance....

10 Million sold copies are not the same number of active players. If I remember correctly they said something of 1 mio active players.

I think it was around 1m per system, so 1m pc, xbox, and ps

XxCaLxX

I like the guild trader system. Non raid guilds are much more active in eso compared to other mmo’s I’ve played(in my experience. I do not speak for everyone.) I think this is mostly due to guild traders. Now I know everyone doesn’t like being in guilds so I think they should add a store to each main city on each alliance to where ppl can list 5 items for sale or 10 items for subscribers. That would be three across Tamriel so shouldn’t be break the trader system but would give ppl other options.

shadyjane62

I don't join Guilds. I vendor everything. I need an AH. The community can be toxic, I prefer not to deal with them.

ZeroXFF

I have different opinions (please comment)

Because the people who actually do trading tend to benefit from most of the players being excluded from the market, creating artificially high prices.

And no, "gold sink" is not a reasonable argument, because that "house cut" that goes to the guild could just go to nobody. And if that's not enough, it could be increased.

jedtb16_ESO

they want a trading system that makes ESO distinct from other mmorpg

ZeroXFF wrote: »

Because the people who actually do trading tend to benefit from most of the players being excluded from the market, creating artificially high prices.

And no, "gold sink" is not a reasonable argument, because that "house cut" that goes to the guild could just go to nobody. And if that's not enough, it could be increased.

the gold sink is the bid for the trader.

Varana

Rackdaniels wrote: »

How about few ”flea market” spots on major cities where casual player can atleast try to sell some valuable stuff and try earn few extra coins without making trading bigger deal.Limit selling spots maybe 1-3 would be sufficient to make little more coins now and then compared vendoring that is pretty much only money making option for us who don’t feel like joining guilds.

With my limited playing time no guild will take me in their ranks even if my bank stuff value is 300k-500k,and to be honest I have zero interest to spend my time explaining myself anyone trying to control my gaming time.I just would like to drop some items for new players or for people more interesred of full profit instead decoing or vendoring,and earn few coins.

My secondary trading guild has no minimum sales requirement or fees, has a minor trader almost every week (in the middle of nowhere but near a wayshrine), and I can use it to sell excess stuff. The entry barrier that is so often postulated here doesn't actually exist.

And for selling out of the guild trader system - that depends. Quite a few people have been selling Summerset stuff at frankly ridiculous prices in zone chat even though they are in a trading guild. It can be done for stuff that is likely to find a buyer quickly.

ResTandRespeC

ZeroXFF wrote: »

Because the people who actually do trading tend to benefit from most of the players being excluded from the market, creating artificially high prices.

And no, "gold sink" is not a reasonable argument, because that "house cut" that goes to the guild could just go to nobody. And if that's not enough, it could be increased.

The amoumt of money brought into guilds by the "house cut" are pretty minute compared to 5-15+ million guilds spend on traders. Atleast on ps4 NA.

Drummerx04

Oh, this again.

Look, there is no meaningful barrier to entry in order to sell items. If you just have a couple gold mats for instance, you'll sell them pretty much instantly in zone chat. Just COD them over to the buyer and you are good.

If you actually have a steady supply of goods to sell, then you'll have no problem finding an existing guild in which to sell your crap. Any decent pve or pvp player will have access to a steady supply of sellable items.

Here's some advice:

• Don't try to sell everything you pick up through guild vendors. If it isn't worth at least 2k, then it's not worth the sale slot.
• Don't join 5 trading guilds. 1-2 trade guilds is more than enough for 95% of casual to active players.
• Don't complain about guild dues if your guild is maintaining a good trader. Think of the 10k gold as an investment or rent. If you actually have things worth selling, then you'll make your investment back 10-100 times over every week just from a single guild.
• Stop complaining about needing addons and just use them. If you are on console, then learn to skim text faster.

Avalon

technical issues

Also, the biggest reason we have no changes in most of the systems that need changing (for QoL reasons), is simple: Add-Ons. Because when something is like that, and needs changed, PC players simply come up with an add-on to work around the issue, then forget that it ever was a problem. No such luck for console players, we cannot make our own work arounds, we get the game as it actually is.

