Why hasn’t cash for gold been addressed? (Crown store gifting)

N0TPLAYER2

With the upcoming crown store gifting, I know we’re in for zone chat full of “buying new senche mount 2 million gold” etc

Meaning people will give their gold to others for pulling out their credit card. Which is essentially gold selling or cash for gold. I’m very surprised this hasn’t been mentioned or discussed yet.

Thoughts?

Colecovision

Because ZoS is the gold seller this time.

Kiralyn2000

Colecovision wrote: »

Because ZoS is the gold seller this time.

Yep.

Companies tend to be fine with this (see: Blizzard and selling WoW Subscription Tokens for gold). Their main problem with external gold sellers is they 1) encourage bots, and 2) tend to also hack people's accounts to steal more gold (which then causes work for the GMs + bad publicity).

danno8

Mostly I think people don't care if you buy a Senche Mount with in-game gold or buy it with Crowns (what people are already doing.)

The real question is whether bots or outside companies will see this as an opportunity to grind out in-game gold to sell to people on their websites, so those people can in turn go back into the game and buy those Senche Mounts from Crown store customers using that ill-gotten gold.

Maybe. It certainly won't help. It does help that the game still has a base purchase cost.

Ley

It was brought up multiple times but ZOS haven't made any official remark about it (unless I missed it).

Doesn't matter how you try to dress it up, Crown Store gifting is just another way of saying, selling crowns for gold. People may give away Crown Store items for free but it will absolutely be used for trading.

I guess I'd rather ZOS get the money than a 3rd party vendor selling gold.

Whiphid

danno8 wrote: »

The real question is whether bots or outside companies will see this as an opportunity to grind out in-game gold to sell to people on their websites, so those people can in turn go back into the game and buy those Senche Mounts from Crown store customers using that ill-gotten gold.

How would that work?
Theres no profit either way, unless people are really dumb. If you buy Y gold for X dollar, why the hell would you the spend that Y gold on a mount that is <X dollar to purchase directly. They will not sell it for <Y gold, as there would not be a profit in it.

Edit. Unless the senche seller is some other party, then yes.

Ley

I wonder how long before a conversion rate is established for X gold per crown.

DuskMarine

N0TPLAYER2 wrote: »

With the upcoming crown store gifting, I know we’re in for zone chat full of “buying new senche mount 2 million gold” etc

Meaning people will give their gold to others for pulling out their credit card. Which is essentially gold selling or cash for gold. I’m very surprised this hasn’t been mentioned or discussed yet.

Thoughts?

this will in a way cause gold sellers to kindve lose out in some ways.

Prof_Bawbag

Even if it was a semi plausible way to obtain a lot of gold and make a little profit, I wouldn't be willing to send gold to anyone who screws folk over selling worthless in game gold. They ain't gonna send that senche first, and i ain't gonna send that 2m first.

Ley

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Even if it was a semi plausible way to obtain a lot of gold and make a little profit, I wouldn't be willing to send gold to anyone who screws folk over selling worthless in game gold. They ain't gonna send that senche first, and i ain't gonna send that 2m first.

That's been my primary concern. If they're going to implement this, they may as well accept the inevitability that this will be used to sell crowns for gold and make the exchange support CoD. Otherwise there will be much scamming.

N0TPLAYER2

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Even if it was a semi plausible way to obtain a lot of gold and make a little profit, I wouldn't be willing to send gold to anyone who screws folk over selling worthless in game gold. They ain't gonna send that senche first, and i ain't gonna send that 2m first.

Interesting. But you know scams are gonna happen as well as legit, 2-5 million sales for rare crown store items (or expensive)

Cpt_Teemo

Colecovision wrote: »

Because ZoS is the gold seller this time.

Crown Gifting will become the gold seller, but then again ZoS will have an absorbent amount of scam tickets over the tickets that need to be answered, this is where greed gets you I guess.

Colecovision

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Even if it was a semi plausible way to obtain a lot of gold and make a little profit, I wouldn't be willing to send gold to anyone who screws folk over selling worthless in game gold. They ain't gonna send that senche first, and i ain't gonna send that 2m first.

