Players are getting rich ( really rich ) selling vas skin

Aesthier

All I am stating is that in my eyes there is absolutely no difference between those who are finding inventive ways to use the actual working mechanics of the game (peeling off a boss on a wall or firing through a closed door) to get something they want (which everyone is calling an exploit) and those who find inventive ways to use actual working mechanics of the game (content locked behind a skill and population gateway) to extort gold from players who really desire the skin.

Both are exploits as those who are taking action are "exploiting" a situation to either get the skin or fill their pockets in a manner in which the game was not designed for.

This is where the disconnect is I think for many people.

Players who have the ability and enough friends who also have the ability claim that there is nothing wrong with selling "carries" for the skin. Players who don't want to lose a monopoly on their virtual monopoly of gold, cry that doing so is not only allowed but there is no way the designers can stop them so hence it is not exploitation (which is incorrect as I can think of many ways to limit carry sales). The intent of the designers was not for players to sell runs, the intent was to reward those who could accomplish the task with the skin. The skin itself is the reward, not the gold made from taking those who cant. This is exploitation.

Players who find ingenious ways around or holes in the mechanics of the game to get the skin are not actually breaking the mechanics, however, they are breaking the intent of the design. Much like those above who claim that because the mechanics allow it, it must be acceptable. Again being able to hide behind a closed door and shoot through it was not the intent behind the initial design. This also is exploitation.

The ONLY difference between the two is that only one is considered by a large portion of the community to be an exploit.


The players this hurts the most are those who legitimately earned the skin with their guilds etc and do not partake in the selling.

Those who sell the skin honestly don't care about the bragging rights all they are truly interested in is keeping its rarity so they can continue to charge a fee for runs, and these are the majority of those who are screaming the loudest at the new competition that the door glitch has provided. Not because it invalidates the bragging rights but because it cuts into their profits.


I think both the door huggers and the sellers should be treated equally in this manner whatever that treatment comes to.

**Personally, I am against permanent bans unless the individual has had multiple warnings and infractions.**

Apache_Kid

VaranisArano wrote: »

Jameliel wrote: »

You mean they are collecting a bunch of data within data? They experience pleasure from it? Good for them. Stop thinking about it, and you too may experience other pleasures=)

You mean they are collecting data within other data and breaking the TOS to get that data? You know, the TOS we all agree to before using that data to experience pleasure? The TOS that lays out how we can and can't use amd obtain that data?

For some people, its a problem that people cheat the fights to get the skins.
For some people, its that the TOS is being broken-the TOS says you report exploits and dont use them, and this is obviously an exploit.
For some people, its about consistency. Players were banned for this exploit when it first happened, therefore ZOS' response is very important now that its recurred.

So, no, ZOS' response to this recurring exploit for which other players were banned is not (and never was) simply a matter of collecting data in a game. Its knowingly and obviously breaking the TOS those players agreed to, and now, its stupidly doing so to abuse a glitch that others got banned for.

I mean, seriously, the last bunch of players to exploit vAS got banned. How stupid is it to think "I can use a very similar exploit that has the same effect and not get punished"?

There are so many players running around on xbox with the skin now that they'd be banning a large portion of their customers. Based on the lack of response to this issue after all of this time, i don't think we will be seeing any punishments given out.

Last time this happened the trial was brand new, i think they have other priorities at this point.

DoctorESO

Aesthier wrote: »

All I am stating is that in my eyes there is absolutely no difference between those who are finding inventive ways to use the actual working mechanics of the game (peeling off a boss on a wall or firing through a closed door) to get something they want (which everyone is calling an exploit) and those who find inventive ways to use actual working mechanics of the game (content locked behind a skill and population gateway) to extort gold from players who really desire the skin.

Both are exploits as those who are taking action are "exploiting" a situation to either get the skin or fill their pockets in a manner in which the game was not designed for.

This is where the disconnect is I think for many people.

Players who have the ability and enough friends who also have the ability claim that there is nothing wrong with selling "carries" for the skin. Players who don't want to lose a monopoly on their virtual monopoly of gold, cry that doing so is not only allowed but there is no way the designers can stop them so hence it is not exploitation (which is incorrect as I can think of many ways to limit carry sales). The intent of the designers was not for players to sell runs, the intent was to reward those who could accomplish the task with the skin. The skin itself is the reward, not the gold made from taking those who cant. This is exploitation.

