Why do we have trials that exclude Stam?

Nyladreas

LeHarrt91 wrote: »

Nyladreas wrote: »

What? I've never heard of this problem. Ditch your guild and find a better one lol.

Its probably not the guilds but how mobile the trial fights are. As with Asylum Sanctorium there is a lot of moving required, and I believe the same is with Cloudrest. And unfortunately Stam excels in melee range, so they have to run from here to there and in doing so lose DPS.

I use speed wpn dmg pots on those fights it helps a ton not only with repositioning but also avoiding aoes.

Katahdin

Yep this is another crock. I also play stam characters and my main achieve character is stam.
So this means I will have a very hard time completing vAS and vCR because stam is the red headed step child of the devs.
Both attributes should be able to complete all content in the game. They need to fix either the trials or stam characteristics.

Narvuntien

They just need to make some melee favoured trials next time.

Bosses that pull people in or fight on unstable floors that could case ranged players to fall to their deaths or poison flowing in from the walls or traps or lots of other things that would greatly favour melee fighting.

Claustrophobic dungeons not wide open area's... most of the craglorn trials are really closed in and underground so melee is just fine there.

JobooAGS

I may just take a long hiatus from the game if we go back to the 8 mag dd meta. I refuse to wear a dress, have pointy ears and wave a oversized stick.

jssriot

Azyle1 wrote: »

Again. If it's not balanced for everything (Stam and Mag) then it's bad design.

Play As You Want*













*but if you really want to do end game dps, you better use one of your character slots for a magsorc

Qbiken

Because magicka nightblade is flavour of the month in PvE, and will continue to be until ZOS says otherwise.

Tasear

Because there's an Monopoly on people who can do this part of game. Some "rules" end are just silly.

There's different ways to trials. I remember hearing about 15k dps AA group, or all Stam dps group, but used hearing LF 30k dps group. To be honest I almost laugh when I hear of tanks crying over 4 axes. My first run there tank had 9 and yes we won, but there was definitely sweat and blood. So yeah, it's basically on people.

Asardes

LF8M StamDK DD vAS+2

davey1107

Because Eric wrobel plays a sorc, and things like this happen:

“This light armor is making me die a lot, I think I’ll invent a shield that costs nothing and blocks tens of thousands in damage. Should apstam get a shield? Nah, that’s OP.”

“We’re making new weapon ultimates. You know what would be cool? What if destro gets a giant AOE that does like 8k per second, stacks and can push out hundreds of thousands in one proc?? Oh...stam? What about an 18k smack. Well call it berserker or some crap.”

“I’m bored pushing these buttons. Maybe my haunting curse should just cast over and over without targeting anyone.”

@zos_wrobel - I didn’t love the combat system in Fallout 4. Have you considered applying for a position as lead combat director in the next game in that series? I also hear that Blizzard is hiring. How awesome a step up would Orange County be over Maryland?

Luckylancer

VaranisArano wrote: »

Because we have trials groups that exclude stam, plain and simple.

If you only ever want to run with the most optimal builds ever, you are always going to exclude certain builds that are somehow slightly less than optimal, even if those builds could complete the content.

Justifiying removal of half of the classes in end game content dont make sense.

HappyElephant

CONSTANT CORRECTIONS TO COMBAT STATS BY ZOS IS ANNOYING

Do these guys know what they are doing? I ask this because:

1) Cooking Pasta without a Timer
ZOS introduces an armor-set only to backtrack and completely change it. This happens frequently with dramatic corrections. ZOS's combat designer/s clearly have no understanding of how the armor sets and skills stats will play out. It is like cooking pasta without a timer and waiting to see if it will be under-cooked or over-cooked.

2) Lacks Foundational Understanding of Game Combat
In the most recent update, Alcast only had to look at the first set of patch notes to immediately discern that the Cloudrest trial set-drops were useless. Shouldn't the combat team be able to see this too? ZOS's team seem to have randomly put a bunch of stats together to create new armor-sets with no clue how they would translate in actual game-play.

3) Let's Make Stuff Up and See how we Do
The frequent and dramatic corrections to armor-sets and skill statistics is a symptom of a team/person that don't know what they are doing. It's a classic case of, "Let's make stuff up and see how we do."

May I suggest ZOS work more closely with the people who know the game -- like Alcast or Gilliam - instead of relying on a bunch of dodo birds who don't have mastery over their craft. You can also consider hiring a more seasoned person -- someone who has successfully designed a game combat system un-accompanied by constant, dramatic corrections.

The game's combat experience will go more smoothly if ZOS worked toward more precision in this area.

p.s - With the exception of combat, all the other parts of the game are actually quite well executed.

waitwhat

I would offer some pushback on stamina having less survivability than mag, so that groups do not exclude stamina for that reason.