But if it’s not against tos, then it will be an accepted part of the game. At that point it can be done with guildies and trusted people. A mundus stone would certainly make an interesting guild auction item.

Violynne

N0TPLAYER2 wrote: »

Meaning people will give their gold to others for pulling out their credit card. Which is essentially gold selling or cash for gold.

No, it's not. There is no cash transaction between the buyer and seller.

Buyer fronts the gold, seller buys the mount. Trade is established. Provided there's no scam between the transaction, everyone wins.

For ZoS, they're well aware this is going to happen because money makes people and companies do stupid, stupid things. ZoS probably already has their "Your fault. Shut up and leave us alone." auto-replies on these types of scam reports.

Most reasonable people would say, "Not interested."

I don't know about most, but I sure wouldn't put my real world cash up on someone's offer inside a game. The last thing I'd want is a surplus of unaccepted gifts.

Now, if I know you and I know why you can't/won't buy Crowns, I'll be much more open.

Otherwise, nope. Not interested.

Jhalin

ZOS is gonna allow it because they’ve already got the money once Crowns are purchased. Out of game $ to gold exchanges are prohibited only because it doesn’t bring the $ to ZOS.

Tandor

The way they're doing it, rogue sellers could easily lose out through being unable to do anything with unaccepted gifts. ZOS will also have a database entry no doubt for all gifts and so will be able to spot those who are doing a lot more than simply making a one-off gift to a friend or offering a raffle prize through a guild. They'll also be able to spot those who are accepting an awful lot of gifts. It may turn out to be a very effective way of identifying illicit RMT traders (both sellers and buyers) who they can then deal with.

I suspect ZOS are doing it primarily because a lot of players have asked for it as a means of helping out friends, plus of course it does help to promote the Crown Store. However, if it turns out to be substantially abused then they can easily change its terms or pull the plug on it completely. We may in any event find that the terms on Live servers are rather more comprehensive than on the PTS.

Knowledge

When Update 18 goes live, it's likely we'll have a new EULA to agree to, I'm sure something will be stated there regarding this stuff.

starkerealm

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Even if it was a semi plausible way to obtain a lot of gold and make a little profit, I wouldn't be willing to send gold to anyone who screws folk over selling worthless in game gold. They ain't gonna send that senche first, and i ain't gonna send that 2m first.

Yeah, this is the real stumbling block to people who try to use gifting as a way to sell gold. You need to trust that the other person is above board. Now, to be fair, some people will blindly stumble in, and then come back out crying about how they got scammed, but at the same time, I doubt we'll see a legitimately stable market for this stuff forming, because of the trust issue.

Sure, your friend might offer gold for a crown store item, but some random stranger in Mournhold? You really should think carefully before you accept that offer.

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER

bots are the real problem, not gold sellers

Furcula

Off the top of my head, I believe there are currently limitations in place to limit who can gift. I believe there are time requirements before you can gift, eg. have to be friends with them for a X amount of time. So this will prevent most of the straight up buying crown store stuff for gold exchanges. Most transactions will limited within friends who know each other.

AlnilamE

Or, you know, we could use the system as intended: To gift things to people we know and like and not expect something in return.

Reading these threads, it feels like an odd concept, though.

Ashtaris

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER wrote: »

bots are the real problem, not gold sellers

And where do you think the Gold Sellers get their gold?

Ley

AlnilamE wrote: »

Or, you know, we could use the system as intended: To gift things to people we know and like and not expect something in return.

Reading these threads, it feels like an odd concept, though.

We can but players using this to trade crown store items for gold is an inevitability. No point in pretending otherwise.

Oreyn_Bearclaw

AlnilamE wrote: »

Or, you know, we could use the system as intended: To gift things to people we know and like and not expect something in return.

Reading these threads, it feels like an odd concept, though.