Players who find ingenious ways around or holes in the mechanics of the game to get the skin are not actually breaking the mechanics, however, they are breaking the intent of the design. Much like those above who claim that because the mechanics allow it, it must be acceptable. Again being able to hide behind a closed door and shoot through it was not the intent behind the initial design. This also is exploitation.

The ONLY difference between the two is that only one is considered by a large portion of the community to be an exploit.


The players this hurts the most are those who legitimately earned the skin with their guilds etc and do not partake in the selling.

Those who sell the skin honestly don't care about the bragging rights all they are truly interested in is keeping its rarity so they can continue to charge a fee for runs, and these are the majority of those who are screaming the loudest at the new competition that the door glitch has provided. Not because it invalidates the bragging rights but because it cuts into their profits.


I think both the door huggers and the sellers should be treated equally in this manner whatever that treatment comes to.

**Personally, I am against permanent bans unless the individual has had multiple warnings and infractions.**

Let's do it like some militaries do. Demote them to level 1, CP 0. And dock 50% of their experience for the next 5 million points.

Kiralyn2000

Personally, I don't see people exploiting an error to make the fight trivial to be the same as people selling a spot in their group (which then does the fight the 'correct' way).

Two different things. One is cheating/exploiting. The other is forming a group, and doing the content as it's intended - 12 people go in and have to successfully fight the boss(es).

Actually, if you think about it, it's "extra challenge mode", since they have to fight the boss with a coordinated team of 11 (and one dude who mostly needs to not screw up and cause a wipe).


...which also gives me a thought on the "it cheapens the achievement for people who did it themselves" idea. The 11 guys selling that 12th slot to carry someone to the skin? They're the people whose achievement you claim is being "cheapened". Apparently, it doesn't bother them.


But, yeah, actually exploiting a bug and cheesing the fight is different, and should be stopped.

MaxwellC

Yeah if they're exploiting then the player who buys the skin & the seller should be banned for a couple weeks + have their gold removed from their account.

Ihatenightblades

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Personally, I don't see people exploiting an error to make the fight trivial to be the same as people selling a spot in their group (which then does the fight the 'correct' way).

Two different things. One is cheating/exploiting. The other is forming a group, and doing the content as it's intended - 12 people go in and have to successfully fight the boss(es).

Actually, if you think about it, it's "extra challenge mode", since they have to fight the boss with a coordinated team of 11 (and one dude who mostly needs to not screw up and cause a wipe).


...which also gives me a thought on the "it cheapens the achievement for people who did it themselves" idea. The 11 guys selling that 12th slot to carry someone to the skin? They're the people whose achievement you claim is being "cheapened". Apparently, it doesn't bother them.


But, yeah, actually exploiting a bug and cheesing the fight is different, and should be stopped.

Why would it bother them they are making millions doing it and are following the rules.

The exploiters are taking away customers from them basicly and cheesing it. I would be pissed too..

karekiz

Guys, they won't ban until summerset is well in their hands.

Get the $$$ -> Ban the account -> Force rebuy -> If they exploit again -> Repeat -> Profit?

Summetset is buyable from Steam so I would expect bans to happen post refund dates.

Silver_Strider

At this point, I can't help but feel ZOS allows these "exploits" just to make players that could never hope of getting it legit have a shot.

I mean honestly, VMoL and vRoM both had exploits that went unaddressed for a good while each and now vAS is being cheesed as well. I wouldn't be surprised if vCR got an "exploited" waiting for someone to find.

Put on your tin foil hats people, this is all a giant conspiracy to appease casuals.

KittyHazWares

Not fair that the first batch of people that glitched it are now perma banned and these guys still have their accounts running around with an exploited skin.

I do hope ZOS does something and doesn’t treat it like the maw snipe where everyone gets away with it.


There’s so many that’s glitched it, it’s insane.

JJBoomer

.

phileunderx2

I have never witnessed anyone selling a skin run on PC but then I don't see that many rocking a skin either. On PS4 I have seen zone chat spammed quite often offering skin runs also wearing a skin is the in thing as I see tons of players with a skin.

DanteYoda

I don't get it everyone knows they be exploiting this skin.. would you buy one at this time off some random for a packet...

I know i wouldn't it might flag you as a exploiter and at best Zos would take it away from you..

DPShiro

This is becoming a ducking joke

Sheezabeast

Has Zos said anything regarding this issue?