This means that any time console players ask for something to be changed or fixed, they have to get past the blockade of PC players who like things exactly as they are (but only because they have add-ons that make it 'seem' ok). Yes, there are some PC players who run 0 add-ons, but they seem to be a rarity. When we have a request to fix stuff like adding buffs/debuffs so we can see them? We had to run the blockade of PC players saying it wasn't important (they have add-ons for that!) and dev time is better spent on other stuff. It took console players a couple of years to get it through, and they added it.

Same with AH. PC players with the add-ons are putting up a hardcore fight against it because they have search bars, extra drop downs, and even websites they can use to find every item they want in no time at all. Console players take forever, because we DON'T have those things.

Animus-ESO

I have different opinions (please comment)

Please change to a global auction house, I have 10 million gold and ill just flip every item i can and sell them for more. Ill drive the prices so high no one can afford basic gear for end game. It will be glorious.

generalmyrick

I have different opinions (please comment)

Making the market more accessible will increase the flow of goods...I'm just baffled at the sheer resistance! Like children being to let someone else to have a turn.

Charliff1966

they want a trading system that makes ESO distinct from other mmorpg

Its easy to control a central marketplace. Me and a friend did it in eq2. It only takes time.

XxCaLxX

Drummerx04 wrote: »

Oh, this again.

Look, there is no meaningful barrier to entry in order to sell items. If you just have a couple gold mats for instance, you'll sell them pretty much instantly in zone chat. Just COD them over to the buyer and you are good.

If you actually have a steady supply of goods to sell, then you'll have no problem finding an existing guild in which to sell your crap. Any decent pve or pvp player will have access to a steady supply of sellable items.

Here's some advice:

• Don't try to sell everything you pick up through guild vendors. If it isn't worth at least 2k, then it's not worth the sale slot.
• Don't join 5 trading guilds. 1-2 trade guilds is more than enough for 95% of casual to active players.
• Don't complain about guild dues if your guild is maintaining a good trader. Think of the 10k gold as an investment or rent. If you actually have things worth selling, then you'll make your investment back 10-100 times over every week just from a single guild.
• Stop complaining about needing addons and just use them. If you are on console, then learn to skim text faster.

After three years us console player have “learned” to skim faster. There’s no other option but is there really any reason why we should have to skim faster when we should have something that should be in a game at release?

ithlia

I have no clue why ZOS set up the auction houses the way they did. I would love a global AH but as that doesn't seem to be the direction they went, I'd settle for a word search. Its tedious enough to have to travel all over looking for a desired item but it is even worse to have to look through pages and pages in an effort to find what your looking for at every vendor.

Kiralyn2000

I have different opinions (please comment)

Because the silly bid-for-traders thing is a massive gold sink.


Outside of that, the system is a dumpster fire.

ezio45

I have different opinions (please comment)

Because it would be annoying asf thats why, i can BARELY stand zone chats..... every player in every instance of the game talking.... nty.... id literally leave chat off forever

Avalon

technical issues

ezio45 wrote: »

Because it would be annoying asf thats why, i can BARELY stand zone chats..... every player in every instance of the game talking.... nty.... id literally leave chat off forever

There would be less zone selling with a universal AH... because everyone would have access to it, and be on equal footing. There would be no reason to sell in chat. The ones doing it now are doing it because they belong to guilds without traders, or the traders are in horrible locations, or they don't even belong to a guild. The amount of zone chat selling you see now? Direct response to the system we have in place. The amount you see is a direct representation of how many need to sell that way to get any realistic amount for real goods (motifs, etc) and cannot through the system in place.

ezio45

I have different opinions (please comment)

Avalon wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Because it would be annoying asf thats why, i can BARELY stand zone chats..... every player in every instance of the game talking.... nty.... id literally leave chat off forever

There would be less zone selling with a universal AH... because everyone would have access to it, and be on equal footing. There would be no reason to sell in chat. The ones doing it now are doing it because they belong to guilds without traders, or the traders are in horrible locations, or they don't even belong to a guild. The amount of zone chat selling you see now? Direct response to the system we have in place. The amount you see is a direct representation of how many need to sell that way to get any realistic amount for real goods (motifs, etc) and cannot through the system in place.