That's it right there. Problem is that this is a wonderful idea in theory, but the potential for abuse is mind blowing. I really hope the reality wont match the worst case scenario. I love the idea of being able to use this for something like a guild hall, so multiple people can contribute. I worry about CS items being blatantly sold for gold in zone chat. If the scam rate gets out of control, it will reflect very poorly on the game.

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER wrote: »

bots are the real problem, not gold sellers

They are essentially one and the same. Kinda hard to be a gold seller of any scale without bots.

Slurg

Seems more likely to be used by people buying items to contribute to a guild hall, or people just, you know, buying gifts for friends and relatives. Maybe guild masters giving prizes for contests.

ZOS will be able to track all the gift giving and presumably will investigate possible abuse of the system. But if they don’t see a problem with it, why should anyone else?

SydneyGrey

I was under the impression that in order to gift something from the store, you have to have a person in mind at the time you buy it, so the item ends up getting sent automatically. I didn't think it was possible to keep an item for a length of time and then give (sell) it to the highest bidder at a later date, which would create a problem because of people buying limited-time items to resell. I haven't tried it out on the test server, though, so I can't tell you for sure.

The system is on PTS right now, so maybe someone can try it out there and tell us. I'd do it, but none of my friends play ESO, so I wouldn't have anyone to gift it to.

Apache_Kid

DRAGON_KILLER_HUNTER wrote: »

bots are the real problem, not gold sellers

What if i told you...

D0PAMINE

Ley wrote: »

Prof_Bawbag wrote: »

Even if it was a semi plausible way to obtain a lot of gold and make a little profit, I wouldn't be willing to send gold to anyone who screws folk over selling worthless in game gold. They ain't gonna send that senche first, and i ain't gonna send that 2m first.

That's been my primary concern. If they're going to implement this, they may as well accept the inevitability that this will be used to sell crowns for gold and make the exchange support CoD. Otherwise there will be much scamming.

Then ZoS will get drawn into it and handle it their way. Take screenshots of any transaction promises and you will likely get a refund.

JasonSilverSpring

SydneyGrey wrote: »

I was under the impression that in order to gift something from the store, you have to have a person in mind at the time you buy it, so the item ends up getting sent automatically. I didn't think it was possible to keep an item for a length of time and then give (sell) it to the highest bidder at a later date, which would create a problem because of people buying limited-time items to resell. I haven't tried it out on the test server, though, so I can't tell you for sure.

The system is on PTS right now, so maybe someone can try it out there and tell us. I'd do it, but none of my friends play ESO, so I wouldn't have anyone to gift it to.

Yes, that is correct. When you make a purchase in the crown store it gives you a choice of for yourself or as a gift. If you choose a gift you provide the user name. I am pretty sure it checks if the user already has it. Then, if not, it will send to them and they have the option of accepting or rejecting. If they reject it then you have the option to gift it to someone else, but it does not appear that there is an option for a refund.

Also, they do not allow gifting of houses at this time. Not all crown store items can be gifted.

And, to gift one must have paid for ESO+ or bought crown packs and wait 30 days. This should help prevent fraud.

I am not sure I get how this would be used much for cash for gold. Yes, one could agree to give someone gold for a crown store item. But, the supposed "gold seller" would only be getting crown store items which they did not already have in exchange for the gold. So, if someone wanted to get in game gold with cash they would need to buy crowns and find someone willing to pay them for a crown store item. I guess it could happen on occasion, but I cannot imagine it being very lucrative.

I would not be surprised if ZOS adds something to the TOS about not trading gold for crown store gifts to help discourage that kind of trading. It would be very risky to do that with anyone you did not know well since there is no COD system.

Gilvoth

i hope we can sell crown store items for gold and it be allowed, and not bannable.
i am a pvp player, so i am allways broke and need Gold.
in all the other MMO's i have played they allways allowed buying items in the cash shop and selling them to other players, i hope eso does the same and that it's not something i get into trouble for.

RouDeR

PC 1 500 000 Gold - 5000 Crowns so 300 gold per Crown
Console : 2 500 000 Gold - 5000 crowns 500 gold per crown .

This prediction is based on the currently gold prices listed by the Ingame Sellers/Bots .
You are welcome