Apache_Kid

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Has Zos said anything regarding this issue?

Radio silence. Unless i missed it somewhere. If they don't take the skins and perfected weapons away from these cheaters its a giant middle finger to the end-game community. @ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_JessicaFolsom

DoctorESO

Sheezabeast wrote: »

Has Zos said anything regarding this issue?

Yes they have, if you consider silence to be a message.

Dymence

Tasear wrote: »

Maybe the exploiting and selling is more of a sign of lack of access but not desire? This reminds me when alcohol was banned. People will continue to be lured into such practices the real issue isn't addressed.

Of course, people desire access to things without working for them.

Dumbing down the entire game to prevent people from exploiting things is one of the most...... interesting things I have read here lately.

Aliyavana

Tasear wrote: »

Maybe the exploiting and selling is more of a sign of lack of access but not desire? This reminds me when alcohol was banned. People will continue to be lured into such practices the real issue isn't addressed.

There's no issue with locking rewards as being proof you did hard content. The issue is these players don't deserve the skins they are exploiting

DPShiro

I am disgusted by this

Mureel

usmguy1234 wrote: »

Ihatenightblades wrote: »

Not cool... something should be done.

EDIT - selling a skin by actually doing the trial is great for the game and players can use their skill to get rich. Fair game.

I am talking about exploiting

Is this the silver skin that ppl are bombarding chat about on xbox?

OH DEAR Sorry Consolians.

Mureel

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Personally, I don't see people exploiting an error to make the fight trivial to be the same as people selling a spot in their group (which then does the fight the 'correct' way).

Two different things. One is cheating/exploiting. The other is forming a group, and doing the content as it's intended - 12 people go in and have to successfully fight the boss(es).

Actually, if you think about it, it's "extra challenge mode", since they have to fight the boss with a coordinated team of 11 (and one dude who mostly needs to not screw up and cause a wipe).


...which also gives me a thought on the "it cheapens the achievement for people who did it themselves" idea. The 11 guys selling that 12th slot to carry someone to the skin? They're the people whose achievement you claim is being "cheapened". Apparently, it doesn't bother them.


But, yeah, actually exploiting a bug and cheesing the fight is different, and should be stopped.

The last boss. Not all. The should make it so that every player must do all bosses to get ach.

DPShiro

Mureel wrote: »

Kiralyn2000 wrote: »

Personally, I don't see people exploiting an error to make the fight trivial to be the same as people selling a spot in their group (which then does the fight the 'correct' way).

Two different things. One is cheating/exploiting. The other is forming a group, and doing the content as it's intended - 12 people go in and have to successfully fight the boss(es).

Actually, if you think about it, it's "extra challenge mode", since they have to fight the boss with a coordinated team of 11 (and one dude who mostly needs to not screw up and cause a wipe).


...which also gives me a thought on the "it cheapens the achievement for people who did it themselves" idea. The 11 guys selling that 12th slot to carry someone to the skin? They're the people whose achievement you claim is being "cheapened". Apparently, it doesn't bother them. I’m


But, yeah, actually exploiting a bug and cheesing the fight is different, and should be stopped.

The last boss. Not all. The should make it so that every player must do all bosses to get ach.

I believe fixing these issues isn’t that hard at all, but maybe the few hours handling it are better spent on shiny new unicorn mounts that farts rainbows

The_ghosted1

This is also a big problem on PS4 eu...

Rawkan

It never ceases to amaze me how *** people are.

SASQUATCH0

Too many people have glitched vas and gotten the skin across all platforms. It’s too late ladies and gents, zos isn’t going to ban anyone. Rip silver skin...

Cpt_Teemo

I didn't see anything about not abusing exploits in the RoC anymore, yet blizzard has oddly.

Skullstachio

A slightly smarter approach to this problem would be to, instead of being able to unlock skins through achievements regarding that particular dungeon (hence those who carry others through.), the final boss of that trial instead drops an extremely rare runebox containing that skin for completing the trial on the hardest setting that can be sold in guild shops to other players

This could very well eliminate a few problems but create a few new indirect problems in the process.

The_ghosted1

Bump

SASQUATCH0

I think this new trial setup is a big problem. They kinda fixed this issue in vmol by making it so you had to kill every boss in the trial to get the skin. Same with vhof. Now in these new trials you have to kill all the bosses at the same time. Making it easier to exploit for skins

socivL

the game is meant to be played through exploitation.