In many situations Blade Cloak is superior to shields, because 1) Blade Cloak mitigation increases as damage received scales up, and 2) the protections provided by shields drops to ZERO once those shields expire/break.

Blade Cloak can often mitigate more damage than shields. Almost all of the damage in trials is coded as AoE, which Blade Cloak reduces by 25%. The higher the damage, the more damage mitigated. If that AoE damage is a cleave from a boss, then most likely neither Blade Cloak nor Harness/Harden/Healing alone will save you, so the distinction may seem moot. It is not. We have to think of AoE DoTs like vSO mantikora bleeds/poisons, vMoL Zaj'hassa's shield phase, vHRC The Warrior's Shehai, and especially vMoL Suneater/Vashai negates. With AoE DoTs, Blade Cloak will provide constant mitigation for nearly twice the duration of most shields, regardless of the severity of the DoT. While a shield in theory provides 100% mitigation until expiry, the severity of the DoT hastens the end of the shield's already short duration, requiring recast else the mitigation drops to zero. As shield users will attest: Shield spam can't go on very long in a PvE context. Crucially, in the case of a negate or a hard CC, however, recast is not possible, and the shield mitigation will drop to 0%.

Prior to Morrowind, back when shields lasted 12 seconds, the Magician CP star reduced cost, the Arcanist star boosted recovery more greatly, and Blade Cloak only reduced damage by 20%, shield damage mitigation--and magicka survivability--was superior to those Blade Cloak and of stamina's. But we must recognize that the maxim "Stamina has less survivability" is outdated and does not comport with reality.

The real discrepancy in survavibility seems to be melee vs. ranged, a discrepancy that does not correspond to stamina vs. magicka. Magplars and Mag DKs pull their highest DPS parses at melee range, and magblades using Master Architect have to at least dart into melee range to get off a Soul Assault every 10-15 seconds. There should be viable ranged stamina builds, but in the meantime, magicka users who are satisfied with stamina being excluded from content on the basis of melee carrying more risk should have a care and think about their melee magicka bretheren, who surely have had it worse for some time.

Asmael

Guilds not taking stam for the new trials?

Find a better guild. If they can't stay alive on stamina just as well as magicka, they don't have proper understanding of the mechanics of both those trials or don't have the proper reflexes. You don't need anything else than Vigor in Cloudrest. Asylum does make it harder on you if you don't slot Deadly cloak to go with Vigor, but that's about it.

Enemy moves? Your strongest DoTs are on your bow bar, and you need to refresh those. It makes no difference.

mr_wazzabi

Just give us a Stam scaling Bone Shield morph and we're good.

To balance in pvp, make major evasion unable to activate for Bone Shield's duration. That way we won't get shielded shuffle abusers.

exiars10

I just watched Alcast's stream from AS and guess what?
Only one stamina DD and it was NB archer who only used Killer's Blade at the end.
Staves, staves and more staves (excluding Warden OHaS tank and NB archer)...

exiars10

And they just started another AS+2.

0 stamina DDs - 7 magicka DDs: 1 Sorcerer and 6x Nightblade.

Everything is all right, nothing to see .

Azyle1

exiars10 wrote: »

And they just started another AS+2.

0 stamina DDs - 7 magicka DDs: 1 Sorcerer and 6x Nightblade.

Everything is all right, nothing to see .

It's garbage. All Mag comps are the worst and anyone who supports it is a moron.

Zagnut123Zagnut123

Tasear wrote: »

Because we need trial group finder?

The objective is to to clear and quing for a random trial would most certainly ensure a long painful defeat. Im not just talking about vets either normal trials are too much for a large majority of the eso population. Vass plus 2 and vcr plus 3 at most have room for 1 stam player "at most" that have access to minor breach anything beyond that and your putting personal ambition before grp performance.

Zagnut123Zagnut123

Asmael wrote: »

Guilds not taking stam for the new trials?

Find a better guild. If they can't stay alive on stamina just as well as magicka, they don't have proper understanding of the mechanics of both those trials or don't have the proper reflexes. You don't need anything else than Vigor in Cloudrest. Asylum does make it harder on you if you don't slot Deadly cloak to go with Vigor, but that's about it.

Enemy moves? Your strongest DoTs are on your bow bar, and you need to refresh those. It makes no difference.

It's because stamina is less efficient and if your alreadt a guild that struggles through vet hm trials then bringing a by stam is a liability. As it stands there's like 3 groups (pc na) that I know of that can complete vet asylum hm comfortably with or without stam none of wich you just into.