ya but the global would get all of that, like every 5 minutes in zone there someone that just HAS to link like 10 motifs lol i can only imagine a global lol

maybe if there was just a way to mute that chat

Avalon

technical issues

ezio45 wrote: »

Avalon wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Because it would be annoying asf thats why, i can BARELY stand zone chats..... every player in every instance of the game talking.... nty.... id literally leave chat off forever

There would be less zone selling with a universal AH... because everyone would have access to it, and be on equal footing. There would be no reason to sell in chat. The ones doing it now are doing it because they belong to guilds without traders, or the traders are in horrible locations, or they don't even belong to a guild. The amount of zone chat selling you see now? Direct response to the system we have in place. The amount you see is a direct representation of how many need to sell that way to get any realistic amount for real goods (motifs, etc) and cannot through the system in place.

ya but the global would get all of that, like every 5 minutes in zone there someone that just HAS to link like 10 motifs lol i can only imagine a global lol

maybe if there was just a way to mute that chat

No, but there is a way to mute individual people lol... perhaps they should implement a Sales Channel, and if you are found to be advertising outside of it (someone reports you) then you get a warning, second time is 3 day suspension, 3rd time is banned? lol I'm all for severe measures to improve QoL.

ezio45

I have different opinions (please comment)

Avalon wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Avalon wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Because it would be annoying asf thats why, i can BARELY stand zone chats..... every player in every instance of the game talking.... nty.... id literally leave chat off forever

There would be less zone selling with a universal AH... because everyone would have access to it, and be on equal footing. There would be no reason to sell in chat. The ones doing it now are doing it because they belong to guilds without traders, or the traders are in horrible locations, or they don't even belong to a guild. The amount of zone chat selling you see now? Direct response to the system we have in place. The amount you see is a direct representation of how many need to sell that way to get any realistic amount for real goods (motifs, etc) and cannot through the system in place.

ya but the global would get all of that, like every 5 minutes in zone there someone that just HAS to link like 10 motifs lol i can only imagine a global lol

maybe if there was just a way to mute that chat

No, but there is a way to mute individual people lol... perhaps they should implement a Sales Channel, and if you are found to be advertising outside of it (someone reports you) then you get a warning, second time is 3 day suspension, 3rd time is banned? lol I'm all for severe measures to improve QoL.

there is technically no way to mute on ps4 lol you either have to flat out block on psn or deal

Avalon

technical issues

ezio45 wrote: »

Avalon wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Avalon wrote: »

ezio45 wrote: »

Because it would be annoying asf thats why, i can BARELY stand zone chats..... every player in every instance of the game talking.... nty.... id literally leave chat off forever

There would be less zone selling with a universal AH... because everyone would have access to it, and be on equal footing. There would be no reason to sell in chat. The ones doing it now are doing it because they belong to guilds without traders, or the traders are in horrible locations, or they don't even belong to a guild. The amount of zone chat selling you see now? Direct response to the system we have in place. The amount you see is a direct representation of how many need to sell that way to get any realistic amount for real goods (motifs, etc) and cannot through the system in place.

ya but the global would get all of that, like every 5 minutes in zone there someone that just HAS to link like 10 motifs lol i can only imagine a global lol

maybe if there was just a way to mute that chat

No, but there is a way to mute individual people lol... perhaps they should implement a Sales Channel, and if you are found to be advertising outside of it (someone reports you) then you get a warning, second time is 3 day suspension, 3rd time is banned? lol I'm all for severe measures to improve QoL.

there is technically no way to mute on ps4 lol you either have to flat out block on psn or deal

O.O!!! WHAT?!? Ok... not going to PS4, that is for sure! lol I dunno, I still think that the perfect solution for the AH system issue, is to include a series of message boards or Town Criers or something, that people can talk to, to find out WHICH trader has the item you are looking for, and at what price, and if you want it, trot your happy butt out to wherever that trader is and buy it. Keeps everything the way it is, and allows for traders in better locations to still have value, but allows for other guilds to have a shot at selling to someone other than their fellow guildmates.